Strongest Natty Stack Possible

breakoutyear

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Hey guys, I'm really looking for a very strong stack that when combined with of course intense training, adequate sleep/recovery, and solid nutrition you can SEE a very very noticeable difference in the mirror. I've done a ton of research but I'm wondering what others who have used the majority of these products think because I haven't. What stack have you used that you could honestly say my money was spent well on because I want to clearly see that my hard work has paid off and that I wasn't ripped off. Strength is not a variable in this equation. I don't want to waste my money with questionable supplementation and then looking in the mirror 4-8 weeks later and look exactly the same or only slightly better. I guess I'm looking for sort a strong recomp effect (building or muscle, cutting fat).
My budget is about $200-250 and I plan on ordering some stuff by the end of next week. I am very open to suggestions and ideas...
Some of the supplements I've been looking into are...

Alphamax
ArA
Test Powder
Anabeta Elite
Folli
Myosynergy
Recompadrol
Mass 550
Pre- workouts like Stimul8, Focus XT, White Flood Reborn...etc.

Once again very open to ideas, suggestions, and advice...

FYI
6'1
212lbs
12%bf
Football player interested in bodybuilding
 
nicksox15

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I am obviously biased but Alphamax has been getting great reviews from users as a strong natty booster. We have some people that have stacked with Ara with great results. Also quite a few stacking with Xgels. As far as PWO check out hypermax, our brand new high stim pre. It's on sale at NP for only 22 bucks right now!
 
jjblacksheep

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Visible results from SNS Agmatine and Anabeta/Erase stack (original...never tried elite versions) and I've been taking natty sups since late 80s. For me these are legit. You'll hear ArA too but it didn't do as much for me although most love it.
 
Auslifter

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ArA + Komodo Katana
Forskolin 95 + original anabeta
(or AnaBeta Elite)
Creatine mono
Recompadrol
Food (protein powder if needed)
Optimal smart training (progressive overload)
Sleep
other good options

amentomaxx + cistamaxx
beast creature
bcca's alcar + agmatine + cit malate + betaine anhydrous + c.o.p
 
TyMan14

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Anabeta and Test Powder was a solid stack for me. Combine with high carbs and youll gain some quality mass.
 

cbsharpe

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Ara, Alphamax, Forskolin 95, Recompadrol, and Folli gets my vote tha's on your list.
 
johnnyp

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Personally wouldn't spend all my budget on one ultimate stack of supps, if you have never used them you have no idea what is really working for you.
 

snagencyV2.0

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I am obviously biased!
yes...well at least you are open about it


we at FINAFLEX, while not biased, are still extremely excited about our MASS 550..getting nice reviews in the early going
 
nicksox15

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yes...well at least you are open about it


we at FINAFLEX, while not biased, are still extremely excited about our MASS 550..getting nice reviews in the early going
I meant biased as it's a product that we sell so wanted to put that on front street before promoting it to him. I however do not recommend Alphamax lightly, I have had multiple 8 week runs with it with great results as well as many users that have had great results with it. Kind of an unnecessary dig there on a board with reps recommending there own stuff in every thread you go into, you included. Kinda hard to be a rep and not be biased towards your own products.
 
Geoforce

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Lots of good products there.

I would advise against running too much at once.

I'd pick one to two from your first "category" and go with a solid pre-workout like Katana.

I see all these people running 4 things at once and I just don't know that the value is better than spreading certain things out.
 
mountainman33

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Follidrone. Just ran 30 days, put on 9 lbs. LBM, leaned out a bit, and knocked PRs off left and right.
 

snagencyV2.0

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Kind of an unnecessary dig there on a board with reps recommending there own stuff in every thread you go into, you included. Kinda hard to be a rep and not be biased towards your own products.
whoa whoa whoaaa there junior
easy to get your ire up today eh? you posted that you were biased - not me
wanna be mad at someone? then look at your own poor choice of a post there
me, I just found it lightly amusing, really no ill intended whatsoever
but carry on in whatever fashion you wish, mate
 

breakoutyear

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ArA + Komodo Katana
Forskolin 95 + original anabeta
(or AnaBeta Elite)
Creatine mono
Recompadrol
Food (protein powder if needed)
Optimal smart training (progressive overload)
Sleep
other good options

amentomaxx + cistamaxx
beast creature
bcca's alcar + agmatine + cit malate + betaine anhydrous + c.o.p
This looks like a well balanced stack and very much affordable. Thanks man!
TyMan14 yea I've always thought Test Powder would be pretty effective. What did you notice from it and how would you compare it to Alphamax? Most people say Anabeta is effective but I'm not sure whether I should get OG or the Elite...
snagencyV2.0 Mass 550 a test booster?
jjblacksheep thanks! Yea i've ran agmatine and liked it
mountainman33 Wow! If I got half of those results I'd be satisfied! Did you cut bodyfat as well?
Geoforce Yea i know what you mean. I'm thinking about running 2-3 I guess you call it natty anabolic tyoe supplements and then making sure my pre-workout supplements are on point to give my body what it need to train efficiently and effectively. I was just wondering what core supplements/products have a synergistic affect to optimize growth.
 
Geoforce

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whoa whoa whoaaa there junior
easy to get your ire up today eh? you posted that you were biased - not me
wanna be mad at someone? then look at your own poor choice of a post there
me, I just found it lightly amusing, really no ill intended whatsoever
but carry on in whatever fashion you wish, mate
All companies reps are biased towards their own products, you included.

It's not a poor choice of words to point that out really.
 

PuZo

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Follidrone. Just ran 30 days, put on 9 lbs. LBM, leaned out a bit, and knocked PRs off left and right.
9 lbs of LBM.. 30 days... nah ;) 9 pounds overall sure... but not LBM.
 

PuZo

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And no mentions of nitrates?
 

snagencyV2.0

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snagencyV2.0 Mass 550 a test booster?
absolutely - very complete and extensive formula, muscle builder/test booster/increase protein synthesis/AI built in as well
nothing else really needed with this one

All companies reps are biased towards their own products, you included.

It's not a poor choice of words to point that out really.
I guess everyione is entitled to their own opinion
for the record - I am not biased, and do not simply run around promoting my brand over other products and brands that, theoretically speaking, I enjoy better ... that, to me, would imply bias

when I make a recommendation, it is because I feel what I am advising is appropriate and suitable to the occasion -- not because I have to "pimp my company product"

if you are a rep for a company, I would HOPE that you have more of a reason than simply trying to get free product out of the company you rep for, when you make these recommendations
 
Geoforce

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absolutely - very complete and extensive formula, muscle builder/test booster/increase protein synthesis/AI built in as well
nothing else really needed with this one

I guess everyione is entitled to their own opinion
for the record - I am not biased, and do not simply run around promoting my brand over other products and brands that, theoretically speaking, I enjoy better ... that, to me, would imply bias

if you are a rep for a company, I would HOPE that you have more of a reason than simply trying to get free product out of the company you rep for, when you make these recommendations
Based on your affiliation with FinaFlex you are more likely to recommend FinaFlex than other products. In fact, this is your job and pretty much every rep does it. It's by no means a bad thing and most reps talk about their products to an extent.

This is an example of bias from an earlier thread you participated in:

if you want to try some exotic muscle-building compounds, look into our new and just-released natural supplement MASS 550
FinaFlex (ReDefine Nutrition) MASS 550 (60 Capsules): Discount MASS 550 Supplements
The thread was about PH cycles and you recommended a product from the company you work for. You were more likely to do this because you work for the company.

As company reps we are biased by nature. It isn't a bad thing, it's just true. It doesn't mean you don't have good intentions and it doesn't mean you don't recommend other products.

I think you're misusing it to an extent. I recommend other products brands all the time, but I'm still "biased" towards Evomuse considering my affiliation.
 
nicksox15

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absolutely - very complete and extensive formula, muscle builder/test booster/increase protein synthesis/AI built in as well
nothing else really needed with this one

I guess everyione is entitled to their own opinion
for the record - I am not biased, and do not simply run around promoting my brand over other products and brands that, theoretically speaking, I enjoy better ... that, to me, would imply bias

when I make a recommendation, it is because I feel what I am advising is appropriate and suitable to the occasion -- not because I have to "pimp my company product"

if you are a rep for a company, I would HOPE that you have more of a reason than simply trying to get free product out of the company you rep for, when you make these recommendations
I'm the same way, I don't recommend our products in every thread, just threads I would find it beneficial to the user. And I give props to plenty of other supplement companies for their products I enjoy as well. I rep for Performax because I enjoy the products alot, my first experience with them was a log I ran I loved the product. I continue to rep for them as I find the products to be of a high caliber and I enjoy helping them grow. I don't need free product, I have a real job and only rep because I genuinely enjoy interacting with everyone on here. I only commented on your original post calling me out as I don't think its a bad thing to indicate that I was a rep, in case he was on mobile where that doesn't show up.
 
mountainman33

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mountainman33 Wow! If I got half of those results I'd be satisfied! Did you cut bodyfat as well?
Can't entirely say for sure there was a leaning effect, but I now have serratus definition, which I haven't had since college, and certainly didn't have before I started Follidrone. Nothing major, but noticable.
 

snagencyV2.0

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This is an example of bias from an earlier thread you participated in:



The thread was about PH cycles and you recommended a product from the company you work for. You were more likely to do this because you work for the company.
lmao
let's keep things real here man, and not skew circumstances to attempt to "fit" things into your own PoV

the excerpt you quote, is in relation to a dude asking about PH/DS, and not having a clue about what he is doing...combine that with the fact the guy has worked out for only a yr, and the obvious conclusion is he is not ready for steroidal use
hence - keep things on the natty for now, and hence my recommendation

(you seem to forget: if I was only concerned with "pimping biasedly" for the company, and he is looking for a first-time hormonal compound, the easy thing here would have been to refer him to our 1-Andro or 1-ALPHA compounds; however I try to do what I feel is best and most appropriate for the customer, rather than simply advise any xyz product that comes to mind, and imo he is not well enough prepared to mess around with anything more than natty stuff right now..)


but I applaud you for your nice attempt to cloud the issue

As company reps we are biased by nature. It isn't a bad thing, it's just true. It doesn't mean you don't have good intentions and it doesn't mean you don't recommend other products.

I think you're misusing it to an extent. I recommend other products brands all the time, but I'm still "biased" towards Evomuse considering my affiliation.
totally understood on this - and yes, I use other products in addition to my company products (of course)
if I like something and think it is quality, i'll have no issue advising such, whether it's from FINAFLEX or not

cheers

I'm the same way, I don't recommend our products in every thread, just threads I would find it beneficial to the user. And I give props to plenty of other supplement companies for their products I enjoy as well. I rep for Performax because I enjoy the products alot, my first experience with them was a log I ran I loved the product. I continue to rep for them as I find the products to be of a high caliber and I enjoy helping them grow. I don't need free product, I have a real job and only rep because I genuinely enjoy interacting with everyone on here. I only commented on your original post calling me out as I don't think its a bad thing to indicate that I was a rep, in case he was on mobile where that doesn't show up.
lol, okay man
seems to me, since everyone is on same page with this "reps are biased" image they wish to promote, that you only continue to make a mountain out of this molehill...if you are offended by what I said, i will not apologize - as there was nothing ill intended by it (as i have said), and you seem to have taken exception to this when i simply repeated your own words, and you insist that i am calling you out

i guess my point here is: if you as a rep state that you are biased, and i simply agreed with you, then why you so mad at me and trying so hard to paint this as adversarial?


have a good day guys, try not to sweat the small things this w/e and just go enjoy yourselves okay?
 
Adizzle1

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i guess my point here is: if you as a rep state that you are biased, and i simply agreed with you, then why you so mad at me and trying so hard to paint this as adversarial?
i dont think nick is 'so mad at you', doubt he really cares....it is just an internet forum.

I think the point being made is its laughable for you to agree with him thats hes biased but then in the same sentence claim your not while recommending a product that its your job to promote. Your a rep, its your JOB to promote your product, to say your not biased to those products is laughable thats all!


Back to the point...... Alphamax is your best option!!!!


i kid i kid ;)
 
mountainman33

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You used a digital scale for BF%?
No, I never got the chance to check BF. I tried tracking down my calipers from my trainer days but I'm pretty sure they got lost when we moved, among other things. Like I mentioned above, I'm not positive I lost BF, but I have some (I repeat some) serratus definition, and haven't had that since college, and didn't before I began Follidrone.
 

PuZo

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No, I never got the chance to check BF. I tried tracking down my calipers from my trainer days but I'm pretty sure they got lost when we moved, among other things. Like I mentioned above, I'm not positive I lost BF, but I have some (I repeat some) serratus definition, and haven't had that since college, and didn't before I began Follidrone.
Then I wouldn't go as far as saying you gained 9lbs of LBM. It could have "dried" you out a bit which has nothing to do with body fat.

Not trying to dismiss your results as they are impressive, but it's important to not "over-reach" and say it is all LBM.

I will most likely be trying Biotivia's Heracles when it gets released.
 

grocker

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I've had the best recomp using Follidrone alone. But if I did a stack from your list, I'd go with a Follidrone/Alphamax/Recompadrol combo. And maybe Stimul8 for the fatburning/preworkout.
 
mountainman33

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Then I wouldn't go as far as saying you gained 9lbs of LBM. It could have "dried" you out a bit which has nothing to do with body fat.

Not trying to dismiss your results as they are impressive, but it's important to not "over-reach" and say it is all LBM.

I will most likely be trying Biotivia's Heracles when it gets released.
Makes sense. I generally don't discount what people say here unless it's absolutely ridiculous. And I learned a long time ago electrofeedback BF measurements are useless.

What's in the Heracles profile?
 

iddqd

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lmao
let's keep things real here man, and not skew circumstances to attempt to "fit" things into your own PoV
but I applaud you for your nice attempt to cloud the issue
you only continue to make a mountain out of this molehill...if you are offended by what I said, i will not apologize

have a good day guys, try not to sweat the small things this w/e and just go enjoy yourselves okay?
1. you are biased
2. you derail almost EVERY thread you post in like this and ruin lots of good discussions, this one included
3. you are extremely condescending to everyone you talk to with 95% of your posts, see above quote
4. whenever you disagree with anything, you type up a mountain of words about a molehill of an issue which half the time reads like 'I AM RIGHT YOU ARE WRONG IF YOU DONT AGREE YOU ARE DUMB'
5. it is annoying enough for someone who never posts to post about this. hell, it is annoying enough to notice and make me remember your screenname which is remarkable in and of itself
6. no one says anything because you follow up with a complete blowup and most regulars here are company reps, so you would (very loudly, i might add) try to make everything sound like its company bashing
7. no, it's not me. it's not everyone else. it really is you.
 

PuZo

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Makes sense. I generally don't discount what people say here unless it's absolutely ridiculous. And I learned a long time ago electrofeedback BF measurements are useless.

What's in the Heracles profile?

Meet The Enemy...and The Hero

Myostatin is produced primarily in skeletal muscle cells, circulates in the bloodstream and exerts its effects on muscle tissue. It inhibits muscle differentiation and development in a process known as Myogenesis.
This protein normally restrains muscle growth, ensuring that muscles do not grow too large. Mutations that reduce the production of functional myostatin lead to an overgrowth of muscle tissue. Mutations of human myostatin gene result in individuals having significantly more muscle bulk and hence are considerably
stronger than normal (sorry, it's not contagious...).
Now of course, we're NOT saying that using Heracles will make you a ripped 300 pounds freak. We're talking about a moderate gene expression modulation, not a total gene ablation like in the pictures that flood the net (you know, those showing comics-like unreal, chimeric hypermuscled dogs, mice and bulls) .
Still, it should give you an idea of the utmost importance of Myostatin in muscle growth and fat loss.
On a good note, modulating Myostatin won't turn you into a cow either.

So how do I keep in check that bad, bad Myostatin? I won't tell you to lift and follow a high protein diet. If you're reading these lines, I guess that's a given.

Some of you maybe remember the great excitement, a decade or so ago, caused by an alleged Myostatin inhibitor found in an algae (Cystoseira canariensis).
You likely also remember countless of furious users who fired their money on those (also very expensive) products.
No surprise. After ingestion, it gets totally degraded and nothing reaches the systemic circulation...hence, zero effect.

Now the amazing news.

There IS a naturally occurring Myostatin inhibitor. One with very good oral bioavailability.
A completely safe and healthy compound. Something that most of us have already (unknowingly) ingested in tiny amounts.

A compound, finally, proven to significantly inhibit Myostation and improve the Myostatin/Follistation ratio when administered orally to healthy men!

This marvellous ingredient is EPICATECHIN(do NOT confuse it with other Cocoa flavanols, ours it's a specialized custom-made extract containing 95% Epicatechin and no, no product on the market can
ever remotely come close to this).

Its effects were so striking that now Epicatechin is getting evaluated for the treatment of progressive muscle loss and impaired skeletal muscle function in Muscular Dystrophy patients.
The subjects of a very recent study were given a total of 1 mg (-)-epicatechin per kg bodyweight per day (N.B.: our product is meant for bodybuilders...hence VERY generously dosed) . The researchers then looked at the effects that the supplement had on the subjects’ hand grip strength (in case you're wondering why a handgrip test, it's a simple and commonly used test of general strength level, also very well researched) and at the concentrations of myostatin and follistatin in their blood.

Treatment for 7 days with (-)-epicatechin yielded a bilateral increase in hand strength of 7%, which was accompanied by a significant increase (49.2%) in the ratio of plasma follistatin/myostatin levels.

A 49.2% increase in the Myostatin/Follistatin ratio is astonishing. Even more so in a mere week.

So YES, we can state out loud that Heracles increases muscle anabolism through an extremely effective yet safe and legal mechanism of action.

Just a brief note: Epicatechin also stimulates LH and Testosterone synthesis and promotes a substantial increase in endothelial Nitric Oxide.


Now, as if this wasn't groundbreaking enough, we went one further step forward.

Heracles features Hesperidin Methyl Chalcone
Hsperidin is a bioflavinoid naturally found in small concentrations in the peel and pulp of citrus fruit.
While hesperidin itself is very poorly water-soluble, hesperidin methyl chalcone is highly water-soluble, allowing for greater absorption of the molecule in the gastrointestinal tract.
Getting enough Hesperidin through food to exert the effects we're going to elucidate, would be basically impossble. For example, 100 gr of grapefruit flesh contains about 3 mg hesperidin, and it's not even the methyl chalcone(more bioavailable) form.
So what does it do?
Hesperedin promotes osteoblast differentiation in human mesenchymal stem cells, indicating an anabolic effect of hesperedin on bone metabolism. Bone marrow mesenchymal stem cells undergo myogenic differentiation as well as osteogenic differentiation. The researchers therefore explored whether hesperedin modulates muscle cell differentiation.
Hesperedin promoted myogenic differentiation, in a dose-dependent manner, by increasing myogenin gene expression. MyoD-induced myogenin gene transcription was enhanced by hesperedin, as this bioflavonoid augmented the nuclear localization and myogenin promoter-binding of MyoD. In addition, hesperedin
accelerated muscle regeneration induced by muscle injury. These results got confirmed both in vitro and in vivo.
Myogenin expression was considerably augmented in the presence of hesperedin during differentiation. Myogenin expression was prominent in the nucleus, indicating that hesperedin promotes myogenic gene expression and terminal differentiation. Skeletal muscle development involves an initial period of
myoblast replication, followed by a phase in which some myoblasts continue to proliferate while others undergo terminal differentiation. The latter process involves activation of muscle-specific gene expression, and the fusion of single cells into multinucleated muscle fibers.
These results strongly demonstrate that hesperedin has a potent pro-myogenic activity via regulation of MyoD activity in the myogenic differentiation of mesenchymal stem cells. During myoblast differentiation or regeneration, MyoD is essential for skeletal muscle repair .
If there's a perfect supporting character for Epicatechin, that's Hesperidin Methyl Chalcone.

HERACLES
Coming in May 2014.
 

PuZo

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Makes sense. I generally don't discount what people say here unless it's absolutely ridiculous. And I learned a long time ago electrofeedback BF measurements are useless.

What's in the Heracles profile?
What % extract is in Follidrone?
 

snagencyV2.0

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thank you sir, for your kind feedback....glad I could inspire you to post something

in life, some ppl just look for any excuse to be unhappy
of your three posts now on this forum (in 15 months), two seem to simply rant and rave about things - like this gem of a thread you posted recently

Long time lurker from europe (who bought at least one bottle of ~80% of the products you put out over the last year) here.
I hope it is ok to talk about a non-sponsor here and that dsade or whoever is in charge of this stuff maybe sees it. Sorry if I am mistaken :)
I also want to apologize for reading troubles, english is not my first language and it has been a while that I actually wrote something/spoke in it.

My question is why in the world, of all the available EU distributors, you guys had to pick the ****tiest one you could find.
Not only is PredatorNutrition about 5-7 pounds (about $10!) more expensive on everything ever than any competition, their 'customer service' is a disgusting condescending joke.
They just don't give a ****.
I placed 4 orders to date, and not a single one simply went through without some random bull****.

- ridiculous delays (as in 'whole week++'), 3 times. usually something is out of stock and you get a standard email about how they will cancel the order if you dont answer within four days, take your CC money instanly, and then after you respond they dont do anything for a couple days. then you have to email them or they will NEVER even notice that they didn't bother sending out what is already paid for.
I think I had to write 10+ emails back and forth for each of those orders.
- I once opted for a refund for one out of stock item, it took over 2 months and again several emails to get my money back. they dont seem to really read what you write them either. like i said, not a single **** given.

Even with orders of >500€(!!) they just can't be asked to send them out, let alone deal with them with any sense of priority (which i would absolutely expect from every half-decent company).

minor stuff:
-zero samples in half of them (never happened with other places), their reasoning being (as far as i gathered from their forums) that samples are expensive and it would reduce their (already ridiculous) earnings
and also, although a bit debatable,
- the shady way they acted about the whole craze debacle (now selling single serving samples they had lying around for 5 pound btw) and now acting as if frenzy was da bomb even tho its either just a random amp product (or spiked) judging from the profile

its like dealing with a government agency where no one is actually doing any work, but internally debating whether your dirty peasant money should even entitle you to any kind of service.
'we are the leading distributors in europe and you should be thankful that we even consider taking your money' is the attitude they seem to have.

the thing is, most stuff is available from their competitors and i would never again buy a single thing from them if it wasn't for you guys.
for all the evomuse stuff (and the newer things from bps as well btw) you have to go through them.
and it's really your fault, with all your fancy new cardiotryx and whatnot ;)
importing from nutraplanet etc is not an option for me due to customs (those guys even seized my fish oil once).
Please, please, please dont force me to do business with those unbearably lazy people ever again when brite, myosynergy etc come out. its thoroughly unpleasant.
thank you.
did you really just complain about the fact that a website that sells supps does not put samples in the order when you purchase?? holy self-serving perspective...

your third post is actually a legitimate question (well sort of anyway) - which you quantify by apologizing if the answer has already been stated, but you "only skimmed the thread"..shrewd

lighten up mate - you may find life to be more enjoyable
 
Geoforce

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lmao
lol, okay man
seems to me, since everyone is on same page with this "reps are biased" image they wish to promote, that you only continue to make a mountain out of this molehill...if you are offended by what I said, i will not apologize - as there was nothing ill intended by it (as i have said), and you seem to have taken exception to this when i simply repeated your own words, and you insist that i am calling you out

i guess my point here is: if you as a rep state that you are biased, and i simply agreed with you, then why you so mad at me and trying so hard to paint this as adversarial?


have a good day guys, try not to sweat the small things this w/e and just go enjoy yourselves okay?
It's not an image we try to promote, but an actual reality. You are no different, but you aren't allowing yourself to see why. You don't have to point out your bias when you recommend a product from a company you work for, he just chose to do so.

The bias is obvious each and every time any of us recommend one of our products while saying we work for that company in our signature. You're making the concept a little more difficult than it needs to be, but I'm thinking you might not understand the point.
 

saggy321

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absolutely - very complete and extensive formula, muscle builder/test booster/increase protein synthesis/AI built in as well
nothing else really needed with this one

I guess everyione is entitled to their own opinion
for the record - I am not biased, and do not simply run around promoting my brand over other products and brands that, theoretically speaking, I enjoy better ... that, to me, would imply bias

when I make a recommendation, it is because I feel what I am advising is appropriate and suitable to the occasion -- not because I have to "pimp my company product"
Haha! Funniest thing I've read all week!
 

snagencyV2.0

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lqtm

I don't know which one amuses me most: the fact that some are still going on and on about what it is to be bias, or the fact that this stalker guy saggy can sense a "conflict" with me (if you want to call it that) anywhere and any time, and promptly come running into the fray to insert himself in the middle of things...

all kinds of shrewd up in this thread, it seems
 
mountainman33

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Based on what I've seen the (-)-epicatechin in Heracles seems pretty under dosed.
 
Geoforce

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lqtm

I don't know which one amuses me most: the fact that some are still going on and on about what it is to be bias, or the fact that this stalker guy saggy can sense a "conflict" with me (if you want to call it that) anywhere and any time, and promptly come running into the fray to insert himself in the middle of things...

all kinds of shrewd up in this thread, it seems
Maybe you should just take your own advice of calming down instead of sending nasty PM's and negging people who disagree with you.

Someone needs to grow up. It seems like the one going on and on about everything is you. I would neg back and send a nasty PM, but it's not really worth it. It's just weird from a guy telling everyone else to calm down and enjoy life.

And to think all I did was point out why so many reps say "obviously I'm biased."
 

snagencyV2.0

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I would neg back and send a nasty PM, but it's not really worth it.
truth be told, I would prolly respect you more if you would simply do that, rather than sit there and whine publicly about pm's and negs like a baby

but hey, we all roll the way we see fit, right? we all have our bias, as you keep telling me....
 

PuZo

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Based on what I've seen the (-)-epicatechin in Heracles seems pretty under dosed.
They both reference the same 1mg per kg study and Biotivia is a premium brand. They also list the % extract whereas Follidrone doesn't. I'd wager they are basically the same amount in the end.
 
Geoforce

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truth be told, I would prolly respect you more if you would simply do that, rather than sit there and whine publicly about pm's and negs like a baby

but hey, we all roll the way we see fit, right? we all have our bias, as you keep telling me....
have a good day guys, try not to sweat the small things this w/e and just go enjoy yourselves okay?

lighten up mate - you may find life to be more enjoyable
Is this really the same person? Unsubbed before my PM's get filled by a guy not trying to sweat the small things.
 
Piston Honda

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"What stack have you used that you could honestly say my money was spent well on because I want to clearly see that my hard work has paid off and that I wasn't ripped off."
"I'm looking for sort a strong recomp effect"

White Pump: Trymethylglycine, Agmatine, Norvaline. -- $20 if you know where to look
XFactor: ArA --$35
NOxygen: nitrates --$15-20 if you know where to look
Alpha Amino, Purple Wraath: $20-40 if you...you know

add the following for a more hardcore stack if you want to spend more of your $$$

Follidrone: myostatin inhibitor --$50 when more batches come in
Forskolin: $20

And no offense, but some of the products in your first post aren't necessarily "natural" products. I don't know if this is a concern to you for competition purposes or not.
 

snagencyV2.0

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Is this really the same person? Unsubbed before my PM's get filled by a guy not trying to sweat the small things.
you can continue in your attempts to make me look bad, but let's get real - one PM to you, and a neg, and now you fly off the wall and insinuate I am flooding your inbox?

you, sir, are genius at deception..
I really should have seen this one coming tho, after you bastardized my advice to the ignorant PH/DS wanna-be-user from another thread, in your earlier post here, trying to make a (???) point
 

breakoutyear

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I have take ArA a few times and really like it but I am wondering whether its results are transient, meaning it goes away post cycle? I saw someone post that this may be he case...and I'm wondering if products like Folli, Alphamax, Recompadrol, and Mass 550 would do the same or would you keep the majority of those gains/improvements?
 
Piston Honda

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I have take ArA a few times and really like it but I am wondering whether its results are transient, meaning it goes away post cycle? I saw someone post that this may be he case...and I'm wondering if products like Folli, Alphamax, Recompadrol, and Mass 550 would do the same or would you keep the majority of those gains/improvements?
Diet-dependent
 

breakoutyear

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"What stack have you used that you could honestly say my money was spent well on because I want to clearly see that my hard work has paid off and that I wasn't ripped off."
"I'm looking for sort a strong recomp effect"

White Pump: Trymethylglycine, Agmatine, Norvaline. -- $20 if you know where to look
XFactor: ArA --$35
NOxygen: nitrates --$15-20 if you know where to look
Alpha Amino, Purple Wraath: $20-40 if you...you know

add the following for a more hardcore stack if you want to spend more of your $$$

Follidrone: myostatin inhibitor --$50 when more batches come in
Forskolin: $20

And no offense, but some of the products in your first post aren't necessarily "natural" products. I don't know if this is a concern to you for competition purposes or not.
Very helpful! And no offense taken at all. Not for competition purposes and I guess I don't mean natty as in herbal but just not like AAS or prohormones, strictly my preference at the moment. And ok at the diet, makes sense. So it seems like the following products would cause a definite increase in blood flow and pumps. I figure that has a lot to do with shaping the body, increasing gains, and allowing for a greater intensity in workouts if I'm not mistaken...
 
Geoforce

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you can continue in your attempts to make me look bad, but let's get real - one PM to you, and a neg, and now you fly off the wall and insinuate I am flooding your inbox?

you, sir, are genius at deception..
I really should have seen this one coming tho, after you bastardized my advice to the ignorant PH/DS wanna-be-user in your earlier post here, trying to make a (???) point
Fly off the wall and bias are two things that you do not know the meaning of. The only person making you look bad is you in this thread. Why you continue down this path is unknown to me.

I didn't post to start anything with you and you have done nothing but attempt to start stuff with multiple people in this thread. I don't get involved in these little drama things you can check my posting history. Have a better day and take your own advice about not making a big deal out of things.
 

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