good OTC chill pill / relaxation?

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by mw1 View Post
    You have got to be out of your mind
    Besides dependency issues Kratom 8s some bad stuff. I doubt its goibg to be available much longer
    I can only speak from my experience. As a younger, more brazen, and idiotic person, I have had the displeasure of taking both (and much worse unfortunately), to the limit.

    Phenibut withdrawal was worse than anything I have experience with any other substance. No sleep for nearly 7 days. Panic attacks. Anxiety. Major BP issues.

    Kratom made me feel like **** for a week or two, but I'd take it any day or Phenibut.
    NSCA-CSCS and CPT - Doctor of Physical Therapy


  2. Quote Originally Posted by mw1 View Post
    Just cause phf is selling it doesn't make it ok- its dangerous stuff. I dont rec any taking it
    You will note in my first post I advocated that if one were going to use, to only use the whole leaf. Extracts are where things go VERY wrong and I absolutely don't recommend their use. I believe they are dangerous.

    I'd take whole leaf kratom over phenibut any day. That's my personal opinion after use of each.

    My general recommendation would be to not use either though.
    NSCA-CSCS and CPT - Doctor of Physical Therapy
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  3. No issues with phenibut here but picamilon works well as well.
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  4. Quote Originally Posted by mw1 View Post
    SNS Phenibut XT or Picamillon 150
    Phenibut and agmatine usually make me feel chill and laid back
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  5. Since kratom gets your dopamine going there are going to be some dependency issues in people who are predisposed to being an addict but much like pot the amount that you would need to take for it to become dangerous is off the charts. Extracts are the same way. But since your body builds up its tolerance levels so quickly if you do become a daily user you are only taking it to take it, you dont get the "high" from it. And as far as withdrawals from kratom much like cigs after the first couple of days its all in your head I have never seen or heard about anyone having opiate like withdrawal sickness from it.
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  6. give lights out a look...should help with relaxation and with the 5htp should put you in a calm and happy mood

    also no dependency
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  7. I gotta mention this again... Good quality kava, in the right dose, feels like alcohol without the mental impairment or hangover.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by jcc80 View Post
    I gotta mention this again... Good quality kava, in the right dose, feels like alcohol without the mental impairment or hangover.
    I do enjoy Kava, but you are spot on about the exact right strain and the right dose. It is difficult.
    NSCA-CSCS and CPT - Doctor of Physical Therapy

  9. Quote Originally Posted by McCrew530 View Post
    Since kratom gets your dopamine going there are going to be some dependency issues in people who are predisposed to being an addict but much like pot the amount that you would need to take for it to become dangerous is off the charts. Extracts are the same way. But since your body builds up its tolerance levels so quickly if you do become a daily user you are only taking it to take it, you dont get the "high" from it. And as far as withdrawals from kratom much like cigs after the first couple of days its all in your head I have never seen or heard about anyone having opiate like withdrawal sickness from it.
    You haven't looked into it very hard then. The ER visits from Kratom have risen dramatically with the method of treatment being the exact same as for opiate withdrawals.
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  10. MRM Relax-All is good, Phenibut is good although can be habit forming. I really like Relora, the new Nimbus line uses it in a couple of their formulas.
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  11. Quote Originally Posted by Spaniard View Post

    You haven't looked into it very hard then. The ER visits from Kratom have risen dramatically with the method of treatment being the exact same as for opiate withdrawals.
    Method of treatment yes because they both go after dopamine but the severity is much less. I'm not saying it is harmless because at the end if the day it is a drug and any drug has the risk of abuse but kratom can provide a relaxation element when needed with about the same negative effects as its cousin the coffee plant. PS sorry if there are spelling errors this is coming from my phone
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  12. Quote Originally Posted by haiz69 View Post
    I do enjoy Kava, but you are spot on about the exact right strain and the right dose. It is difficult.
    There is a Kava bar in town that I've wanted to hit.
    Might swing by this weekend.

  13. Quote Originally Posted by thegameoflife View Post
    There is a Kava bar in town that I've wanted to hit.
    Might swing by this weekend.
    Careful, the taste will put some hair on your nads!

  14. Quote Originally Posted by mw1 View Post
    You have got to be out of your mind
    Besides dependency issues Kratom 8s some bad stuff. I doubt its goibg to be available much longer
    No doubt. Kratom is very dangerous on both a dependency and health level. I have spent a lot of time in SE Asia where Kratom is used heavily. These guys are not looking so well and are easy to spot due teeth issues and discoloring of skin and eyes. May cause liver toxicity and blood sugar issues also.

    Kratom is a mu receptor drug and contains a morphine akaloid that is stronger than morphine. This is why opiate addicts use it and it is used to curb withdrawals during periods of cessation.

    Kratom is a bad recommendation, particularly if you have a propensity for addiction. Better off on the natural non synthetic prescribed opiates and save your teeth, liver and skin.

    i always thought it pretty sad these desperate opiate addicts in SE Asia had to resort to such a dirty substance because they were poor.

    -----
    Mitragynine, the major alkaloid identified from Kratom, has been reported as a partial opioid agonist producing similar effects to morphine. An interesting minor alkaloid of Kratom, 7-hydroxymitragynine, has been reported to be more potent than morphine. Both Kratom alkaloids are reported to activate supraspinal mu- and delta- opioid receptors, explaining their use by chronic narcotics users to ameliorate opioid withdrawal symptoms.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/18259963/

  15. I say go green
    The Swole Stoner

  16. Thanks to all for the advice and input. Much appreciated.

  17. I am curious if anyone complaining about withdrawal effects from Phenibut were taking larger than recommended doses. I spoke to a very knowledgeable doctor regarding phenibut and rebound hypertension at 500 mg to 1,500 mgs seems doubtful. Phenibut in the recommended dosage range should have very little impact on bp. My guess is someone having 7 days of withdrawal and severe rebound hypertension where taking some pretty hefty doses. I have read reports of people using as high as 12 grams at a single usage. The problem with phenibut again is that people with propensities to abuse drugs or alcohol should shy away from because those are the type that may start taking this daily at levels that could potentially result in withdrawal or rebound hypertension.

  18. Okay, a fantastic combo that I used last night was 4 tablespoons of a high quality Fiji kava powder extracted into water with coconut oil. And I took a half teaspoon of phenibut. Excellent. Could not be bothered by anything.

    I DO have addictive tendencies. I'm fortunate, though, that I don't get physical withdrawal symptoms from anything. Your mileage may vary.

  19. Diphenhydramine (active ingredient in Benadryl)

    Very cheap and works. Just get the knock-off brand stuff. Non-habit forming, and good to have on hand when you're sick.

    Can't remember if I've taken Phenibut, but I probably have. I tend to have an addictive personality so I'd be leery to try again.

  20. Picamillon works great for me : )

  21. Tried phenibut yesterday and it was very calming.
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  22. Quote Originally Posted by thegameoflife View Post
    Any recommendations on a good OTC supplement to help with relaxation?
    I like ALRI Comatose before bed it will knock you out

  23. Quote Originally Posted by McCrew530 View Post
    Tried phenibut yesterday and it was very calming.
    Where can you buy it anymore?,

  24. Quote Originally Posted by EatMoar View Post

    Where can you buy it anymore?,
    SNS sells it
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  25. Quote Originally Posted by 996ttelise View Post
    I am curious if anyone complaining about withdrawal effects from Phenibut were taking larger than recommended doses. I spoke to a very knowledgeable doctor regarding phenibut and rebound hypertension at 500 mg to 1,500 mgs seems doubtful. Phenibut in the recommended dosage range should have very little impact on bp. My guess is someone having 7 days of withdrawal and severe rebound hypertension where taking some pretty hefty doses. I have read reports of people using as high as 12 grams at a single usage. The problem with phenibut again is that people with propensities to abuse drugs or alcohol should shy away from because those are the type that may start taking this daily at levels that could potentially result in withdrawal or rebound hypertension.
    I have seen others with rebound hyptertenison for 1,000-1500mg doses.
    NSCA-CSCS and CPT - Doctor of Physical Therapy
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