Lipomorph or Baiba

halljo

halljo

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I have been using Baiba for about a month now, while on a cut. I attribute some better than normal fat loss due to it.

Was getting ready to order some more Baiba, when I saw Lipomorph.
I've read a lot about Lipomorph, but it always seemed to be dosed at 2-3 pills and added Baiba as well.

Has anyone used Lipomorph just by itself, without the addition of extra Baiba? Trying to decide whether I should just stick with what I'm doing or try Lipomorph.

Thanks in advance
 
LeanEngineer

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If you haven't tried Lipomorph I would suggest picking up a bottle. It's worth it to try especially since you haven't used it before.
 
Quads_of_Stee

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definitely try lipomorph on it's own before adding more baiba
 
TeamTGB

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I recommend Lipomorph as well, take it before you eat your meals it will help push it doen so you wont get any of the menthol burps.
 
hewhoisripped

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I actually echo the menthol burps :). As for which to choose, I also suggest you give Lipomorph a try. Many the added effect of the other ingredients, but BAIBA solo is a simple, clean effective supplement so it also has it's own place.

Are you planning on stacking anything else with it? If you were to use EC say, you could do two weeks of each (EC+BAIBA/Lipo & a lower dose of BAIBA) to change things up.
 
Alex281

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I actually echo the menthol burps :). As for which to choose, I also suggest you give Lipomorph a try. Many the added effect of the other ingredients, but BAIBA solo is a simple, clean effective supplement so it also has it's own place.

Are you planning on stacking anything else with it? If you were to use EC say, you could do two weeks of each (EC+BAIBA/Lipo & a lower dose of BAIBA) to change things up.
Are there any benefits at 2g of Baiba over 1g?
 
schizm

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On baiba, has anyone weighed out what a 1/4 tsp is? Does it match up to 1 gram? Trying to decide if my small plastic (mg up to 3 g) scale (from '97) is way off or not...as when I measure out 1g, it's considerably more than a 1/4 tsp
 
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I would say lipomorph is worth a shot. I just got 3 bottles of brite. Going to run that and decide if i continue or try lipo.
 
daniel11

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Lipomorph by itself is great. you can add more BAIBA, or stack either one with stim based fat burners.
 
pintowin

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I rain a few bottles of Lipomorph on prep with good results. I noticed a slight increase in fat loss when utilizing extra BAIBA with it. As mentioned above, give Lipomorph a run solo then add in extra BAIBA after you see the solo results.
 
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No side effects have been reported with BAIBA?
There is no human studie done yet on it?
 
NoAddedHmones

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No side effects have been reported with BAIBA?
There is no human studie done yet on it?
Been using upward of 3g Baiba for the last two weeks. No side effects, no effects at all really.
 
The_Old_Guy

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Read the write up on SuppVersity about it. Seems the HED is 8mg/Kg, which puts me at 770mg. Is Anteus Bulk the only bulk powder out there ATM?
 
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Been using upward of 3g Baiba for the last two weeks. No side effects, no effects at all really.
Ah, okey. Well sorry to hear that you have not got any effect at all. Maybe it something that take time to kick in.
 
NoAddedHmones

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Ah, okey. Well sorry to hear that you have not got any effect at all. Maybe it something that take time to kick in.
Im not so sure, I have been using for ~6 weeks now.
 
The_Old_Guy

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No side effects have been reported with BAIBA?
There is no human studie done yet on it?
No humans I can find:

Is BAIBA even safe? In the absence of human studies that's difficult to say, but in rodents it had no ill effects on mtDNA replication (Mainonneuve. 2004) and displays a generally low toxicity. As Begrich et al. point out, their "further investigations are [still] requested to determine whether BAIBA could induce deleterious effects," even though, "it seems that this endogenous derivative could have a favourable safety profile that might be attractive for pharmacological usage" (Begrich. 2010). Deteriorations of the lipid or glucose metabolism, were not observed in any of the currently published studies and at a dosage of 100mg/kg BAIBA reduced the fibrotic leasons in the livers of obesity prone mice and improved the level of lactate dehydrogenase, a potential marker of liver problems (Begrich. 2008).
 
The_Old_Guy

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And here's how they dosed the mice:

Animals, diets, and treatment

A first series of experiments was performed on 5-week-old male C57BL/6J-ob/ob mice (henceforth referred to as ob/ob mice) purchased from Janvier (Le-Genest-St-Isle, France) and fed ad libitum a normal chow (A04 biscuits; UAR, Villemoisson-sur-Orge, France). This standard-calorie (SC) diet brings 2,900 kcal/kg of food and contains 3% fat, 60% complex carbohydrate (primarily starch), and 16% protein. After a week of acclimatization in the animal house, ob/ob mice were treated with 100 or 500 mg/kg/day of BAIBA (Sigma-Aldrich, Saint-Quentin Fallavier, France) for 4 months. BAIBA was administered in the drinking water, as previously described (6,7). In ob/ob mice, but not in ob/+ mice, we rapidly noticed that BAIBA slightly but significantly lowered the daily consumption of drinking water by 15%. Consequently, the concentration of BAIBA was adjusted in the drinking solution so that the daily intake of BAIBA was kept constant.

A second series of experiments was performed on 5-week-old male C57BL/6J-+/+ mice (wild type, referred to as +/+ mice) and C57BL/6 -ob/+ mice (partially deficient in leptin, henceforth referred to as ob/+ mice) purchased from Janvier. After a week of acclimatization, both +/+ and ob/+ mice were fed ad libitum a high-fat, high-sucrose diet (referred to as high-calorie (HC) diet) purchased from SAFE (Augy, France). The HC diet brings 5,500 kcal/kg and includes 35% fat (primarily lard), 36% simple carbohydrate (mainly saccharose), and 19% protein. Ob/+ mice were treated or not treated with 100 mg/kg/day of BAIBA. Thus, three different groups of mice were studied for 4 months, namely +/+ fed the HC diet and ob/+ mice fed the HC diet, treated or not treated with BAIBA. To measure food consumption, the HC diet (which presents a pastry consistency) was manually transformed into pellets that were frozen until their utilization. Food consumption was then assessed every day during 6 consecutive weeks.

Our last experiment was performed on a few +/+ mice fed the SC or the HC diet for 4 months. Hence, three different groups of mice were studied (n = 6–8 per group), namely, +/+ mice fed the SC diet and +/+ mice fed the HC diet, treated or not treated with 100 mg/kg/day of BAIBA. All experiments were performed in agreement with national guidelines for the proper use of animals in biomedical research.
 
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Read the write up on SuppVersity about it. Seems the HED is 8mg/Kg, which puts me at 770mg. Is Anteus Bulk the only bulk powder out there ATM?
While I appreciate anyone going to the trouble of writing about BAIBA, I have a few criticisms of the article which I regret that I feel compelled to share.
"What the same amount of BAIBA did not do, though, was to prevent the weight gain in already obese mice. ...the currently available evidence clearly doesn't support the use of BAIBA as a classic "fat burner"."
They weren't "already obese mice", they were mice genetically engineered to be obese (ob/ob), through the deletion of functioning leptin genes. BAIBA doesn't work in mice that have no functional leptin system, that much is true. But to claim that "the currently available evidence clearly doesn't support the use of BAIBA as a classic fat burner" based on that information is not an appropriate conclusion.
Bottom line: Whether an increase in leptin production is... the only (or at least the most important) mechanism of the beta-aminoisobutyric acid induced anti-obesity effect will yet have to be confirmed in future studies.
The article cites only four references. Not only does this overlook some more studies from the French INSERM team, but it ignores the 2014 Cell study that completely reframed understanding of the molecule.
The title of the study alone should underline how relevant this research is: β-Aminoisobutyric Acid Induces Browning of White Fat and Hepatic β-Oxidation and Is Inversely Correlated with Cardiometabolic Risk Factors so to overlook it in an article about BAIBA is a massive oversight.
The article makes no attempt to explain the mechanisms of action of BAIBA, aside from a link to leptin, making no mention of PPARa or PGC1a, crucial to understanding the relationship between BAIBA and exercise, or of BAIBA's white fat browning effect. BAIBA was also recently determined to be an AMPK-activator in (mouse) muscle.
I really hate to criticise, but a poorly-researched article does an injustice to a fascinating endogenous signalling molecule.

For a more rounded overview of the ingredient, I recommend reading the following lay articles:
Ergo-Log - Beta-AIBA, a new weight-loss supplement
and their follow-up article (currently only available in Dutch) Ergogenics - Animal study: BAIBA effective and safe weight loss supplement
Molecular Gainz - BAIBA: A new weight loss supplement that might actually work?
PricePlow - BAIBA: New Ingredient Generates Exercise in a Pill?!
TFB - What is BAIBA?
and journal articles:
β-Aminoisobutyric acid induces browning of white fat and hepatic β-oxidation and is inversely correlated with cardiometabolic risk factors (free pdf)
Recent data on obesity research: β-aminoisobutyric acid (free pdf)
 
The_Old_Guy

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Thanks. So are you guys the only ones selling bulk?

And can you tell me what link above, is for the human studies so I don't have to go through each one? Thanks!
 
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Thanks. So are you guys the only ones selling bulk?

And can you tell me what link above, is for the human studies so I don't have to go through each one? Thanks!
As far as I know Antaeus are the only ones selling BAIBA as a bulk powder or a finished product (chem houses notwithstanding).
β-Aminoisobutyric acid induces browning of white fat and hepatic β-oxidation and is inversely correlated with cardiometabolic risk factors observes that naturally-occurring BAIBA levels in human participants blood were inversely correlated with fasting glucose, insulin, triglycerides, and total cholesterol. Dr Gerszten summarized the correlation as “The more BAIBA, the lower your insulin, the better your glucose, the less you weigh” (observed only as a correlation, not a proven causative relationship). Also, human pluripotent stem cells exposed in vitro to BAIBA differentiated to a brown fat-like phenotype rather than white fat.
 
The_Old_Guy

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Yeah, I saw Sigma-A had it. Ok, thanks. I'll check the link.
 
brofessorx

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I've been thinking of giving lipomorph a try. but am wondering if there's any information on how, if any, the ingredients would react when on other ped's like testosterone, or ostarine.
 
The_Old_Guy

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As far as I know Antaeus are the only ones selling BAIBA as a bulk powder or a finished product (chem houses notwithstanding).
β-Aminoisobutyric acid induces browning of white fat and hepatic β-oxidation and is inversely correlated with cardiometabolic risk factors observes that naturally-occurring BAIBA levels in human participants blood were inversely correlated with fasting glucose, insulin, triglycerides, and total cholesterol. Dr Gerszten summarized the correlation as “The more BAIBA, the lower your insulin, the better your glucose, the less you weigh” (observed only as a correlation, not a proven causative relationship). Also, human pluripotent stem cells exposed in vitro to BAIBA differentiated to a brown fat-like phenotype rather than white fat.
Ok, well that was a bust my friend :) So at this time, we have zero studies of people taking x amount of supplemental BAIBA and losing x amount of fat mass. That link only had the the Framingham Heart Study where they just checked levels - not "they took this much BAIBA and lost this much fat".

But the cell and mice research looks interesting (and the SuppVersity article actually was favorable toward it's use in leaner athletes trying to get the final % points off) - so I grabbed some Anteus bulk powder. Man, over $1 a gram... it's like Coke in the 80's :D
 

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