Are Prohormones Toxic?

[Firreozkan]

What do u guys think about pro hormones? Like I dont think Ill be able to have needles n stuff at my house, so PHs would def be better. But ive heard its so toxic for the liver. Is it true? Or a myth? Or was true years ago but not todays supplement? What if I tried PHs for a few cycles only and then moved on to the real deal? And what stuff is the best, if I want to keep most of the gains when Im off for a long time? Like some stuff are strong and hit u hard but are hard tp recover from, but some stuff are mild and u keep more? Or am I totally wrong? Maybe stack upp IGF-1 with the PCT too? What do u guys think? Thanks guys!!

 

[hambone2493]

They are liver toxic it's not a myth it's science.

 

[Firreozkan]

So what do I do? What are the risks? Should I just pin

 

[Swindler]

From my understanding yes it puts a strain on your liver..

 

[Swindler]

About anything you put in your body has some kind of a side or negative effect on your body... on oral some recommend milk thistle for your liver... I skipped prohormones because of the process your liver goes threw with the chemicals. But I have done used sarms which I am sure are not much better... just research it thoroughly before and make sure you taking all the precautionary steps...

 

[Firreozkan]

Thx!!

 

[Volvo140G]

They'll strain various functions of the body negatively. Same with too much sun, beer, butter, etc. Be wise and impacts can be minimized.

 

[bigdavid]

Honestly not trying to flame you here...but based off the type of questions you are asking you should prob take some time to do more research and increase your understanding of both the benefits and detriments of AAS use. And you’re nonchalant idea of also using igf when you don’t seem to know how you would respond to a simple AAS cycle shows me that you may be quick to impulsive decisions, ie why I think you should give it more thought. Like I said I’m not trying to be an ass here I just think you need to fully understand what you are getting yourself into.

 

[bigdavid]

They'll strain various functions of the body negatively. Same with too much sun, beer, butter, etc. Be wise and impacts can be minimized.

I know you mean well by this, but comparing methylated prohormones to eating too much butter or staying at the beach too long is a somewhat irresponsible comparison. I know people who have gone into acute hepatic failure from using methylated hormones... and while they ultimately did recover and are fine now, it is certainly not something to scoff at or take lightly.

 

[cheftepesh1]

If you have a concern stay natural. There are plenty of different types of products you can use.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

You can gain some insight on the negatives from the West Texas A&M study:

http://suppversity.blogspot.com/2014/01/study-says-prohormone-1-andro-works-but.html

This was with a Grapefruit based "enhancer".

There are other things beside liver values to worry about (and liver is the least IMO when talking non a-alkylated / methylated orals).

A support regime covering BP, Liver, and Lipids would be the safest way to use them.

 

[booneman77]

Yes, they are toxic, but to varying degrees. Methylated compounds, for example, are far more so than others.

With a solid cycle support setup (CEL Cycle Assist, TUDCA, Liver Assist XT, etc etc) they are totally manageable though. Obviously, there is still some risk, but supports have come a long way as well as the PH's themselves in terms of safety and effectiveness.

 

[vujade]

too some degree, all PH's can tax the liver. But non-methlyated ones are not liver toxic,
and i have not heard of anyone destroying their liver from 1 / 4 or epi andro.

But liver enzymes definitely get elevated if no cycle supports are used.

 

[niklasericson]

What do u guys think about pro hormones? Like I dont think Ill be able to have needles n stuff at my house, so PHs would def be better. But ive heard its so toxic for the liver. Is it true? Or a myth? Or was true years ago but not todays supplement? What if I tried PHs for a few cycles only and then moved on to the real deal? And what stuff is the best, if I want to keep most of the gains when Im off for a long time? Like some stuff are strong and hit u hard but are hard tp recover from, but some stuff are mild and u keep more? Or am I totally wrong? Maybe stack upp IGF-1 with the PCT too? What do u guys think? Thanks guys!!

There are prohormones...and there are prohormones.
It's not that easy to say all prohormones are toxic at the same level.
I'am based in the EU where you can buy Alpha one for example,it converts to Methyl 1-Testosterone, this is a very toxic compound.
But you can also buy 11 Andro transdermal and this converts to 11-Ketotestosterone it's basically not toxic at all.
One simple rule is to avoid the most harsh compounds is to stay away from 17A methyls.

 

[Firreozkan]

Thanks everyone so much! So what would be recommended for a first stack? And what support stuff? And what for PCT? Anything else? And any good sites or stores? I am really thankful for the help!

 

[bigdavid]

Thanks everyone so much! So what would be recommended for a first stack? And what support stuff? And what for PCT? Anything else? And any good sites or stores? I am really thankful for the help!

What are your goals? Be specific if you can.

 

[Firreozkan]

Okay! So right now, I'm cutting down the weight a bit, so I'll be on single digit once the things I'll be getting arrives. The IGF-1 from Hi-Tech will arrive in some time too, so I'll figure out stacking, if I'll use it with the gear or with the PCT, or both.... Well, I want to put on size, I'm already looking great, but as a natural. I'm pretty strong, I benched 140kg once, took the 48kg dumbells for a ride today too on the flat bench. Well, I'd say for being a natural and just turned 19, I've done thing pretty good! Also considering I'm a bodybuildrr and not powerlifter. I've got short and peaky biceps, a good tricep with a thick insertion of thr long head. Arms are strong point, beside my back chest and delts. My legs are def not up tp.par with my upper body, but Im still happy with them. I will try to get thrm better with the gear, and intense high volume training with high frequenty, where the IGF-1 will help with recovery etc. What I want from the Stack (orals ot whatever is recommended frpm.u guys) is to just look amazing when I walk around In a t shirt or withouy a shirt. Maybe in normal clothes too. And I want long term gains, so not grt on then lose most when going off. Like I also want to be able to stay off with the gains I got from.when on. Not blast and cruise, and hopefully not get back on too soon. I like being natural, but I dont like not being big and lean... And I believe Ive pushed my genetics very far too. Thanks in advance.

 

[booneman77]

For a first cycle, stick with something simple and with low/manageable sides 1/4 andro is a pretty common, basic stack.

On Cycle (8 weeks):
1 Andro
4 Andro
CEL Cycle Assist (comprehensive support)
SNS Inhibit E (ai)

PCT:
SERM of choice
SNS Inhibit E (ai)
SNS Reduce XT (cortisol)
CEL M-Test (natty test booster)
SNS X-gels + PES Anabeta Elite (natural anabolic stack), CEL Epi-Plex (natty anabolic) - these are not "required" but can help you maintain gains as well as "feel" good during pct. Use some or all if funds allow IMO.

 

[Firreozkan]

Man I seriously don't know how to thanl you!! What would you guess the results would be? And how much to maintain? Amd how much would it cost? And where should I get these? Mayne Mysupplementstore?

 

[Young Gotti]

Yes they can be toxic....with the right precautions you can minimize that but if you just willy nilly take whatever you want and put caution to the wind, you can mess some things up

 

[Firreozkan]

Thanks!

 

[booneman77]

Man I seriously don't know how to thanl you!! What would you guess the results would be? And how much to maintain? Amd how much would it cost? And where should I get these? Mayne Mysupplementstore?

Results are ALWAYS 100% diet driven. Eat a ton of calories? Add more size (and fat potentially). Eat reasonable, but clean? Lean gains, nothing crazy (a few lbs or lean mass). Dont eat enough or cutting? Maintain mass, may cut some fat, minimal gains overall.

Cost depends as well where you buy (and really just about any board sponsor site will have most, if not all of the things I listed). A SERM will be something you have to find on your own as those are technically illegal (but 100% required for any good pct).

One thing to note: DO NOT GET CHEAP ON SUPPORTS AND PCT. People always want to spend their cash on PH's but then get cheap on everything else... Bad PCT? Lose most or all of your gains (sometimes even more). Poor support? Enjoy all the sides and potential risks.

 

[Firreozkan]

Thanks!

 

[bigdavid]

Idk what your access is but my first cycle was 6 weeks of CEL hdrol and I loved it. Not sure if its being made anymore. But it was pretty low sides and kept most gains. Great for size and strength.

 

[Firreozkan]

Thanks°

 

[mw1]

Results are ALWAYS 100% diet driven. Eat a ton of calories? Add more size (and fat potentially). Eat reasonable, but clean? Lean gains, nothing crazy (a few lbs or lean mass). Dont eat enough or cutting? Maintain mass, may cut some fat, minimal gains overall.

Cost depends as well where you buy (and really just about any board sponsor site will have most, if not all of the things I listed). A SERM will be something you have to find on your own as those are technically illegal (but 100% required for any good pct).

One thing to note: DO NOT GET CHEAP ON SUPPORTS AND PCT. People always want to spend their cash on PH's but then get cheap on everything else... Bad PCT? Lose most or all of your gains (sometimes even more). Poor support? Enjoy all the sides and potential risks.

Post is spot on..especially the last paragraph. If you cant afford on cycle and pct products do not do the cycle

 

[Rad83]

Just turned 19...? You've got so much natural progress to make before considering this sh*t

 

[Firreozkan]

Haha yeah... but this is my passion...

 

[bigdavid]

Just turned 19...? You've got so much natural progress to make before considering this sh*t

I have said this over and over to many people. They listen 0% of the time. ie they are gona do it with or without our advice. Might as well try to keep them healthy (as much as is possible).

I think of it as analogous to “abstinence programs” (instead of real legitimate birth control [even proper condom use for crying out loud..] w/ honest conversations about safe sex). No matter what some politician or church says....People are going to have sex. Nothing is going to change that. I’d rather we keep stds (stis for you persnickety folks) and unwanted pregnancies to a minimum in our society.... Unfortunately many don’t see it that way. They protect the fetus and then doom the mother and the child once the fetus is born. (!!Ok. Deep breaths. Deep breaths). We’re good... But ok off my soap box :0.

 

[Volvo140G]

Don't mess with your hormones at 19

 

[heavylifter33]

It would be foolish for you to mess with oral steroids at such a young age, passion or not.

But, you'll likely do it anyways no matter what we say. You're ok with being on testosterone replacement therapy for the rest of your life right? You're ok with having your sex drive always screwed up and sometimes not even being able to get it up right? And i'm sure you're ok with possibly decreasing your chances of having children in the future.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

Well, I'd say for being a natural and just turned 19, I've done thing pretty good!

Full Stop. Don't. This is why we can't have nice things. My opinion anyway...

 

[Firreozkan]

Thanks guys... I guess I'll stay off and just work harder