GIJane1928
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Anyone know what's up with the change in formula? Thoughts on the new one? Bummed.. I liked the old one. Suggestions for somethings similar are welcomed
Edit. Misread.If it weren't for the Kola Nut/Caffeine, I'd think maybe they were releasing a Norcodrene PM or something - the lemon balm may reduce cortisol, but the entire formula seems pretty lacking.
so no novel stim for the New pre work out? And is alphamine gonna change to?Hi friends,
I've been away while (abroad for personal reasons) so I haven't posted lately. The reason the formula was altered was for a multitude of reasons, so let's delve into them together:
1) Abroad appeal. The brand is trying to consolidate formulas. Having formulas specific to different regions is not particularly helpful and the new formula for norcodrene is the best formula for both domestic and international markets where some ingredients are not allowed (think Y)
2) On the subject on Y, we removed Y for international appeal and because of recent lawsuits due to stimulants getting unwanted attention from the FDA/ the guys at harvard doing all those studies. Y is a great ingredient, but lots of people are sensitive, and all it takes is one person to have things go wrong; we do not want to have to deal with potential lawsuits. That is why the formula isn't stimulant heavy as well. This is a trend you'll notice from all the major brands soon.
3) Okay, so now you're thinking that's fine and all, but what about results? The first norcodrene was truly revolutionary and is still a fantastic formula. The new formula, however, is also fantastic. Let's discuss it:
Chromium picolinate has a host of studies in humans showing it results in significant weight loss, including the dose included in norcodrene.
Kaats GR, Blum K, Pullin D, Keith SC, Wood R. 1998. A randomized, double-masked, placebo controlled study of the effects of chromium picolinate supplementation on body composition: A replication and extension of a previous study. Current Therapeutic Research. 59(6):379- 88.
Kaats, G. R., Blum, K., Fisher, J. A., & Adelman, J. A. (1996). Effects of chromium picolinate supplementation on body composition: A randomized, double-masked, placebo-controlled study. Current Therapeutic Research - Clinical and Experimental, 57(10), 747-756.
Lemon balm was included for the product for the same reason l-theanine was, it's ability to take the edge off. Lemon balm has research in humans showing it relieves moderate anxiety, which is particularly helpful to individuals dieting (who are prone to being stressed).
Cases J, et al. (2011). Pilot trial of Melissa officinalis L. leaf extract in the treatment of volunteers suffering from mild-to-moderate anxiety disorders and sleep disturbances. Med J Nutrition Metab.
L-theanine is also known for its ability to take the edge off (I'm going to make my next article on l-theanine to explain in further detail). L-theanine not only reduces psychological and physiological stress, but it also enhances performance.
Higashiyama, A., Htay, H., Ozeki, M., et al. (2011). Effects of l-theanine on attention and reaction time response. Journal of Functional Foods. 3:3(171-178).
Kimura, K., Ozeki, M., Juneja, L. R., & Ohira, H. (2007). l-Theanine reduces psychological and physiological stress responses. Biological Psychology, 74(1), 39-45.
Aframomum melegueta has a human study showing it increases your metabolism while decreasing visceral fat in humans.
Sugita, J., et al. (2014). Daily ingestion of grains of paradise (Aframomum melegueta) extract increases whole-body energy expenditure and decreases visceral fat in humans. J Nutr Sci Vitaminol. 60(1):22-7.
Kola nut extract is a unique inclusion because of its stimulant feel. We were thinking of a new stimulant to put into this product that wouldn't be in prolific that would cause a unique feeling. Kola nut has a history of use, provides unique stimulant feel (euphoria), and the FDA has granted Kola Nut GRAS status, recognizing that it is safe for consumption in humans.
Caffeine- as for caffeine, not much I really have to say there about caffeine, we all know what it does.
The important part about this product is that it is a product filled with ingredients based on human studies, that the ingredients work well together to burn fat, provide a unique stimulant feel, while taking the edge off from dieting. Not only that, but every ingredient has been vetted by our team of lawyers, so there will be no issues with the product in the future, etc. I am confident those who enjoyed the old norcodrene will enjoy the new norcodrene if they give it a chance. It also gives you the ability to stack with SHIFT (should you choose to, but by no means do you need to stack the two together). It got rave reviews during out beta tests. I will have a longer product write up later; I wasn't expecting the label to be leaked so early, but that's just the way it is sometimes!
That was my first thought too, but wanted to double check since Alphamine is about as light on stims as you can get.Based off the comment regarding stimulants, Alphamine is probably next.
One study? I posted multiple, and there are more, but this is not intended as the product write up.One study... that showed some results in males. Will stock up on the old and watch reviews while looking for a replacement supp. Thanks for the response
Thank you Woody. There is an important take home message from my post and I am afraid most people will skip it: it's that the product works for what it's intended use is: improved body composition, while providing mood enhancement. This product is a supplement, not a magical cure. This product honestly works great, and feels great. The product was not reformulated for any other primary reason other than more human studies showing improved body composition while accounting for more mood enhancement. The reason I included reasons #1 and 2 are because they were minute factors (less than 10% of the reason), but factors nonetheless. I have always been honest and upfront with the AM crew about the reason for changes, and not many people are willing to do that on the forums.Is Alphamine going to change, too?
Totally understand your brand is more than AM - although some won't. Will also try it before I knock it.
Synapsin
Weren't they using Alpha-Y?Wishing you guys switched to Alpha-Y instead as it seems like it would have achieved a similar idea...but I guess I will just wait for the write up. Kola Nut seems like it could be intetesting.
They said it was Yohimbine, but a special extract called SA2-A or something.Weren't they using Alpha-Y?
It was a yohimbe extract that included different alkaloids, including having yohimbine in it.They said it was Yohimbine, but a special extract called SA2-A or something.
Some people just hate change in general.I loved the OG Norcodrene, one of the few on here who thought it was way better than alphamine. I'm as big a skeptic as anyone of the new formula. You guys are going in a new direction, and on a personal/business level, I'm happy for you. I hope you guys are even more successful.
On a greedy level, I'm sad for me, because I will miss the old stuff.
Right, it wasn't alpha-yohimbe.They said it was Yohimbine, but a special extract called SA2-A or something.
That's right. I remember now.They said it was Yohimbine, but a special extract called SA2-A or something.
Less logic, more pitchforks!!!!I like Y, but it's so damn cheap I can add my own. Is that the point? Naw, but it can still be done if you also like Y.
I know people who HATE Y. It exacerbates their anxiety and makes them feel uncomfortable. Moreover, I personally cannot readily import it. I do, but ive had enough warning letters from the govt. that a few less would be preferred.
When OG Erase was altered, there was an outcry, but you can buy the ingredient for a fraction of the cost nowadays and its still included in a multitide of products. IMO PES stay ahead of the redundant curve by being innovative. Stay complacent and you'll be left behind.
The brand is also beyond AM - have you seen the amount of e-tailers and countries they are in now? They have more than just YOU to consider. I also understand why SNS includes somethings that I know the board won't approve of, or at the very least question, but it's done because the company is beyond the forum and needs to take into account the needs of it's entire market.
Meh. I like the look of it.
No need to worry guys, Hi-Tech will come out with a knock-off of the OG. Just like they did with Hydroxycuts or whatever it is.
lmaoinsider special, only $9.99/bottle Morcodrene coming soon
Drug screenings? Nope!As I said, I'm interested in hearing the feedback on the new. Until then I'm enjoying the old. I haven't been disappointed yet by PES on quality of products. Any prob w any screenings for the new?
Interesting, I remember reading up on kola nut a while ago, but never tested it for stim effects. Will be trying this new formula, to see how it feelzHi friends,
I've been away while (abroad for personal reasons) so I haven't posted lately. The reason the formula was altered was for a multitude of reasons, so let's delve into them together:
1) Abroad appeal. The brand is trying to consolidate formulas. Having formulas specific to different regions is not particularly helpful and the new formula for norcodrene is the best formula for both domestic and international markets where some ingredients are not allowed (think Y)
2) On the subject on Y, we removed Y for international appeal and because of recent lawsuits due to stimulants getting unwanted attention from the FDA/ the guys at harvard doing all those studies. Y is a great ingredient, but lots of people are sensitive, and all it takes is one person to have things go wrong; we do not want to have to deal with potential lawsuits. That is why the formula isn't stimulant heavy as well. This is a trend you'll notice from all the major brands soon.
3) Okay, so now you're thinking that's fine and all, but what about results? The first norcodrene was truly revolutionary and is still a fantastic formula. The new formula, however, is also fantastic. Let's discuss it:
Chromium picolinate has a host of studies in humans showing it results in significant weight loss, including the dose included in norcodrene.
Kaats GR, Blum K, Pullin D, Keith SC, Wood R. 1998. A randomized, double-masked, placebo controlled study of the effects of chromium picolinate supplementation on body composition: A replication and extension of a previous study. Current Therapeutic Research. 59(6):379- 88.
Kaats, G. R., Blum, K., Fisher, J. A., & Adelman, J. A. (1996). Effects of chromium picolinate supplementation on body composition: A randomized, double-masked, placebo-controlled study. Current Therapeutic Research - Clinical and Experimental, 57(10), 747-756.
Lemon balm was included for the product for the same reason l-theanine was, it's ability to take the edge off. Lemon balm has research in humans showing it relieves moderate anxiety, which is particularly helpful to individuals dieting (who are prone to being stressed).
Cases J, et al. (2011). Pilot trial of Melissa officinalis L. leaf extract in the treatment of volunteers suffering from mild-to-moderate anxiety disorders and sleep disturbances. Med J Nutrition Metab.
L-theanine is also known for its ability to take the edge off (I'm going to make my next article on l-theanine to explain in further detail). L-theanine not only reduces psychological and physiological stress, but it also enhances performance.
Higashiyama, A., Htay, H., Ozeki, M., et al. (2011). Effects of l-theanine on attention and reaction time response. Journal of Functional Foods. 3:3(171-178).
Kimura, K., Ozeki, M., Juneja, L. R., & Ohira, H. (2007). l-Theanine reduces psychological and physiological stress responses. Biological Psychology, 74(1), 39-45.
Aframomum melegueta has a human study showing it increases your metabolism while decreasing visceral fat in humans.
Sugita, J., et al. (2014). Daily ingestion of grains of paradise (Aframomum melegueta) extract increases whole-body energy expenditure and decreases visceral fat in humans. J Nutr Sci Vitaminol. 60(1):22-7.
Kola nut extract is a unique inclusion because of its stimulant feel. We were thinking of a new stimulant to put into this product that wouldn't be in prolific that would cause a unique feeling. Kola nut has a history of use, provides unique stimulant feel (euphoria), and the FDA has granted Kola Nut GRAS status, recognizing that it is safe for consumption in humans.
Caffeine- as for caffeine, not much I really have to say there about caffeine, we all know what it does.
The important part about this product is that it is a product filled with ingredients based on human studies, that the ingredients work well together to burn fat, provide a unique stimulant feel, while taking the edge off from dieting. Not only that, but every ingredient has been vetted by our team of lawyers, so there will be no issues with the product in the future, etc. I am confident those who enjoyed the old norcodrene will enjoy the new norcodrene if they give it a chance. It also gives you the ability to stack with SHIFT (should you choose to, but by no means do you need to stack the two together). It got rave reviews during out beta tests. I will have a longer product write up later; I wasn't expecting the label to be leaked so early, but that's just the way it is sometimes!
There is an important take home message from my post and I am afraid most people will skip it: it's that the product works for what it's intended use is: improved body composition, while providing mood enhancement. This product is a supplement, not a magical cure. This product honestly works great, and feels great. The product was not reformulated for any other primary reason other than more human studies showing improved body composition while accounting for more mood enhancement. The reason I included reasons #1 and 2 are because they were minute factors (less than 10% of the reason), but factors nonetheless. I have always been honest and upfront with the AM crew about the reason for changes, and not many people are willing to do that on the forums.
What shape and color will the pills come in? Please say blue and in the shape of Minsider special, only $9.99/bottle Morcodrene coming soon
Wholeheartedly agree. While I understand that PES is a growing company and has to cover themselves from liability, it's kinda disappointing to see this new formula. I'm not saying that it necessarily won't work (time will tell) but I am saying that it sux to see them change so much. They are most definitely a mainstream company now and need to cater to the masses I guess.Not to sound like an asshat but these newer, lighter products harken back to the old days of fat burners with nothing novel or exciting about them.
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