What's the best fat burning supplement available today??

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by daxiang View Post
    I thought one should avoid taking yohimbine with ephedrine+caff.
    like said above, there is *possible* problem, but not guaranteed. they both target different receptors (alpha 2 and beta 2/3) and the heart has both - so it's possible high heart rate could occur. so you can test by starting with tiny amounts and checking pulse. if you want to be safe, just don't take the yohimbine - i don't think you'd be missing much - insulin kills its effect (if it even works -debatable based on *all* research) so you can't take it throughout the day like eph, and you don't "burn" that much fat in 45 min of cardio.


  2. Quote Originally Posted by Bintherduntht View Post
    I would hate to hear of obese people taking ephedrine, Yikes. Can you say heart attack? Most guys on here will tell you if your overweight stay away from AAS. I'm sure they affect the heart equally bad... I didn't read the thread but obese people need 0 supplements to lose the first weight. They just have to move their bodies more, and change there eating habits
    What? Plenty of obese people take ephedrine. In fact, there are tons of studies, and analysis/reviews of hundreds of thousands of people, who were prescribed ephedrine and caffeine daily (multiple times a day) for months. The combination is actually quite safe and very well tolerated, even for prolonged periods of time. I agree that fixing/changing exercise and diet should be the first step, and is more important than any supplements/drugs, but EC is actually one of the most proven, both in regards to safety and effectiveness. I second staying away from AAS if you're obese though, that much makes a lot of sense.
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  3. Ephedrine HCL and Yohimbine HCL are both pharmaceuticals drugs, not herbal dietary supplements. Both have associated risks. Many would argue that Y is more harmful than E. One obviously got more bad press from atheletes taking and doing max capacity workouts in 100 degree weather than the other and thus got an fda ban. Ephedrine is commonly used by anasthesiologists for blood pressure and heart rate support of unstable vitals in surgery. I believe Yohimbine HCL is used in other countries for similar purposes and I believe some countries have banned it in dietary supps

    They both have a wide array of literature available on them as they are both pharmaceuticals if you are anyone is curious about researching the safety of them.

    Yohimbine causes my pupils to dialate, goosebumps, cold sweats, anxiety, shakes. Alpha Y is somewhat better tolerated by me if I have developed a tolerance to caffiene and keep the dose ultra low.

  4. yohimbe works like dick pills

  5. Quote Originally Posted by john.patterson View Post
    It isn't recommended to use both right away, but if you've used EC and are comfortable with your stimulant intake, adding in yohimbine can help target some of the more stubborn fat areas. If you decide to try EC+Y, make sure you start with a very low dose of yohimbine to assess tolerance. This stack has been a great success for me in combination with fasted cardio
    The first time I used Y was 19 years ago...in college. I was used to ECA...which was in all the fat burners back then. I bought some Twinlab Yohimbe Fuel ...it came in the mail and I got it at 3 PM and took 1 pill with my afternoon dose of ECA.

    That night I was laying in bed staring at the ceiling until I went to class the next morning...no sleep. I couldn't fall asleep until late the following night. I never used it again for many years after that.

    Sometimes I use it now when I want to induce insomnia in myself.
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  6. RXS Radiate has been working wonders for me! Highly recommend it, have a few freinds trying it who love it as well.

    I personally take Radiate, Forskolin, GCB, Garcinia, Reduce XT, and additional Alpha-Y as my cutting stack.

  7. I’ve read that Y kind of bombs the alpha receptors as well as numerous other serotonin and I believe even one of dopamine receptors. We know it’s got very high binding to the alpha 2 which it acts as an antagonist at and basically shuts down the body’s negative feedback of NorEpi release.

    In a normal situation you release nor epi in a fight or flight situation and it binds to alpha and beta receptors which increase cardiac output, etc. To keep the cascade from getting out of control nor epi binds to the alpha 2 and it shuts down the release of more epi, putting a break in the system . Yohimbine binds to the alpha 2 and shuts off that brake mechanism.

    As stayed above it’s also extremely non selective and does a lot with serotonin and also binds D3, and thus has numerous drug interactions.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by Rostam View Post
    I used to have good results with Sesamin oil/Sesathin but can't find it anymore. It seems they all discontinued making it and I can't understand why. If someone knows where to find some, let us know.
    I always enjoyed Sesamin as well. Ran it a lot back in the day. Evomuse Brite still contains a hefty dose of it. I have been running FitMax and Brite with great results.
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  9. yohimbine hydrochloride is tricky for sure - some can take 20mg no problem, others wig out at 2mg. definitely test for sure slow. if going by all studies, still not concensus on lipolysis (hate term fat burn) and seems a constant lately > little fat "burned" during any exercise! 100% fat of 300cal energy (never happen) is only about 1 ounce. feel safe not using (cant take it realistically except first thing in morning - insulin. ephedrine was taken before/with food, worked great.). ah well at least its cheap (10 grams last forever (year?) and is about $30).

  10. Quote Originally Posted by muscleupcrohn View Post
    What? Plenty of obese people take ephedrine. In fact, there are tons of studies, and analysis/reviews of hundreds of thousands of people, who were prescribed ephedrine and caffeine daily (multiple times a day) for months. The combination is actually quite safe and very well tolerated, even for prolonged periods of time. I agree that fixing/changing exercise and diet should be the first step, and is more important than any supplements/drugs, but EC is actually one of the most proven, both in regards to safety and effectiveness. I second staying away from AAS if you're obese though, that much makes a lot of sense.
    I know you love ephedrine. I have nothing against it. Never tried it actually but have taken addies and whatnot preworkout.

    If your obese, you should not need any supps. I was way overweight and I used green tea to help fat loss. But mostly I got the fuk up and moved my ass!

    I'm saying someone who is truly that overweight, should be putting health first, than add supps or AAS later. This is what's wrong with American Culture... We look for the shortest possible way! Lol.

    "Fat" people need to focus first on moving (a workout plan) and eating healthy
  11. What's the best fat burning supplement available today??


    Quote Originally Posted by Bintherduntht View Post
    I know you love ephedrine. I have nothing against it. Never tried it actually but have taken addies and whatnot preworkout.

    Of your obese, you should not need any supps. I was way overweight and I used green tea to help fat loss. But mostly I got the fuk up and moved my ass!

    I'm saying someone who is truly that overweight, should be putting health first, than add supps or AAS later. This is what's wrong with American Culture... We look for the shortest possible way! Lol.

    "Fat" people need to focus first on moving (a workout plan) and eating healthy
    I agree that people who are obese should dial in their training and diet before using any supplements or drugs. My point wasnít to tell obese people to use ephedrine before fixing their diet and working out, but only to correct the incorrect claim that ephedrine is somehow a bad idea for overweight people to use when it has more safety data than most every ingredient/stimulant people use. You mentioned hear attacks; the overwhelming consensus in studies and analyses shows this is not a significant concern. That doesnít mean that someone should use EC without or before fixing their diet and hitting the gym, so thatís beside the point really.
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  12. Quote Originally Posted by muscleupcrohn View Post
    I agree that people who are obese should dial in their training and diet before using any supplements or drugs. My point wasn’t to tell obese people to use ephedrine before fixing their diet and working out, but only to correct the incorrect claim that ephedrine is somehow a bad idea for overweight people to use when it has more safety data than most every ingredient/stimulant people use. You mentioned hear attacks; the overwhelming consensus in studies and analyses shows this is not a significant concern. That doesn’t mean that someone should use EC without or before fixing their diet and hitting the gym, so that’s beside the point really.
    Ephedrine is a bad idea for overweight people. Just the fact it raises blood pressure is enough for an obese person to have a heart attack...

    "Ephedrine can cause a quickened heartbeat and elevated blood pressure. Side effects include heart palpitations, nausea, and vomiting. More than 800 dangerous reactions have been reported with use of the herb. These include heart attacks, strokes, seizures, and sudden deaths"

    I just wouldn't recommend this to an obese person
  13. What's the best fat burning supplement available today??


    Quote Originally Posted by Bintherduntht View Post
    Ephedrine is a bad idea for overweight people. Just the fact it raises blood pressure is enough for an obese person to have a heart attack...

    "Ephedrine can cause a quickened heartbeat and elevated blood pressure. Side effects include heart palpitations, nausea, and vomiting. More than 800 dangerous reactions have been reported with use of the herb. These include heart attacks, strokes, seizures, and sudden deaths"

    I just wouldn't recommend this to an obese person
    Care to put the reference for that quote up? More importantly, EPHEDRA (the herb) is NOT synonymous or interchangeable with EPHEDRINE, which is what is used in the EC stack. This shows you have a fundamental misunderstanding of the topic of discussion. Also, a myriad of placebo-controlled studies and analysis of HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE, overweight people, prescribed EC would vehemently disagree with you; they show itís very well tolerated and NOT associated with adverse cardiac episodes. Iíve linked up said studies numerous times on this forum before, but Iíll post them up again in the morning if you want, because youíre completely wrong.
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  14. Quote Originally Posted by muscleupcrohn View Post
    Care to put the reference for that quote up? More importantly, EPHEDRA (the herb) is NOT synonymous or interchangeable with EPHEDRINE, which is what is used in the EC stack. This shows you have a fundamental misunderstanding of the topic of discussion. Also, a myriad of placebo-controlled studies and analysis of HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE, overweight people, prescribed EC would vehemently disagree with you; they show it’s very well tolerated and NOT associated with adverse cardiac episodes. I’ve linked up said studies numerous times on this forum before, but I’ll post them up again in the morning if you want, because you’re completely wrong.
    Damn dude always a problem with me lol.

    I just believe people are quick to reach for a shortcut in trying to lose weight/get to goals quicker.

    I looked up ephedrine and it says the sides are worst than ephedra.

    I understand where your coming from. I do believe you when you say It can be taken safely

  15. Quote Originally Posted by Bintherduntht View Post
    Damn dude always a problem with me lol.

    I just believe people are quick to reach for a shortcut in trying to lose weight/get to goals quicker.

    I looked up ephedrine and it says the sides are worst than ephedra.

    I understand where your coming from. I do believe you when you say I can be taken safely
    Itís not a problem with you haha. Iím saying your statement/claim is wrong, Iím not saying youíre a bad person or stupid or anything. I agree completely that people look for shortcuts and magic pills and are adverse to putting in work, but thatís not relevant to the safety of ephedrine at all. No hard feelings at all.
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  16. Quote Originally Posted by muscleupcrohn View Post
    It’s not a problem with you haha. I’m saying your statement/claim is wrong, I’m not saying you’re a bad person or stupid or anything. I agree completely that people look for shortcuts and magic pills and are adverse to putting in work, but that’s not relevant to the safety of ephedrine at all. No hard feelings at all.
    What statement is wrong? I feel like I am not wrong.

    I don't think a doctor, or anyone, would suggest ephedrine to a clinically obese person

  17. Quote Originally Posted by Bintherduntht View Post
    What statement is wrong? I feel like I am not wrong.

    I don't think a doctor, or anyone, would suggest ephedrine to a clinically obese person
    The part where you say that ephedrine isnít safe for overweight/obese people, and that it can give them heart attacks.
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  18. What's the best fat burning supplement available today??


    The safety and efficacy of a mixture of ephedrine (75-150mg), caffeine (150mg) and aspirin (330mg), in divided premeal doses, were investigated in 24 obese humans (mean BMI 37.0) in a randomized double blind placebo-controlled trial.
    In all studies, no significant changes in heart rate, blood pressure, blood glucose, insulin, and cholesterol levels, and no differences in the frequency of side effects were found. ECA in these doses is thus well tolerated in otherwise healthy obese subjects, and supports modest, sustained weight loss even without prescribed caloric restriction, and may be more effective in conjunction with restriction of energy intake.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/8384187/
    We conclude that the ephedrine/caffeine combination is effective in improving and maintaining weight loss, further it has lean body mass saving properties. The side effects are minor and transient and no withdrawal symptoms have been found.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/8384186/
    The authors linked data from four different sources within Statistics Denmark, using data on 257,364 users of prescribed ephedrine/caffeine for the period 1995Ė2002.
    Prescribed ephedrine/caffeine was not associated with a substantially increased risk of adverse cardiovascular outcomes in this study.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2565736/
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  19. Quote Originally Posted by Rostam View Post
    I used to have good results with Sesamin oil/Sesathin but can't find it anymore. It seems they all discontinued making it and I can't understand why. If someone knows where to find some, let us know.
    Look into Evomuse Brite if you are looking for an upgraded replacement.

    To the OP, Evomuse puts out several products that will help you obtain your goal. DCP is a great product along with his topicals. @dsade
    E-Pharm Rep... PM me with any questions or concerns

  20. Quote Originally Posted by Bintherduntht View Post
    "Healthy obese subjects"

    Really? How can you be healthy and obese
    Dude, please actually read what I posted. It says ďOTHERWISE healthy obese subjects.Ē I assume you have no actual response to the studies?
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  21. Quote Originally Posted by muscleupcrohn View Post
    Dude, please actually read what I posted. It says “OTHERWISE healthy obese subjects.” I assume you have no actual response to the studies?
    Obese people are not healthy though man
  22. What's the best fat burning supplement available today??


    Quote Originally Posted by Bintherduntht View Post
    Obese people are not healthy though man
    Dude, what donít you understand. OTHERWISE healthy means that besides the obesity the are OTHERWISE healthy. They arenít considered healthy because of their obesity, but besides the obesity they are. Itís akin to saying someone can have asthma but be OTHERWISE healthy. Itís not that difficult man...
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  23. Quote Originally Posted by muscleupcrohn View Post
    Dude, what donít you understand. OTHERWISE healthy means that besides the obesity the are OTHERWISE healthy. They arenít considered healthy because of their obesity, but besides the obesity they are. Itís akin to saying someone can have asthma but be OTHERWISE healthy. Itís not that difficult man...
    I guess man. I don't feel like arguing anymore lol. Agree to disagree
  24. What's the best fat burning supplement available today??


    Quote Originally Posted by Bintherduntht View Post
    I guess man. I don't feel like arguing anymore lol. Agree to disagree
    What? You clearly donít know what otherwise healthy means. You canít just agree to disagree about definitions. ďI think 2 + 2 = 7. You donít? Weíll just agree to disagree.Ē It doesnít make sense man. Also, any response to the actual content of the studies? The studies that showed its well tolerated and safe?
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