muscle perserving cut stack

[ripped22]

i know cutting is all in the diet but what natural products do you recommend for perserving muscle and staying "full" while on a diet. i am starting bootcamp training M and SAT and cardio on WED. keep in mind im on 250 test e a week. (234 lbs 11% 6'1".)

 

[Cellardude]

i would have said clen but you said natural. :lol:

Leviathan is a really good muscle preserving cut product. All natural, Increase testosterone and helps you hold onto the most muscles as possible. You should probably take a look at it. Leviathan Reloaded is new and yet to be released ( this week I believe ) but I think that would be a straight cutter? Not too sure. But definately look into Leviathan.

 

[onelife]

im not really sure what you are saying.. you are on 250mg of test e per week?

if thats the case than throw in some bcaas and eat every two hours and you should be just fine in maintaining lean muscle tissue.

 

[strategicmove]

im not really sure what you are saying.. you are on 250mg of test e per week?

if thats the case than throw in some bcaas and eat every two hours and you should be just fine in maintaining lean muscle tissue.

I agree BCAAs are crucial for anti-catabolism. Be sure to add extra L-Leucine.

 

[nelix]

EAA and fish oil whenever you have a spare moment to eat them...
Drive is pretty good for preservation (read the writeup)

 

[Travis]

im not really sure what you are saying.. you are on 250mg of test e per week?

if thats the case than throw in some bcaas and eat every two hours and you should be just fine in maintaining lean muscle tissue.

I'm guessing he is on TRT. If not then yeah what onelife said.

 

[Vitruvian]

I'd read up on a Drive/Neovar stack.

 

[asianbabe]

DCP/Leviathan.

Should definitely help with maintaining strength, increasing endurance and losing FAT on a recomp or cut.

 

[grila jujitsu]

OK so what i found to be the best formula for a cut wail maintaining muscle or even gaining muscle is,perfect diet, levi/levi R, mega dose bcca (my fave in purple wrath), through in some cort blocker. like ax retain2 and a slight amount of creatine mono. when i mean a slight amount i mean like 1-1.5 grams pre and post workout. very small amounts!!!! if you do this bro you will get cut up and swoll as f*ck

/\ i call it the anti catabolic stack!

 

[john123131]

hmmmm lots of options...

bcaa's for sure...Leviathan/DCP...

 

[TommyTuffGuy]

I'm tellin' y'all! This stack I'm going to run in a few weeks once Leviathan Reloaded comes out.

2 Leviathan Reloaded
2 Lean Xtreme
2 Drive
(bottles)!!!:blink:

 

[john123131]

I'm tellin' y'all! This stack I'm going to run in a few weeks once Leviathan Reloaded comes out.

2 Leviathan Reloaded
2 Lean Xtreme
2 Drive
(bottles)!!!:blink:

sick stack....cant wait to see this

 

[Ryan Leal]

To get cut and keep muscle go with tons of protein and bcaas, a calorie restricted diet (be sure not to lower your calories to quickly or losing muscle with be inevitable), cla and fish oil (both proven to help with anti-catabolism), and maybe throw in some ephedra and caffiene after about a month of strict dieting...and be sure to do cardio.

And another word on cardio:
DO NOT DO CARDIO FIRST THING IN THE MORNING! Upon waking your body has been fasting for 8 hours (hopefully at least 8) and your muscles are starving for aminos. Most bodybuilder will just get up without eating anything and do there cardio under the impression that they will lose more bodyfat...this maybe true but with the bodyfat they lose they will also lose hard earned muscle. And DO NOT DO CARDIO IMMEDIATELY AFTER TRAINING either! After training your muscle have been beatin and are hunger for aminos and high glycemic carbs (dextrose) and jumping on the treadmill will make your body steal muscle to fuel your cardio. This obviously is not the goal so try to aviod this at all cost remember.

Remember be patient with fat lose because having muscle is the most important and hardest thing to hold onto.

 

[nelix]

I do morning cardio after a light shake... More for the mood lift than anything

 

[Rodja]

To get cut and keep muscle go with tons of protein and bcaas, a calorie restricted diet (be sure not to lower your calories to quickly or losing muscle with be inevitable), cla and fish oil (both proven to help with anti-catabolism), and maybe throw in some ephedra and caffiene after about a month of strict dieting...and be sure to do cardio.

And another word on cardio:
DO NOT DO CARDIO FIRST THING IN THE MORNING! Upon waking your body has been fasting for 8 hours (hopefully at least 8) and your muscles are starving for aminos. Most bodybuilder will just get up without eating anything and do there cardio under the impression that they will lose more bodyfat...this maybe true but with the bodyfat they lose they will also lose hard earned muscle. And DO NOT DO CARDIO IMMEDIATELY AFTER TRAINING either! After training your muscle have been beatin and are hunger for aminos and high glycemic carbs (dextrose) and jumping on the treadmill will make your body steal muscle to fuel your cardio. This obviously is not the goal so try to aviod this at all cost remember.

Remember be patient with fat lose because having muscle is the most important and hardest thing to hold onto.

I disagree on your statement about cardio after training. 30-40 minutes of steady-state, moderate intensity cardio is a great way to lose fat. Also, if losing fat is your goal, then cutting out all high-GI carbs is the smartest way to go.

Using 30g or so of BCAAs throughout the day is something I highly recommend. A topical anti-cort supplement is also a great way to reduce catabolism and to increase fat loss.

 

[Ryan Leal]

I disagree on your statement about cardio after training. 30-40 minutes of steady-state, moderate intensity cardio is a great way to lose fat. Also, if losing fat is your goal, then cutting out all high-GI carbs is the smartest way to go.

Using 30g or so of BCAAs throughout the day is something I highly recommend. A topical anti-cort supplement is also a great way to reduce catabolism and to increase fat loss.

I never said cardio after training wasnt a good way to lose extra fat...i said cardio after training when u should be consuming your postworkout meals is counterproductive. It interfers with the recovery process, which alone is responsible for growth.
And I dont believe anyone should ever cut out high gi carbs postworkout. Science has proven this:

Don’t underestimate the importance of carb timing for triggering glycogen synthesis after a workout. Not only is a bodybuilders total work capacity correlated directly to the amount of glucose/glycogen held within muscle, the process of glycogen accumulation triggers an immediate “cell volumizing” effect, a potent anabolic response. The right carbohydrate timing strategy will amplify the anabolic stimulus of resistance training.[1,3,20]

The research on carbohydrate intake and weight lifting shows that the consumption of a carbohydrate supplement just before (or during) an intense workout can save valuable muscle glycogen stores from complete depletion, as well as enhance total lifting capacity during the workout. [15,16] While training without using a carb supplement before weight training results in muscle carb depletion, and poor weight training performance [14], supplementing just before or during training, results in only a 13.7% decrease in muscle glycogen content and more weight lifted, for more reps in every working set![16-18]

A carbohydrate supplement consumed immediately before or after weight training is shown to directly affect the hormonal response. Taken before training, a carb supplement will maintain blood sugar levels, and restore insulin levels. The presence of insulin is vital for stimulating muscle protein synthesis rates. [19] A carb supplement taken immediately after training increases insulin concentration while decreasing 3-methylhistidine and urea nitrogen excretion (all examples of reduced muscle breakdown).[20]

Consuming a carbohydrate supplement after resistance training also enhances the growth hormone response and reduces circulating cortisol concentrations.[21,22] Cortisol is the number one glucocorticoids hormone that is responsible for muscle breakdown. Carb timing stops cortisol elevation dead in its tracks.

For more on carbohydrates http://ast-ss.com/articles/article.asp?AID=129

 

[Ryan Leal]

I do morning cardio after a light shake... More for the mood lift than anything

Good idea just be sure to drink a postworkout shake of simple carbs (dextrose) and whey protein isolate afterwards.

 

[msucurt]

A topical anti-cort supplement is also a great way to reduce catabolism and to increase fat loss.

Rodja, i know u have mentioned this before, and i even think i asked you about this....but what do you feel is the best topical supplement for fat loss? Lipo-U....Lipo-Y....Napalm? Adding accessories like RK, clen, yoh....etc...

thanks

 

[Rodja]

Rodja, i know u have mentioned this before, and i even think i asked you about this....but what do you feel is the best topical supplement for fat loss? Lipo-U....Lipo-Y....Napalm? Adding accessories like RK, clen, yoh....etc...

thanks

I am a huge fan of Lipo-U with clen rotated every 7 days, but I will hold off on saying what the absolute best is until I try out some Napalm.

 

[Rodja]

I never said cardio after training wasnt a good way to lose extra fat...i said cardio after training when u should be consuming your postworkout meals is counterproductive. It interfers with the recovery process, which alone is responsible for growth.
And I dont believe anyone should ever cut out high gi carbs postworkout. Science has proven this:

Don’t underestimate the importance of carb timing for triggering glycogen synthesis after a workout. Not only is a bodybuilders total work capacity correlated directly to the amount of glucose/glycogen held within muscle, the process of glycogen accumulation triggers an immediate “cell volumizing” effect, a potent anabolic response. The right carbohydrate timing strategy will amplify the anabolic stimulus of resistance training.[1,3,20]

The research on carbohydrate intake and weight lifting shows that the consumption of a carbohydrate supplement just before (or during) an intense workout can save valuable muscle glycogen stores from complete depletion, as well as enhance total lifting capacity during the workout. [15,16] While training without using a carb supplement before weight training results in muscle carb depletion, and poor weight training performance [14], supplementing just before or during training, results in only a 13.7% decrease in muscle glycogen content and more weight lifted, for more reps in every working set![16-18]

A carbohydrate supplement consumed immediately before or after weight training is shown to directly affect the hormonal response. Taken before training, a carb supplement will maintain blood sugar levels, and restore insulin levels. The presence of insulin is vital for stimulating muscle protein synthesis rates. [19] A carb supplement taken immediately after training increases insulin concentration while decreasing 3-methylhistidine and urea nitrogen excretion (all examples of reduced muscle breakdown).[20]

Consuming a carbohydrate supplement after resistance training also enhances the growth hormone response and reduces circulating cortisol concentrations.[21,22] Cortisol is the number one glucocorticoids hormone that is responsible for muscle breakdown. Carb timing stops cortisol elevation dead in its tracks.

For more on carbohydrates http://ast-ss.com/articles/article.asp?AID=129

It's nice to see you can do a cut and paste job from a company that sells high-GI post-WO formulas. There is ZERO reason to have a huge insulin spike after training. For starters, there are just as many, if not more, studies showing that overall carb consumption is more important than timing. Glycogen synthesis is a process, not an event. Also, by creating hyperinsulemia, you negate any fat loss that may take place post-training.

It is a much smarter idea to use low to moderate GI carbs after training along with a protein/leucine drink.

 

[Ryan Leal]

So u do not feel high gi carbs should be consumed postworkout for gylcogen resenthisis? Consuming low gi carbs pwo would take to long to be shuttled into your starving muscles wouldnt u say?

 

[Rodja]

So u do not feel high gi carbs should be consumed postworkout for gylcogen resenthisis? Consuming low gi carbs pwo would take to long to be shuttled into your starving muscles wouldnt u say?

I guess you ignored the statement saying that glycogen resynthesis is a process. You do not exhaust your glycogen stores in an hour so it is foolish to say that you can refill them in the same timeframe. Focus on proper nutrition throughout the day instead of just around training.

 

[Ryan Leal]

I guess you ignored the statement saying that glycogen resynthesis is a process. You do not exhaust your glycogen stores in an hour so it is foolish to say that you can refill them in the same timeframe. Focus on proper nutrition throughout the day instead of just around training.

Its interesting to hear that...ive always heard postworkout your muscles have been depleted of glycogen and need hi gi carbs to replenish there stores...like a dry sponge...it sounds logical to me and seems to be what most bodybuilders do.

 

[Rodja]

Its interesting to hear that...ive always heard postworkout your muscles have been depleted of glycogen and need hi gi carbs to replenish there stores...like a dry sponge...it sounds logical to me and seems to be what most bodybuilders do.

Why does it sound logical?? Many supplement companies have mistakenly mixed up performance and aesthetics when it comes to carbohydrate consumption. If you are a performance athlete, such as a cyclist or fighter, then using a mix of high and low is a good idea, but if physique is your goal, then stick with low GI.

If you are trying to cut, then, obviously, aesthetics are your concern. Low GI carbs do not have the insulin spikes and, therefore, lower any chances of storing those carbs as fat. Insulin is not tissue specific and the spikes from high GI can lead to storage within fat in addition to muscle tissue.

 

[Force of Green]

I think that a good cutting stack would be Drive, 7-Cort, and Blaze. Or even just drop the Blaze and run Drive and 7-Cort, but for an extra 20 bucks, you'll get a non-stim that helps boost thyroid function and will definitely got you 'blazing' during workouts.