17 yrs old and need some help

[gerryh649t]

im a senior in high school. im built pretty well i only weigh 160 but everyone compliments me on my large chest and big arms and a great body. pretty much every one of my friends are into lifting. more than half of them are using real gear or at least ph's and most dont know what they are doing or what pct is or even have their diets in check. after researching every night for about 2 months i have come to the conclusion that thats really not the route i want to go because im far from ready and dont want to hurt myself in the long run. about 5 months ago i went to the local vitamin world and told the woman im interested in building muscle mass. she sold me a bottle of methyl 1d which lasted me a month. i really think it worked well for me even though most of the reviews i read on it wer ****ty. i also had to turn to soy for my source of protein because iv been pretty much cursed with horrible cystic acne if i consume any type of dairy at all and i mean it can get really bad (this has been goin on for 4 years and it took a lot of research and a lot of dermatologist visits to figure out the problem). my skin is extremely clear now after 6 months of almost an all organic diet. i eat VERY clean and i eat alot of it. what im trying to get to is asking you guys what can help me achieve my goals of lean muscle mass. more of a natural way for my age. creatine? i see a ton of creatine products and i have no idea which one to go with. keep in mind nothing with lactose or dairy. i should also add that im at the gym 5 nights a week, i do 10 minutes of cardio before working out and another 50 minutes concentrated on 1 or 2 muscles a night.

 

[nosnmiveins]

creatine, bcaa's and tonnnnnnnns of food. i get my protein from chicken,eggs,tuna, and whey

trust me if u eat like a horse u will gain plenty of size, 17 is just too young to look into supplements, im only 20 and im not touching a PH till im 40...ur friends who take them are IDIOTS :fool2:

 

[Dancebot 2000]

Stick to the basics. AVoid anything hormonal or sexy sounding. I know you want to grow like crazy, but you have sooooo much time. Slow and steady is going to win this race. Creatine is a good, safe idea. Get simple creatine monohydrate. It's dirt cheap and will cause great wet gains (which is perfect at your age). Make sure you take it with fast carbs (like in some juice) so you're body can absorb it. Take 20g the first 5 days and 5g (1 rounded teaspoon) each day after that (preferrably post workout). Eat alot, and lift heavy. Do lots of squats.

DB2000

 

[EasyEJL]

food food food. thats the only supplement you really need. concentrate on squats, deadlifts, legpresses, benchpresses. Those are your bigger mass gaining exercises as they recruit the most muscle mass.

Food

and then more food.

this is an ok list as far as carbs go

Must-have carb sources: green veggies (broccoli, cucumbers, lettuce, spinach, celery, asparagus, etc.)

Can-have carb sources: other veggies (except potatoes), berries (blueberries, raspberries, strawberries, blackberries, etc.), quinoa

Occasional carb sources: Other fruits

Rare carb sources: brown rice, whole wheat bread, whole wheat pasta, cream of wheat, potatoes, yams

Should-avoid carb sources: white bread, white pasta, oatmeal

Must-avoid carb source: pastries, cookies, candy and any other junk sugary food

for meats, just lean cuts of meats, avoid sandwich/deli meats. chicken breasts are cheap at walmart. For fats, get some coconut oil, its not too pricey and is healthy.

track your intake using something like fitday.com and then figure out where your maintenance is, and add 500 calories xtra to gain a lb a week

 

[Cellardude]

im a senior in high school. im built pretty well i only weigh 160 but everyone compliments me on my large chest and big arms and a great body. pretty much every one of my friends are into lifting. more than half of them are using real gear or at least ph's and most dont know what they are doing or what post cycle therapy is or even have their diets in check. after researching every night for about 2 months i have come to the conclusion that thats really not the route i want to go because im far from ready and dont want to hurt myself in the long run. about 5 months ago i went to the local vitamin world and told the woman im interested in building muscle mass. she sold me a bottle of methyl 1d which lasted me a month. i really think it worked well for me even though most of the reviews i read on it wer ****ty. i also had to turn to soy for my source of protein because iv been pretty much cursed with horrible cystic acne if i consume any type of dairy at all and i mean it can get really bad (this has been goin on for 4 years and it took a lot of research and a lot of dermatologist visits to figure out the problem). my skin is extremely clear now after 6 months of almost an all organic diet. i eat VERY clean and i eat alot of it. what im trying to get to is asking you guys what can help me achieve my goals of lean muscle mass. more of a natural way for my age. creatine? i see a ton of creatine products and i have no idea which one to go with. keep in mind nothing with lactose or dairy. i should also add that im at the gym 5 nights a week, i do 10 minutes of cardio before working out and another 50 minutes concentrated on 1 or 2 muscles a night.

LOL! Hey buddy! You sounded exactly like me last year. I too break out with acne from protien. I found out however that I cannot take whey protien concentrate. Try it. Go to GNC and pick up about 6 bottles of Isopure. They are ionized Whey protien isolate and it's solved my acne problem. If this does cure your acne case it saves you a trip to the dermatoligist because those can get pricy. Whey protien isolate I believe is 100% whey and nothing that contains any lactose in it. (not 100% sure) For creatine get yourself something basic like Green Magnitude. It's very tasty, cheap, effective and great for beginners. (did I mention the sour apple is amazing?) Throw in some White Flood along with the GM and get yourself some bulk citrulline malate. VERY effective muscle building stack. Citrulline Malate helps prevent build up of lactic acids which should help your workout at the gym. Get them and you won't be sorry. :thumbsup: Also try Isopure and tell me how it goes ( no milk in it, works great for me since I have the same problem)

 

[Necroticism]

when it comes to creatine, i seem to get my best gains with kre-alkalyn. i think a bottle of scifit kre-alkalyn is 13 dollars for 60 pills and about 30 for 240 pills. i prefer to be able to take 2 pills opposed to having to mix shakes all day long.

 

[CHA0S]

if you are looking to get stronger. try managing these three workouts into your routine
1. Squats
2. Deadlifts
3. Power Cleans

these three are major workouts that contributes to all muscles. whether its a primary or secondary muscle being involved.

 

[heebs10]

get any creatine mono, its all pretty much the same. other wise just be patient, it sounds like u r really on the right track unlike many people your age that come on here for advise. just keep at it , you will get there.

 

[EctoPower]

Some good suggestions for you. I think food is the best thing to concentrate on. Creatine mono will help also, and if you want to amp up your workouts a little, you could try a stim. Basic caffeine pills are probably safest and definitely cheapest.

As far as workouts, a couple other guys touched on it, but I can't stress enough the focus on compound movements with heavy weight. Look into MaxOT on the AST Sports Science website. I'm a big fan of that routine.

Stay patient and eat big. :food:

Good luck.

 

[gerryh649t]

Thanks alot guys i will def. take all of this advise. the only thing im worried about is with soy protein it is VERY estrogen promoting and the woman at vitamin world said i cud develop some breasts like women? if this is true would an estrogen blocking supplement be a thought?

 

[nosnmiveins]

never heard of it before. if u are lactose intollerant i would suggest getting Lactaid Milk...theres whole, fat free, and 2%

 

[EasyEJL]

soy in theory can cause that, but so in theory can caffeine. you wouldnt want to take an AI daily except at a very low dose. at your age I woudl think the downsides of taking an AI are worse than the amount of estrogen soy would add. Look into gemma protein (pea based) as an alternative as well

 

[Irish Cannon]

First things first, smack the whore that sold you Methyl-1D at the age of 17.

Next, keep on eating tons of food. Play with your diet to find what works for you. Get some of the basic supplements like Whey, Creatine Monohydrate, Flax oil, Fish oil, Multi vitamin, Dessicated liver, Beta alanine, and HMB. Train hard and be consistent.

 

[EctoPower]

Thanks alot guys i will def. take all of this advise. the only thing im worried about is with soy protein it is VERY estrogen promoting and the woman at vitamin world said i cud develop some breasts like women? if this is true would an estrogen blocking supplement be a thought?

Gerry, repeat after me:

"The woman at Vitamin World is retarded. The woman at Vitamin World is retarded..."

Soy protein won't give you breasts. And I'm pretty sure the supposed estrogen increase from soy has been proven false. Even if there is a slight increase in estrogen, it's not nearly enough to give a guy gynecomastia.

And if the Whey Protein Isolate that Cellardude suggested doesn't work out and you're still scared of soy, eat more meat and nuts. Milk and soy aren't the only protein sources out there, just two of the more convenient forms.

And don't try DHEA, estrogen blockers, aromatase inhibitors, testosterone boosters or any other hormone manipulator right now. At 17 y/o, they could do more harm than good and your natural test levels are higher now than they ever will be again. No need to mess with your hormones.

 

[Cellardude]

Gerry, repeat after me:

"The woman at Vitamin World is retarded. The woman at Vitamin World is retarded..."

Soy protein won't give you breasts. And I'm pretty sure the supposed estrogen increase from soy has been proven false. Even if there is a slight increase in estrogen, it's not nearly enough to give a guy gynecomastia.

And if the Whey Protein Isolate that Cellardude suggested doesn't work out and you're still scared of soy, eat more meat and nuts. Milk and soy aren't the only protein sources out there, just two of the more convenient forms.

And don't try DHEA, estrogen blockers, aromatase inhibitors, testosterone boosters or any other hormone manipulator right now. At 17 y/o, they could do more harm than good and your natural test levels are higher now than they ever will be again. No need to mess with your hormones.

good posting, I saw this a few hours ago, but I had to leave the house ( had to get to class). Lady's a retard. soy may increase estrogen but you cannot associate an increase in estrogen from soy to gyno. That's retarded. Try a few bottles of whey protien isolate, you dont have to buy a full bottle. It might work for you like it does for me, just watch out for the whey protien concentrate.

 

[opfor101]

creatine, bcaa's and tonnnnnnnns of food. i get my protein from chicken,eggs,tuna, and whey

trust me if u eat like a horse u will gain plenty of size, 17 is just too young to look into supplements, im only 20 and im not touching a PH till im 40...ur friends who take them are IDIOTS :fool2:

17 isnt too young for supplements at all

BCAA's, protein, creatine
all benefit teenagers as well

Now PH's and steroids are a WHOLE differnt issue.

 

[gerryh649t]

thanks alot guys for your help and concern. i ordered some of supplement directs micronized creatine today and also went to sams club and bought a big package of chicken breasts.

 

[EctoPower]

thanks alot guys for your help and concern. i ordered some of supplement directs micronized creatine today and also went to sams club and bought a big package of chicken breasts.

Nice dude. Eat your face off, lift like a freak and you'll see results.

 

[CHA0S]

thanks alot guys for your help and concern. i ordered some of supplement directs micronized creatine today and also went to sams club and bought a big package of chicken breasts.

cook the chicken in EVOO and you've got a really simple, good meal.

 

[Liteweight]

Hey man
Im sort of in your place as well
I am goin on 19 real soon and it is soo hard for me to gain and I eat like a freak of nature and my diet is very healthy and supposed to help me bulk
But unlike you I dont have a large chest or large arms or access fat to turn into muscle
My main problem is my excessivly high metabolism is very high
The muscle I have while not being large it is very toned which I like
My words while not being wise and were already statedby other members is to eat eat eat
They dont necessarily have to be big meals just plentyful
and junk foods and alcohal well for me are out of the picture
Im currently doing some research on supplements or vitamins that will slow down my metabolism but I keep on getting side tracked
So anyone who would like to lend me a hand there it would be appreciated
I hope I helped atleast the slightest bit Im sure you knew all of that anyways
-Cheers and good luck with it all

 

[opfor101]

Hey man
Im sort of in your place as well
I am goin on 19 real soon and it is soo hard for me to gain and I eat like a freak of nature and my diet is very healthy and supposed to help me bulk
But unlike you I dont have a large chest or large arms or access fat to turn into muscle
My main problem is my excessivly high metabolism is very high
The muscle I have while not being large it is very toned which I like
My words while not being wise and were already statedby other members is to eat eat eat
They dont necessarily have to be big meals just plentyful
and junk foods and alcohal well for me are out of the picture
Im currently doing some research on supplements or vitamins that will slow down my metabolism but I keep on getting side tracked
So anyone who would like to lend me a hand there it would be appreciated
I hope I helped atleast the slightest bit Im sure you knew all of that anyways
-Cheers and good luck with it all

:wtf:


no supplement will decrease your metabolism.
just dont run as much.

how many calories do you take in everyday?
since you sound like an ectomorph, you can do a dirty bulk.

 

[EctoPower]

Hey man
Im sort of in your place as well
I am goin on 19 real soon and it is soo hard for me to gain and I eat like a freak of nature and my diet is very healthy and supposed to help me bulk
But unlike you I dont have a large chest or large arms or access fat to turn into muscle
My main problem is my excessivly high metabolism is very high
The muscle I have while not being large it is very toned which I like
My words while not being wise and were already statedby other members is to eat eat eat
They dont necessarily have to be big meals just plentyful
and junk foods and alcohal well for me are out of the picture
Im currently doing some research on supplements or vitamins that will slow down my metabolism but I keep on getting side tracked
So anyone who would like to lend me a hand there it would be appreciated
I hope I helped atleast the slightest bit Im sure you knew all of that anyways
-Cheers and good luck with it all

OK, there are several things wrong with this post. First, your metabolism will slow as you age, so take advantage of it now. Don't try to slow it down. You'll regret the hell out of that. Second, fat does not turn into muscle. It just doesn't. If you're already lean and you want mass, you need to focus on your routine and your diet.

Are you eating enough? Really? Re-examine it. Check on your macro breakdown. Are you getting enough protein from whole foods? Not shakes, those are for pre and post workout and maybe casein before bed. Ectomorphs in particular need a ton of whole food protein sources. This is a big piece that people miss. Your body cannot build new muscle without the building blocks. That means protein, protein, protein. Take a close look at your diet and see if there's a way to improve it.

As far as routines go, look into MaxOT. It works well for everyone and has plenty of variety to change things up and keep it interesting. Plus it requires doing compound moves with heavy weight. Not only is this the most effective way to train, imo, but it's also the most fun.

 

[Liteweight]

well my eating schedule is whenever I feel the need to eat or if I think I should have something to eat even if its just a baked potato and few peices of rye bread
As for calorie intake IM not completly sure to a percise number but I would estimate about 3500 - 4000 on a daily basis
Could be a little more or a little less
And I like to eat tuna just about everyday along with chicken breats and other meats
And breakfast I usually have 2-3 potatos fried in olive oil along with 2 boiled eggs
I would eat this every morning before school and Ill eat some whole wheat pasta for lunch with some bread
and it goes on like that
Is it possible I am not getting enough sugars?
or is that just an absolute idiotic question

 

[EctoPower]

well my eating schedule is whenever I feel the need to eat or if I think I should have something to eat even if its just a baked potato and few peices of rye bread
As for calorie intake IM not completly sure to a percise number but I would estimate about 3500 - 4000 on a daily basis
Could be a little more or a little less
And I like to eat tuna just about everyday along with chicken breats and other meats
And breakfast I usually have 2-3 potatos fried in olive oil along with 2 boiled eggs
I would eat this every morning before school and Ill eat some whole wheat pasta for lunch with some bread
and it goes on like that
Is it possible I am not getting enough sugars?
or is that just an absolute idiotic question

Just based on what you say in the post above, it sounds like you're eating a high carb, low protein diet. Not good. Try replacing the fried potatoes with some oatmeal and double the eggs. Pasta and bread for lunch and no protein? Try a tuna sandwhich, or re-heat a chicken breast with some veg. And I'm assuming that's wheat bread you're talking about. If it's white bread, you might as well drink anti-freeze because that sh*t will kill you.

Sugar doesn't build muscle, protein does. I think you're protein deficient. You can cook up a week's worth of chicken breasts and keep them in the fridge for lunches. Tuna is a great option too, and easy. Hamburgers work. If you want to get really fancy, bake a salmon filet for dinner.

I also think you have too much starch and grain for your carb supply and not enough veg. Again, you may not be giving me the whole picture here, but I don't see mention of fruits and vegetables anywhere. Green beans, brocoli, basically any green leafy veg. Those are all good with lunches and dinners. Blueberries or apples could be good with breakfast. I throw 1/2 a cup of frozen blueberries in my oatmeal in the morning. That pretty much takes care of my daily supply of fruit in one sitting. Just a thought.

Try changing up just a couple things at a time and get used to it. I wouldn't recommend totally changing your whole diet at once because it may be too much of a shock and you also won't know what is really working and what isn't. Take your time and see how you respond to changes.

 

[Liteweight]

I am also taking whey protein shakes and I eat almonds all the time (forgot to mention) drink milk a lot
And the bread is whole grain bread (only dark bread)
I should also state that I know that sugar will not build muscle but would it help me gain some weight
Im not sure of my body fat percentage but I garuntee it is really low
and fruit and vegtables I have my share
2 apples a day most days (mainly because I like the taste)
and green veggies is what I was mainly brought up on
every homemade meal has atleast 2 servings of veggies thanks to my momma
Haha
and that chicken breast idea will be taken to heart and 1 more question
Milk or water with my whey Protein shake
I know both can be used but is it really worth mixing it with milk all the time?

 

[EctoPower]

I am also taking whey protein shakes and I eat almonds all the time (forgot to mention) drink milk a lot
And the bread is whole grain bread (only dark bread)
I should also state that I know that sugar will not build muscle but would it help me gain some weight
Im not sure of my body fat percentage but I garuntee it is really low
and fruit and vegtables I have my share
2 apples a day most days (mainly because I like the taste)
and green veggies is what I was mainly brought up on
every homemade meal has atleast 2 servings of veggies thanks to my momma
Haha
and that chicken breast idea will be taken to heart and 1 more question
Milk or water with my whey Protein shake
I know both can be used but is it really worth mixing it with milk all the time?

OK, that sounds better. I still think you need to to up your protein from whole foods, rather than shakes. Milk is fine with your shakes. I use water most of the time, especially pre-w/o because the milk sits too heavy in my stomach during a workout. But there's nothing really wrong with it and if you're looking for more calories, that's one way to get some.

 

[Liteweight]

Thanks a lot

 

[TenMan]

Educate yourself on diet and nutrition timing, along w/ how to lift properly; what moves are a waste of time and what moves will bring you the best results.
Build your routine around heavy deads, squat and bench. Everything else is secondary to these three moves.

Real food + Compound Moves + Rest + Time = You being a monster.

Eat, eat, eat, eat, eat, eat, eat, lift, rest, rest, and repeat.

 

[ahsbaseball08]

Sup bro, im 18 and ive been lifting for about 2 years steady, like really commiting my self, not just going and sitting around checkin out babes. ( which isnt a bad idea ) but i workout before that. lol

When i was 17, i kept it simple, started out with whey protein. 3 shakes a day, taking in as many calories as possible. Trying to bulk up.

Then i got on the Pre-workout train, MRI;s NO2. Just for a little boost, so i can maximize my workouts, and get as much done as possible, worked good for me. I took half the recommended dosage though, it says 4 before workouts, i took 2 sometimes 3. Cause i was a smaller guy, and didnt need much.

Then after i started to fill out a little better, i bought some creatine mono-hydrate. DIRT CHEAP STUFF!! Took that as recommended.

A bunch of my freinds i go to school with, 16-19yrs old. Started taking PH, TEST BOOSTERS. I bought some, but later turned it down and sold it. Because i found this wonderful website, and did some research, and asked around. And eveyone on here said NO! DO NOT. So i didnt, later finding out why, im glad i didnt.

Your young, keep it simple.

Eat, Eat, Eat.
workout workout workout.
sleep sleep sleep.

repeat.

Do some research on here, in the search thread. There is plenty of info out there for us young guys.

- Kevin

 

[Cellardude]

Sup bro, im 18 and ive been lifting for about 2 years steady, like really commiting my self, not just going and sitting around checkin out babes. ( which isnt a bad idea ) but i workout before that. lol

When i was 17, i kept it simple, started out with whey protein. 3 shakes a day, taking in as many calories as possible. Trying to bulk up.

Then i got on the Pre-workout train, MRI;s NO2. Just for a little boost, so i can maximize my workouts, and get as much done as possible, worked good for me. I took half the recommended dosage though, it says 4 before workouts, i took 2 sometimes 3. Cause i was a smaller guy, and didnt need much.

Then after i started to fill out a little better, i bought some creatine mono-hydrate. DIRT CHEAP STUFF!! Took that as recommended.

A bunch of my freinds i go to school with, 16-19yrs old. Started taking PH, TEST BOOSTERS. I bought some, but later turned it down and sold it. Because i found this wonderful website, and did some research, and asked around. And eveyone on here said NO! DO NOT. So i didnt, later finding out why, im glad i didnt.

Your young, keep it simple.

Eat, Eat, Eat.
workout workout workout.
sleep sleep sleep.

repeat.

Do some research on here, in the search thread. There is plenty of info out there for us young guys.

- Kevin

good posting. Only one problem

NO2 -ewww


haha jk. repped!

 

[ahsbaseball08]

good posting. Only one problem

NO2 -ewww


haha jk. repped!

lol thanks bro,

yeah, theres other stuff. but i was being honest.

 

[EasyEJL]

any of the NO products are more for how you feel about yourself rather than giving any real benefit, but how you feel about yourself does pretty directly translate into your in gym results high motivation helps

 

[ahsbaseball08]

any of the NO products are more for how you feel about yourself rather than giving any real benefit, but how you feel about yourself does pretty directly translate into your in gym results high motivation helps

True- with that said though, i still feel a slight pick me up in my morning workouts.

its helps.

 

[Cellardude]

True- with that said though, i still feel a slight pick me up in my morning workouts.

its helps.

I agree strongly on this part. Ive tried morning workouts and afternoon workouts. I went from afternoon workouts to morning workouts. It's completely different. Morning pick me up N.O products in my opinion really help in making the highly motivated anabolic state although they don't directly lead to muscle growth. A bad morning with some bad lifting = slow growth.

 

[ahsbaseball08]

I agree strongly on this part. Ive tried morning workouts and afternoon workouts. I went from afternoon workouts to morning workouts. It's completely different. Morning pick me up N.O products in my opinion really help in making the highly motivated anabolic state although they don't directly lead to muscle growth. A bad morning with a some bad lifting = slow growth.

Agree'd!

 

[EasyEJL]

NO Shotgun always had me ready to puke, but gave great intensity

 

[Cellardude]

NO Shotgun always had me ready to puke, but gave great intensity

white flood is the sh1t for morning workouts.

 

[ahsbaseball08]

CMI- NO3 OVRLOAD. Is my morning workout weapon of Choice.
5 tabs, of the recommended 4.

HXC bbr's - 6 tabs.