My nootropic stack

Hyde12

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
Planning on running the following nootropic stack in about a week or so. Here is what is will look like. Any input on my dosages would be appreciated.

500 mgs Phenibut
1000 mgs Aniracetam
500 mgs Bacopa Monnieri
300 mcgs Huperzine A
7-10 grams Piracetam
Pyroglutamic Acid - not sure how much to take
10 grams Choline Cooler (Choline blend)
3 grams L-Tyrosine
2 grams ALCAR
 
The_Reverend

The_Reverend

Active member
Awards
1
  • Established
My only suggestion is to replace Choline Cooler with Alpha-GPC. It's a much better source of choline and it also stimulates the release of GH.

Also, consider including some R-ALA to quench the free radicals from the use of ALCAR.
 
strategicmove

strategicmove

Legend
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
Planning on running the following nootropic stack in about a week or so. Here is what is will look like. Any input on my dosages would be appreciated.

500 mgs Phenibut
1000 mgs Aniracetam
500 mgs Bacopa Monnieri
300 mcgs Huperzine A
7-10 grams Piracetam
Pyroglutamic Acid - not sure how much to take
10 grams Choline Cooler (Choline blend)
3 grams L-Tyrosine
2 grams ALCAR
I agree with The_Reverend that you should add a potent antioxidant to your mix.
Some of the compounds that my be worth considering, if you have not made up your mind already, include:
1) Acetyl-L-Carnitine Arginate: potent brain nutrient; stimulates the growth of new neurites in the brain;
2) Phosphatidylserine (PS): keeps brain cell membranes fluid and pliant; permits brain cells to absorb nutrients more efficiently; stimulates neurotransmitter activity, improves overall cognitive function);
3) Ginkgo biloba: fights brain aging; improves circulation to brain; potent anti-oxidant that inhibits free-radical oxidation in brain cells;
4) Vinpocetine: selectively improves blood flow to the brain; improves the efficiency of oxygen transfer to the brain, as well as the brain's utilization of oxygen; inhibits the clotting or lumping of platelets;
5) Galantamine: potent cholinesterase inhibitor, permitting higher levels of acetylcholine in the brain; stimulates acetylcholine receptors; helps to inhibit formation of beta-amyloid plaque deposits; regulates release of neurotransmitters such as glutamate, gamma-aminobutyric acid, and serotonin;
6) Dimethylaminoethanol (DMAE): neurotransmitter enhancer; boosts verbal and creative abilities;
7) Pantothenic Acid: aids in the production of the neurotransmitter acetylcholine;
8) Phosphatidylcholine (Lecithin): structural component of cerebral cells; boosts neurotransmitter (acetylcholine) levels.

The list may continue.
 

Hyde12

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to strategicmove again.

The Reverend - You got reps

Thanks for the suggestions. I might go with the Alpha-GPC after all because I have heard good things about it. I have ALA so I could add that in with no problem.
 
The_Reverend

The_Reverend

Active member
Awards
1
  • Established
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to strategicmove again.

The Reverend - You got reps

Thanks for the suggestions. I might go with the Alpha-GPC after all because I have heard good things about it. I have ALA so I could add that in with no problem.
Thanks for the reps!

I've been on my current stack for about 6 months and I love it. It's piracetam (5grams), PLCAR(2grams), alpha-GPC(1gram), and R-ALA(300mg). Its simple and gives me great focus and energy.
 
Topfueljunkie

Topfueljunkie

New member
Awards
0
have any of you tried sulbutiamine (sp?) in a nootropic stack? more specifically with DMAE ? the DMAE sounds like it helps with speech similar to the way the sulbutiamine does.
 

nelix

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
Planning on running the following nootropic stack in about a week or so. Here is what is will look like. Any input on my dosages would be appreciated.

500 mgs Phenibut
1000 mgs Aniracetam
500 mgs Bacopa Monnieri
300 mcgs Huperzine A
7-10 grams Piracetam
Pyroglutamic Acid - not sure how much to take
10 grams Choline Cooler (Choline blend)
3 grams L-Tyrosine
2 grams ALCAR
For me (you are obviously different) that is to much bacopa, and to much ALCAR, my head would explode.

My current noot stack is Aniracetam 800mg,Idebenone 180mg and 1g Alpha-GPC.
 
The_Reverend

The_Reverend

Active member
Awards
1
  • Established
For me (you are obviously different) that is to much bacopa, and to much ALCAR, my head would explode.

My current noot stack is Aniracetam 800mg,Idebenone 180mg and 1g Alpha-GPC.
I agree. Too much ALCAR fogs my mind. 1g seems to be the sweet spot for me as well.
 
strategicmove

strategicmove

Legend
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to strategicmove again.

The Reverend - You got reps

Thanks for the suggestions. I might go with the Alpha-GPC after all because I have heard good things about it. I have ALA so I could add that in with no problem.
How did you finally decide?
 
thesinner

thesinner

Recovering AXoholic
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
What about lecithin instead of alpha-gpc? Very similar (alpha GPC is just without a cholesterol tail) and WAY cheaper.
 
strategicmove

strategicmove

Legend
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
What about lecithin instead of alpha-gpc? Very similar (alpha GPC is just without a cholesterol tail) and WAY cheaper.
The reason, as you know, is that, alpha-gpc, although a phospholipid metabolite of lecithin, is comparatively extremely well absorbed, crosses the brain barrier, and better promotes the synthesis and secretion of acetylcholine, an essential neurotransmitter involved in muscle control, sleep, and cognition. Furthermore, alpa-gpc supports neurons and enhances signal transmission by acting as a membrane phospholipids precursor.
 
heebs10

heebs10

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
500mg of phenibut is rather low in my opinion, it wouldnt do anything for me even if i only took it like once a month, ie: if i didnt have a tolerance. but if that works for you, thats great, just adding my 2 cents. if you are using it for sleep then 500mg should be fine though.
 

Hyde12

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
500mg of phenibut is rather low in my opinion, it wouldnt do anything for me even if i only took it like once a month, ie: if i didnt have a tolerance. but if that works for you, thats great, just adding my 2 cents. if you are using it for sleep then 500mg should be fine though.
When combining as many Nootropics as I am, it is a good idea to cut the dosages of each. I have used upwards of 6 grams of phenibut.
 
John Smeton

John Smeton

Legend
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
have any of you tried sulbutiamine (sp?) in a nootropic stack? more specifically with DMAE ? the DMAE sounds like it helps with speech similar to the way the sulbutiamine does.
Yes. Sulb works really well with language barriers. I did a log on here a while back on it. I made the mistake of using it for three months strait, started getting headaches. Take it from me only use for a breif amount od time than get off. I use it if Im learning a new skill.
 
heebs10

heebs10

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
When combining as many Nootropics as I am, it is a good idea to cut the dosages of each. I have used upwards of 6 grams of phenibut.
this is a good point, you obviously know what you are doing. should be a pleasant stack.
 
Topfueljunkie

Topfueljunkie

New member
Awards
0
Yes. Sulb works really well with language barriers. I did a log on here a while back on it. I made the mistake of using it for three months strait, started getting headaches. Take it from me only use for a breif amount od time than get off. I use it if Im learning a new skill.
Headaches? Really..hmmmm, interesting. I've only tried sulb once (Biotest spike) and the very first time I used it was absolutely amazing. But it seems I built up a tolerance to it and felt nothing the very next day. That or the first dose was the best placebo effect ever! Third day I upped the dose and still felt nothing so on the fourth day I upped the dose again and WHOA! that was a bad idea! I felt shaky and a little dizzy and started getting sweaty and just had an overall feeling of something being not right in my body. I was quite nervous when that happened but those ill effects only lasted about two hours before subsiding. No headaches though, but then again, everyone is different.

How long of a break do you take before resuming use to avoid the headaches? Outside of the headaches, did the (good) effects wear off or decrease the longer you used it like you started to build up a tolerance to it ?
 

Hyde12

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
Just a quick update. I am getting the most benefit from the Bacopa Monnieri because I tried using it alone and for sure, that is the best thing in my stack. Bacopa is amazing! I feel so relaxed and mentally sharp. I also read a study that showed Bacopa increased T4 levels and I can confirm this because my waist is getting tighter and my pants lose around the waist. I wish Nutra carried this.
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
What about lecithin instead of alpha-gpc? Very similar (alpha GPC is just without a cholesterol tail) and WAY cheaper.
Lecithin's choline content is not spectacular.
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Just a quick update. I am getting the most benefit from the Bacopa Monnieri because I tried using it alone and for sure, that is the best thing in my stack. Bacopa is amazing! I feel so relaxed and mentally sharp. I also read a study that showed Bacopa increased T4 levels and I can confirm this because my waist is getting tighter and my pants lose around the waist. I wish Nutra carried this.
I am a big fan of Bacopa, for sure.

It can be arranged to carry it at Nutra, since I will be needing some for Clear Edge.
 
thesinner

thesinner

Recovering AXoholic
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
Lecithin's choline content is not spectacular.
Isn't it typically 25% PC? Alpha-GPC usually comes 50%.

You can pick up a pound of lecithin for $5-$6. The cheapest I've seen AGPC was for $195 per pound.
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Isn't it typically 25% PC? Alpha-GPC usually comes 50%.

You can pick up a pound of lecithin for $5-$6. The cheapest I've seen AGPC was for $195 per pound.
I thought it was closer to 10%.

Choline Citrate is pretty cheap.
 
thesinner

thesinner

Recovering AXoholic
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
I'm NOW Foods' makes one standardized for 25%. Generic lecithin, it's about 15%ish.

Citrate is a bargain as well.

I opted to use lecithin for the preparation of my current sinner nootropic cocktal because (1) it was sold out at the time (2) I know what taste I can expect with lecithin, and how to go accordingly. (came out tasting pretty good, actually)
 
thesinner

thesinner

Recovering AXoholic
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
When medical researchers use the term lecithin, they are referring to a purified substance called phosphatidylcholine (PC). Supplements labeled as lecithin usually contain 10-20% PC. Relatively pure PC supplements are generally labeled as phosphatidylcholine.￾ PC best duplicates supplements used in medical research.

Choline by itself (without the phosphatidyl￾ group) is also available in foods and supplements. In high amounts, however, pure choline can make people smell like fish, so it's rarely used, except in the small amounts found in multivitamin supplements.



What does it do? PC acts as a supplier of choline, which is needed for cell membrane integrity and to facilitate the movement of fats in and out of cells. It is also a component of the neurotransmitter acetylcholine and is needed for normal brain functioning, particularly in infants. Although the human body can synthesize choline, additional amounts from the diet are considered essential under certain circumstances. For this reason, PC has been used in a number of preliminary studies for a wide variety of neurological and psychiatric disorders, though not every study suggests that supplemental choline is capable of reaching the brain. Choline participates in many functions involving cellular components called phospholipids.



Where is it found? Choline, the major constituent of PC, is found in soybeans, liver, oatmeal, cabbage, and cauliflower. Soybeans, egg yolks, meat, and some vegetables contain PC. Lecithin (containing 10-20% PC) is added to many processed foods in small amounts for the purpose of maintaining texture consistency.

Lecithin contains 25% phosphatidyl choline, which comprises a major portion of all cell membranes. NOW Lecithin Granules are derived entirely from soybeans. Lecithin is also used to emulsify fats in baking and cooking.
I mean, unless I'm reading this wrong.
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
I mean, unless I'm reading this wrong.
I was just going by CHOLINE content...!=PC.

Not sure by weight how much choline in PC...my google-fu is weak tonight.
 
thesinner

thesinner

Recovering AXoholic
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
I was just going by CHOLINE content...!=PC.

Not sure by weight how much choline in PC...my google-fu is weak tonight.
There's really not a definite answer to this, however, since there's no set ruling as to what carboxylic (fatty) acids are bound to the gyceryl group. Don't worry, your google-fu power isn't deteriorating.

Yes, the content of actual choline is going to be smaller; however, lecithin not only has a greater oral bioavailability than choline salts, but tends to elevate serum choline levels for a longer period of time.

If anything, I would say a combination of lecithin and another choline (such as citrate) might make for an effective as well as economical stack.
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
If anything, I would say a combination of lecithin and another choline (such as citrate) might make for an effective as well as economical stack.
I'll agree with you here, but mostly because lecithin has MANY benefits far beyond just a source for Choline.

And as you pouint out, it is extremely cheap.

Should be able to pick up Bulk Lecithin at any natural foods store worth a dime.
 
thesinner

thesinner

Recovering AXoholic
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
I'll agree with you here, but mostly because lecithin has MANY benefits far beyond just a source for Choline.

And as you pouint out, it is extremely cheap.

Should be able to pick up Bulk Lecithin at any natural foods store worth a dime.
Actually where I picked up my lecithin. And a good thing I did, the girl working the cashier was HOT! It was a rather enjoyable lecithin purchase.
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Actually where I picked up my lecithin. And a good thing I did, the girl working the cashier was HOT! It was a rather enjoyable lecithin purchase.
did you tell her one of the side benefits of Lecithin supplementation is better quality/bigger loads?
 
thesinner

thesinner

Recovering AXoholic
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
did you tell her one of the side benefits of Lecithin supplementation is better quality/bigger loads?
20 minutes after her shift ended....she found that out the hard way. (No, not really, that'd be awesome though).

Oh, I've also using this in conjunction with ALCAR, which Ive read that increased levels of free carnitines increases sperm quality.
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
20 minutes after her shift ended....she found that out the hard way. (No, not really, that'd be awesome though).
"It's the most natural, organic thing in the world, baby"
 
John Smeton

John Smeton

Legend
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
20 minutes after her shift ended....she found that out the hard way. (No, not really, that'd be awesome though).

Oh, I've also using this in conjunction with ALCAR, which Ive read that increased levels of free carnitines increases sperm quality.
Yes you are correct. Alcar is one of the only compounds I know o that increases male fertility. In additon it speeds up Testostrone metabolism. I have a theory that Alcar may be used in conjunction with a natural test booster for better results. It could be off and it makes sense to me.
 
asianbabe

asianbabe

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
Just a quick update. I am getting the most benefit from the Bacopa Monnieri because I tried using it alone and for sure, that is the best thing in my stack. Bacopa is amazing! I feel so relaxed and mentally sharp. I also read a study that showed Bacopa increased T4 levels and I can confirm this because my waist is getting tighter and my pants lose around the waist. I wish Nutra carried this.
Great news, I need to experiment with Bacopa a little more. Should be good at night to unwind, possibly with some theanine...
 
strategicmove

strategicmove

Legend
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
...I also read a study that showed Bacopa increased T4 levels...
Agree. Bacopa significantly boosts thyroid function. It modulates thyroid-hormone levels via enhancement of T4 synthesis and conversion of T4 (normally synthesized from free tyrosine) to biologically active T3. It is also a potent adaptogen.
 
strategicmove

strategicmove

Legend
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
Great news, I need to experiment with Bacopa a little more. Should be good at night to unwind, possibly with some theanine...
Lipotrophin-PM contains Bacopa Monnieri standardized to 40% Bacosides! Besides, Lipotrophin-PM also contains Mucuna Pruriens (standardized to 25% L-Dopa), Green Tea Extract (50% EGCG), and Banaba Extract (1% Corosolic Acid). Might be worth considering :D
 

jermcpicky

New member
Awards
0
Huperzine and Galantamine

Huperzine and galantamine have both worked VERY well for me.

Huperzine I take 50 mg every 2 hours when I'm studying hardcore or just really needing to get things done. Half-life is about 4 hours and can leave you feeling kind of dumb for a half hour or so.

Galantamine I take 4 mg usually just once in a day because it has an 8 hour half-life.

Dosage is tricky. Too little = nothing. Too much = depression symptoms, not cool. I currently take the huperzine because the galantamine I have is in 8 mg form and I'm too lazy to break it open; plus I once took the 8 mg galantamine on an empty stomach and felt like absolute **** for 8 hours; 2 of which were in the bathroom. I don't know why, but it's pretty important to take these with some food; or at least it is for me to, heh.

Also, remember, there is always the pharma route where you can buy Aricept (donezepil), Memantine, or Exelon (rivastigmine). These are Alzheimer's drugs and Exelon is even available in a trans-dermal patch form.

Half-lives of the pharma drugs:

Aricept: 70 hours (almost 3 days)
Memantine: 60 - 100 hours (2.5 to 4 days)
Exelon: 1.5 hours (patch - 24 hours)

I looked up prices for these from indian pharms and they come to:
Aricept: $ 77 for 50 x 10mg = around $0.77 per day
Memantine $180 for 50 x 10mg = around $1.14 per day
Exelon: $ 38 for 50 x 6 mg = around $0.76 per day (not sure about patch)

I thought about doing one of these, but have had good luck with the huperzine. I bet there are some people out there taking this stuff that don't have Alzheimer's though, and I bet they don't forget much, but I also think they might experience significant down-regulation of their nicotinic acetylcholine receptors because of the huge half-lives. Though it may be a tad bit unethical to use the pharma without having Alzheimer's, it's a way lesser offense than all these college kids absolutely abusing adderall and such.
 
strategicmove

strategicmove

Legend
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
Huperzine and galantamine have both worked VERY well for me.

Huperzine I take 50 mg every 2 hours when I'm studying hardcore or just really needing to get things done. Half-life is about 4 hours and can leave you feeling kind of dumb for a half hour or so.

Galantamine I take 4 mg usually just once in a day because it has an 8 hour half-life.

Dosage is tricky. Too little = nothing. Too much = depression symptoms, not cool. I currently take the huperzine because the galantamine I have is in 8 mg form and I'm too lazy to break it open; plus I once took the 8 mg galantamine on an empty stomach and felt like absolute **** for 8 hours; 2 of which were in the bathroom. I don't know why, but it's pretty important to take these with some food; or at least it is for me to, heh...
Galantamine (Galanthamine) is said to be one of the most effective nootropics around. By the way, 50mg of Huperzine every two hours sound exceedingly high! My recollection of the recommended dosage is more like 50mcg once or twice daily. I also recall that Huperzine A should not be taken, if one is also on other acetylcholinesterase inhibitors such as Tacrine or Aricept.
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Galantamine (Galanthamine) is said to be one of the most effective nootropics around. By the way, 50mg of Huperzine every two hours sound exceedingly high! My recollection of the recommended dosage is more like 50mcg once or twice daily. I also recall that Huperzine A should not be taken, if one is also on other acetylcholinesterase inhibitors such as Tacrine or Aricept.
Not to mention the fact that Galanthamine is ALSO an acetylcholineesterase inhibitor.

One or the other, I say.
 
strategicmove

strategicmove

Legend
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
Not to mention the fact that Galanthamine is ALSO an acetylcholineesterase inhibitor.

One or the other, I say.
Absolutely!
 

jermcpicky

New member
Awards
0
Galanthamine and Huperzine A

Yeah, these are both acetylcholinesterase inhibitors. I meant mcg when I said mg; hopefully that was obvious, hah. A 50 mg dose of the GNC brand huperzine would cost $300. I have tried the Source Naturals brand at 200 mcg and it just does not work at all. It was WAY cheaper, but also just didn't work for me. 4 x 50mg of the GNC brand works so well it's unreal, so I jumped on the Source Naturals deal and will probably just be throwing the bottle away. :( Galanthamine, on the other hand, works extremely well, but only WHEN it works. For some reason, when I take the Galantamind brand stuff, it either works extremely well or it makes me feel terrible physically and emotionally. I don't know if it's too much choline or what, but I can't figure out why it happens like that with me. I'd try it two days in a row when both would work well, two days in a row when both would work terribly, and mostly two days in a row where one worked and one didn't. I was not taking anything except for a One-A-Day multivitamin with this and my diet was mostly cereal and protein shakes. Anybody else had similar problems with galanthamine or huperzine being inconsistent? The GNC Huperzine has been consistent with me, but not the Galantamind. What other brands of galanthamine have some of you tried? Any bulk suppliers? It's almost finals week so it's kind of a big deal for me, haha.
 
strategicmove

strategicmove

Legend
Awards
2
  • Legend!
  • Established
...Galanthamine, on the other hand, works extremely well, but only WHEN it works. For some reason, when I take the Galantamind brand stuff, it either works extremely well or it makes me feel terrible physically and emotionally. I don't know if it's too much choline or what, but I can't figure out why it happens like that with me. I'd try it two days in a row when both would work well, two days in a row when both would work terribly, and mostly two days in a row where one worked and one didn't. I was not taking anything except for a One-A-Day multivitamin with this and my diet was mostly cereal and protein shakes. Anybody else had similar problems with galanthamine or huperzine being inconsistent? The GNC Huperzine has been consistent with me, but not the Galantamind. What other brands of galanthamine have some of you tried? Any bulk suppliers? It's almost finals week so it's kind of a big deal for me, haha.
Your reaction to Galantamind may be an expression of over-stimulation of the cholinergic receptors. While acetylcholinesterase inhibition is a good thing during low acetylcholine levels, a dramatic elevation of acetylcholine levels can produce emotional stress in some users. Galantamind, with the inclusion of acetylcholine co-factors, may cumulatively boost acetylcholine to such an extent that less-than-desired effects emerge. Reducing the dose here may help. Alternatively, simultaneous use of other acetlycholinesterase inhibitors should be reviewed. As you know, galanthamine is the only acetylcholinesterase inhibitor that also stimulates nicotinic receptors (acetylcholine works by activation of acetylcholine receptors in the brain; these receptors are also activated by nicotine from tobacco). So, galanthamine produces a considerable boost in acetylcholine levels via two mechanisms, and may constitute an "overkill", depending on the dosage of course, if stacked with other acetylcholinesterase inhibitors.

Regarding other brands of Galantamine, there is one by Vitamin Research Products (VRP), called "Galantamine", and another by Beyond A Century called "Galanthamine".
 

Similar threads


Top