USP Cissus vs Bulk Cissus

[handzilla]

Being that the USP version is a specific extract, would there be any difference b/w the two as far as results go?

Has anyone that has tried both noticed any difference?

 

[getjacked63]

if your talking about the bulk cissus from Nutraplanet i believe that IS usplabs cissus.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

I will only go as far as saying our extraction is our extraction, and take that as you will

 

[handzilla]

if your talking about the bulk cissus from Nutraplanet i believe that IS usplabs cissus.

Can anybody confirm this?

 

[getjacked63]

Can anybody confirm this?

i can confirm haha.....yes it is

 

[TSB4me]

Just about to post in NP for any feedback on bulk cissus and seen your thread.I have used about 5 bottles of USP cissus and had nothing but great results from it. Last week I started on the bulk cissus and currently using 2 teaspoons per day and I am starting to think that it is nowhere as potent as the USP stuff.Not getting the same results.

Maybe I need to up the dose some more?

BULK cissus 2 tspoons per day = 6400mg.
USP cissus 6 caps per day = 3660mg

 

[thebigt]

i think originally it was usp cissus but they ran out and got it from another source.

 

[handzilla]

I'm pretty sure it was never USP cissus although USP was selling theirs in bulk for $50 a kilo at one point.

 

[protomike]

usp bulk cissus is diffrent as far how looks, taste, smells, and its soluble it is.

 

[meowmeow]

USP cissus = anabolic + pain relief + fracture healing + strengthened stomach lining

Bulk cissus = pain relief + fracture healing + strengthened stomach lining

 

[GettingSwole]

USP cissus = anabolic + pain relief + fracture healing + strengthened stomach lining

Bulk cissus = pain relief + fracture healing + strengthened stomach lining

wait, fracture healing as in healing a broken bone faster?!??!


That would explain why my doc was shocked at the amount my hand healed after a week.

 

[Ziricote]

Nutra Cissus is NOT the same as USPLabs Cissus RX Bulk.

 

[wojo]

god i wish that usps would jsut have there own bulk powder website as this is a very small niche of people that buy it.not everyone is a fan of capping and swallowing powders ,loving nutraplanet right now with all its powders and capping equipment

 

[WhatsaRoid?]

god i wish that usps would jsut have there own bulk powder website as this is a very small niche of people that buy it.not everyone is a fan of capping and swallowing powders ,loving nutraplanet right now with all its powders and capping equipment

I'm with you on that..I also wish there was more yg to go around haha...

 

[getjacked63]

I'm with you on that..I also wish there was more yg to go around haha...

for sure. thats bogus that the powder is gone for good.

 

[wojo]

somebody start a poll..lol

 

[Guest]

USPLabs Direct - Anabolic Pump

we will be ready to roll very soon...

 

[wojo]

already signed up..lol

 

[Guest]

usp bulk cissus is diffrent as far how looks, taste, smells, and its soluble it is.

The bulk guys will claim that its my marketing gimmic...So why does it look different?

The industry is full of liars so they just group me by association. I am trying hard to change the standard..it may take a lifetime.lol

 

[Guest]

god i wish that usps would jsut have there own bulk powder website as this is a very small niche of people that buy it.not everyone is a fan of capping and swallowing powders ,loving nutraplanet right now with all its powders and capping equipment

I have a deal in the works with a company. I really would love to work with nutra with cissus, but it will not work out.

 

[GettingSwole]

The bulk guys will claim that its my marketing gimmic...So why does it look different?

The industry is full of liars so they just group me by association. I am trying hard to change the standard..it may take a lifetime.lol

so.....

wait, fracture healing as in healing a broken bone faster?!??!


That would explain why my doc was shocked at the amount my hand healed after a week.

 

[Guest]

so.....

wait, fracture healing as in healing a broken bone faster?!??!


That would explain why my doc was shocked at the amount my hand healed after a week.

The main research is around fracture healing.

 

[GettingSwole]

that's awesome

 

[propho]

ya there was definately a difference in powders.. i noticed that the USP cissus was more grainy.. had little white specs in it.. while the rest are a more fine powder and actually a lighter color.. I take it just for a backbone every day supplement.. so I'm not too concerned with the anabolic effects..

 

[b unit]

Just about to post in NP for any feedback on bulk cissus and seen your thread.I have used about 5 bottles of USP cissus and had nothing but great results from it. Last week I started on the bulk cissus and currently using 2 teaspoons per day and I am starting to think that it is nowhere as potent as the USP stuff.Not getting the same results.

Maybe I need to up the dose some more?

BULK cissus 2 tspoons per day = 6400mg.
USP cissus 6 caps per day = 3660mg

it's all in the extraction process tsb, how many times do i have to tell ya!! :stick:

 

[vince spider]

high lats

Just about to post in NP for any feedback on bulk cissus and seen your thread.I have used about 5 bottles of USP cissus and had nothing but great results from it. Last week I started on the bulk cissus and currently using 2 teaspoons per day and I am starting to think that it is nowhere as potent as the USP stuff.Not getting the same results.

Maybe I need to up the dose some more?

BULK cissus 2 tspoons per day = 6400mg.
USP cissus 6 caps per day = 3660mg

maybe u need to start working on your lower lats, or start thinking about getting some illegals from team sausage, just remember the spider's waiting in the shadows:icon_lol:

 

[TSB4me]

it's all in the extraction process tsb, how many times do i have to tell ya!! :stick:

I"m sure your right B. It would be nice to see some more feedback from other bulk cissus users.

And when is the stronger version going to be available???

 

[ray sausage]

keetle bell

:dump: :hot:

I"m sure your right B. It would be nice to see some more feedback from other bulk cissus users.

And when is the stronger version going to be available???

 

[wojo]

I"m sure your right B. It would be nice to see some more feedback from other bulk cissus users.

And when is the stronger version going to be available???

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/custom-capsule/54907-your-cissus.html post number 8 has feedback

 

[Oswizle]

i thought thr difference was USP's extract for Ketosterones was 6% and Symmetry was like 10%(I'm probaly off by 1 % give or take) ....while the bulk everyone else has is 4%....just take more of the bulk

 

[Vitruvian]

i thought thr difference was USP's extract for Ketosterones was 6% and Symmetry was like 10%(I'm probaly off by 1 % give or take) ....while the bulk everyone else has is 4%....just take more of the bulk

I chink you wong. Sowwy.



(Half Asian.... so licensed to make these comments)

 

[Mulletsoldier]

i thought thr difference was USP's extract for Ketosterones was 6% and Symmetry was like 10%(I'm probaly off by 1 % give or take) ....while the bulk everyone else has is 4%....just take more of the bulk

Cissus RX is 5% ketosterones whilst Symmetry is 4 sterones extracted from Cissus Quad. specifically for their anabolic activity.

 

[Alpine]

USP cissus = anabolic + pain relief + fracture healing + strengthened stomach lining

Bulk cissus = pain relief + fracture healing + strengthened stomach lining

Why is USP Labs more anabolic?

Cissus RX is 5% ketosterones whilst Symmetry is 4 sterones extracted from Cissus Quad. specifically for their anabolic activity.

Is the (supposed) anabolic advantage of USP's specifically because of the ketosterones? Wouldnt you be better of just taking MORE of the cheaper bulk extraction anyway? It's cost effective and you get more Cissus in the end. I hardly see how a slightly better extraction trumps literally doubling the dose.

I understand the extraction is superior, but HOW much of a real world advantage does this give us? How "anabolic" are we talking here?

Someone lay it down no BS. Spare us the marketing...

I know USP Cissus RX is a fantastic product. Cissus in general is great. I was taking high dose bulk cissus (the first run that was said to be exactly like USP's from Nutra) I felt dramatic decreases in pain/weakness in a minor A/C shoulder joint injury that I have had for years. Not even cortisone injections seemed to have the lasting effect that cissus did. When we went over the Xrays, the doc showed me clear signs of bone spurs and damage at the joint due to friction. Rather than masking the injury, Cissus seemed to truly help heal the joint/tendon pain I was experiencing in the shoulder. It doesnt seem to "catch" as much. Obviously I attribute some of this to slowly learning how to workout smarter to avoid it. It's been a month since I have taken anymore Cissus and I'm still pain free. Cortisone never did that for me.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Why is USP Labs more anabolic?

Is the (supposed) anabolic advantage of USP's specifically because of the ketosterones? Wouldnt you be better of just taking MORE of the cheaper bulk extraction anyway? It's cost effective and you get more Cissus in the end. I hardly see how a slightly better extraction trumps literally doubling the dose.

I understand the extraction is superior, but HOW much of a real world advantage does this give us? How "anabolic" are we talking here?

Someone lay it down no BS. Spare us the marketing...

I'm not sure where I was marketing anything, or addressing the anabolic activity of our Cissus compared to a bulk Cissus product, but now that you have brought it up I will.

The real world advantage as you eloquently put it lies in the extraction itself. If it is not the same ketosterones than the same effect will not be reached irregardless of your dosage. If it is say half of the same extraction then yes doubling the dose will give you the same benefit.

You are right, you do not see how a slightly better extraction would 'trump literally double the dose'. As I have stated, without the same ketosterones then the same benefit would not be reached.

 

[Alpine]

I'm not sure where I was marketing anything, or addressing the anabolic activity of our Cissus compared to a bulk Cissus product, but now that you have brought it up I will.

The real world advantage as you eloquently put it lies in the extraction itself. If it is not the same ketosterones than the same effect will not be reached irregardless of your dosage. If it is say half of the same extraction then yes doubling the dose will give you the same benefit.

You are right, you do not see how a slightly better extraction would 'trump literally double the dose'. As I have stated, without the same ketosterones then the same benefit would not be reached.

You get a kick out of trying to talk down to people on message boards don't you? Heres a clue, WE ARE YOUR CUSTOMERS. You're a lowly rep. Take your ego down a notch.

All I asked was, WHAT makes USP's extraction more anabolic. Obviously thats the Keto's. OK, so HOW MUCH of a "real world" (in our body, not on paper) anabolic effect are we talking about? A lot of things can clearly be considered anabolic. That doesn't mean they all lead to a pronounced anabolic effect in our systems. And that is precisely what has been insinuated here. That is what I am questioning. I guess its safe to assume that non USP cissus has ZERO anabolic impact? That is, If ANY of it really has an anabolic impact in the first first place. This is why I asked for a division in marketing and science.

Is this slight (how slight?) advantage worth the premium we pay above normal bulk cissus? And that is why I'm asking for a no BS response. What you gave me was more BS I already knew and with a touch of elitist tone - How Nice. You also seem to miss the fact that I am an outspoken FAN of cissus. I am not trying to tear down your product. All I ask for is a little respect and some straight answers.

Mulletsoldier, You don't represent USP well and I don't mind telling you.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

You get a kick out of trying to talk down to people on message boards don't you? Heres a clue, WE ARE YOUR CUSTOMERS. You're a lowly rep. Take your ego down a notch.

All I asked was, WHAT makes USP's extraction more anabolic. Obviously thats the Keto's. OK, so HOW MUCH of a "real world" (in our body, not on paper) anabolic effect are we talking about? A lot of things can clearly be considered anabolic. That doesn't mean they all lead to a pronounced anabolic effect in our systems. And that is precisely what has been insinuated here. That is what I am questioning. I guess its safe to assume that non USP cissus has ZERO anabolic impact? That is, If ANY of it really has an anabolic impact in the first first place. This is why I asked for a division in marketing and science.

Is this slight (how slight?) advantage worth the premium we pay above normal bulk cissus? And that is why I'm asking for a no BS response. What you gave me was more BS I already knew and with a touch of elitist tone - How Nice. You also seem to miss the fact that I am an outspoken FAN of cissus. I am not trying to tear down your product. All I ask for is a little respect and some straight answers.

Mulletsoldier, You don't represent USP well and I don't mind telling you.

Alpine, you are obviously antagonistic, with the need to enter into every discussion with the point of arguing. That is fine. Your initial question was filled with attitude, asking questions which you obviously had arrogantly convinced yourself you already knew and I responded in kind. You asked me to spare you 'marketing' which I found amusing because I was never 'marketing' in the first place, though you continue to make this assertion. You are wrong.

I never stated in this thread, or any other thread for that matter that non-USP Labs Cissus IS NOT anabolic as a whole. Each case would depend completely on the extraction of ketosterones. As I said, if the same extraction in half the concentration is present then the same anabolism exists. You are right, claiming another product is as good as ours is a very sheisty marketing ploy, I apologize.

I am also interested in how you would like me to go about quantifying anabolism in the 'real world' without diverting to assays, or theory. You ask for science, and then ask for a response which would be devoid of it by definition, so which will it be? I could explain why Cissus is anabolic, and what pruported effect that could have, but this is not what you want correct? Ok, if you take Cissus you will gain 5lbs in one month..There, purely anecdotal evidence, real world in a sense.

Alpine, although servicing the customer is always the ultimate imperative of a rep that does not make you immune from recieving the same antagonism and disrespect you initially showed to me. That being said your 'suggestions' to my behaviour are duly noted.

Good day.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Beyond that post you are more than welcome to continue this discussion privately through e-mail, as I do not see how you and I insulting eachother can provide any benefit to either the board or additional customers. I have already become more unprofessional than I would like and I apologize.

 

[Alpine]

Awesome. You have managed to reply twice now with comments that have absolutely no semblance of any real meat and potatoes answer.

I suspect you like to see & read the eloquence of your ever so carefully constructed retorts far too much. You aren't a world renowned chemist. You arent a biochem expert. Just don't talk down to your customers when they ask simple questions. That is all....

I dont start drama or act antagonistically. I just call it like I see it. I'm not afraid to speak out on anyone or anything. Unlike you, I have nothing to lose. In addition, you're futile attempts at looking professional and cool headed come little and late.

Keep up the good work. I'm done with this thread.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Awesome. You have managed to reply twice now with comments that have absolutely no semblance of any real meat and potatoes answer.

I suspect you like to see & read the eloquence of your ever so carefully constructed retorts far too much. You aren't a world renowned chemist. You arent a biochem expert. Just don't talk down to your customers when they ask simple questions. That is all....

I dont start drama or act antagonistically. I just call it like I see it. I'm not afraid to speak out on anyone or anything. Unlike you, I have nothing to lose.

Keep up the good work. I'm done with this thread.

Well, I could and would call you a ****ing ******* if I wanted to, irregardless of what I had to lose, but I just chose not to.

I don't talk down to customers, I treat them with the same respect they treat me. Not good business sense? Maybe not, but like yourself, I call it like I see it.

P.S. I like the way you changed your post, the biochemist thing gave it a little more meat.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Ahh, I missed the 'futile cool and collected thing' in that last post, you are changin' em quick boi!! And do not flatter yourself, the apology was not to you.

 

[Alpine]

Rapid Fire!

 

[dsade]

i thought thr difference was USP's extract for Ketosterones was 6% and Symmetry was like 10%(I'm probaly off by 1 % give or take) ....while the bulk everyone else has is 4%....just take more of the bulk

Our current extract is 5%.

We have a stronger extract (between 10 and 20%) on the way right now.

 

[poison]

Someone in this thread is taking too much powerfull.

 

[rmag2447]

Cissus quadrangularis contains high amount of vitamin C, carotene A, "anabolic steroidal substances" and calcium.

So, let's talk about these anabolic steroidal components from Cissus quadrangularis. They have showed a marked influence in the rate of fracture- healing by influencing early regeneration of all connective tissues of mesenchyma origin, namely the fibroblasts, the chondroblasts and osteoblasts involved in the healing and quicker mineralization of the callus. It has greater impact on osteoblastic proliferation than other cellular responses.

While this may mean actually nothing to you in science-jibberish fashion, the anti-catabolic properties (or anabolic-like combatants) of cissus has actually been shown only to combat bone issues in long-term corticosteroid (cortisone, hydrocortisone, fluticasone, etc...) users. It has been advertised as such in the realm of "anabolic" but it is kind of misconstruing the info a tad.

For bone issues, I think this shows extreme promise and bone-regeneration has even been promoted in studies that use it, but what use it really has outside of the non fracture patient, bb, etc... is not really that clear. It hasn't really had the same effect or a statistically significant effect in those who are not nursing a fracture, etc...

Now, there are some other off-label uses, but the efficacy doesn't tend to pan out in practice.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

rmag, you're definitely right on all accounts as it pertains to the gluccocorticoid antagonistic capabilities being the reparative mechanism of action for Cissus Q. In that instance it is anabolic in the literal, as opposed to the often assumed, sense.

The problem with classifying that as minconstruing information however, stems from the very good body of anecdotal evidence from users. While you know this information is not as credible as a six month, placebo controlled, double blind study involving humans, such a study would not take place anytime soon as it pertains to the anabolic activity of Cissus as we know it.

Also Cissus Q. has been shown to be an antagonist to TNF-Alpha, a pro inflammatory cytokine that is particularily involved in oxidative stress and systemic inflammation. It is in this capacity, more anti-catabolic as you mentioned, that I feel Cissus exhibits its most promising 'anabolic' capabilities.

 

[Vitruvian]

Mullet,

If by chance you need some lube to get your foot out of Alpine's ass, drop me a line.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Mullet,

If by chance you need some lube to get your foot out of Alpine's ass, drop me a line.

lol....

 

[Oswizle]

Our current extract is 5%.

We have a stronger extract (between 10 and 20%) on the way right now.

:jaw: I sure do love me some NP whats the time table on this ?

 

[meowmeow]

Not that it matters...

But I have used both USPLabs and/or bulk Cissus everyday for the last almost year and a half. I have "felt" an anti-catabolic or anabolic effect from the CissusRX only...

The bulk Cissus works well as an agent to strengthen my stomach lining (See: J Med Food. 2004 Fall;7(3):372-6 Effect of Cissus quadrangularis on gastric mucosal defensive factors in experimentally induced gastric ulcer-a comparative study with sucralfate. So I generally use the bulk.

BUT for ultimate pain relief I would go with USPLabs. USPLabs Cissus RX greatly helped with pain and healing of my fractured ribs. In fact I just had a bottle of Cissus RX sent to my fiance to help her carpal tunnel pain. I chose USPLabs over the bulk because I feel based on my experience that it has a greater chance of helping relieve her pain.

 

[Ziricote]

In fact I just had a bottle of Cissus RX sent to my fiance to help her carpal tunnel pain. I chose USPLabs over the bulk because I feel based on my experience that it has a greater chance of helping relieve her pain.

Let us know how it goes for her, carpal tunnel is terrible...