ARA, DOMS & Splits

HAMinTheTrap

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I`ll start with ara soon for the first time, and from what ive read, many people complain about the doms.

Was it enough to have an impact on your training splits though?

Are you able to train the same muscle twice per week while running ara?

Also, is that something that might be dose dependant?? Like the higher the dose it may impact your ability to train x amount of times per week?

Just trying to program ahead...

thanks
 

Slims

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I`ll start with ara soon for the first time, and from what ive read, many people complain about the doms.

Was it enough to have an impact on your training splits though?

Are you able to train the same muscle twice per week while running ara?

Also, is that something that might be dose dependant?? Like the higher the dose it may impact your ability to train x amount of times per week?
I've done multiple ARA runs and yes, the increased DOMS can leave you very sore.

I was still able to train my arms twice per week as they're only small muscle groups, which should recoup and recover fairly quickly. However, the larger muscle groups such as Legs and Back, were sometimes still quite sore 5-6 days after their targetted training day and needed the full 7 days off before I was able to train them again.

Regarding the dosage though, just run it as advised on the packaging.

Which ARA product(s) are you considering?
 
AntM1564

AntM1564

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Honestly, I do not think you can program ahead. Each time I have ran X-Gels, I did not experience the DOMS others have complained about. Others on the forum have experienced the same as me. On the other hand, you do get people that have crippling DOMS. It is one of those thing you need to experiment to see how it affects you.
 

Slims

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As with all supplements, your training style, diet programme and rest will also play a major role in how well you recover between workouts.
 

HAMinTheTrap

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I've done multiple ARA runs and yes, the increased DOMS can leave you very sore.

I was still able to train my arms twice per week as they're only small muscle groups, which should recoup and recover fairly quickly. However, the larger muscle groups such as Legs and Back, were sometimes still quite sore 5-6 days after their targetted training day and needed the full 7 days off before I was able to train them again.

Regarding the dosage though, just run it as advised on the packaging.

Which ARA product(s) are you considering?
Funny that you ask this... I actually have already, but its rather peculiar: One bottle of ARA from EA, and another bottle of x-gels. hahah It just ended up being like that because i bought in different orders with other stuff from different places and this is what they had
 

HAMinTheTrap

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Honestly, I do not think you can program ahead. Each time I have ran X-Gels, I did not experience the DOMS others have complained about. Others on the forum have experienced the same as me. On the other hand, you do get people that have crippling DOMS. It is one of those thing you need to experiment to see how it affects you.
I can plan ahead in the sense that i can have an idea in mind for two different splits in case i need it ;)
 
The Express 42

The Express 42

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The DOMS is very overrated in my opinion or maybe it’s just me. Maybe a little more sore than normal but nothing crazy or debilitating
 
LeanEngineer

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Honestly, I do not think you can program ahead. Each time I have ran X-Gels, I did not experience the DOMS others have complained about. Others on the forum have experienced the same as me. On the other hand, you do get people that have crippling DOMS. It is one of those thing you need to experiment to see how it affects you.
Agreed with this. It affects everyone differently so just try it out and see out you react and it treats you.
 

Slims

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Funny that you ask this... I actually have already, but its rather peculiar: One bottle of ARA from EA, and another bottle of x-gels. hahah It just ended up being like that because i bought in different orders with other stuff from different places and this is what they had
I've never tried EA's Arachidonic Acid, so can't suggest or say anything about it. However, SNS' X-Gelz is a solid ARA product and top forum favourite. 4-5 softgels 60-45 minutes pre-workout should ensure you some serious muscle pumps and fullness.
 
heavylifter33

heavylifter33

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I've only used X Gels, but i don't think there would be a difference between SNS and MN's products as they are both licensed from the same source.

At 1g pre workout i never experienced DOMS. At 1.5g pre workout i have never experienced DOMS. However at 1.5g pre i would have to be careful if i was ingesting any other pump-related ingredients as it could become painful if you are doing isolation exercises. ArA and potassium nitrate is a no-no for me, pump is just too intense lol.
 
Jiigzz

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I train each main movement twice per week, minimum.

Squats
Bench
Deads
Ohp

And then a mix of exercises thrown in around that.

For me, I've never really had an issue with the increased DOMS unless unless i dosed it higher than 1.5g.

At 2g I struggled with maintaining Squats twice per week
 
The Express 42

The Express 42

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Enhanced athletes ARA has much less ARA per cap than X gels does or MN’s
 

HAMinTheTrap

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SNS and MN use ARASYN standardized Arachidonic Acid, Quality over Quantity.
Indeed, i had not noticed that... The quantity itself is higher though... but that makes me wonder now...

EAs say: "10% fermented from mortierella alpina including lipid complex"

SNS: "625mg of of ARA acid oil blend at 40% standardization yielding 250mg of ARA"

So... does EA's product only come with 35mg of the good stuff(10% of 350)?? thats a gigantic difference then. i hope the way i should be calculating this is wrong somehow, otherwise the worth/cost-benefit of EAs product is a joke.

It cant be right?! Because that would mean id have to take about 7 caps from EA to get that 250mg id be getting for 1 x-gel?
Specially considering the recommended dose on EAs product is 4 caps total (with a 6 max recommendation)

There is probably something going on that invalidates my math/comparisson.
 

Slims

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EAs say: "10% fermented from mortierella alpina including lipid complex"

So... does EA's product only come with 35mg of the good stuff(10% of 350)?? thats a gigantic difference then. i hope the way i should be calculating this is wrong somehow, otherwise the worth/cost-benefit of EAs product is a joke.

It cant be right?! Because that would mean id have to take about 7 caps from EA to get that 250mg id be getting for 1 x-gel?
Specially considering the recommended dose on EAs product is 4 caps total
Unfortunately bro if you're right and EA's standardization is only 10% Arachidonic Acid then yes, you're only getting 35mg per cap. The regular dose for ARA is 1g-1.5g per day which would equate to you having to take about 28 caps per day to get the effective dose.
 

HAMinTheTrap

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Unfortunately bro if you're right and EA's standardization is only 10% Arachidonic Acid then yes, you're only getting 35mg per cap. The regular dose for ARA is 1g-1.5g per day which would equate to you having to take about 28 caps per day to get the effective dose.


I think you might have to zoom-in to read, but its doable
 

BlockBuilder

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Is it safe to take something that’s pro inflammatory? What if you have an underlying (yet dormant) disease? Couldn’t something like this bring it out? I’ve read about Arachodonic acid having a role in cancer and other diseases. I’m struggling to understand how under any circumstance purposely trying to create inflammation in the body could be healthy. If I’m wrong I would at least like an explanation as to how I’m wrong. Inflammation in the body is what causes disease and chronic illness
 

Slims

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I think you might have to zoom-in to read, but its doable
Yup, that's a very low standard and underdosed product. Sorry, but unless you are exceptionally reactive to ARA I doubt you'll get anything beneficial from this product.
 

ironkill

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Is it safe to take something that’s pro inflammatory? What if you have an underlying (yet dormant) disease? Couldn’t something like this bring it out? I’ve read about Arachodonic acid having a role in cancer and other diseases. I’m struggling to understand how under any circumstance purposely trying to create inflammation in the body could be healthy. If I’m wrong I would at least like an explanation as to how I’m wrong. Inflammation in the body is what causes disease and chronic illness
Arachidonic acid, a muscle-strengthening fatty acid without health risks



Arachidonic Acid
According to a small but growing number of human studies, supplementation with one and a half grams of arachidonic acid per day stimulates muscle growth. But is arachidonic acid safe in those quantities? Doesn't the stuff also trigger inflammatory reactions in the body? According to a small human study that sports scientist James Markworth, from the University of Auckland in New Zealand, published in Prostaglandins, Leukotrienes & Essential Fatty Acids, there is no cause for concern.

Arachidonic acid
Every day the average Westerner consumes about 15 grams of the omega-6 fatty acid linoleic acid. Using this linoleic acid as a precursor, the body synthesizes about 30 milligrams of arachidonic acid, another omega-6 fatty acid daily. Through diet the same average Westerner consumes about 150 milligrams of arachidonic acid daily.

The bulk of the arachidonic acid in the human body - of which a surprisingly high percentage can be found in muscle tissue - is not synthesized from linoleic acid, but comes directly from the diet. This suggests that supplementation with arachidonic acid is an excellent way to increase the amount of arachidonic acid in the muscles.

Arachidonic acid, a muscle-strengthening fatty acid without health risks
More arachidonic acid in the muscles means more muscle growth according to studies. Arachidonic acid is the precursor of all kinds of inflammatory factors, such as PGFs and PGEs. Some of them play a crucial role in muscle growth. That was the reason behind the introduction of arachidonic acid as a sports supplement by Molecular Nutrition over a decade ago.

But, as some nutrition scientists ask themselves, is supplementation with such amounts of arachidonic acid safe? Indeed, inflammatory factors can also have negative health effects. Hence the New Zealand research.

Study
Markworth divided 19 male twenties, all of whom had been training with weights for at least a year, into two groups. One got 1500 milligrams of arachidonic acid daily for 4 weeks, the other group took a placebo. The researchers used Arasco, a DSM product. Arasco is mainly used in baby food.

The research was by no means funded by Molecular Nutrition, nor by DSM.

Results
Supplementation with arachidonic acid did not lead to statistically significant changes in body composition - but well, the duration of the study was too short for that. However, the supplementation improved the cholesterol household of the test subjects a bit.

During the supplementation period, the concentration of arachidonic acid in white blood cells [PBMC] and muscle cells increased by 8 and 4 percent respectively. Nevertheless, the production of inflammatory factors such as interleukin 1-beta and TNF-alpha did not increase - not in the blood cells and not in the muscle cells.


Arachidonic acid, a muscle-strengthening fatty acid without health risks


Arachidonic acid, a muscle-strengthening fatty acid without health risks


Supplementation with arachidonic acid increased the production of MyoG and MyoD1 in the muscle cells. These are signaling molecules that play a role in muscle growth, partly because they make stem cells to develop into new muscle cells.

Conclusion
"Increasing arachidonic acid consumption by 1.5 g/day arachidonic acid for 4-weeks in healthy young men participating in resistance exercise training promotes greater changes in plasma and muscle lipid arachidonic acid abundance compared to placebo, but this is not associated with any evidence of a heightened systemic or intramuscular basal inflammation", Markworth wrote.

"Arachidonic acid supplementation also had no obvious negative impact on a range of clinical parameters in this population. Therefore, short term increases in dietary arachidonic acid intake at least up to 1.5 g/day do not influence local inflammation in healthy young men participating in regular resistance exercise training."
 

HAMinTheTrap

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Yup, that's a very low standard and underdosed product. Sorry, but unless you are exceptionally reactive to ARA I doubt you'll get anything beneficial from this product.
:damnit::damnit::damnit:

Anyone else can confirm this??

Before i overdose on this **** trying to make up for the underdosed serving!
 
warbird01

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:damnit::damnit::damnit:

Anyone else can confirm this??

Before i overdose on this **** trying to make up for the underdosed serving!
Yup this is true :/ Maybe you will have epic placebo gains?
 
Jiigzz

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Indeed, i had not noticed that... The quantity itself is higher though... but that makes me wonder now...

EAs say: "10% fermented from mortierella alpina including lipid complex"

SNS: "625mg of of ARA acid oil blend at 40% standardization yielding 250mg of ARA"

So... does EA's product only come with 35mg of the good stuff(10% of 350)?? thats a gigantic difference then. i hope the way i should be calculating this is wrong somehow, otherwise the worth/cost-benefit of EAs product is a joke.

It cant be right?! Because that would mean id have to take about 7 caps from EA to get that 250mg id be getting for 1 x-gel?
Specially considering the recommended dose on EAs product is 4 caps total (with a 6 max recommendation)

There is probably something going on that invalidates my math/comparisson.
That is correct. That company is absolutely screwing people over
 
Jiigzz

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I think you might have to zoom-in to read, but its doable
Looking at that, those caps appear to be powdered inside? If so, the powder is usually 10% of actual usable ARA.
 

HAMinTheTrap

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Looking at that, those caps appear to be powdered inside? If so, the powder is usually 10% of actual usable ARA.
Are you just confirming/reaffirming your other post above?

Im a bit confused now...

Yes, the caps looks exactly like the ones on the pic... so i guess they would be powder indeed.
 
Jiigzz

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Is it safe to take something that’s pro inflammatory? What if you have an underlying (yet dormant) disease? Couldn’t something like this bring it out? I’ve read about Arachodonic acid having a role in cancer and other diseases. I’m struggling to understand how under any circumstance purposely trying to create inflammation in the body could be healthy. If I’m wrong I would at least like an explanation as to how I’m wrong. Inflammation in the body is what causes disease and chronic illness
Very valid concerns, however the role of ARA is very very complex, and therein lies a distinction between prostagladin release through supplemental ARA and prostaglandins produced through a dysfunction in the body. PGE2 can exert both proinflammatory and anti-inflammatory responses depending on receptor subtype, context of activation, and receptor gene expression in tissues.

Ara doesn't cause disease, it is simply released from cell membranes where it generates the appropriate PGs based on what caused their release.

Moreover, progressive inflammatory diseases like Rheumatoid Arthritis are not caused by ARA, but rather extremely complex interactions that occur as a result of immune dysfunction and leukocyte infiltration of the synovial compartment - essentially this is a dysfunction with the auto immune system.

A lot of other inflammatory diseases have other, far more complex factors that lead to dysfunction of the immune system, but these are not caused by ARA.
 
Jiigzz

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Are you just confirming/reaffirming your other post above?

Im a bit confused now...

Yes, the caps looks exactly like the ones on the pic... so i guess they would be powder indeed.
Yep! My bad, I got an error on the first post but it went through anyway
 
The Express 42

The Express 42

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Yep, you got played brother. Next time go for the good stuff, happens to the best of us
 
taylor8461

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Faaaaaaam I personally take EA's Arachidonic acid and I can promise it is not bunk whatsoever. Three caps and I get godlike pumps, four and I'll have doms for the next week. It works.
 
warbird01

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Faaaaaaam I personally take EA's Arachidonic acid and I can promise it is not bunk whatsoever. Three caps and I get godlike pumps, four and I'll have doms for the next week. It works.
Take some properly dosed ArA and feel the real power of the ingredient :)
 
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