Serotonin & Dopamine...
- 12-23-2013, 04:45 PM
D 1,25 levels fluctuate and a single low reading could be attributable to a high calcium intake day or an underlying parathyroid issue, both of which would be contraindicated for d supplementation.
- 12-23-2013, 04:59 PM
I am all for people taking whatever and doing whatever with their body. I, however, see so many young people on here completely jacked up. How sad is it 20 something year olds needing libido enhancers. You may think your not doing any damage, but it may take a while to manifest.
12-23-2013, 05:03 PM
You make a valid point also. Both your points are along the same lines. One is backed by big pharma and the other by big vitamin companies.
Most people in our instant gratification society wants quick results and answers. That is not the reality of dealing with personal psychology, even though the science of psychology has become just as big of a pill pusher as the AMA. I used to tell my patients to talk, listen and meditate, not medicate. Truly, most psychological disorders are minor in the public at large. There is a small part of the population that really needs psycho active drugs for their disorders.
I would rather see the original poster take D3 than have some ''expert" put him on Abilify or prozac and make him even worse than he started. Abilify for example is a very power antipsychotic drug now being touted for bipolar disorder or just plain depression. This Stuff is scary to use on a ''normal person'' it can possible make a person worse off then they were.
Take a step back and breathe. Get out in nature. Hike, walk. Don't look for the quick answer.
12-23-2013, 05:08 PM
12-23-2013, 05:15 PM
12-23-2013, 05:26 PM
12-23-2013, 10:52 PM
There was a recent study showing a reduction in muscle damage with vitamin D supplementation in healthy, young, active males, with vitamin D levels slightly low yet within normal range (A set of demographics I would imagine a huge number of people in this community fit into)
There is also a difference between clinical deficiency and suboptimal levels of an essential nutrient. Lots of people aren't clinically deficient enough in Vitamin D that they are experiencing significant negative effects as a result, you can still however benefit from supplementation.
Leucine is an essential nutrient.
The average person is not deficient in leucine.
You can however consume more leucine every day and experience beneficial effects.
12-23-2013, 11:08 PM
12-23-2013, 11:30 PM
more melatonin does not better sleep make..more zinc does not more T make..and too much potassium can stop your heart, just to name a few
12-24-2013, 02:55 AM
12-24-2013, 03:57 AM
My wife, an endo, says not to take more than 1,000 ius daily and most healthy young males only need 400 to 800. She works with rehabbing professional athletes at Andrews Clinic after injuries and surgery and surgical repair. Diet and hormone optimization is a big piece here.
I cannot link to her so below are some articles and blurbs. As with anything, read skeptically and realize that excess of fat soluable vitamins might not be as safe as you think.
The good news is that you can't overdose on the vitamin D manufactured by your skin. But as for vitamin D in the diet and in pills, Sandon says that the upper limit is 2,000 IU a day. "Vitamin D is a fat-soluble vitamin, so it's stored in the body," she says. "If you're taking a supplement that puts your daily intake at more than 2,000 IU, you can get a toxic or overdose effect, which can possibly lead to kidney stones or kidney damage, muscle weakness, or excessive bleeding."
Here is a doctor that basically says don't exceed 1,000 ius and excess d over time can cause cardiac issues, calcification of arteries, calcification of vessels in the brain, calcufucation of soft tissues, atrial fibrillation, increased levels of CRP, impaired kidney function and . . .
Dr. Jo Ann Carson, a clinical nutritionist at the University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center in Dallas, says dietary vitamin D offers a solution for people who are at high risk of skin cancer or who just don't want to take any chances.
Taking a vitamin D supplement every day can also help, but don't take more than 1,000 IU per day, Carson said.
Read more: http://www.upi.com/Health_News/2008/...#ixzz2oNZz62mt
12-24-2013, 04:13 AM
A 21st century evaluation of the safety of oral vitamin D.
Risk assessment for vitamin D.Because long-term daily intakes up to and including 10 000 IU of vitamin D do not produce signs or symptoms of vitamin D toxicity and are safe for the entire general population of otherwise healthy adults, even daily vitamin D intakes of 2000 IU allow for the often-cited and excessively conservative five-fold safety factor. In conclusion, long-term daily intakes of up to and including 10 000 IU of vitamin D maximize physiologic benefits and are safe.
Vitamin D toxicity, policy, and science.We present a risk assessment based on relevant, well-designed human clinical trials of vitamin D. Collectively, the absence of toxicity in trials conducted in healthy adults that used vitamin D dose > or = 250 microg/d (10,000 IU vitamin D3) supports the confident selection of this value as the UL.
Mayoclinic: Vitamin D. The clinical trial evidence shows that a prolonged intake of 250 mug (10,000 IU)/d of vitamin D(3) is likely to pose no risk of adverse effects in almost all individuals in the general population; this meets the criteria for a tolerable upper intake level.
Safety research supports an upper limit of a dose of vitamin D to be more than or equal to 250 micrograms daily (10,000 IU of vitamin D3)
12-24-2013, 04:50 AM
Perhaps the issue is not simply toxicity if you read the article by the doctor above and as I noted earlier. There are concerns about long term calcification of arteries and soft tissue, increased incidence of atrial fibrillation and a host of other potential issues that may not fit neatly with the purview of observed acute toxicity.
BTW, are all three of your links all related to or based on the same 2007 study?
Why bang away at 5,000 or 10,000 ius daily when no doctors seem to be saying that is necessary or beneficial in young healthy males, much less geriatrics. Just the if good, more must be better mentality of those peddling supplements.
12-24-2013, 05:01 AM
I'll take the advice of those published peer reviewed sources and an authority on medicine over a random quack who also shills, LAUGHABLY underdosed supplements (see: http://www.raysahelian.com/mindpowerrx.html) an unsourced news article, and an unsourced webmd article.
Note, I'm not saying everyone should supplement 10,000 IU per day, I'm just saying that to suggest that there are no benefits, and in fact significant risks at any dosing higher than 1,000 or 2,000 IU is just laughable scare tactics.
12-24-2013, 05:29 AM
I believe there was only one 2007 study that addresses toxicity at 10,000 ius. You still ignore the artery calcification, soft tissue calcufication or potential increased incidence in congestive heart failure issues. Even the 10,000 iu ul has been questioned as to safety as noted below. You focus on acute toxicity. The concerns seem to be related to long term cardiovascular impact and etc.
You evade the real issues and still produce notta saying that a young healthy male would benefit from greater than 1,000 ius. Candidly, its all good and vitamin d is perhaps so low on the list of potentially harmful substances being ingested around here it is not worth discussing.
About to catch our flight to Bali. Happy holidays.
While symptoms of toxicity are unlikely at daily intakes below 10,000 IU/day, the FNB pointed to emerging science from national survey data, observational studies, and clinical trials suggesting that even lower vitamin D intakes and serum 25(OH)D levels might have adverse health effects over time. The FNB concluded that serum 25(OH)D levels above approximately 125150 nmol/L (5060 ng/mL) should be avoided, as even lower serum levels (approximately 75120 nmol/L or 3048 ng/mL) are associated with increases in all-cause mortality, greater risk of cancer at some sites like the pancreas, greater risk of cardiovascular events, and more falls and fractures among the elderly. The FNB committee cited research which found that vitamin D intakes of 5,000 IU/day achieved serum 25(OH)D concentrations between 100150 nmol/L (4060 ng/mL), but no greater. Applying an uncertainty factor of 20% to this intake value gave a UL of 4,000 IU
12-24-2013, 06:15 AM
Also, I'm not focusing on acute toxicity at all...The acute tolerable upper limit of vitamin D is something absurd like a 250,000 IU bolus once per month.
All of the references I'm making are about long term daily safety at 10,000 IU.
12-24-2013, 06:19 AM
12-24-2013, 06:55 AM
12-24-2013, 07:06 AM
I won't hold my breath waiting on it though.
12-24-2013, 07:19 AM
12-24-2013, 02:40 PM
12-24-2013, 02:48 PM
12-24-2013, 03:55 PM
12-24-2013, 04:00 PM
mineral balance is a crucial component of hormonal function, as well as many other functions in the body..
IMO, while I do not minimize the importance of zinc for T production, I rather look at the bigger picture ie, zinc being important mineral for insulin function and the fact that even a marginal deficiency has been shown to increase insulin resistance and to worsen glycemic control....combined with a deficiency in vitamin D, the two have been implicated in the development of type 1 diabetes and other autoimmune diseases such as crohns disease
rather than advise X amount of zinc to supplement, I rather promote a diet heavy in zinc-rich foods
if one chooses to supplement with zinc, preferred forms would be chelates such as zinc picolinate, monomethionine, gluconate and citrate for raising testosterone levels, as would a concurrent reduction (if applicable) in oversupplementation with copper, calcium and iron + a reduction in high fiber dietary consumption
mineral balance can only be tested professionally, but I would encourage anyone to check this if they think they have a problem in this area, rather than self-diagnose and attempt to "fix" on their own
12-24-2013, 04:30 PM
12-24-2013, 05:28 PM
12-26-2013, 02:04 AM
12-26-2013, 08:54 AM
12-26-2013, 09:35 AM
996-nice contributions-thank u
I am not certain what what my conclusion is just yet on vitamin D3 supplementation but I for one appreciate the contrarian position conveyed here!
As I admit I am one who simply added this to my arsenal w/o much thought based on all the proposed litany of benefits.
Time to get my read on.
A-Minds HYPE-SLAYER! All posts & feedback are guaranteed to be unsolicited and legit
"The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge. Fools despise wisdom & instruction" Proverbs 1:7
12-26-2013, 09:38 AM
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