New blood work- need Natty t booster

[chedapalooza]

Most recent labs while on cistamax, forskolin95 100mg, powerfull and ep1c

Test: 588
Free: not checked
Shbg- 38
Prolactin- 13
Estradiol- 43
Fsh- 5.7
LH-5.3

I've been on TRT and had a clomid restart.

Highest ive ever seen my test was last fall at 1053 while taking test powder- but had a whole host of elevated estrogen and prolactin sides including inability to achieve erection.

What can I add to get the natural test up? I have some AI sports perform on hand. I'm afraid To run DAA anymore bc I get the nasty prolactin and estro sides

 

[Driven2lift]

Been seeing good feedback on Viron as a natty booster

http://www.orbitnutrition.com/cart/black-lion-research-viron.html

TestPowder is my usual recommendation but I see that one is out

 

[abformulations]

Give Viron a try. Raises free test. Also you could try bulk divanil as well.

 

[abformulations]

Driven beat me to it lol.

 

[Driven2lift]

Driven beat me to it lol.

They call me the Ninja rep

 

[abformulations]

They call me the Ninja rep

You're a straight ninja rep for sure lol. I need to stay on my toes wit u lol

 

[chedapalooza]

Been seeing good feedback on Viron as a natty booster

http://www.orbitnutrition.com/cart/black-lion-research-viron.html

TestPowder is my usual recommendation but I see that one is out

I honestly was just looking at viron. EL is solid... Not sure about boron tho? I know testofen and maca are helpful too.. Also like divanil

 

[chedapalooza]

I'm disappointed that cistamax didnt really raise my t levels, but the effects on body comp, nutrient utilization, and strength have been there

 

[abformulations]

I'm disappointed that cistamax didnt really raise my t levels, but the effects on body comp, nutrient utilization, and strength have been there

Worth it U think? Or a pass?

 

[ELROCK]

Most recent labs while on cistamax, forskolin95 100mg, powerfull and ep1c

Test: 588
Free: not checked
Shbg- 38
Prolactin- 13
Estradiol- 43
Fsh- 5.7
LH-5.3

I've been on TRT and had a clomid restart.

Highest ive ever seen my test was last fall at 1053 while taking test powder- but had a whole host of elevated estrogen and prolactin sides including inability to achieve erection.

What can I add to get the natural test up? I have some AI sports perform on hand. I'm afraid To run DAA anymore bc I get the nasty prolactin and estro sides

You really should have requested your Free T get checked. It much more important than your Total T. Your e2 is on the high side. Estrogen levels are different for everyone but 20 is usually a good number for most. Try running Viron, a fadogia product (tropinol xp is a good one) and a formestane product (Formeron is a good one). That stack should definitely get you were you need to be.

 

[kbayne]

I'm disappointed that cistamax didnt really raise my t levels, but the effects on body comp, nutrient utilization, and strength have been there

How are you sure Cistamax didn't raise it? Especially when you were running 4 other products along side it?

And I wouldn't be upset at all with an increase in nutrient utilization, body composition, and strength.

 

[alvin1]

Op you are on trt and test powder raised your testosterone?

ok my bad you did trt then did clomid restart and testpowder.....still 1065 is impressive, 1200 is the upper limit i think?

 

[haiz69]

I honestly was just looking at viron. EL is solid... Not sure about boron tho? I know testofen and maca are helpful too.. Also like divanil

If you like Divanil, you should take a look at Alphamax. The daily recommended dose will deliver 1400mg per day of the stuff. In addition, you will get 50mg per day of 95% forskolin, 300mg of L-DOPA, and 75mg of Arimistane. Rounded out with some ZMA and D3 and you have a very effective product. You could reduce the Powerfull/Forskolin 95% dosage, because Alphamax will have some crossover there.

 

[Goliath1]

I'd stack Viron & Endosurge, I ran it and liked it..
I used Tribulus, Xgels and something else to, can't remember off the top of my head..

 

[chedapalooza]

Worth it U think? Or a pass?

Worth it for the effects noted

 

[chedapalooza]

Thanks for suggestions. All stuff I am familiar with and considering.

 

[chedapalooza]

Does viron need an AI?

 

[abformulations]

Does viron need an AI?

Doesn't but highly suggested. I personally won't run it without an AI

 

[chedapalooza]

Doesn't but highly suggested. I personally won't run it without an AI

Gotcha. I am prone to estro sides obviously with my blood work like it is. Is arimistane strong enough? Or the new erase? I have heard great things about formeron but I'm not a huge fan of topicals/ I am not too familiar with it... Any sides/rebound from formeron? Cycle guidelines?

 

[T-Bone]

Does your doc know all the supplements you are on?. Also did he recommend going on OTC test boosters?. By constantly using different supplements you never give your body a chance to go back to normal homeostasis.

Also mr.cooper69

I'm pretty sure he is studying to be a doctor and might have some insight for you.

 

[chedapalooza]

Does your doc know all the supplements you are on?. Also did he recommend going on OTC test boosters?. By constantly using different supplements you never give your body a chance to go back to normal homeostasis.

Also mr.cooper69

I'm pretty sure he is studying to be a doctor and might have some insight for you.

Yes. I've talked at length with coop via PM for over a year now. Doctor knows. Said he doesn't mind as he doesn't actually believe any of it to be strong enough to play a major role (maybe 100 points) bloods have been consistent around 700-800 for the last year. This is my first check that has had a drastic stop. We may discuss another restart, but with FSH and LH In average range, I doubt he will prescribe clomid again/ I wouldn't wanna deal with the 2 month emotional roller coaster.

 

[chedapalooza]

I am getting a redraw next week on Monday or Tuesday. My insurance runs out Tuesday. I won't be able to get an rx anyway without steep out of pocket. At 26, 588 total test is not cool though

 

[T-Bone]

Yes. I've talked at length with coop via PM for over a year now. Doctor knows. Said he doesn't mind as he doesn't actually believe any of it to be strong enough to play a major role (maybe 100 points) bloods have been consistent around 700-800 for the last year. This is my first check that has had a drastic stop. We may discuss another restart, but with FSH and LH In average range, I doubt he will prescribe clomid again/ I wouldn't wanna deal with the 2 month emotional roller coaster.

Didn't you say you were taking Norcodrene and dieting?. Sixteen hour days also?. I can't imagine that your sleep is that great either..When I said supplements, I meant all supplements, not just test boosters. "Don't poke the bear." "Leave well enough alone"...etc...etc...I wouldn't mess for any formestane product at this point. I'd guess that your doctor would probally stay to steer clear of it. It's not exactly the same as an OTC test booster.

 

[abformulations]

Gotcha. I am prone to estro sides obviously with my blood work like it is. Is arimistane strong enough? Or the new erase? I have heard great things about formeron but I'm not a huge fan of topicals/ I am not too familiar with it... Any sides/rebound from formeron? Cycle guidelines?

Arimistane is ok. I rather run formeron. Go for formeron trust me. Topical aren't bad. I apply it in my inner thighs which makes it easy and if u have kids hard for them to touch.

The only sides is some suppression if taken 3-4 pumps. 2 pumps is the perfect dosage. 8 weeks no more.

Viron run 5 on 2 off

 

[xhrr]

I am getting a redraw next week on Monday or Tuesday. My insurance runs out Tuesday. I won't be able to get an rx anyway without steep out of pocket. At 26, 588 total test is not cool though

It's also not horrible either and you really need your free test checked. Do you have symptoms of low t or something cause your not low your average which isn't the worst thing in the world.

 

[chedapalooza]

Didn't you say you were taking Norcodrene and dieting?. Sixteen hour days also?. I can't imagine that your sleep is that great either..When I said supplements, I meant all supplements, not just test boosters. "Don't poke the bear." "Leave well enough alone"...etc...etc...I wouldn't mess for any formestane product at this point. I'd guess that your doctor would probally stay to steer clear of it. It's not exactly the same as an OTC test booster.

I agree with you on formeron.. Believe it or not t bone, there are certain things that I don't want to risk using/I agree are not worth the risks. Yes, I have been under the most stress literally in all my life. I've recently moved to a new state,
Started grad school, had a pretty horrendous issue with the "girlfriend"/ex/idk what we are after moving in together after 4 years. So definitely lots of situational stress and long hours, new schedule. Dieting I wouldn't say so much... But just a general change in nutritional timing and quality of food since I am still getting used to living in a new state and nailing down a routine.

It's also not horrible either and you really need your free test checked. Do you have symptoms of low t or something cause your not low your average which isn't the worst thing in the world.

Agreed not horrible. No real symptoms other than body comp not being optimal and weak orgasms/below average libido.

 

[xhrr]

I agree with you on formeron.. Believe it or not t bone, there are certain things that I don't want to risk using/I agree are not worth the risks. Yes, I have been under the most stress literally in all my life. I've recently moved to a new state, Started grad school, had a pretty horrendous issue with the "girlfriend"/ex/idk what we are after moving in together after 4 years. So definitely lots of situational stress and long hours, new schedule. Dieting I wouldn't say so much... But just a general change in nutritional timing and quality of food since I am still getting used to living in a new state and nailing down a routine. Agreed not horrible. No real symptoms other than body comp not being optimal and weak orgasms/below average libido.

Got Ya. Well with everything you just said it could most definitely be all the stress your under as stress is a libido killer. I hate using supps as a crutch in your situation but bps macapro may be a good investment to help with stress and libido as your total t is fine but we obviously don't know your free t yet. I agree on staying away from form until things get ironed out.

 

[Goliath1]

Does viron need an AI?

I used Formeron..

 

[T-Bone]

Ok so at this point I'd think adding supplements to the equation is just going to compound the problems and increase the stress on your system. I'd take a break or a "fast" from all supplements for a month or so. Try and reduce stress, sleep more, and increase caloric intake especially fat consumption. Take naps if you have to. Stimulants will definitely make things worse. If you absolutely need some kind of stimulant have a good cup of coffee. Stay away from strong stimulants and pre-workout products. Then again I did say stop taking all supplements for a while. Take at least 1 month to six weeks like this and then get re-tested if you are worried. I'd bet if you did this though that you would feel better and not feel the need for another blood test.

You have got to make your body work for you instead of getting blood tests and then responding by either taking synthetic products or OTC supplements to try and "fix" the "problems" as you see them.

 

[ELROCK]

Does viron need an AI?

With your e2 level it would require an AI and dont bother with arimistane that stuff doesnt lower estrogen levels. Run a formestane product along side it like Formeron.

 

[Goliath1]

I'm curious to see bloodwork before,on, after Forma products.. I got before and after labs done myself, but I've never seen any labs with all 3..

 

[ELROCK]

I'm curious to see bloodwork before,on, after Forma products.. I got before and after labs done myself, but I've never seen any labs with all 3..

Formeron brought my e2 levels down 14 points in 3 months and I only use it EOD.

 

[Goliath1]

Formeron brought my e2 levels down 14 points in 3 months and I only use it EOD.

I'm curious as to how Test levels are effected while on.. I showed suppression 5 days after my last dose of Formeron, but I want to see results while on..

 

[xR1pp3Rx]

I will just say that for me divinil and ALC after a clomid restart is amazing. my libido was great, until I tried trest. then all I want to do is to stay on it.. lulz..
but yes.. after I ran a clomid restart I ran D/aLC for several months with great success. I would definitely recommend that combo.

 

[xhrr]

I will just say that for me divinil and ALC after a clomid restart is amazing. my libido was great, until I tried trest. then all I want to do is to stay on it.. lulz.. but yes.. after I ran a clomid restart I ran D/aLC for several months with great success. I would definitely recommend that combo.

Are you on trt or dos the restart work?

 

[kisaj]

I'm curious to see bloodwork before,on, after Forma products.. I got before and after labs done myself, but I've never seen any labs with all 3..

Can't speak for the others, but Formeron lowers mine approx 10 points from mid 20s to teens on 2 pumps eod. I prefer to keep my e2 in the 20s, but it goes to show how well it works.

As others have already stated, Viron is a great supp for increasing free test. I have used so many Tongkat products over the years and there is only one other Tongkat supplier that I would consider equal to the quality in Viron- but it costs 3x as much. I have always taken boron and love it.

As far as an AI, it really depends on how prone you are to e2 increase and sides. I have no issues with it and have never had an issue with it increasing with TA or boron. Just keep an eye on it.

 

[dtrain13]

Can't speak for the others, but Formeron lowers mine approx 10 points from mid 20s to teens on 2 pumps eod. I prefer to keep my e2 in the 20s, but it goes to show how well it works.

As others have already stated, Viron is a great supp for increasing free test. I have used so many Tongkat products over the years and there is only one other Tongkat supplier that I would consider equal to the quality in Viron- but it costs 3x as much. I have always taken boron and love it.

As far as an AI, it really depends on how prone you are to e2 increase and sides. I have no issues with it and have never had an issue with it increasing with TA or boron. Just keep an eye on it.

Is the Tongkat standardized for anything in your product?

 

[chedapalooza]

Doctor said free test is 10.26. On what scale idk but he said 6 is where he makes his cutoff for treatment. He said test is low but average. He may want to run adex if estrogen stays at 43 or higher. I am retesting Monday or Tuesday.

 

[xR1pp3Rx]

Are you on trt or dos the restart work?

restart worked for me..

 

[chedapalooza]

restart worked for me..

Same with me. Restart got me from 200 total to 1052 total. Unfortunately, after a year, I am back down to the current 588... Hopefully my retest next week will show a higher number.

 

[alvin1]

What is a restart, clomid.?

 

[xR1pp3Rx]

its a slang reference to a modern procedure in which a patient uses clomid long term to restore natural test output/libido ect..

 

[xR1pp3Rx]

588 keeps me happy.. but when im at 200 or less... I feel like death becomes me.

 

[alvin1]

So clomid and test powder put him to 1050?

 

[chedapalooza]

588 keeps me happy.. but when im at 200 or less... I feel like death becomes me.

Yea I can hang at 588 no pun intended lol but after experiencing the 800-1000 range... Call me crazy but id like to be back there lol

So clomid and test powder put him to 1050?

Clomid put me to 800 after about 5 weeks. But shot my estrogen up to mid 70s!

After being off clomid for 3 months I took test powder and went up to 1050... Idk if it was a result of JUST test powder... Or test powder + residual effects of clomid..... Regardless, my w and prolactin were still so high that I couldn't get it up even with total test that high. So that's not worth it.

 

[alvin1]

On how many clomid where you?

 

[Goliath1]

On how many clomid where you?

In English brotha...

 

[alvin1]

Grams i guest, 25 or 50?

 

[chedapalooza]

I started at 25 daily then went up to 50 daily then went to 50 EOD. Then 25 EOD then off

I don't recall the exact schedule

 

[jaces]

Just. Get something with a **** load of d-aspertic acid(5g-10g pd) , lots of fats and zinc