Epistane Cycle

[nendol02606]

I would appreciate any advice or help offered. I olan on doing a cycle this June/July of Epistane.

I currently plan on dosing 30/30/30/30 (pills are 30mg per, or Id consider minor change to dosage.

I will take creatine daily before, during and after

Taurine and liver support during weeks 1-4

For PCT I plan on using an OTC PCT and Nolva, but Im having trouble getting it currently. I live in Europe and cannot seem to get it mailed here, plus a few other reasons. Im wondering, is it realistic to get a legit OTC source in the US? I will be in the US during the complete cycle. If not ill have to keep trying to find a way.

About me: I am 27, 195 pounds, about 15-16% bodyfat (assumed), I have been lifting from moderate to heavily consistently since I was 18. I have reached a "plateau " for reasons including the usual, but also due to work keeping me from maintaining heavy volume, diet (also from work) and schools.

I would like to lean up without losing muscle, and I have never been able to lose fat effectively and maintain muscle. Even practically starving I barely lose weight, but I WILL lose my lifts.

My bench is 305, squat around 355, deadlift around 395-405 (past injury/neglected hamstrings until recently).

 

[nendol02606]

I used epistane for 1 week about 7 years ago (on a deployment) and was forced to stop due to work conditions. So this is basically my firsr cycle.

 

[mw1]

I would highly recommend using CEL Cycle assist thru cycle and pct as it offers complete support and not just liver support. For an otc pct i highly rec Inhibit E- its probably the most comprehensive on the arket at the moment. It u will be on cycle during your stay you can easily buy it and nolva. Message me if you need help locating it

 

[LeanEngineer]

Agreed with mw1... CEL cycle assist will be one of your best options in terms of on cycle support. Definitely pick up some nolva for pct and run the otc pct along side the nolva. Inhibit e would be good to have on hand and you could even throw in some reduce xt if you wanted.

 

[nendol02606]

Lecheek Nutrition Cycle Armor and
Blackstone Labs PCT V is what I currently have for my on cycle and post cycle supports. Along with nolva of course, once I can find a way to locally purchase in the U.S.

Do you happen to know if those two items would be considered sufficient? I feel like I'm rushing it, because everytime I get into the discussion it seems I should be adding something in at some point during or after the cycle. But then again ive been holding it for a couple months now.

Appreciate the help fellas.

 

[mw1]

Edit

 

[The Express 42]

I’m going to be pretty blunt here... but tbh LC cycle armor and BSL PCT V are garbage. Will offer no benefit to you. I think most knowledgeable people on this board would strongly agree.

First off I would run Epistane for 6 weeks at 40mg. If you can get another bottle I would try and do so. Now you will need a test base. Something to keep energy up and lethargy away. Ex. 4 andro, Epiandro, dermacrine, androsterone

Other add ons I highly recommend

On cycle: CEL cycle assist -protects organs, aids in normalizing blood pressure.
Fish Oil
CEL Tudca - not essential but Epistane is liver toxic and can cause some issues there

PCT: Reduce XT or Invictus: control cortisol and prevent unwanted fat gain
M test: natural test booster to help boost free test, better sleep, promote feeling of well being
X gels or Vector/Follidrone2.0: a natural anabolic to help keep gains made on cycle.

DIET is key on and coming off cycle to retain muscle. Good luck buddy

 

[nendol02606]

I’m going to be pretty blunt here... but tbh LC cycle armor and BSL PCT V are garbage. Will offer no benefit to you. I think most knowledgeable people on this board would strongly agree.

First off I would run Epistane for 6 weeks at 40mg. If you can get another bottle I would try and do so. Now you will need a test base. Something to keep energy up and lethargy away. Ex. 4 andro, Epiandro, dermacrine, androsterone

Other add ons I highly recommend

On cycle: CEL cycle assist -protects organs, aids in normalizing blood pressure.
Fish Oil
CEL Tudca - not essential but Epistane is liver toxic and can cause some issues there

PCT: Reduce XT or Invictus: control cortisol and prevent unwanted fat gain
M test: natural test booster to help boost free test, better sleep, promote feeling of well being
X gels or Vector/Follidrone2.0: a natural anabolic to help keep gains made on cycle.

DIET is key on and coming off cycle to retain muscle. Good luck buddy

Appreciate the honesty, Ill look into swapping them.

Getting the bottle of epi i have currently was a nightmare. Somehow it was seized by customs and.... was released a month later (no idea, im not asking). Im trying to avoid any of that again.

I have a good way of getting nolva now so that is covered. While i know the answer is "you get what you pay for" or "better safe than sorry" etc. is it pretty necessary to get those suggested add ons to make effective use of this cycle? Or can I run it with what I got in addition to the minor additions such as fish oil?

I dont want to waste my time doing this cycle if its not gonna show results or last, but ive put a lot of money into it as is and a ridiculous headache. Additionally, ive researched the hell out of epistane in general in order to feel completely comfortable diving in, Im somewhat unfamiliar with some of the other things youre mentioning.

Basically, of what you suggested to change (besides replacing my junk cycle support and pct) what is NECESSARY and REALISTIC assuming I cant receive any more "illegal" products?

Thanks so much again guys. And sorry for any ridiculous grammar issues, typing on phone.

 

[The Express 42]

I would consider the CEL cycle support to be the only absolute necessity.

I think something like dermacrine will make a big difference with your energy levels on cycle, week 3 and 4 the lethargy sets in and can honestly make it tough to get into the gym lol not to mention the sexual problems associated with surpassed testosterone

 

[warbird01]

Appreciate the honesty, Ill look into swapping them.

Getting the bottle of epi i have currently was a nightmare. Somehow it was seized by customs and.... was released a month later (no idea, im not asking). Im trying to avoid any of that again.

I have a good way of getting nolva now so that is covered. While i know the answer is "you get what you pay for" or "better safe than sorry" etc. is it pretty necessary to get those suggested add ons to make effective use of this cycle? Or can I run it with what I got in addition to the minor additions such as fish oil?

I dont want to waste my time doing this cycle if its not gonna show results or last, but ive put a lot of money into it as is and a ridiculous headache. Additionally, ive researched the hell out of epistane in general in order to feel completely comfortable diving in, Im somewhat unfamiliar with some of the other things youre mentioning.

Basically, of what you suggested to change (besides replacing my junk cycle support and pct) what is NECESSARY and REALISTIC assuming I cant receive any more "illegal" products?

Thanks so much again guys. And sorry for any ridiculous grammar issues, typing on phone.

While only cycle support and nolva are probably ABSOLUTELY necessary, my take on PCT is why risk not running an optimal PCT and losing your gains/potentially not recovering?

 

[Wobmarvel]

I think 4 weeks of epistane would be a waste. Its one of that slow burners that may not even kick in for a few weeks and you will be stopping at that point also doses up to 60mg when I ran it a few years back and got a decent recomp. If your able to get hold of andros than may be worth running it at 15/15/15/15/30/30 along with 1 and 4 andro to create a synergistic stack otherwise I think it will be wasted. Ideally 2 bottles of epistane would be better but I see that's not an option. May be worth waiting till you get to the US and see what you can get hold of.

 

[Whisky]

I’m going to be pretty blunt here... but tbh LC cycle armor and BSL PCT V are garbage. Will offer no benefit to you. I think most knowledgeable people on this board would strongly agree.

First off I would run Epistane for 6 weeks at 40mg. If you can get another bottle I would try and do so. Now you will need a test base. Something to keep energy up and lethargy away. Ex. 4 andro, Epiandro, dermacrine, androsterone

Other add ons I highly recommend

On cycle: CEL cycle assist -protects organs, aids in normalizing blood pressure.
Fish Oil
CEL Tudca - not essential but Epistane is liver toxic and can cause some issues there

PCT: Reduce XT or Invictus: control cortisol and prevent unwanted fat gain
M test: natural test booster to help boost free test, better sleep, promote feeling of well being
X gels or Vector/Follidrone2.0: a natural anabolic to help keep gains made on cycle.

DIET is key on and coming off cycle to retain muscle. Good luck buddy

Running epistane at the moment and 100% agree with this.

Definitely suggest a test base.....

Definitely look at 6 weeks at least (it took 2 to kick in for me).......

I know this stuff all adds up but personally I think it’s better to wait, put some more cash aside then run a cycle properly to make and maintain the most from it, rather than end up disappointed because it was a half a55ed cycle.

And yeah, diet and training still needs to be on point for sure.....

 

[nendol02606]

I hate to discredit anyone (when I basically know nothing compared to most of you) but its very disheartening when I look up most of the products suggested and find mixed reviews I.E. dermacrine.

I will absolutely swap the cycle support and post supports around since mine are apparantly weak, and continue looking into alternatives.

Overall, thanks so much for the conversation.. its been pretty informative and I appreciate all the help.

In the future, if i do another cycle I might stick to SARMs. I know its not an old school preference currently, but the "generally" proven lack of sides and support necessary seems to make it more user friendly. Less expensive in long run also, even though the actual products themselves are crazy expensive.

 

[delsolrob]

dermacrine would come in quite handy on this cycle...epistane has killed my libido and caused quite a bit of lethargy for me in the past. I've had great luck combating these sides when running it with Dermacrine.

4-andro would be great, but likely cost prohibitive at the necessary doses.

 

[delsolrob]

Also, you may want to consider running Invictus with your cycle and during PCT...will likely be quite helpful with your cut.

 

[Wobmarvel]

I think dermacrine gets a bad rep when people run it solo. It doesn't build muscle by itself but there is no denying that it helped mitigate the sides from the superdrol I was taking. It was night and day difference without it.

 

[The Express 42]

I hate to discredit anyone (when I basically know nothing compared to most of you) but its very disheartening when I look up most of the products suggested and find mixed reviews I.E. dermacrine.

I will absolutely swap the cycle support and post supports around since mine are apparantly weak, and continue looking into alternatives.

Overall, thanks so much for the conversation.. its been pretty informative and I appreciate all the help.

In the future, if i do another cycle I might stick to SARMs. I know its not an old school preference currently, but the "generally" proven lack of sides and support necessary seems to make it more user friendly. Less expensive in long run also, even though the actual products themselves are crazy expensive.

If you read reviews on products on amazon compared to guys on this forum yes there’s usually a difference. 99% of those idiots are looking for a magic pill and newsflash, no such thing. I’m sure most of those reviews for dermacrine are because people are trying to build muscle on it while not even in a surplus. Products work better for guys on here because we know that if your diet and training ain’t working, nothing will. (Not coming at you) just something I realized when I really started digging into reviews because I was also curious.

 

[SwoleNation]

I used Dermacrine while on msten... Worked like a charm for me. I would use again.

 

[Bigmatt57]

If your gonna go with a otc pct definitely go with Olympus labs sup3r pct. it has e cottonii extract which is the main ingredient in Black lion labs rebirth . But it also has a AI (arimastane) and loads of test boosters. Definitely the best OTC PCT on the market. And with something like epistane you should be absolutely fine with just that. But of course nothing replaces a real serm and if you can get one. Definitely go with that