Best supplements to add to TRT for gains? (Plus TRT results)

[Justlooking5]

Hey all, I'm currently on TRT (21 weeks) prescribed through a men's health clinic at 170mg/week split into 2 shots per week, along with 2 x .25mg anastrazole and 250iu HCG 1x/ week. I had chronic low testosterone for years prior to this. I have done several AAS cycles in the past, but none within the last 11 years (last cycle 2006). I am 35 y/o.

So far I can unequivocally say that even this amount of testosterone has allowed me to make more gains in size, strength, fat loss, and overall muscularity than ALL OTHER SUPPLEMENTS COMBINED (i.e., taking creatine, BA, PA, Betaine, Carnitine, etc. simultaneously)... in other words, even a small dose of testosterone is superior to all other supplements combined, at least if you have low T like I did.

Anyway, I'm looking for any ideas for supplements to add to TRT to boost results. I'm only interested in individual ingredients (i.e., bulk creatine), not combination products.

So far I am taking:

Creatine mono 5g/day (good results)
Betaine 3g/day (boosts IGF-1, maybe synergize with test)
10g Leucine w/ dextrose PWO (to spike insulin synergistically)
Carnitine tartrate (increase androgen receptors)
various other things such as fish oil, joint supps, etc.

Anyway, looking for other products to enhance size and strength gains. I'm holding off on beta alanine (anxiety) and phosphatidic acid (swear it makes my midsection fat) for now, but may add both later (BTW do people still think Phosphatidic acid is good?)

Anyway, just looking for ideas for additional individual ingredients to boost size and strength gains.

Thanks. And feel free to ask me any qs about my TRT experiences.

 

[Laxarcher13]

I’m actually starting TRT on Monday. Do the doctors start you off on an amount that will carry over to the gym and help progress there? Also would it be silly to ask her if she prescribed anything besides testosterone (I would ask for it in a way that dosnt sound like I want it just for the gym) is trt the same as bioidentical hormones? Dosnt estrogen increase as well when on trt? Will my balls be noticeably smaller oh and will I go longer in bed. When I say longer I mean do you have more of that want to keep going to town on her? Did you lose body fat with out changing anything? From talking and reading I’ve found people will add a sarm such as RAD140 or MK677.

 

[Georgiepecker]

I’m actually starting TRT on Monday. Do the doctors start you off on an amount that will carry over to the gym and help progress there? Also would it be silly to ask her if she prescribed anything besides testosterone (I would ask for it in a way that dosnt sound like I want it just for the gym) is trt the same as bioidentical hormones? Dosnt estrogen increase as well when on trt? Will my balls be noticeably smaller oh and will I go longer in bed. When I say longer I mean do you have more of that want to keep going to town on her? Did you lose body fat with out changing anything? From talking and reading I’ve found people will add a sarm such as RAD140 or MK677.

They are only going to prescribe you some form of Testosterone or a drug that can cause your body to make its own testosterone in a higher amount than currently. It can be shots, pellets, creams. They won’t give you AAS lol.

However dosage is what will matter. OP’s starting dose is on the high end at 170mg a week for starters, but based on height/weight might make sense for him.

Even on 100mg/week you will see a difference and have an athletic edge.

 

[Laxarcher13]

Someone told me that you receive more test out of the shots than you do creams. Is this true? When my grandma had melanoma cancer they gave her Masteron near the end. Cool thing about my doc is she used to be a trainer in bed school

 

[MrKleen73]

Hey all, I'm currently on TRT (21 weeks) prescribed through a men's health clinic at 170mg/week split into 2 shots per week, along with 2 x .25mg anastrazole and 250iu HCG 1x/ week. I had chronic low testosterone for years prior to this. I have done several AAS cycles in the past, but none within the last 11 years (last cycle 2006). I am 35 y/o.

So far I can unequivocally say that even this amount of testosterone has allowed me to make more gains in size, strength, fat loss, and overall muscularity than ALL OTHER SUPPLEMENTS COMBINED (i.e., taking creatine, BA, PA, Betaine, Carnitine, etc. simultaneously)... in other words, even a small dose of testosterone is superior to all other supplements combined, at least if you have low T like I did.

Anyway, I'm looking for any ideas for supplements to add to TRT to boost results. I'm only interested in individual ingredients (i.e., bulk creatine), not combination products.

So far I am taking:

Creatine mono 5g/day (good results)
Betaine 3g/day (boosts IGF-1, maybe synergize with test)
10g Leucine w/ dextrose PWO (to spike insulin synergistically)
Carnitine tartrate (increase androgen receptors)
various other things such as fish oil, joint supps, etc.

Anyway, looking for other products to enhance size and strength gains. I'm holding off on beta alanine (anxiety) and phosphatidic acid (swear it makes my midsection fat) for now, but may add both later (BTW do people still think Phosphatidic acid is good?)

Anyway, just looking for ideas for additional individual ingredients to boost size and strength gains.

Thanks. And feel free to ask me any qs about my TRT experiences.

Look at natty rest boosters that have a lot if SHBG binding ingredients. Divanyl, tribulus, Maca, longjak and testofen. They will I crease your free test and on trt that works out nicely!

 

[jgntyce]

A great natty test booster is CEL M TEST. Many positive reviews about the product. Recommended by many respected members here on AM.

 

[ManuR]

Someone told me that you receive more test out of the shots than you do creams. Is this true? When my grandma had melanoma cancer they gave her Masteron near the end. Cool thing about my doc is she used to be a trainer in bed school

difference is some dudes dont absorb topicals very well or do not prepare their skin will enough.
several studies show that creams/gels are not inferior to shots.
creams/gels might increase DHT more though, so you have to keep prostata in check

 

[corsaking]

They are only going to prescribe you some form of Testosterone or a drug that can cause your body to make its own testosterone in a higher amount than currently. It can be shots, pellets, creams. They won’t give you AAS lol.

However dosage is what will matter. OP’s starting dose is on the high end at 170mg a week for starters, but based on height/weight might make sense for him.

Even on 100mg/week you will see a difference and have an athletic edge.

not quite sure where you get the idea that quote Testosterone or a drug that can cause your body to make its own testosterone in a higher amount than currently.

the little you have will shut down and your balls will shrink.Perhaps you could explain that quotation , ive been on trt for about 10 years and its the first ive heard of that

 

[kenpoengineer]

Can I recommend joining two FB groups?

Testosterone Replacement Therapy Discussion

Anabolic Steroid Harm Reduction

 

[kisaj]

We have an anti- aging section here that you guys that are new to this should check out. Many of us have been on TRT for years and have posted experiences with blast/cruise, adjuncts, etc

 

[Wildcat528]

You really only need 3-5g leucine per serving. MPS does cap out after all. I would add the remaining 5-7g to your post workout and maybe even to spike MPS in between whole food meals. The science seems pretty conclusive on that. Dr. Layne Norton is a great person to follow if you don't already. Very wise man.

 

[Georgiepecker]

not quite sure where you get the idea that quote Testosterone or a drug that can cause your body to make its own testosterone in a higher amount than currently.

the little you have will shut down and your balls will shrink.Perhaps you could explain that quotation , ive been on trt for about 10 years and its the first ive heard of that

Clomid...Nolva...etc

 

[thebigt]

Someone told me that you receive more test out of the shots than you do creams. Is this true? When my grandma had melanoma cancer they gave her Masteron near the end. Cool thing about my doc is she used to be a trainer in bed school

trainer in bed school, eh?


on topic---the best thing to add to trt is dhea, I've found that transdermal works best...look at Olympus labs sup3r dhea, it has both dhea and preg....I've personally tried it and recommend!!!

 

[Justlooking5]

I’m actually starting TRT on Monday. Do the doctors start you off on an amount that will carry over to the gym and help progress there? Also would it be silly to ask her if she prescribed anything besides testosterone (I would ask for it in a way that dosnt sound like I want it just for the gym) is trt the same as bioidentical hormones? Dosnt estrogen increase as well when on trt? Will my balls be noticeably smaller oh and will I go longer in bed. When I say longer I mean do you have more of that want to keep going to town on her? Did you lose body fat with out changing anything? From talking and reading I’ve found people will add a sarm such as RAD140 or MK677.

It depends on your clinic. My clinic is a men's health clinic which is concierge medicine you pay for monthly (I'd give up my apartment, all supps, and other things before giving up paying for the clinic). Therefore, they are a bit more liberal with dosages perhaps which is OK with me.

I want to be on the high to high normal side right now. Both because I feel better and take good care of my health generally, as well as for gains, and because I've had low test for a very long time and want high test going forward. I am 6' and weigh about 220-224 lbs. Arms are around 17.75" cold. Prior to TRT they were about 17" so I've definitely made some gains in the last 5 months/21 weeks.

Generally doctors might start you off at a lower amount if it is a more traditional GP etc., they are often scared of high testosterone, but what seems clear to me is even a dose of trt in the 100mg-125mg/week range can give you a significant, kind of slow but steady boost in gains and strength. It's not dramatic but it's steady improvement.

Estro can increase when you're on TRT but that is why you take arimidex. I am on .25mg 2x/week which seems like plenty for me. Take the min anti estro that you need.

Some of your qs are how you will individually react and I can't answer that (stamina, ball size (likely shrink)... also I think you should do more research on TRT so you have enough general knowledge about it to answer these questions.

 

[Justlooking5]

You really only need 3-5g leucine per serving. MPS does cap out after all. I would add the remaining 5-7g to your post workout and maybe even to spike MPS in between whole food meals. The science seems pretty conclusive on that. Dr. Layne Norton is a great person to follow if you don't already. Very wise man.

Actually I'm not using the leucine just for MPS. The main reason I take it is to spike insulin levels PWO. Leucine has been shown in studies to synergize with dextrose to cause a bigger insulin release than either alone.

If I were taking a high dose of test and added injectable insulin (insulin can be very dangerous for you new people reading this), I'd get bigger gains and the insulin would synergize with the testosterone to increase gains.

Since I don't want to take injectable insulin, this is the next best thing I've found and is relatively straightforward and cheap. I feel it works well but of course how can you distinguish between TRT results and this. But my recovery is extremely good.

 

[corsaking]

trainer in bed school, eh?


on topic---the best thing to add to trt is dhea, I've found that transdermal works best...look at Olympus labs sup3r dhea, it has both dhea and preg....I've personally tried it and recommend!!!

what benefits did you get from dhea, thanks

 

[Wildcat528]

Actually I'm not using the leucine just for MPS. The main reason I take it is to spike insulin levels PWO. Leucine has been shown in studies to synergize with dextrose to cause a bigger insulin release than either alone.

If I were taking a high dose of test and added injectable insulin (insulin can be very dangerous for you new people reading this), I'd get bigger gains and the insulin would synergize with the testosterone to increase gains.

Since I don't want to take injectable insulin, this is the next best thing I've found and is relatively straightforward and cheap. I feel it works well but of course how can you distinguish between TRT results and this. But my recovery is extremely good.

That's interesting! I guess I missed the study comparing their varying doses and the 10g recommendation. Do you mind posting it if you find it? It's fascinating to read the work people are doing and it's great to see people using the science to optimize results. I try to keep an eye out for the peer reviewed studies but sometimes I miss a few :/

 

[GreekTheBrick]

Hey all, I'm currently on TRT (21 weeks) prescribed through a men's health clinic at 170mg/week split into 2 shots per week, along with 2 x .25mg anastrazole and 250iu HCG 1x/ week. I had chronic low testosterone for years prior to this. I have done several AAS cycles in the past, but none within the last 11 years (last cycle 2006). I am 35 y/o.

So far I can unequivocally say that even this amount of testosterone has allowed me to make more gains in size, strength, fat loss, and overall muscularity than ALL OTHER SUPPLEMENTS COMBINED (i.e., taking creatine, BA, PA, Betaine, Carnitine, etc. simultaneously)... in other words, even a small dose of testosterone is superior to all other supplements combined, at least if you have low T like I did.

Anyway, I'm looking for any ideas for supplements to add to TRT to boost results. I'm only interested in individual ingredients (i.e., bulk creatine), not combination products.

So far I am taking:

Creatine mono 5g/day (good results)
Betaine 3g/day (boosts IGF-1, maybe synergize with test)
10g Leucine w/ dextrose PWO (to spike insulin synergistically)
Carnitine tartrate (increase androgen receptors)
various other things such as fish oil, joint supps, etc.

Anyway, looking for other products to enhance size and strength gains. I'm holding off on beta alanine (anxiety) and phosphatidic acid (swear it makes my midsection fat) for now, but may add both later (BTW do people still think Phosphatidic acid is good?)

Anyway, just looking for ideas for additional individual ingredients to boost size and strength gains.

Thanks. And feel free to ask me any qs about my TRT experiences.

Hey, you said it yourself. Test worked way better than any sup that you tried. And it makes sense as it is a drug. Eventually, you will end up playing with test dose. Why not saving money on sups and do it now. The only thing that may notably add to test-besides more test or AAS-is DHEA and pregnolone, which IMO are inaccurately considered to be supplements

 

[EMPIREMIND]

Why don't you ad some hydrolyzed whey and a fast carb like glycofuse or karbolyn and have intra workout. My overall recovery and energy between sets definitely improved.

Another could be Arachidonic Acid. Alot of people really like this, natty or not

 

[JVee63]

Hey, you said it yourself. Test worked way better than any sup that you tried. And it makes sense as it is a drug. Eventually, you will end up playing with test dose. Why not saving money on sups and do it now. The only thing that may notably add to test-besides more test or AAS-is DHEA and pregnolone, which IMO are inaccurately considered to be supplements

Correct answer right there ^^^^
Test boosters, ARA ...etc are only going to work if you have a vivid imagination. Save your money.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

Hey all, I'm currently on TRT (21 weeks) prescribed through a men's health clinic at 170mg/week split into 2 shots per week, along with 2 x .25mg anastrazole and 250iu HCG 1x/ week.

You get your trough levels checked at 170mg yet? Depending on SHBG, I bet you are pretty happy. Everyone is different obviously, but I was in the 7's (trough) at 120mg - Crisler moved me up to 140 with bloods coming up soon. His hCG protocol is a little different though - 10 units/day to mimic what occurs naturally when we were younger - the boys are back to normal size and that amount is pretty affordable (compound pharmacy). No DHEA/Preg? Glad you are having success.

 

[Justlooking5]

That's interesting! I guess I missed the study comparing their varying doses and the 10g recommendation. Do you mind posting it if you find it? It's fascinating to read the work people are doing and it's great to see people using the science to optimize results. I try to keep an eye out for the peer reviewed studies but sometimes I miss a few :/

Hi, here is one study I found:

Leucine, when ingested alone, increased the serum insulin area response modestly. However, it increased the insulin area response to glucose by an additional 66%; that is, it almost doubled the response.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19013300

I can't find it, but I thought I read another study that showed leucine + dextrose increased insulin by 450%, which is quite a bit.

It's kind of an experiment, but supposedly taking other aminos interferes with the leucine effect, so what I do is take ~10g leucine + dextrose immediately PWO (hoping for the insulin response), then after waiting about 15 min I take 100g whey/casein along with waxy maize, which I just started using and think is so so but a good choice for a longer lasting powdered carb.

 

[Justlooking5]

You get your trough levels checked at 170mg yet? Depending on SHBG, I bet you are pretty happy. Everyone is different obviously, but I was in the 7's (trough) at 120mg - Crisler moved me up to 140 with bloods coming up soon. His hCG protocol is a little different though - 10 units/day to mimic what occurs naturally when we were younger - the boys are back to normal size and that amount is pretty affordable (compound pharmacy). No DHEA/Preg? Glad you are having success.

On split dosages 90mg/80mg (so not 7 days after 90mg shot but 4 days after) my level was 944, which is fine with me right now. I'm hoping to stay around 900+ for now, given that I've had low T either forever (I remember some issues as a teenager) or at least for the past 10-15 years (caused by AAS).

It's not entirely clear to me that having testosterone levels in the 900 to say 12-1400 range is inherently unhealthy in any significant way.

 

[MrKleen73]

Correct answer right there ^^^^
Test boosters, ARA ...etc are only going to work if you have a vivid imagination. Save your money.

You are correct that a Test Booster will not do much to raise natural test, they can increase LH a bit, but they will not raise it at all while on TRT. However, the SHBG binding supplements used in just about every single testosterone booster on the market work quite well to free up testosterone. Free Testosterone is the ONLY testosterone that matters. Bound testosterone can not bind to the androgenic receptors, therefor rendered completely ineffective while bound to SHBG. With a solid test booster that has SHBG binding ingredients a person on TRT can get free test up around 26-30 while using one of these, and that makes a big difference.

Before I got on TRT I was running another booster called TestoPro and although it could not elevate my already low testosterone, it made me feel as if I was back to normal. So I want and got tested. My serum levels were 385, but my Free Test was a whopping 16 which is damn high for having that low of a serum level.

While on TRT, I have had my results come back with 900 total, and 28 free test while using the old Endosurge which pretty much only had 1 SHBG binding ingredients in it, and something to stimulate LH and GH release. Basically it had 533mg of divanyl, and some mucan pruriens to stimulate LH and GH release. Just the divanlyl was responsible for a 15 point increase in my Free Testosterone!!!!

To give you an idea of how big that is here are some typical Free Test levels by age, and consider I was 42 when I tested while using the endosurge my levels should have been much lower and the time before when I was not on Endosurge my Free test was almost half that @14 with pretty much the same total serum level.


TESTOSTERONE, FREE
Males (adult):
20 - <25 years: 5.25-20.7 ng/dL
25 - <30 years: 5.05-19.8 ng/dL
30 - <35 years: 4.85-19.0 ng/dL
35 - <40 years: 4.65-18.1 ng/dL
40 - <45 years: 4.46-17.1 ng/dL
45 - <50 years: 4.26-16.4 ng/dL
50 - <55 years: 4.06-15.6 ng/dL
55 - <60 years: 3.87-14.7 ng/dL
60 - <65 years: 3.67-13.9 ng/dL

SHBG binders are the real deal. One of the few ingredient types out there that actually deliver. I often use a test booster at the end of a cycle in the place of Proviron because it is often used to combat the high level of SHBG present toward the end of a cycle. It is the same exact methodology, just not quite as potent as proviron but cheaper too!

Most products are pretty hyped up but if you actually research the compounds individually you can learn how to really make them work for you. Like I said I basically doubled my free test using this method. That is huge and does not require a vivid imagination. I both saw the proof in my blood work, as well as felt the increase. You can't go from Low T @385 and zero libido or motivation to feeling horny and excited all the time without something actually happening.

Tons of products are a lot of hype, but when it comes to proven SHBG binding products, they definitely do make a difference whether you are a natty or just trying to free up your androgens on a cycle.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

If you're on TRT, just get around High SHBG by using more Testosterone - which is what a TRT specialist will do. I wish 3,4 Div had actual N=Many studies done on it in vivio - same for Eurycoma Longifolia - but there aren't. Then quality of source becomes an issue and you're adding at least $30/Month to your TRT cost - when $45 gets you ~5 months of Testosterone. A lot of recent data on SHBG also suggests that it's more of a slow release repository, than a "I've captured you and now you're gone" type of thing. Hopefully everyone can find a Doctor that will dose according to Free T numbers, but I realize that's a big ask. $30 (or more) a month is a big cost to try to manipulate SHBG with plants - I would at least get a blood test after using it for a month to make sure it's working for you. If you happen to be in the initial stages of TRT, where you are getting bloods done frequently, you may be able to work it in (tell your Doc) and get a read on it on your next test. If not, Total and Free T tests (under 1500ng/dl) are about $35, which could save you $360/year or more.

 

[MrKleen73]

If you're on TRT, just get around High SHBG by using more Testosterone - which is what a TRT specialist will do. I wish 3,4 Div had actual N=Many studies done on it in vivio - same for Eurycoma Longifolia - but there aren't. Then quality of source becomes an issue and you're adding at least $30/Month to your TRT cost - when $45 gets you ~5 months of Testosterone. A lot of recent data on SHBG also suggests that it's more of a slow release repository, than a "I've captured you and now you're gone" type of thing. Hopefully everyone can find a Doctor that will dose according to Free T numbers, but I realize that's a big ask. $30 (or more) a month is a big cost to try to manipulate SHBG with plants - I would at least get a blood test after using it for a month to make sure it's working for you. If you happen to be in the initial stages of TRT, where you are getting bloods done frequently, you may be able to work it in (tell your Doc) and get a read on it on your next test. If not, Total and Free T tests (under 1500ng/dl) are about $35, which could save you $360/year or more.

Yes more test certainly does increase free test! Since he was asking specifically for supplements though I wanted to give him some supplement options that worked for me.

Spending $30 a month for 2-3 months while trying to elevate free test isn't too bad. If he was thinking running as a staple then yeah that would be pretty expensive. As far as supplements go a good SHGB binder was the best natty type supp I have added to my TRT that had the most effect. I had the blood work that backed up what effect it had on my free test numbers. So for me anyway it was not just anecdotal evidence there. It worked and worked well on more than one occasion.

I am actually contemplating going to this Endo over here by me that I know is into Concierge type TRT treatment. He also can be my PCP if I chose that option. I already know if I want it he will prescribe me an AI, HCG, higher test, and Metformin all I pretty much have to do is ask him. He seems to be in the vanity side of things. Has that plastic face from too many face lifts and also gives botox injections... Side Note: Botox is just Creepy!!!

 

[EricMM]

Rise and Swell is AMAZING for people on TRT to help avoid shutdown. I would also take some Novedex XT from Gaspari if you can get your hands on it. The best AI on the market right now!

 

[JVee63]

Rise and Swell is AMAZING for people on TRT to help avoid shutdown. I would also take some Novedex XT from Gaspari if you can get your hands on it. The best AI on the market right now!

Your posts are becoming my main source of comedy these days. Please keep it up.

 

[kenpoengineer]

Your posts are becoming my main source of comedy these days. Please keep it up.

I’m agreeing. Introduction of exogenous testosterone from TRT, does shut you down completely. It’s unavoidable and no supplement is going to stop that. Only the use of HCG can “somewhat” maintain a slight natural production.

 

[corsaking]

i found this quite interesting
http://anabolicapex.com/2016/03/25/increase-free-testosterone-lower-shbg/

 

[MrKleen73]

Rise and Swell is AMAZING for people on TRT to help avoid shutdown. I would also take some Novedex XT from Gaspari if you can get your hands on it. The best AI on the market right now!

I have to argue both points there. People on TRT are shutdown... as a matter of fact their HPTA had to be subpar at the time of testing for them to even get on TRT. A lot of guys do this by doing a cycle first then going in while still shut down. Either way though the negative feedback loop would shut you down regardless of whether you started with normal levels or not.

As far as Nolvadex XT. Not to bag on it but right now and for the last 2 years nothing compares to the estrogen MANGAGEMENT of chuckdiesel's E2-X. I have never used an AI that worked as well as E2-X, not for destroying estrogen but actually managing it in an optimal range while DIM works to lower the negative hydroxy-16 metabolites of estrogen and promotes the positive hydroxy-2 estrogne metabolites. When it comes to estrogen now I prefer to manage it than just get it as low as possible.

 

[EricMM]

I have to argue both points there. People on TRT are shutdown... as a matter of fact their HPTA had to be subpar at the time of testing for them to even get on TRT. A lot of guys do this by doing a cycle first then going in while still shut down. Either way though the negative feedback loop would shut you down regardless of whether you started with normal levels or not.

As far as Nolvadex XT. Not to bag on it but right now and for the last 2 years nothing compares to the estrogen MANGAGEMENT of chuckdiesel's E2-X. I have never used an AI that worked as well as E2-X, not for destroying estrogen but actually managing it in an optimal range while DIM works to lower the negative hydroxy-16 metabolites of estrogen and promotes the positive hydroxy-2 estrogne metabolites. When it comes to estrogen now I prefer to manage it than just get it as low as possible.

I will have to check it out! I like CD he seems like a good guy!

 

[Georgiepecker]

I have to argue both points there. People on TRT are shutdown... as a matter of fact their HPTA had to be subpar at the time of testing for them to even get on TRT. A lot of guys do this by doing a cycle first then going in while still shut down. Either way though the negative feedback loop would shut you down regardless of whether you started with normal levels or not.

As far as Nolvadex XT. Not to bag on it but right now and for the last 2 years nothing compares to the estrogen MANGAGEMENT of chuckdiesel's E2-X. I have never used an AI that worked as well as E2-X, not for destroying estrogen but actually managing it in an optimal range while DIM works to lower the negative hydroxy-16 metabolites of estrogen and promotes the positive hydroxy-2 estrogne metabolites. When it comes to estrogen now I prefer to manage it than just get it as low as possible.

Only thing is it seems to be around $40 for a month supply. If I had to pay for an AI I’d pay for pharma grade...though like you said managing IS different than crushing estrogen completely.

Edit: Amazon has it at not such a bad price however

 

[MrKleen73]

Only thing is it seems to be around $40 for a month supply. If I had to pay for an AI I’d pay for pharma grade...though like you said managing IS different than crushing estrogen completely.

Edit: Amazon has it at not such a bad price however

Yes, I tend to use it on my TRT as well and run it at 1 cap a day and it does wonders. I have had some joint issues and other things happen from using a pharma grade AI and accidentally overdoing it. However what I did notice is that I feel so much better with the EX-2 than just an AI is the main reason why I like something with a weaker AI effect, and more of the DIM ie Management side. In all honesty just getting a nice DIM product and adding to a really low dose AI might be perfect too. However since he is just doing TRT 1 cap a day makes that E2-X last 2 months and that is better. Plus you can get a discount code from Rocket3015 or one of the other reps.

Here is a little info on how and why DIM works the way it does without crushing estrogen.

http://www.naturodoc.com/library/hormones/diindolymethane.htm

 

[EricMM]

I really like to keep DIM on hand as well. I don't take it daily but I can feel estrogen and it's certainly something I keep on hand!

 

[Laxarcher13]

trainer in bed school, eh?


on topic---the best thing to add to trt is dhea, I've found that transdermal works best...look at Olympus labs sup3r dhea, it has both dhea and preg....I've personally tried it and recommend!!!

She was a trainer in med school. Auto correct

 

[EricMM]

I don't think all TRT patients are irreversably shut down. I have heard so many stories of men who were supposed to be shooting blanks all of a sudden having babies after supplements. It's something to test quarterly and I bet you'd be surprised!

 

[Rocket3015]

Yes, I tend to use it on my TRT as well and run it at 1 cap a day and it does wonders. I have had some joint issues and other things happen from using a pharma grade AI and accidentally overdoing it. However what I did notice is that I feel so much better with the EX-2 than just an AI is the main reason why I like something with a weaker AI effect, and more of the DIM ie Management side. In all honesty just getting a nice DIM product and adding to a really low dose AI might be perfect too. However since he is just doing TRT 1 cap a day makes that E2-X last 2 months and that is better. Plus you can get a discount code from Rocket3015 or one of the other reps.

Here is a little info on how and why DIM works the way it does without crushing estrogen.

http://www.naturodoc.com/library/hormones/diindolymethane.htm

Thanks for the shout out, I've been out of town and away from my P C for the last week

 

[The_Old_Guy]

I don't think all TRT patients are irreversably shut down. I have heard so many stories of men who were supposed to be shooting blanks all of a sudden having babies after supplements. It's something to test quarterly and I bet you'd be surprised!

Not an expert by any means, but I seem recall that the Leydig Cells are suppressed (Test), but the Sertoli Cells still produce Sperm?

 

[kenpoengineer]

Not an expert by any means, but I seem recall that the Leydig Cells are suppressed (Test), but the Sertoli Cells still produce Sperm?

From my research, you are correct. It’s bro science that men on TRT can’t produce sperm. With that said, it’s the quantity of sperm that is reduced, but it only takes one! Lol

 

[EricMM]

It's dependent on each person! I don't think there is a one size fits all for TRT issues. That's why I suggest a broad spectrum approach to increasing testosterone.

https://mindandmuscle.net/articles/sensitize-leydig-cells-produce-testosterone-larger-loads/

http://mindandmuscle.net/articles/stop-beating-lh-dead-horse-testosterone/

http://mindandmuscle.net/articles/save-balls-destruction/

 

[MANLYUSERNAME]

I’m actually starting TRT on Monday. Do the doctors start you off on an amount that will carry over to the gym and help progress there? Also would it be silly to ask her if she prescribed anything besides testosterone (I would ask for it in a way that dosnt sound like I want it just for the gym) is trt the same as bioidentical hormones? Dosnt estrogen increase as well when on trt? Will my balls be noticeably smaller oh and will I go longer in bed. When I say longer I mean do you have more of that want to keep going to town on her? Did you lose body fat with out changing anything? From talking and reading I’ve found people will add a sarm such as RAD140 or MK677.

They start you with an average dose and wait and see where that takes you. Then they increase or decrease. It also depends on your doctor. Mine wants me around 1000 test which is a little high but...cool. I'm probably a little over that now. My gym results are noticable in strength, size, and vascularity. On certain days of the week nearest to injections my muscles are so hard and pumped. But... I have muscle memory and take pretty good care of myself so I guess everyone will respond diferently. After being low on test for so long, it feels really nice but I'm not going to be crazy huge or strong without adding a lot of unhealthy chemicals that will screw me up. Don't need that now.

It's not bioidentical, it's synthetic, but it's better.

E does increase but they give you something like anastrozole to block that. I would take less than they give you though. Apparently a good level is around 60 but the docs want you around 40 for some reason. If it's too low it will effect other systems in your body. Google all of this stuff later.

Testes will eventually shrink a bit but they can give you HCG if it becomes too much of a problem. I've also heard that clomid does the trick but it's only hearsay. Mine feel a bit smaller, not hanging as low. I might have to do something about that.

My Doc also gave me a little Cialis and.....wow. On about the day after injection when my test is the highest level with a little cialis, it's like Im 18 years old again but better because I'm bigger, stronger, and smarter at 50. I've got to say it's pretty GREAT without getting into details. I think it's what you are looking for. Just tell your Doc that you are having problems with erections and I'm sure that they will hook you up.

I actually lost fat but gained weight. But like I said, I take pretty good care of myself, diet, etc.

I've tried Rad and MK stacked before and it was really nice. Didn't get as big as with LGD but got soooo much more cut. Liked sarms but there is nothing like the real thing. I've been wanting to add both of those to my trt but my next blood test is coming up and Im pretty sure that the rad will screw up my cholesterol levels and possibly other effects so I don't want to answer uncomfortable questions from my doctor. Maybe right after the test I will try 6 or 8 weeks of it and postpone my blood test for a couple of weeks while my system recovers. IDK.
Anyway, I think that covers everything you might need to know. This is just from my own experience, I hope it helps.

 

[Rocket3015]

MANLYUSERNAME
Good information !

 

[kisaj]

It's been 3 years, hopefully OP figured it out by now. lol