6-OXO Extreme Dosing?

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  1. Question 6-OXO Extreme Dosing?


    6-oxo xtreme

    The write-up suggests 10 pills a day (twice daily dosing of 5 pills) divided by 75 in a bottle. That means one bottle equals 7.5 days worth of product.

    I'm not understanding this. It looks like an interesting product but I'm wondering who is going to buy 4 to 8 bottles worth to run the suggested 4-8 week cycle of it?

    I've got to think there's a mistake in the suggested dosing. Unless these go for $5-$10 a bottle, the math just doesn't pencil out if Ergopharm expects this to be a mass market product.

    Is there anyone with insight on this?


  2. yea dosages are going crazy... I dont think anyone knows whats going on with this product yet. I think it would be best to just wait till its released. Im hoping this isnt a $60+ product
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by yeahright View Post
    The write-up suggests 10 pills a day (twice daily dosing of 5 pills) divided by 75 in a bottle. That means one bottle equals 7.5 days worth of product.

    I'm not understanding this. It looks like an interesting product but I'm wondering who is going to buy 4 to 8 bottles worth to run the suggested 4-8 week cycle of it?

    I've got to think there's a mistake in the suggested dosing. Unless these go for $5-$10 a bottle, the math just doesn't pencil out if Ergopharm expects this to be a mass market product.

    Is there anyone with insight on this?
    Somebody said that the write up may be for the beta test version.

  4. 6-oxo extreme looks like it will be retailing for around $40/bottle of 75 pills. The dosage recommendations are 5 pills, up to 2x per day. The old 6-oxo says to use 3 pills, up to 2x per day. It does make sense, as 6-oxo extreme has added ingredients that 6-oxo doesn't have. It looks like 5 pills of 6-oxo extreme will contain what 3 pills of 6-oxo had + the new stuff added. With less dosage and a substantially higher price, I don't see this product as a big seller initially. Unless, of course, I am wrong with the dosages. Nobody, but PA, and a select few know though, because no info has been released yet. It is just conjecture at this point. A moot point.

  5. not exact but it comes out to around $150 a month!
    WELL DONE IS BETTER THAN WELL SAID

  6. Quote Originally Posted by bigstabile View Post
    Somebody said that the write up may be for the beta test version.
    I was quoting the ergopharm website.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by p951 View Post
    6-oxo extreme looks like it will be retailing for around $40/bottle of 75 pills. The dosage recommendations are 5 pills, up to 2x per day. The old 6-oxo says to use 3 pills, up to 2x per day. It does make sense, as 6-oxo extreme has added ingredients that 6-oxo doesn't have. It looks like 5 pills of 6-oxo extreme will contain what 3 pills of 6-oxo had + the new stuff added. With less dosage and a substantially higher price, I don't see this product as a big seller initially. Unless, of course, I am wrong with the dosages. Nobody, but PA, and a select few know though, because no info has been released yet. It is just conjecture at this point. A moot point.
    Nope, full write-up with doasages is on ergopharm website. The only thing missing is retail price.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by Aeternitatis View Post
    It's kinda stupid how people would rather spend a little money on supps that do barely anything (and they spend this money monthly), yet pitch a fit when a well designed supp actually costs what it's worth.

    I guess that's just the dominating human nature of preserving mediocrity rearing its head.
    I don't share your enthusiasm for this product. It looks interesting but let's break it down: It contains a weak AI, ZMA, a flavanoid, pepper extract and resveratrol. This isn't cutting edge biotech or the product of a rare flower which only blossoms once a year. This is a synergy of commonly available supplements (I have all of them in my sup cabinet at this very moment).

    Resveratrol exerts its effects over long term continuous dosing. Making it more biolavailable by adding in a flavanoid and pepper extract is a neat idea but you still need to take resveratrol consistently for months to years to see its effects. Coupling it with something one needs to cycle like an AI isn't making sense to me.

  9. how stupid is it to spend 30-40 bucks for 60- 6oxo when you can buy 90 trione for 12 bucks?
    WELL DONE IS BETTER THAN WELL SAID

  10. Quote Originally Posted by yeahright View Post
    Resveratrol exerts its effects over long term continuous dosing. Making it more biolavailable by adding in a flavanoid and pepper extract is a neat idea but you still need to take resveratrol consistently for months to years to see its effects. Coupling it with something one needs to cycle like an AI isn't making sense to me.
    This is a very good point. I hadn't even thought of it that way.
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  11. Quote Originally Posted by yeahright View Post
    I don't share your enthusiasm for this product. It looks interesting but let's break it down: It contains a weak AI, ZMA, a flavanoid, pepper extract and resveratrol. This isn't cutting edge biotech or the product of a rare flower which only blossoms once a year. This is a synergy of commonly available supplements (I have all of them in my sup cabinet at this very moment).

    Resveratrol exerts its effects over long term continuous dosing. Making it more biolavailable by adding in a flavanoid and pepper extract is a neat idea but you still need to take resveratrol consistently for months to years to see its effects. Coupling it with something one needs to cycle like an AI isn't making sense to me.
    Another issue is the unstability of resveratrol.

    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/ibe-n...sveratrol.html

    I am guessing that the large amount of caps is due to the large amounts of resveratrol necessary for an effective dose. I think this is product's release was more to build a little extra revenues, rather than innovation.

    Another thing which we need to take into account about the cost efficiency with this supplement is the fact that it is resveratrol is not a very cost-effective supplement in the first place. Factor in the costs of 6-oxo, ZMA (I think they still have to pay royalties for this), and the costs of capping/packaging it all, and $40 per bottle really isn't that unrealistic. I do agree, however, that the the amount of caps provided in each bottle is a bit low.

  12. big thanks to dsade and np for bulk powders. supplements are getting as bad as prescriptions, no one can afford the original, have to get the generic.
    WELL DONE IS BETTER THAN WELL SAID

  13. Quote Originally Posted by thesinner View Post

    Another thing which we need to take into account about the cost efficiency with this supplement is the fact that it is resveratrol is not a very cost-effective supplement in the first place. Factor in the costs of 6-oxo, ZMA (I think they still have to pay royalties for this), and the costs of capping/packaging it all, and $40 per bottle really isn't that unrealistic. I do agree, however, that the the amount of caps provided in each bottle is a bit low.
    Yeah, I am in NO WAY saying that Ergo is trying to rip anyone off with this. I'm just looking at the ingredients and the effect they are likely to deliver, and wondering why I should pay $120 for a month's supply. That's what confuses me. This product isn't going to be that different in effect from things like Jungle Warfare, BAM and MassFX.....but at triple the price. I must be missing something.

  14. Well, if you can get away with selling it at triple the price.........wouldn't you? Sure this will take away from some of the consumer pools, but as PA had mentioned in another thread, Ergo isn't in direct competition with companies like AX (or ALRI); therefore, the consumers he'd lose to products like JW, BAM, MassFX, or HD were a lost cause to begin with.

  15. Quote Originally Posted by yeahright View Post
    Yeah, I am in NO WAY saying that Ergo is trying to rip anyone off with this. I'm just looking at the ingredients and the effect they are likely to deliver, and wondering why I should pay $120 for a month's supply. That's what confuses me. This product isn't going to be that different in effect from things like Jungle Warfare, BAM and MassFX.....but at triple the price. I must be missing something.
    You will need 4 bottles for a full month, so it will be $160 + shipping costs. I will definitely not be buying this.

  16. look for 3 page adds in m&f magazine. i bet ergo is ramping up the pr machine for this one.
    WELL DONE IS BETTER THAN WELL SAID

  17. Quote Originally Posted by yeahright View Post
    Yeah, I am in NO WAY saying that Ergo is trying to rip anyone off with this. I'm just looking at the ingredients and the effect they are likely to deliver, and wondering why I should pay $120 for a month's supply. That's what confuses me. This product isn't going to be that different in effect from things like Jungle Warfare, BAM and MassFX.....but at triple the price. I must be missing something.
    Yeah, I'm with you there. My first thought was "Is there something on the label that I missed?" So, I did a double take and came away with this

  18. Quote Originally Posted by p951 View Post
    6-oxo extreme looks like it will be retailing for around $40/bottle of 75 pills. The dosage recommendations are 5 pills, up to 2x per day. The old 6-oxo says to use 3 pills, up to 2x per day. It does make sense, as 6-oxo extreme has added ingredients that 6-oxo doesn't have. It looks like 5 pills of 6-oxo extreme will contain what 3 pills of 6-oxo had + the new stuff added. With less dosage and a substantially higher price, I don't see this product as a big seller initially. Unless, of course, I am wrong with the dosages. Nobody, but PA, and a select few know though, because no info has been released yet. It is just conjecture at this point. A moot point.

    this is all correct. this product is what it is, you can't make expensive ingredients cheaper. I could throw crap in a bottle and tell you its better and sell it for cheap but you don't want that

    I understand cost is a big issue here. this product perhaps could be used as part of a 6-OXO cycle if you are tight budgeted. start off with extreme for a week or two then go to 6-OXO. or use for whatever times you feel you need the maximum test benefit

  19. Quote Originally Posted by yeahright View Post
    IResveratrol exerts its effects over long term continuous dosing. Making it more biolavailable by adding in a flavanoid and pepper extract is a neat idea but you still need to take resveratrol consistently for months to years to see its effects. Coupling it with something one needs to cycle like an AI isn't making sense to me.

    you are confusing gene mediated Sirt1 effects with estrogen receptor antagonist effects. the former does take time, the latter does not

    resveratrol's testosterone increasing effects are seen within a week or two. one of our guys had an increase of 1100% in total test after 4 weeks while taking 1000mg res / 1000mg quercetin combination

    i knew people would scoff at resveratrol and quercetin etc. i would have too if i did not see how powerful the combo was. i had to put that in the product, despite cost and lack of luster

  20. Quote Originally Posted by thesinner View Post
    Another issue is the unstability of resveratrol.

    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/ibe-n...sveratrol.html

    I am guessing that the large amount of caps is due to the large amounts of resveratrol necessary for an effective dose. I think this is product's release was more to build a little extra revenues, rather than innovation.

    Another thing which we need to take into account about the cost efficiency with this supplement is the fact that it is resveratrol is not a very cost-effective supplement in the first place. Factor in the costs of 6-oxo, ZMA (I think they still have to pay royalties for this), and the costs of capping/packaging it all, and $40 per bottle really isn't that unrealistic. I do agree, however, that the the amount of caps provided in each bottle is a bit low.


    1) i want to take zma out for the future to reduce cost

    2) there are no stabiility issues with resveratrol. this is completely false rumor. do a search

    3) i don't understand your comment on resveratrol being not a cost effective supplement. to make this comment than you would have to have a supplement that does the same things as resveratrol to compare it against. there is none though. its in a class by itself in regards to its striking effects on metabolism, aging, and hormone production

  21. Quote Originally Posted by thesinner View Post
    Another issue is the unstability of resveratrol.

    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/ibe-n...sveratrol.html
    .
    in the future, i suggest you don't use internet postings as a resource tool

    Journal of Medicinal Food
    Resveratrol and Its Glycon Piceid Are Stable Polyphenols
    Mar 2006, Vol. 9, No. 1 : 11 -14



    Jiri Prokop
    1Interpharma Praha, a.s., Prague, Czech Republic.
    Petr Abrman
    1Interpharma Praha, a.s., Prague, Czech Republic.
    Allen L. Seligson
    Biophysica Research, San Diego, La Jolla, California.
    Milos Sovak
    Biophysica Research and University of California, San Diego, La Jolla, California.
    Plant extracts containing phytopolyphenols, including resveratrol, are extensively used as nutraceutical supplements. Recent reports allege their lack of stability at ambient conditions. We have studied the stability of resveratrol and its glycon piceid in a mixture with a whole grape extract for 2 years (long-term stability) under Good Manufacturing Practice pharmaceutical protocols (at 60% humidity and 25C). The neat compounds were followed for 4 years under conditions of "accelerated stability," at 75% humidity and 40C, all in the presence of ambient air. Chromatographic analysis did not detect any instability, thus disproving the claims to the opposite. No storage precautions are necessary for these nutritional supplements.

  22. Quote Originally Posted by thesinner View Post
    Well, if you can get away with selling it at triple the price.........wouldn't you? Sure this will take away from some of the consumer pools, but as PA had mentioned in another thread, Ergo isn't in direct competition with companies like AX (or ALRI); therefore, the consumers he'd lose to products like JW, BAM, MassFX, or HD were a lost cause to begin with.

    i am not trying to get away with anything. this product is extemely expensive to make

    i hear you though. in the future i will not release any products which cost alot to make. even if they are very effective. cuz it pisses people off and then i have to live with being accused of greedy. then everyone is upset


    you would rather be restricted to cheaper less effective products. whichis cool.

    the consumer is the boss

  23. Quote Originally Posted by thebigt View Post
    look for 3 page adds in m&f magazine. i bet ergo is ramping up the pr machine for this one.

    why?

  24. Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    you are confusing gene mediated Sirt1 effects with estrogen receptor antagonist effects. the former does take time, the latter does not

    resveratrol's testosterone increasing effects are seen within a week or two. one of our guys had an increase of 1100% in total test after 4 weeks while taking 1000mg res / 1000mg quercetin combination

    i knew people would scoff at resveratrol and quercetin etc. i would have too if i did not see how powerful the combo was. i had to put that in the product, despite cost and lack of luster
    Any numbers on his free test?? Was this taken as a standalon "cycle" or as a PCT? That seems a very impressive number, if it is anywhere near the average this may very well be worth all the money.

  25. Quote Originally Posted by jasonschaffin View Post
    Any numbers on his free test?? Was this taken as a standalon "cycle" or as a post cycle therapy? That seems a very impressive number, if it is anywhere near the average this may very well be worth all the money.
    there was no free test taken. it was done standalone, he had not done any hormone stuff for quite a while

    resveratrol at that dose also makes you feel remarkably good

    don't knock this till you try it

    people knock AMP all the time cuz it says geranium oil. they think it is sissy
  26. Guest
    Guest's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    2) there are no stabiility issues with resveratrol. this is completely false rumor. do a search
    I been preaching this since we released SirPlus. The stability issue was feed into the media by the man researching resveratrol as a way to cause consumer speculation before he released his product.

    It's Great what a NBC report does to society's perception.

  27. Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    you are confusing gene mediated Sirt1 effects with estrogen receptor antagonist effects. the former does take time, the latter does not

    resveratrol's testosterone increasing effects are seen within a week or two. one of our guys had an increase of 1100% in total test after 4 weeks while taking 1000mg res / 1000mg quercetin combination

    i knew people would scoff at resveratrol and quercetin etc. i would have too if i did not see how powerful the combo was. i had to put that in the product, despite cost and lack of luster
    Thanks for the FYI. Count me in the enlightened camp now. I misread the information as it was posted.

  28. Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    i am not trying to get away with anything. this product is extemely expensive to make

    i hear you though. in the future i will not release any products which cost alot to make. even if they are very effective. cuz it pisses people off and then i have to live with being accused of greedy. then everyone is upset


    you would rather be restricted to cheaper less effective products. whichis cool.

    the consumer is the boss
    Not true Patrick. To me, bodybuilding is as addictive as some of the drugs I tried out in college. I'm 34 years old and when I started working out during high school, bodybuilding was almost frowned upon and people deemed us as stupid and wasting time. My how things have changed. Everyone from every walk of life participates at the gym in some capacity now. As the population that digs working out and bodybuilding grows, so too will the money available for purchasing supplements. Heck, I spend about $200 a month on supplements of various kinds every month. At my age, and I think I speak for alot of people, what I want is a product that is safer than a steroid but gives visible results. It doesn't have to add 10 pounds of LBM in 10 weeks, but it does have to produce visible and measurable results. As long as we can go to the gym, bust our asses and continue to make progress, then we are happy. We just hate to bust our asses and see basically nothing. To say you are greedy, no way! To say you are ambitious, hell yes! We need creative minds like yours dedicated to bringing the bodybuilding/weightlifter the best posssible product. Rest assured, there are some of us with deep pockets, who will pay a premium for products you develop.

  29. Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    1) i want to take zma out for the future to reduce cost

    2) there are no stabiility issues with resveratrol. this is completely false rumor. do a search

    3) i don't understand your comment on resveratrol being not a cost effective supplement. to make this comment than you would have to have a supplement that does the same things as resveratrol to compare it against. there is none though. its in a class by itself in regards to its striking effects on metabolism, aging, and hormone production
    1) Removing the ZMA is probably a good idea, as most people who use ZMA, use it as a staple supplement anyways.

    2) My bad, I just go by what I hear. If I'm ever wrong, don't hesitate to correct me, 90% of why I'm even on these boards is to learn.

    3)Cost effectiveness is more of an opinionated thing. I was referring to how much it costs per day, which is kinda high for someone of my income to be taking regularly (I guess "Cost-restricting" would be a better term to use). But I do agree with your rebuttlement, there really isn't something to compare it to as to say something like "it would be cheaper to use ______"

  30. Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    you are confusing gene mediated Sirt1 effects with estrogen receptor antagonist effects. the former does take time, the latter does not

    resveratrol's testosterone increasing effects are seen within a week or two. one of our guys had an increase of 1100% in total test after 4 weeks while taking 1000mg res / 1000mg quercetin combination

    i knew people would scoff at resveratrol and quercetin etc. i would have too if i did not see how powerful the combo was. i had to put that in the product, despite cost and lack of luster
    Thanks for chiming in. I wasn't scoffing. You are correct, I was thinking about resveratrol's effects upon Sirt1 (and possible other gene expression). So, resveratrol is included in this product as estrogen receptor antagonist? Hmmmm, I'd actually done some research on this but the only commercial product I was aware of was put out by Biotest (and thus was suspect in my mind).

    I'll keep my mind open on this but that price is still pretty steep for me.
  

  
 

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