Question about phytosterols in cissus

[crzyakta]

ok 2 questions:

In one serving of cissus (1.2g) how much beta-sitosterol is there?

Also, other than the anti-catabolic effects, does cissus mimic or increase progesterone? are there estrogen-like effects the reason for increased bone health on the supp?

I have scoured the journals online, and there is barely any mention of it

I ask about beta-s as from personal experience and what I am reading about it...it is a very bad phytosterol when used at dosages of 200+mg daily...since it primarily binds at the prostate and testes (may help with BPH) it will reduce overall sexual ability and erection quality by binding to 5AR PRIMARILY in those regions (some becomes systemic, but not much)...ie much less DHT in those regions...it also has the ability to lower cholesterol, ie overall less androgens

If cissus has an amount greater than 50mg I see it posing a problem for some who may be sensitve to beta-s

 

[NO HYPE]

ok 2 questions:

In one serving of cissus (1.2g) how much beta-sitosterol is there?

Also, other than the anti-catabolic effects, does cissus mimic or increase progesterone? are there estrogen-like effects the reason for increased bone health on the supp?

I have scoured the journals online, and there is barely any mention of it

I ask about beta-s as from personal experience and what I am reading about it...it is a very bad phytosterol when used at dosages of 200+mg daily...since it primarily binds at the prostate and testes (may help with BPH) it will reduce overall sexual ability and erection quality by binding to 5AR PRIMARILY in those regions (some becomes systemic, but not much)...ie much less DHT in those regions...it also has the ability to lower cholesterol, ie overall less androgens

If cissus has an amount greater than 50mg I see it posing a problem for some who may be sensitve to beta-s

I am very much interested in reading your findings as I have never heard the phrase.... "it is a very bad phytosterol" when reffering to Beta Sitosterol. I use about 325mg every day and never had any problems. I use it for prostate support and for proper metabolization of cholesterol (lowers LDL). If you could link me to those studies I would greatly apprieciate it.

 

[crzyakta]

Personally, beta-s did a number on my erection, and maintaining ability

here are some studies:

Entrez PubMed

Entrez PubMed

and Dr Lin spoke to me about, he's a sex doctor guru online

 

[NO HYPE]

Personally, beta-s did a number on my erection, and maintaining ability

here are some studies:

Entrez PubMed

Entrez PubMed

and Dr Lin spoke to me about, he's a sex doctor guru online

Damn bro, sux to hear bout that thang you had to deal with but in refference to those links....

Please don't take me the wrong way here, but the first link is only relevant to fish that were being exposed to a high concentration of a phytoestrogen found in BKME.

The findings in this particular study are irrelevant to humans
and non-conclusive at best. The results only questioned the possibility.... that beta-sitosterol could be a contributing factor to reproductive dysfunction in fish exposed to BKME.

As far as the second link, even though this study was conducted on rats. It is much more relevant to humans than the previous study.

The second study stated that the side-chain of cholesterol is important for stimulatory action and that partially modified side-chains (of beta-sitosterol and stigmasterol), did not reduce stimulatory action whereas Androstenalone did.

In any case if you dont like it.... chances are, there's probably a pretty good reason for it. As for me, I've never noticed any problems but I'll keep an eye out for any.... "Package Problems"

 

[DeerDeer]

ok 2 questions:

In one serving of cissus (1.2g) how much beta-sitosterol is there?

Also, other than the anti-catabolic effects, does cissus mimic or increase progesterone? are there estrogen-like effects the reason for increased bone health on the supp?

I have scoured the journals online, and there is barely any mention of it

I ask about beta-s as from personal experience and what I am reading about it...it is a very bad phytosterol when used at dosages of 200+mg daily...since it primarily binds at the prostate and testes (may help with BPH) it will reduce overall sexual ability and erection quality by binding to 5AR PRIMARILY in those regions (some becomes systemic, but not much)...ie much less DHT in those regions...it also has the ability to lower cholesterol, ie overall less androgens

If cissus has an amount greater than 50mg I see it posing a problem for some who may be sensitve to beta-s

You bring up a good point in the sense that we don't know exactly what is in cissus/in what percentage/ or its mechanism of action. It owuld be helpful to know in order to fully regain the consumer's confidence in the product. One shoul dbe wary about it currently IMO.

 

[Ronin13]

Before I interject here I want to be sure I am understanding this correctly...............

You are wondering if Cissus has enough beta-sitosterol in it to impact erection quality?????

 

[DeerDeer]

Before I interject here I want to be sure I am understanding this correctly...............

You are wondering if Cissus has enough beta-sitosterol in it to impact erection quality?????

I think he is referring to potential sides with poor erection qulaity being one of them. I guess he is essentially wondering if there are Progesterone effects mediating it's activity in vivo.

 

[Ronin13]

I think he is referring to potential sides with poor erection qulaity being one of them. I guess he is essentially wondering if there are Progesterone effects mediating it's activity in vivo.

OK... then I am not crazy.... allow me to explain....

If this is TMI - let me know and I will delete this repsonse.... :twisted:

I have always been a walking erection... I mean out of control like a 15 year old.... every day.... I started taking cissus three or four months ago for the chronic pain in my shoulder due to a surgery back in November of 05. I was taking 4 a day for like a month or so with moderate results. I bumped it up to 9 and sometimes 12 a day until last week when I started a beta test for USP Labs creatine supp (now am running it at 4 a day). Let me tell you I am 10 times worse than I used to be and the erection quality insane... it is like titanium. I feel like I am on viagra or something. F'N ridiculous. After the third round my gf is running from me because she can't take it anymore than three times in one day.... and go figure, I am 35.... most guys my age are lucky if they get it up twice a day let alone actually get some twice a day.

I know it is just my $0.02 but I can say affirmatively that Cissus has in no way negatively impacted my package performance nor has it shown any sign of progesterone sides.

 

[Pfunk47]

agreed with Ronin - "strong like bull" all the time when I am on cissus and your balls get huge ,no joke. Been off for 1.5 months and the only thing that has changed is - it's not 24/7 wood - actually a slight relief

 

[crzyakta]

Ronin yeah that was what I was wondering...beta-s i think has two modes of function against DHT and androgens

one is by lowering cholesterol, even LDL, reducing overall androgen concentration in serum

and two by limiting DHT (actually 5AR) binding in the testes and prostate region

this may only be at high dosages, I was on ~800mg a day, with other phytosterols (it was a complex)...but beta-s was the primary one

according to ronins anecdotal experience, the presence of beta-s is small enough to not cause the sides I spoke of prior

 

[Kam]

man, I'm about to start a cissus/powerfull stack. I don't want my balls any bigger.... There tough to manige as they are now, maybe if they made the johnson bigger I would be happy.

I'll let you know if elephantites sets in.

 

[crzyakta]

if you want your johnson bigger without risking permanent damage via jelqing ect

try boosting hormones (DHEA, androstenedione-> DHT) in that region (to increase androgen receptors there)...to do this you can use a DHEA based cream to massage on your shaft/glans...also want to increase nitric oxide production (L-arg will help with this, may also boost oxytocin) and prostaglandin e-1 production (increase GLA intake to do this, like borage oil taken with fish oil to limit production of pge-2 and AA)

well enough of this, dont know if its taboo or not, but good luck