Calories in BCAA's?

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    Calories in BCAA's?


    so I havent supplemented bcaa's yet so I decided to give it a shot since I'm on a recomp and was reading an article derek charlebois wrote on mega dosing and he said he removed 50 grams of protien and added 50 grams of bcaa's as to not add calories to his diet but I didnt think bcaa's had nutritional value well heres the article

    ****************************** ****************
    I have been using BCAA for the past three years. I have used large amounts of BCAA in the past, but never really contributed my results to the BCAA, though now I realize they played a big part in my results.

    Recently I began using large quantities of BCAA as part of a self-experiment and my results have been very impressive. I began "mega-dosing" BCAA in March using Scivation's Xtend as my source of BCAA. Xtend also contains citrulline malate (and glutamine), which as stated above, should work hand-to-hand with BCAA and increasing protein synthesis by elevating ATP levels.

    In order to really put Xtend to the test, I decreased my protein intake by 50 grams (200 calories) and replaced that with 50 grams of BCAA. I did this because if I would have just added 50 grams of BCAA, I would be adding 200 more calories to my diet, which should cause a change in lean mass on its own. Here are the results of my month long Xtend "mega-dosing" experiment:

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    sounds pretty dump. they have calories but not counted because FDA says only count whole proteins



    o and where the **** is his body gonna get the rest of the essential amino acids in order to build muscle
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    but if they infact do have calories how dose that not add to your caloric intake?....and I know Derek know's his **** so can anyone elaborate maybe Derek or someone
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmillz224 View Post
    but if they infact do have calories how dose that not add to your caloric intake?....and I know Derek know's his **** so can anyone elaborate maybe Derek or someone
    cause FDA says it doesnt. and we all listen to the FDA, right
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    No, but they do have calories thats why Derek subtracted 200 calories from his diet and added 200 calories of BCAA's.

    If he had just added BCAA's to his current diet that would would have been an extra variable to his "experiment." The extra variable would have been extra calories and of course extra calories surplus brings on weight/muscle/whatever even if that 200 extra calories is a cheeseburger or a cups of skim milk.

    He wanted to test BCAA's while ma tainting the same calorie intake and seeing his results.
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    They are only stored as calories if they are "in need"; otherwise, you just piss them out.

    You could take a serving of Xtend, and utilize absolutely zero energy from it, but another time utilize 20 calories from it (5g should equate to 20kcal @ 100% utilization).
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    Quote Originally Posted by thesinner View Post
    They are only stored as calories if they are "in need"; otherwise, you just piss them out.

    You could take a serving of Xtend, and utilize absolutely zero energy from it, but another time utilize 20 calories from it (5g should equate to 20kcal @ 100% utilization).
    They would be added to the amino acid pool. They would be pissed out if there was some renal dysfunction otherwise the body would find a use for them e.g. ATP
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    Like what sinner said, they're 4 calories per gram. The old Xtend labels used to reflect this.
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    Yep 4 cals/gram. Count them if you're anal or if you like to megadose.
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    I would not be too certain that bcaa contain 4kcal/g. I cannot find it now but when I was at work seeking more information I did find that valine was 5.6kcal/g.

    It makes sense that they may carry a greater energy potential considering how they are utilized. I can't remember the exacts but I know 1 is ketogenic, 1 is glucogenic & 1 is both ketogenic & glucogenic.

    I am sure it is just easier to consider them as 4kcal/g but I got monkey brain over the question.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonny21 View Post
    They would be added to the amino acid pool. They would be pissed out if there was some renal dysfunction otherwise the body would find a use for them e.g. ATP
    As far as pissing, I didn't mean directly pissing them out (yeah that sounds bad), but rather that they would be used to make things such as urea.
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    well whatever they do it works been using xtend for about 3 days now and it definately helps with recovery and during cardio pshhhhh fugetaboutit..... good stuff
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    Quote Originally Posted by thesinner View Post
    As far as pissing, I didn't mean directly pissing them out (yeah that sounds bad), but rather that they would be used to make things such as urea.
    When amino acids are in excess they are used to make glucose or fatty acids. During this process ammonia is formed and coverted to urea by the liver and then is excreted in urine. They are not used to make urea. Urea is a waste by-product.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonny21 View Post
    When amino acids are in excess they are used to make glucose or fatty acids. During this process ammonia is formed and coverted to urea by the liver and then is excreted in urine. They are not used to make urea. Urea is a waste by-product.
    ok, that makes sense.
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    Bumping an old thread, just because I'm trying to do some research while making some very serious restrictions to my diet.

    I've never saw a 100% clear consensus answer on calorie content on amino acids. Some products have calories, but bulk BCAAs, for example, don't have them listed.

    I'd love to hear someone like natty weigh in on this.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MidwestBeast View Post
    Bumping an old thread, just because I'm trying to do some research while making some very serious restrictions to my diet.

    I've never saw a 100% clear consensus answer on calorie content on amino acids. Some products have calories, but bulk BCAAs, for example, don't have them listed.

    I'd love to hear someone like natty weigh in on this.
    BCAAs most certainly have calories. Count them at 4 per gram although BCAAs in particular actually have an insignificantly higher caloric content due to their structure. Further, free form may [insignificantly] reduce TEF.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    BCAAs most certainly have calories. Count them at 4 per gram although BCAAs in particular actually have an insignificantly higher caloric content due to their structure. Further, free form may [insignificantly] reduce TEF.
    Thank you.

    That's what I'd figured, but like I said, it seems like there's a ton of conflicting information on this out there. I appreciate the response.
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    I take 25 grams post workout, and i always counted it as 100 cals. BUT many labels seem to count it more around 1-2 cals not the assumed 4 cals. Perhaps since its not complete protein? therefore its counted as a fraction of the usual 4 cals? either way, it is kind of anal to fuss over it. I figure its "protein" so just count it as 25 grams of protein at the usual 4 which equals 100. But i have noticed that the glutamine and BCAA labels tend to value the caloric value at 50% or less of protein....for what the labels worth....if they actually know this as fact....example, the monster amino BCAA says "10 cals" 1 gram carb and 3 grams protein, despite the fact that there are NINE grams of BCAA per serving. so that is in fact 1/3 the value calorie-wise of protein.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WARBIRDWS6 View Post
    I take 25 grams post workout, and i always counted it as 100 cals. BUT many labels seem to count it more around 1-2 cals not the assumed 4 cals. Perhaps since its not complete protein? therefore its counted as a fraction of the usual 4 cals? either way, it is kind of anal to fuss over it. I figure its "protein" so just count it as 25 grams of protein at the usual 4 which equals 100. But i have noticed that the glutamine and BCAA labels tend to value the caloric value at 50% or less of protein....for what the labels worth....if they actually know this as fact....example, the monster amino BCAA says "10 cals" 1 gram carb and 3 grams protein, despite the fact that there are NINE grams of BCAA per serving. so that is in fact 1/3 the value calorie-wise of protein.
    No, that is because the listed calories are 12, which are rounded down to 10. Proper labeling will have BCAAs listed as zero calories, when in reality they are 4 cals per gram. A protein is by definition a "chain" of amino acids....such a chain does not exist in free-form amino acids.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    No, that is because the listed calories are 12, which are rounded down to 10. Proper labeling will have BCAAs listed as zero calories, when in reality they are 4 cals per gram. A protein is by definition a "chain" of amino acids....such a chain does not exist in free-form amino acids.
    there is one gram of carb in there though, so that brings the 10 down to 6 (or 8). still not equivalent to the 9 grams of BCAA which should be like 30 something plus 4 for the carb adding to 40. and it says 10. I've seen this on numerous products....not saying its correct, just that it does not add up.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WARBIRDWS6 View Post
    there is one gram of carb in there though, so that brings the 10 down to 6 (or 8). still not equivalent to the 9 grams of BCAA which should be like 30 something plus 4 for the carb adding to 40. and it says 10. I've seen this on numerous products....not saying its correct, just that it does not add up.
    Not really sure what you're talking about, but 1g of carbs and 3g of protein = 12 calories. The 9g BCAAs count as 0 calories as I said, though they contain 4 cals per gram.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Not really sure what you're talking about, but 1g of carbs and 3g of protein = 12 calories. The 9g BCAAs count as 0 calories as I said, though they contain 4 cals per gram.
    where did the 3 grams of protein come from? lol...that is the BCAA they are listing at a protein value. there is no other protein in there other than BCAA....same as other products I've had.....BCAA only, says "3 grams protein" and "10 cals" or something close to 10 cals despite 9 grams of BCAA.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Not really sure what you're talking about, but 1g of carbs and 3g of protein = 12 calories. The 9g BCAAs count as 0 calories as I said, though they contain 4 cals per gram.
    4 x 4 = 12?
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    ...unless they have a random 3 grams of protein in there? along with BCAA? which is possible. If so, then they are assigning a zero value to the BCAA. Not sure where the whole proteins come from though, but there could be 3 grams in there for all I know.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frank Reynolds View Post
    4 x 4 = 12?
    Of course not lol, I'm just trying to reason through their label. I'm pretty positive the BCAAs count as 0, so they must have just counted the rest as 12 calories rather than 16.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WARBIRDWS6 View Post
    where did the 3 grams of protein come from? lol...that is the BCAA they are listing at a protein value. there is no other protein in there other than BCAA....same as other products I've had.....BCAA only, says "3 grams protein" and "10 cals" or something close to 10 cals despite 9 grams of BCAA.
    Quote Originally Posted by WARBIRDWS6 View Post
    ...unless they have a random 3 grams of protein in there? along with BCAA? which is possible. If so, then they are assigning a zero value to the BCAA. Not sure where the whole proteins come from though, but there could be 3 grams in there for all I know.
    The 3g of protein are not from the BCAAs. That would be extremely odd since I've never heard of a company considering 1g of BCAAs as 1/3g of protein (totally illogical). All in all, there is either a labeling error, or that 1g of carbs comes from fiber (often counted as 2 calories).
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    there is soy lecithin in there, perhaps there are a few grams of protein from that.
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    I just want to count them as "25 grams of protein" so that I don't need to chase an additional 25 grams later in the day . But I'd love to count them as 25 grams of protein, and 0 cals! I feel as if i am fooling myself though....so I keep it real and figure 25 grams of protein AND 100 cals for 25 G's of BCAA.
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    There appears to be something else in there as it looks like there is a full spectrum EAA in there.

    Quote Originally Posted by WARBIRDWS6 View Post
    I just want to count them as "25 grams of protein" so that I don't need to chase an additional 25 grams later in the day . But I'd love to count them as 25 grams of protein, and 0 cals! I feel as if i am fooling myself though....so I keep it real and figure 25 grams of protein AND 100 cals for 25 G's of BCAA.
    It really doesn't matter at all. If everything is consistent, it makes no difference what you "count" it as.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frank Reynolds View Post
    There appears to be something else in there as it looks like there is a full spectrum EAA in there.
    yep, there is an amino acid breakdown on the side of the label (not just BCAA's but all the aminos).....so something in there is a source of protein. damn, so that means its 12 grams times 3 scoops which = 36 grams protein. since there are 3 grams of protein and 9 grams of BCAA per scoop and I use 3. I'm adding that in, 9 extra grams of protein I don't need to take in later!
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    Quote Originally Posted by WARBIRDWS6 View Post
    yep, there is an amino acid breakdown on the side of the label (not just BCAA's but all the aminos).....so something in there is a source of protein. damn, so that means its 12 grams times 3 scoops which = 36 grams protein. since there are 3 grams of protein and 9 grams of BCAA per scoop and I use 3. I'm adding that in, 9 extra grams of protein I don't need to take in later!
    Actually, the calories are coming from the leucine peptides.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frank Reynolds View Post
    Actually, the calories are coming from the leucine peptides.
    are you sure? I'm back to 25 grams of protein?.....that sucks....what about the amino acid profile listing? 'them ain't no peptides'
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    Straight leucine peptides.


    If it is 2x total material to peptide content, and MA says it has 3.5g of leu peptides, it would mean it has 3.5of total material, and contains 1.75 of actual leu peptides. It is 1.8 gram of protein per g of actual peptide content (1.8 x 1.75=3.1g protein) As for the calories, I can't even understand that..lol Even on the leu peptides it lists 9g as 35 cal.

    It would make sense as well because the serving of MA is 12.5g 9g amino, and 3.5g of leu peptide material is 12.5 g.
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    How about glutamine (or glutamine peptide)? If you take a megadose of that, 10-20 grams.....no protein value right? like it never happened.
  

  
 

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