I just wanna fckin grow!

[Jbtwentytwo]

As the title reads.. I just wanna ****in grow. I feel like I have completely come to a dead point & I feel like it happens way to much & last way to long. I'll get these natural growths & then its like my body just stops growing for the longest time (thats what it seems like to me). I get so frustrated cause I bust my ass day in and day out of the gym. Around March I began counting my calories because I wasn't eating enough. Now I'm pushing in 3500-4000 calories a day. (weekends I do slack sometimes). I took ABE for 8 weeks and I did see some improvement. I'm currently about 2 and half weeks into Alphamax XT stacked with X-gels. I was completely stoked about this stack because of the amazing reviews. Honestly I feel like my body is hardly responding to it. X-Gels I haven't seen any strength gains. I do feel pumps with Alphamax XT, but I'm not really feeling what I expected. My training is definitely on point as well as my diet. I don't know maybe I'm just over thinking things. I see all these kids around my age who are 180-200 pounds solid, and not once in my life have I hit 170+. It motivates me so much but at the same time it pisses me off cause I feel like I'm working so hard for minimal results. I'm just tired of get in these ruts were I don't see anything for the longest time. I just wanna ****ing grow. I'm very proud of how much I have accomplished since I began this fitness journey, but I just want more. Can someone point me in the right direction?

Age:21
Height: 6'0
Weight: 165lbs

(Heres some transformation pictures)
& some pictures from a pump I had after the gym.

 

[GiftedNatty]

As the title reads.. I just wanna ****in grow. I feel like I have completely come to a dead point & I feel like it happens way to much & last way to long. I'll get these natural growths & then its like my body just stops growing for the longest time (thats what it seems like to me). I get so frustrated cause I bust my ass day in and day out of the gym. Around March I began counting my calories because I wasn't eating enough. Now I'm pushing in 3500-4000 calories a day. (weekends I do slack sometimes). I took ABE for 8 weeks and I did see some improvement. I'm currently about 2 and half weeks into Alphamax XT stacked with X-gels. I was completely stoked about this stack because of the amazing reviews. Honestly I feel like my body is hardly responding to it. X-Gels I haven't seen any strength gains. I do feel pumps with Alphamax XT, but I'm not really feeling what I expected. My training is definitely on point as well as my diet. I don't know maybe I'm just over thinking things. I see all these kids around my age who are 180-200 pounds solid, and not once in my life have I hit 170+. It motivates me so much but at the same time it pisses me off cause I feel like I'm working so hard for minimal results. I'm just tired of get in these ruts were I don't see anything for the longest time. I just wanna ****ing grow. I'm very proud of how much I have accomplished since I began this fitness journey, but I just want more. Can someone point me in the right direction?

Age:21
Height: 6'0
Weight: 165lbs

(Heres some transformation pictures)
& some pictures from a pump I had after the gym.

Dude you look incredible for your age imo. Staying natural is a long commitment to be honest it takes forever to build an impressive physique. I do however think that you have good insertions and shape. Just keep pushing yourself and you'll get there. I know that isn't what you want to hear but sometimes it can be painfully slow. Just my 2 cents though.

Not to mention you are just starting to keep track of your calorie intake so that ideally will make a huge difference if you stay consistent.

 

[john.patterson]

I know the feeling man, I get caught in the same mindset sometimes. Being natural and opting to not use gear makes it a long road. Its all too easy to compare yourself to the pictures you see in magazines and sponsored athletes, and it sucks. In all honesty though, no homo, you look great dude. You've made great progress and you actually look like you lift, which is more than most natural dudes can say.

My only question is about your diet - what are your current macros. All of your progress pictures are showing you very lean. Its a pain in the ass but the only way to pack on true quality muscle is to put on some fat with it and eat more. You have a great start point and I think if you committed a solid 10-12 months to packing on size and aiming to gain 1-2 pounds per week, you'd see some incredible development.

Give Alphamax XT a bit of time. Its a natural product so its nothing miraculous, but it will definitely begin to shine in the 3rd and 4th week if you're eating right and training hard. Its not easy to commit to a bulk when you want to keep your definition, but I think its the next required step you need to take if you're looking to grow

 

[kboxer7]

Solid progress man. Much respect.

I've read a decent amount of research that strongly supports taking anywhere from 21 - 60 days off from working out. No one likes to hear that, but in each study the participants bounced back and then some, essentially allowing them to surpass their plateau and experience "newbie-like" gains again.

Over time mTor and protein synthesis is blunted naturally as a response to continual training. This "time off" is meant to biologically reset this.

Remind me and I'll dig up that research if you are interested in looking it over. Anyway, just one of many strategies you can employ to push past that stale point.

 

[Epolis13]

I know the feeling man, I get caught in the same mindset sometimes. Being natural and opting to use gear makes it a long road. Its all too easy to compare yourself to the pictures you see in magazines and sponsored athletes, and it sucks. In all honesty though, no homo, but you look great dude. You've made great progress and you actually look like you lift, which is more than most natural dudes can say.

My only question is about your diet - what are your current macros. All of your progress pictures are showing you very lean. Its a pain in the ass but the only way to pack on true quality muscle is to put on some fat with it and eat more. You have a great start point and I think if you committed a solid 10-12 months to packing on size and aiming to gain 1-2 pounds per week, you'd see some incredible development.

Give Alphamax XT a bit of time. Its a natural product so its nothing miraculous, but it will definitely begin to shine in the 3rd and 4th week if you're eating right and training hard. Its not easy to commit to a bulk when you want to keep your definition, but I think its the next required step you need to take if you're looking to grow

Great advice here.

For a natural lifter, gains take a VERY long time. There are some people here who have been doing this for 10-15 years and are still trying to make improvements. It's going to be a long process.

 

[JDybya]

Looking big and strong!

Great advice above.

 

[Jbtwentytwo]

Dude you look incredible for your age imo. Staying natural is a long commitment to be honest it takes forever to build an impressive physique. I do however think that you have good insertions and shape. Just keep pushing yourself and you'll get there. I know that isn't what you want to hear but sometimes it can be painfully slow. Just my 2 cents though.

Not to mention you are just starting to keep track of your calorie intake so that ideally will make a huge difference if you stay consistent.

Really appreciate that! I know its a slow process & I must be patient. I think it get so caught up looking at these dudes on youtube around my age who have size & then I look at myself like why the **** is taking me forever.

 

[Jbtwentytwo]

I know the feeling man, I get caught in the same mindset sometimes. Being natural and opting to not use gear makes it a long road. Its all too easy to compare yourself to the pictures you see in magazines and sponsored athletes, and it sucks. In all honesty though, no homo, you look great dude. You've made great progress and you actually look like you lift, which is more than most natural dudes can say.

My only question is about your diet - what are your current macros. All of your progress pictures are showing you very lean. Its a pain in the ass but the only way to pack on true quality muscle is to put on some fat with it and eat more. You have a great start point and I think if you committed a solid 10-12 months to packing on size and aiming to gain 1-2 pounds per week, you'd see some incredible development.

Give Alphamax XT a bit of time. Its a natural product so its nothing miraculous, but it will definitely begin to shine in the 3rd and 4th week if you're eating right and training hard. Its not easy to commit to a bulk when you want to keep your definition, but I think its the next required step you need to take if you're looking to grow

Thanks man! Honestly I haven't really tracked my macros I have just been eating. Eating clean for the most part. The two first pictures in the hat I actually feel like I packed on some fat which i'm perfectly okay with. Like you said I think I really need to focus for a good 10-12 months on my dieting & really pack on pounds. Really appreciate the feed back!

 

[Jbtwentytwo]

Solid progress man. Much respect.

I've read a decent amount of research that strongly supports taking anywhere from 21 - 60 days off from working out. No one likes to hear that, but in each study the participants bounced back and then some, essentially allowing them to surpass their plateau and experience "newbie-like" gains again.

Over time mTor and protein synthesis is blunted naturally as a response to continual training. This "time off" is meant to biologically reset this.

Remind me and I'll dig up that research if you are interested in looking it over. Anyway, just one of many strategies you can employ to push past that stale point.

Yes please send me that research. I have read and heard the same thing about taking some time off to allow the central nervous to basically reboot!

 

[Lynks8]

Really appreciate that! I know its a slow process & I must be patient. I think it get so caught up looking at these dudes on youtube around my age who have size & then I look at myself like why the **** is taking me forever.

Most of those dudes are on something.

I know the natty pain. Plateaus are a b1tch.

You're doing great for your age. I'd heed kboxer's advice and, at the very least, do a 1-2 week deload if you haven't in some time. It's very hard to do, but every time I deload, I come back stronger.

 

[vujade]

Great progress so far man. Seriously at your age to look like you do naturally, is an accomplishment.

Here are some products that will help you at your age. I would primarily focus on natural anabolics
because test booster won't do much for you because your test should already be the highest its
ever going to be naturally.

BLR Follidrone 2.0 (epicatechin & ecklonia cava)

Olympus Labs Tr1umph (Phosphatidic Acid)

HMB

Laxogenin (BPS Androcrine, Iron Legion Vedius, OL Strength Unleashed)

 

[EMPIREMIND]

Very lean man.stay like that. I personally think it has to do with your diet and you training. Also your probly just frustrated. As mentioned above just stick with it. It takes a long time to get what your more than likely looking for. I also will say that I loved alphamax. Didn't see any growth from it though. X gels.... I got nothing from. I personally don't understand the hype but dude love it on here.

 

[EasyEJL]

My training is definitely on point as well as my diet.

No disrespect, as you've made awesome progress but....... How do you know your training or diet is on point?

There isn't a universal training or diet program that works for everyone. Particularly, there is definitely no diet or workout program that works without changing it on a regular basis.

How often do you switch rep ranges? do you log every workout / every meal? Have you tried doing 8 week cycles of 5x5 type strength gains followed by 8 weeks of higher rep hypertrophy training?

Rather than necessarily the long deload, I'd tend to think that flipping around the heavy for strength lifts, hypertrophy, calisthenics, bodyweight, ,functional exercises etc in 6-10 week cycles will help break up any plateaus. If you can make some strength gains, you can usually fill those in with mass gains after.

 

[ma70]

Solid progress man. Much respect.

I've read a decent amount of research that strongly supports taking anywhere from 21 - 60 days off from working out. No one likes to hear that, but in each study the participants bounced back and then some, essentially allowing them to surpass their plateau and experience "newbie-like" gains again.

Over time mTor and protein synthesis is blunted naturally as a response to continual training. This "time off" is meant to biologically reset this.

Remind me and I'll dig up that research if you are interested in looking it over. Anyway, just one of many strategies you can employ to push past that stale point.

Well, along with this theory, there's also the idea of doing complete contrast training for 3-4 weeks. If you normally do high frequency+high intensity, considering adding more volume to your workouts with less intensity/frequency, etc. Or simply put, bodybuilding --> powerlifting, powerlifting --> bodybuilding, plyometrics instead of weights, etc.

 

[The Solution]

Thanks man! Honestly I haven't really tracked my macros I have just been eating. Eating clean for the most part. The two first pictures in the hat I actually feel like I packed on some fat which i'm perfectly okay with. Like you said I think I really need to focus for a good 10-12 months on my dieting & really pack on pounds. Really appreciate the feed back!

Bold is the problem.
Look, No caloric allotment is going to be the same from person to person. The body is not a textbook. The issue here is calories. You are not growing because you are not putting yourself into a proper caloric surplus for muscle/size/strength gains.

No pills or powders will help you if your diet is not in check (which you say it is) but lacks calories because you have a hit a standstill and roadblock.
Start by adding another 200-300 kcals (mostly from carbs/fat) once your protein minimums are met. Since you are around 170 pounds 170-180 would be a good starting point (1g/lb)

Some good links here as well


http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/general-philosophies-of-muscle-mass-gain.html
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/macronutrient-intake-for-mass-gains-qa.html
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/training-frequency-for-mass-gains.html
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/cardio-and-mass-gains.html

Philosophies, Macro intake, training , and cardio articles for you to understand and help set up what you need to do before moving forward towards more supplements or advanced workout routines.

Increase the food. Don't be afraid to push the kcals. Eating "Clean" Is subjective. there is not true definition of clean. Do you wash your food? Some things people deem unclean have more nutrients, vitamins, and minerals then say rice or oatmeal which are very nutrient void but are deemed healthy and clean. Whey protein is deemed clean, but is processed to no end and has metal extracted from it during the process of making it

Read this article by alan aragon on the dirt on clean eating:
http://www.simplyshredded.com/research-review-the-dirt-on-clean-eating-written-by-nutrition-expert-alan-aragon.html

Sounds like you just need some more food here buddy. You cannot supplement a diet that lacks in calories or a training program that does not have enough fuel to keep the car running. Time to increase the kcals and keep grinding.

Growing is a long process, continue to add calories when you stick, and continue to train hard and utilize all rep ranges to engage both Type I and Type II Muscle fibers. Be Patient, have fun, and most of all fuel the fire.

 

[booksbooks]

Look up Renaissance Periodization.

 

[JSTR808]

Dude! You're already pretty jacked and look great. Sure, you'll be putting on size as your body matures, but be proud of what you've already accomplished. I mentor young bucks like you, and recommend finding an old lifter who can really tune into what you're doing in the gym and maybe in the kitchen. You can smash a brick wall all day long and know that you're putting a ton of effort into it, but a mentor can show you where to hit that wall effectively to smash right through it and move on to the next wall. Peace!!!

 

[Jiigzz]

DUP! Then DUP some more! As you're looking at stepping it up to the next level training wise, you will need to put a lot more effort into training plan structure (periodisation) and diet (tracking and hitting macros).

Diet is by far the hardest to get a handle of as we can only approximate our needs using an online calculator, and further we only have a ballpark idea of how many Calories we are actually ingesting due to label variance.

Can always post an example plan here for critique if you like.

 

[JSTR808]

Couldn't agree more! Too many great athletes want pills first before the food to make big changes in their physique. I'm sure that is NOT the case here because he is disciplined, but there is a common theme.

 

[Distilled Water]

Eat 8 solid meals a day. Don't miss a meal and plan your macros, when 50 gr doesn't work go to 55gr. You're not going to accomplish what you want without putting in effort. Simply eating and training will leave you excalty where you are, wanting more. I haven't missed a meal or had an incalculable workout since February of this year and my results have been nothing short of amazing on minimal supplemnts.

 

[JSTR808]

Spoken like a pro

 

[Jiigzz]

Eat 8 solid meals a day. Don't miss a meal and plan your macros, when 50 gr doesn't work go to 55gr. You're not going to accomplish what you want without putting in effort. Simply eating and training will leave you excalty where you are, wanting more. I haven't missed a meal or had an incalculable workout since February of this year and my results have been nothing short of amazing on minimal supplemnts.

And this guy knows too!

 

[Jbtwentytwo]

Eat 8 solid meals a day. Don't miss a meal and plan your macros, when 50 gr doesn't work go to 55gr. You're not going to accomplish what you want without putting in effort. Simply eating and training will leave you excalty where you are, wanting more. I haven't missed a meal or had an incalculable workout since February of this year and my results have been nothing short of amazing on minimal supplemnts.

I really do appreciate the honest feedback & this exactly the kind of the stuff I'm looking for. I haven't been on these forums very long, but I have seen nothing but positive help towards the members. Diet is low-key were I am struggling. Like I said I began keep track of how many calories I was consuming around march. I was using my fitness pal to log everything I ate. I started out aiming for 3500 calories daily & eventually was hitting around 4,000. I didn't even pay attention to macros. I really want to get my macros in check for bulking & adding mass. Do you have any reliable resources for calculating these numbers? I know I can simply go onto google and click the first thing to search.. but just curious if you have anything you personally like to follow. Thanks again!

 

[R1balla]

Change routines, do things you have never done before. Increase calories by 500 a day. Or if you can't do that, drink an extra two glasses of milk a day.

If you want to give androcrine a shot, I can see if I can get you a bottle to log BPS

 

[Distilled Water]

I really do appreciate the honest feedback & this exactly the kind of the stuff I'm looking for. I haven't been on these forums very long, but I have seen nothing but positive help towards the members. Diet is low-key were I am struggling. Like I said I began keep track of how many calories I was consuming around march. I was using my fitness pal to log everything I ate. I started out aiming for 3500 calories daily & eventually was hitting around 4,000. I didn't even pay attention to macros. I really want to get my macros in check for bulking & adding mass. Do you have any reliable resources for calculating these numbers? I know I can simply go onto google and click the first thing to search.. but just curious if you have anything you personally like to follow. Thanks again!

Start out at 1.5gr protein per lb of body weight and same with carbs. Make sure 20% of your diet is fats and then build from there. It'll take about a month of tweaking. To give and idea, I started my recomp at 350/360/60 at about 188lbs. 32min fasted HIIT cardio 7 days a week with weight training 7 days per week. Carbs in every meal. I didn't have a cheat meal or refeed for 8 weeks

 

[kdubson14]

Needs more back and legs

 

[drseuss6969]

DUP! Then DUP some more! As you're looking at stepping it up to the next level training wise, you will need to put a lot more effort into training plan structure (periodisation) and diet (tracking and hitting macros).

Diet is by far the hardest to get a handle of as we can only approximate our needs using an online calculator, and further we only have a ballpark idea of how many Calories we are actually ingesting due to label variance.

Can always post an example plan here for critique if you like.

Do you have any dup programs you would recommend? Would love to see them

 

[R1balla]

Do you have any dup programs you would recommend? Would love to see them

I'll post what I usually do tonight. But my main thing is muscle confusion. May be bro science but I like it. Always changing routines right when I feel I'm starting to adapt to one.

 

[Jiigzz]

Do you have any dup programs you would recommend? Would love to see them

I write my own programs, but will dig around for examples!

 

[malin]

Rest , you grow when you rest not at the gym busting bols ,

 

[CATdiesel76]

A couple of things:

1. Most natty Supps won't give anyone the size they are looking for. Some can help and be useful tools but time and consistency is everything.

2. You are getting to an age where putting on weight becomes easier. Everyone I know who trained hard and had decent genetics put on close their most weight from 20-26. I myself put on 40lbs naturally during this period. This is purely bro science but I think it has a lot to do with you body being able to put on more size when it isn't spending so much energy just trying to become fully developed

3. What you are doing seems to be working. Keep hitting it hard. 5 years from now, you will look back and see an incredible amount of progress. Progress is always harder to monitor when you are looking at yourself every day.

4. Train for strength for some time. Try powerlifting etc. this in itself may not get you bigger. However, if you increase your max bench, squat, etc by 40lbs, when you go back to hypertrophy workouts and are using 40 more lbs for volume work the size will start packing on.

Otherwise keep up the good work. The above things helped me through many plateaus. I was 172 going into college and I am currently sitting at 235lbs

 

[teencomp]

you looked into adaptogens mate like kre anabolyn or progenadrex

 

[dbrock504]

You're doin great man. Your composition reminds me a lot of myself at your age. 4 years later I'm 191 with a little more bf than what you're at now. Point is, like these guys are saying, it takes time. Consistency is key. I tell myself that everyday because like you say, it gets frustrating at times. We all want it now and we work our butts off for it. This is just how the body works... Keep it up bro.

One tip maybe? You're really, really lean. Not a bad thing. But maybe that's an indication you aren't consuming enough carbs? When I was bulking at 170 lbs, I was eating almost 5k cals with 500g carbs 200g protein. Eat big to get big.