Hi-tech pharm 1-ad and 1-testosterone cycle advice

[jtbull]

Hell all.

This will be my second cycle last one ended in july and was a 90 day lgd and cardarine by primeval labs with PCT

This one I have 1 bottle of 1-ad and 1-testosterone. I was told to stay on for one month and take both bottles and cycle together then do a pct during week 4 as opposed to using all of one bottle in one month the other in month 2 or 1/2 dose of each for the full two months.

Following up with PCT.

Anything else I need with this? Looking to get stronger mostly Muscle gain and fat loss is great, but mostly worried about strength.

 

[dvw]

Theyre both same 1 dhea, just different mg. per tab. Take 200-400 mgs daily for 6-8 weeks. Run a SERM for pct. Over counter herbal pct not good enough.

 

[dvw]

You can gainz 8 lbs in 8 weeks if you train hard.

 

[Whey]

4dhea or some form test would be beneficial. Back in the day that was the stack 1ad/4ad

 

[criticalbench]

You can run them both together for 4 weeks total and get some very solid results. An otc is enough, NOTHING, legal or illegal will shut you down hard enough in 4 weeks time where you couldn't even recover on your own without a pct. It will just take longer. Hi Tech makes arimiplex which is more than enough to cover you.

 

[booneman77]

You can run them both together for 4 weeks total and get some very solid results. An otc is enough, NOTHING, legal or illegal will shut you down hard enough in 4 weeks time where you couldn't even recover on your own without a pct. It will just take longer. Hi Tech makes arimiplex which is more than enough to cover you.

um no... trest... tren... etc... 4 weeks is more than enough to cause permanent issues. Saying OTC is enough (100% of the time) is just flat out wrong. and dangerous. It's totally user dependent so you cannot state this as fact. Some poor newbie is gonna take 4 weeks of trest now and be permanently sterile thanks to posts like this.

 

[AntM1564]

um no... trest... tren... etc... 4 weeks is more than enough to cause permanent issues. Saying OTC is enough (100% of the time) is just flat out wrong. and dangerous. It's totally user dependent so you cannot state this as fact. Some poor newbie is gonna take 4 weeks of trest now and be permanently sterile thanks to posts like this.

If you haven't noticed, OTC PCT is more than enough, for some Hi-Tech reps. I'm not trying to rip Hi-Tech, but it is not right, in my opinion, to say a SERM is not needed. It is not responsible.

 

[jtbull]

You can run them both together for 4 weeks total and get some very solid results. An otc is enough, NOTHING, legal or illegal will shut you down hard enough in 4 weeks time where you couldn't even recover on your own without a pct. It will just take longer. Hi Tech makes arimiplex which is more than enough to cover you.

I thought arimiplex was more of a cycle support?

um no... trest... tren... etc... 4 weeks is more than enough to cause permanent issues. Saying OTC is enough (100% of the time) is just flat out wrong. and dangerous. It's totally user dependent so you cannot state this as fact. Some poor newbie is gonna take 4 weeks of trest now and be permanently sterile thanks to posts like this.

what is Trest? Yeah I have heard that. On the gear I know otc wont cut it. Some ph stuff I know people who have been fine with an OTC. I have clomid on hand and actually was going to take that with an otc ptc just to be safe.

 

[booneman77]

I thought arimiplex was more of a cycle support?



what is Trest? Yeah I have heard that. On the gear I know otc wont cut it. Some ph stuff I know people who have been fine with an OTC. I have clomid on hand and actually was going to take that with an otc ptc just to be safe.

arimiplex is a mix of cycle support ingredients, test booster ingredients and arimistane... and underdosed at 1 serving...

Trest is a steroid thats basically the best of test and tren... wet, huge gains in strength and mass, functions similar to test in the body, but can be very dangerous due to the methyl estrogen it converts to as well as potentially causing infertility (it was actually being tested as a male contraceptive)... huge gains but def higher risk. Oral, TD, and injectible all exist.

You're already smarter than most of the HT reps by knowing to do a proper pct even for a "mild" cycle. That said, 4 weeks is too short for these compounds and I would suggest 6-8 as a much better alternative. You will need more though as dosing has to stay high though as well.

 

[dvw]

You can recover from nearly anything androgenic taken as exogenous hormone "eventually". But why have several weeks of low test, higher e2 and lose gainz? Clomid is cheap and effective at low dose.

 

[booneman77]

You can recover from nearly anything androgenic taken as exogenous hormone "eventually". But why have several weeks of low test, higher e2 and lose gainz? Clomid is cheap and effective at low dose.

you "may" recover... never a guarantee (even with a serm this is still true)... chances are it would take months not just weeks though and months of low t would just have you lose everything you built (and prob more) on cycle... so basically you have wasted money, time, and become miserable and weak for it haha

 

[criticalbench]

um no... trest... tren... etc... 4 weeks is more than enough to cause permanent issues. Saying OTC is enough (100% of the time) is just flat out wrong. and dangerous. It's totally user dependent so you cannot state this as fact. Some poor newbie is gonna take 4 weeks of trest now and be permanently sterile thanks to posts like this.

Bro, I don't know what your experience is like in this field, but don't dare try to assert your dominance in this field and try scare and shy away others who may be newer to this generation of hormonal agents and trick them into thinking chemotherapeutic agents are the only way possible to restore a proper hormonal balance.

If the extent of your experience with hormones revolves around pro-hormones, designer steroids, sarms, etc. then this conversation is essentially pointless, especially if you have never spent time on more, "underground," "darkside," forums.

If you would like to be real, don't even begin to try to convince people that it is not possible to recover from a 16+, hell even 6 month+ cycle without even a pct; people do it all the time. Am I advocating it, absolutely not. A pct speeds recovery, but your body has ONE hell of an ability to recovery on its own, it may just take a bit longer.

Perm sterile? Are you aware of primary and secondary hypogonadism? Are you aware of the differences, the treatments? How the occur? Your statement is utter proof, you do not. You should not be using those terms when you don't no what your talking about.

Lastly, since when are you an Oncologist to go ahead and recommend / suggest chemotherapy treatment to members on the forum? Afterall, that is what tamoxifen truly is?

I have been in this world of hormones for a long long long long time, on unground private forums you have never heard of, been running stuff for 12 years now. I know what goes on, I know what happens, I know what people do, and I know how people here blow situations to the extreme. I know the reality that most are buying research chemicals and that is the goal, to prevent. They are not sourcing pharma tabs.. I don't want any of those newbies with horrid research chems in their hands. They are far far better otc if anything. If you had the balls to do some blood work, you might surprise yourself.

You fell into the insecure, unknowledgable forum trap of SERMS are a must. How much blood work did you review to back up this thought process before you decided to preach it like your own? Most likely, none. Yet you got suckered in back in the day.. which isnt your fault, it was the hype back then and people with zero knowledge just keep spitting it out. Hell, people who never even ran cycle before or never good bloods even preach it, which is terrible, but thats life.

 

[criticalbench]

You're already smarter than most of the HT reps by knowing to do a proper pct even for a "mild" cycle.

Negative.. were all not a bunch of little pretty pretty prisses or cute little princesses who kiss the ass of the general forum opinion.. we formulate our own damn knowledge, use our brains, most of us have been in this game for longer than you have ever been around.. and know by experience and blood work backed by various cycles and users over many forums.. your exaggerated pcts are ridiculous for a simple 4 week cycle where your body doesn't even get shut down, or just begins to take a hit.

Yes you push these members towards research chemicals which are suspicious as hell, proven many times to be bunk, grey marketed.. are you giving them pharma grade sources.. prolly not?

So they run research nolva, which is bunk, so they run a fake nothing pct.. Solid.

 

[criticalbench]

If you haven't noticed, OTC PCT is more than enough, for some Hi-Tech reps. I'm not trying to rip Hi-Tech, but it is not right, in my opinion, to say a SERM is not needed. It is not responsible.

I'm not going to argue with you, because I actually like you as a member.. all I can say. If you EVER suggest a serm to a member. PLEASE link them to a pharma grade source and plead with them NOT to order a research grade product.

 

[AntM1564]

I'm not going to argue with you, because I actually like you as a member.. all I can say. If you EVER suggest a serm to a member. PLEASE link them to a pharma grade source and plead with them NOT to order a research grade product.

I obviously cannot link them to PG, but I always so go with PG over RC. I would not trust PG and because of that, never suggest it. I state to look around before starting and yes, that is in my post history.

 

[booneman77]

um no... trest... tren... etc... 4 weeks is more than enough to cause permanent issues. Saying OTC is enough (100% of the time) is just flat out wrong. and dangerous. It's totally user dependent so you cannot state this as fact. Some poor newbie is gonna take 4 weeks of trest now and be permanently sterile thanks to posts like this.

Bro, I don't know what your experience is like in this field, but don't dare try to assert your dominance in this field and try scare and shy away others who may be newer to this generation of hormonal agents and trick them into thinking chemotherapeutic agents are the only way possible to restore a proper hormonal balance.

First off, as you stated, you don't know what my experience is like... so don't assume (as the rest of your post goes on to do). Am I an expert? Hell no. But to say some of the things IN THE WAY that you said them is misleading and potentially dangerous. In no way did I try to "assert my dominance", only to guide people away from your statement of "NO PCT REQUIRED"... can they get away with that? sure, maybe, and sometimes... is that a guarantee (as a REQUIREMENT) would suggest? nope. No doctorate required to understand that.Nothing I said is out of the realm of POSSIBILITY and that's the key here. All of the good and that bad versions of this story are POSSIBLE for anyone so dealing in GUARANTEES is ignorant.

If the extent of your experience with hormones revolves around pro-hormones, designer steroids, sarms, etc. then this conversation is essentially pointless, especially if you have never spent time on more, "underground," "darkside," forums.

again, don't make assumptions based on the fact that you have no idea what I do with my life outside of these forums and what's posted here.

If you would like to be real, don't even begin to try to convince people that it is not possible to recover from a 16+, hell even 6 month+ cycle without even a pct; people do it all the time. Am I advocating it, absolutely not. A pct speeds recovery, but your body has ONE hell of an ability to recovery on its own, it may just take a bit longer.

Never once did I say it was IMPOSSIBLE... It surely can be, but most likely is not... that said, we are in agreement that its just more practical to PCT (but again this goes back to my point that you blatantly recommended NOT to do one above, which was my entire issue with your post). The main point is that the time ti takes to recover without a pct can basically negate or more anything benefited from while on. As amazing as the body is, when you have no hormonal balance to support that new muscle/leanness/etc, your body will only keep what is necessary to continue living. Which defeats the purpose of a cycle altogether and now just has placed undue stress on your body for zero net benefit (or worse).

Perm sterile? Are you aware of primary and secondary hypogonadism? Are you aware of the differences, the treatments? How the occur? Your statement is utter proof, you do not. You should not be using those terms when you don't no what your talking about.

Lastly, since when are you an Oncologist to go ahead and recommend / suggest chemotherapy treatment to members on the forum? Afterall, that is what tamoxifen truly is?

Of course i am aware (i come from a family of medical professionals FYI), but the majority are not and to speak in detailed scientific terms would not be an effective means of communicating the potential seriousness of the possible issues to the typical forum member... is it a bit "over-the-top" to use that term? sure, maybe... but the point is the same... its serious business and needs to be taken as such and not just "well lets hope i recover just fine... johnny did"

The danger of a cycle IMO is far greater than the danger of a SERM.

I have been in this world of hormones for a long long long long time, on unground private forums you have never heard of, been running stuff for 12 years now. I know what goes on, I know what happens, I know what people do, and I know how people here blow situations to the extreme. I know the reality that most are buying research chemicals and that is the goal, to prevent. They are not sourcing pharma tabs.. I don't want any of those newbies with horrid research chems in their hands. They are far far better otc if anything. If you had the balls to do some blood work, you might surprise yourself.

You fell into the insecure, unknowledgable forum trap of SERMS are a must. How much blood work did you review to back up this thought process before you decided to preach it like your own? Most likely, none. Yet you got suckered in back in the day.. which isnt your fault, it was the hype back then and people with zero knowledge just keep spitting it out. Hell, people who never even ran cycle before or never good bloods even preach it, which is terrible, but thats life.

Discussing OTC vs research vs pharma is not what the original statement was about... it was PCT vs none. I'm in agreement that research is flat out a risk anytime and not the best option, but to say nothing at all is the better option is really just assuming equal risk IMO.

My personal bloodwork is exactly that, mine and personal... I would not expect you to know how often and to what degree I get it done so again, stop making assumptions that I have none and couldn't possibly have. I handle my personal life and bloodwork just fine (which is why I'm confident enough to make recommendations based on ACTUAL EXPERIENCE).

Nobody ever suggested he go get research chems... again, you extrapolated a statement to the nth degree to make your end sound better. OF COURSE a pharma grade SERM is what we should and do recommend. Can we source it for them? NOPE. You know the forum rules... we can suggest all we want but in the end, its always going to be up to the user to make the right decision and not go the cheap/easy route. We can give advice and recommendations, but that's it.

Negative.. were all not a bunch of little pretty pretty prisses or cute little princesses who kiss the ass of the general forum opinion.. we formulate our own damn knowledge, use our brains, most of us have been in this game for longer than you have ever been around.. and know by experience and blood work backed by various cycles and users over many forums.. your exaggerated pcts are ridiculous for a simple 4 week cycle where your body doesn't even get shut down, or just begins to take a hit.

Yes you push these members towards research chemicals which are suspicious as hell, proven many times to be bunk, grey marketed.. are you giving them pharma grade sources.. prolly not?

So they run research nolva, which is bunk, so they run a fake nothing pct.. Solid.

nobody ever pushed research chems so you can drop that argument as its just you arguing with yourself. And even so, if their RC are bunk, they're essentially running your suggested pct so you should be happy haha.

I'm not going to argue with you, because I actually like you as a member.. all I can say. If you EVER suggest a serm to a member. PLEASE link them to a pharma grade source and plead with them NOT to order a research grade product.

again, you know we cannot LINK sources. RC or pharma. c'mon.

 

[jtbull]

Would 100mg or 4 andro be ok with this just for the lethargy? I really like what 1 andro does but seems you really need some 4 with it. Does epiandro do what 4 does where you can take it with 1 andro?

Also if I can get 4 androdiol ( banned) what is a dosage to get results? I have seen some people say 1000mg per day and hell gear would be cheaper in that case. matter of fact gear is cheaper than ph it seems

 

[210LBS]

Why the hate on research chems? Whether you get research chems here or pharma grade from India, you can end up with bunk. Anything can be bunk or underdosed unless you're getting a prescription filled at your local drug store. I've been searching through research chems and pharma grade and I haven't found anything that makes me feel 100% comfortable. Both ways seem risky.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

It's up to the user to do his due dilligence and make an adult decision. Old School guys never did "PCT" - no idea on the stats of who became shut down perm or sterile, but guys like Skip Hill still aren't fans of it. Dr. Rand says the best way to kick the HPTA back into production - is to stop cold turkey - he also doesn't recco PCT. On the flip side, there is blood work from N=1 UncleSARM after 8 weeks of Ostarine at 20mg. He was in the 100's Total T. He did a "natty PCT" and didn't even make it back to baseline (567 start / 467 after natty product) - IMO that was natural recovery. Me personally, think it's insane not to use a SERM, because I'd rather be artificially high and drop back down, than climb my way out of the basement - for numerous quality of life, and physiological reasons. Rx over RC (and India is fine with me, thank god for ADC Aromasin), but there are RCs who crush up Rx and stick it in liquid. You can test your SERM, but it costs you a blood draw. Isn't all this shjt fun!

 

[Derek Wilson]

Great info!

 

[210LBS]

It's up to the user to do his due dilligence and make an adult decision. Old School guys never did "PCT" - no idea on the stats of who became shut down perm or sterile, but guys like Skip Hill still aren't fans of it. Dr. Rand says the best way to kick the HPTA back into production - is to stop cold turkey - he also doesn't recco PCT. On the flip side, there is blood work from N=1 UncleSARM after 8 weeks of Ostarine at 20mg. He was in the 100's Total T. He did a "natty PCT" and didn't even make it back to baseline (567 start / 467 after natty product) - IMO that was natural recovery. Me personally, think it's insane not to use a SERM, because I'd rather be artificially high and drop back down, than climb my way out of the basement - for numerous quality of life, and physiological reasons. Rx over RC (and India is fine with me, thank god for ADC Aromasin), but there are RCs who crush up Rx and stick it in liquid. You can test your SERM, but it costs you a blood draw. Isn't all this shjt fun!

Your libertarian ways are clouding your judgement. People can do their own due diligence and make their own decisions, but most people are stupid and mostly need to be told what to do. Just because you're an exception doesn't mean it applies to everyone else.

No PH use here, but I've known and seen many who have used them over the years. Back in the day many people were taking the original andros and running 6-oxo as PCT with no issues. Today it seems like the andros have gotten weaker and the PCTs have gotten stronger with most people opting for pharma SERMs now and some even running pharma AIs. I don't have an answer as to what the appropriate PCT is for a mild and short run of today's andros, but I do know there are lots of conflicting answers.

As for importing pharma SERMs from India... eh. You may have no problem with it, but how do you really know what you're getting? You also don't know what you're getting from research chems. But just because you think you're getting legit pharma from India doesn't mean you are. And I actually know someone who was getting a lot of overseas pharma for a few years just to find out it was all bunk. When you play in the gray/black market you have to pay.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

Your libertarian ways are clouding your judgement. People can do their own due diligence and make their own decisions, but most people are stupid and mostly need to be told what to do.

As for importing pharma SERMs from India... eh. You may have no problem with it, but how do you really know what you're getting? You also don't know what you're getting from research chems. But just because you think you're getting legit pharma from India doesn't mean you are. And I actually know someone who was getting a lot of overseas pharma for a few years just to find out it was all bunk. When you play in the gray/black market you have to pay.

Stupid hurts, but it cleanses the gene pool. Darwin prevents pro-creation. You'll know pretty quick if your imported AI is bunk even without blood work - your tits will light up like Rudolph's nose. Sure, the only way to be 100% is to get a US script, but good luck getting that. Yes, I guess you can counterfeit Holograms and even Pill Imprints (?) but the next logical choice is foreign pharma (the US doesn't have the market cornered on medicine), then local RC. I mean, come on - you have to use something, right? Or you don't cycle, that's an option too. You'd also know if the importer was scamming people pretty quick I think - long history, and 4 or 5 reccos from on here for the one I went with. No matter now though - TRT FTW.

PS: What medicine was your buddy using for years - that he couldn't tell wasn't working?

 

[210LBS]

Stupid hurts, but it cleanses the gene pool. Darwin prevents pro-creation. You'll know pretty quick if your imported AI is bunk even without blood work - your tits will light up like Rudolph's nose. Sure, the only way to be 100% is to get a US script, but good luck getting that. Yes, I guess you can counterfeit Holograms and even Pill Imprints (?) but the next logical choice is foreign pharma (the US doesn't have the market cornered on medicine), then local RC. I mean, come on - you have to use something, right? Or you don't cycle, that's an option too. You'd also know if the importer was scamming people pretty quick I think - long history, and 4 or 5 reccos from on here for the one I went with. No matter now though - TRT FTW.

PS: What medicine was your buddy using for years - that he couldn't tell wasn't working?

That's true. My point is, you're always taking a risk when you're playing in the black/gray market. There are only so many precautions one can take and you still have to day f**k it at some point. As for as your tits lighting up... who knows. What brought you to TRT? Do you think it's related to AAS use or were you low prior to using?

What my buddy was using was not related to bodybuilding supplements. He was getting stuff like propecia and viagra. Ended up just being a mixture of cement and sand I think.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

That's true. My point is, you're always taking a risk when you're playing in the black/gray market. There are only so many precautions one can take and you still have to day f**k it at some point. As for as your tits lighting up... who knows. What brought you to TRT? Do you think it's related to AAS use or were you low prior to using?

What my buddy was using was not related to bodybuilding supplements. He was getting stuff like propecia and viagra. Ended up just being a mixture of cement and sand I think.

Yes, anything but Rx from a US Doc/Walgreen's et. al. is riskier - agree 100.

Believe me - inject Test w/o (or with bunk) an AI and you'll *know* what true "the Gyno's comein''" really is.

I'm almost 50 and was at 320ng/dl - old age my man.

He didn't know his Viagra wasn't working? "Hey man! Where's my wood!?

 

[210LBS]

Yes, anything but Rx from a US Doc/Walgreen's et. al. is riskier - agree 100.

Believe me - inject Test w/o (or with bunk) an AI and you'll *know* what true "the Gyno's comein''" really is.

I'm almost 50 and was at 320ng/dl - old age my man.

He didn't know his Viagra wasn't working? "Hey man! Where's my wood!?

In the short term I really believe that the fake viagra worked via the placebo effect for him. Long term that doesn't hold up as well.

I don't have any plans on injecting test at all. I'm looking at running 1,4-andro, so hopefully I don't know that feeling of gyno flare up. Although I assume there were guys during Arnold's day that were running AAS without any PCT and some didn't get gyno, so perhaps it is user dependent.

 

[Derek Wilson]

100mg okay maybe

 

[jtbull]

100mg okay maybe

100mg of 4 andro with what i am taking is ok? I am also looking at my next cycle and will be posting about it soon. If i can keep the gains from it i am thinking of epistaine added in since i have a source for it.