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Holy Cow... Aegeline No More

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spaniard View Post
    This whole entire post is just completely ridiculous. Come on man. You're singling out their water supply when soooooo many other states operate the exact same way. No water filtration systems filter out all pharmaceuticals. They waste them into the toilet... seriously come on man. Where do you get your facts?
    what fact are you disputing bro? i said there are drugs in tap water, and you counter that by saying there are drugs in tap water?

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    Quote Originally Posted by thescience View Post
    what fact are you disputing bro? i said there are drugs in tap water, and you counter that by saying there are drugs in tap water?
    There are drugs in all tap water
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    Quote Originally Posted by thescience View Post
    yeah. as general advice, id recommend any supplement company that believes their product is safe to fight issues all the way to the burger. thats what lef did. fda had 55 charges brought up against them. bear in mind FDA has unlimited legal funds (taxpayer). in the end, it cost lef 50million i think but they beat off every single charge, and then the fda (ie taxpayers) had to pay it all back. i personally think dmaa was smeared; ask anyone and they'll tell you about the guy who died. but now its only about blood pressure:DMAA Cleared in Army Deaths, Still Poses Risks
    Whether DMAA, Aegeline, or any other ingredient is smeared or not does not make them legal to sell.

    You can think that DMAA is safe, and a great ingredient all you want and the fda does not give one single ****.

    An ingredient is legal to market as a supplement if:

    -It explicitly falls into one of the categories listed in the text of the legislation
    OR
    -It was marketed a dietary supplement or consumed in the food supply in the united states prior to 1994
    OR
    -The NDI process is undergone successfully.

    "Synthetic Aegeline" does not meet any of those requirements.

    What I don't understand is why USPLabs wouldn't have performed a safety study on a decent pool of people and submitted an NDI.
    The retail value of the inventory they're destroying in this most recent incident is $22 MILLION.
    They could have spent a few hundred grand, and probably averted this whole mess.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spaniard View Post
    There are drugs in all tap water
    well then you should support what i know about NH, not question the fact of it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Spaniard View Post
    They waste them into the toilet... seriously come on man. Where do you get your facts?
    and yeah, thats how controlled substances are disposed of in institutions. when a sleeve of optional morphine tablets expire, they dont pop them into the trash so that some opportunist can end up with them. you cant have social workers who handle the stuff for $10/hr stick them in a waste bucket and assure everyone they are disposed of. a nurse trainer oversees a ritual toilet flushing. its written into the protocall
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    Quote Originally Posted by thescience View Post
    yeah. as general advice, id recommend any supplement company that believes their product is safe to fight issues all the way to the burger. thats what lef did. fda had 55 charges brought up against them. bear in mind FDA has unlimited legal funds (taxpayer). in the end, it cost lef 50million i think but they beat off every single charge, and then the fda (ie taxpayers) had to pay it all back. i personally think dmaa was smeared; ask anyone and they'll tell you about the guy who died. but now its only about blood pressure:DMAA Cleared in Army Deaths, Still Poses Risks
    What about other 4 deaths and the 86 health related issues reported. Candidly, I have no issues with DMAA. I was teethed on the real stuff back in late 80s and remember when we could buy GHB on same isle as Hot Stuff and that crazy orange preworkout. DMA, aegeline, higenamine, and all stuff today is just knock off loop hole engineered trash buzzes compared compared to 80s and early to mid 90s. I actually think the stuff today is less clean designer type buzzes that are more dangerous or questionable now that good stuff has be outlawed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by De__eB View Post
    Whether DMAA, Aegeline, or any other ingredient is smeared or not does not make them legal to sell.

    You can think that DMAA is safe, and a great ingredient all you want and the fda does not give one single ****.

    An ingredient is legal to market as a supplement if:

    -It explicitly falls into one of the categories listed in the text of the legislation
    OR
    -It was marketed a dietary supplement or consumed in the food supply in the united states prior to 1994
    OR
    -The NDI process is undergone successfully.

    "Synthetic Aegeline" does not meet any of those requirements.

    What I don't understand is why USPLabs wouldn't have performed a safety study on a decent pool of people and submitted an NDI.
    The retail value of the inventory they're destroying in this most recent incident is $22 MILLION.
    They could have spent a few hundred grand, and probably averted this whole mess.
    Where did you get the 22 million figure from? Not disputing it just genuinely curious. I had no idea USP was that big to begin with!
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    Quote Originally Posted by 996ttelise View Post
    What about other 4 deaths and the 86 health related issues reported. Candidly, I have no issues with DMAA. I was teethed on the real stuff back in late 80s and remember when we could buy GHB on same isle as Hot Stuff and that crazy orange per workout. DMA, aegeline, higamine, and all stuff today is just knock off loop hole engineered trash buzzes compared compared to 80s and early to mid 90s. I actually think the stuff today is less clean designer type buzzes that are more dangerous or questionable now that good stuff has be outlawed.
    thats my point. those people didnt die because of dmaa, but everyone still thinks they did. see the article
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quadzilla99 View Post
    I prefer to make my conclusions first and then look at the evidence later, if at all
    Lol,

    Us forum folk love to solve crimes
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoforce View Post
    Where did you get the 22 million figure from? Not disputing it just genuinely curious. I had no idea USP was that big to begin with!
    FDA press release

    In addition to the recall of certain OxyElite Pro products, USPLabs assured FDA officials that it will destroy warehouse stocks of the supplement, with a retail value of about $22 million. FDA will oversee the destruction of the product.
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    Thats a lot of stock. The retail value is probably inflated to 'actual' retail price and not the prices you see on places such as NP.

    But its still a lot of money.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoforce View Post
    Where did you get the 22 million figure from? Not disputing it just genuinely curious. I had no idea USP was that big to begin with!
    Think of it this way.

    There are 7000 GNC locations.

    If each of them has 20 bottles of OEP in stock that is 140,000 bottles on the shelves in one supply chain at a retail price of $61.

    That's $8.5m retail of one SKU of the impacted products, on the shelves of one store, not counting warehoused stock.
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    De__eB I like you buddy, but I gotta know..did it hurt when you pulled those numbers out of your ass?
    phaggy opinions+certainty=douchebag status
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quadzilla99 View Post
    De__eB I like you buddy, but I gotta know..did it hurt when you pulled those numbers out of your ass?
    There's actually like 7300 GNC locations per their own corporate documents.

    The MSRP for OEP from cached GNC/USPLabs web pages and stores still selling it is $61.99

    And the # of bottles was just what I would guess I've seen on shelves at any given time.

    Did it hurt when I tried to provide a ballpark estimate of scope for someone who didn't realize how big some of the large supplement companies are or something?
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    Quote Originally Posted by thescience View Post
    thats my point. those people didnt die because of dmaa, but everyone still thinks they did. see the article
    My bad man, I read your post and seemed to reference soldier in the singular. Wasn't there some long distance runner lady that also died? The report seemed to indicated that no pose significant risk at low recommended doses, but did state the finding were inconclusive and perhaps needed additional research. You are right about it being as safe as anything else. My recollection is that Jacked initially came under fire by millitary when people started popping positive or false positives for meth.
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    Quote Originally Posted by De__eB View Post
    There's actually like 7300 GNC locations per their own corporate documents.

    The MSRP for OEP from cached GNC/USPLabs web pages and stores still selling it is $61.99

    And the # of bottles was just what I would guess I've seen on shelves at any given time.

    Did it hurt when I tried to provide a ballpark estimate of scope for someone who didn't realize how big some of the large supplement companies are or something?
    No I figured it was in the millions but trying to guess the exact amount is going pretty far into mental masturbation territory
    phaggy opinions+certainty=douchebag status
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    Quote Originally Posted by 996ttelise View Post
    My bad man, I read your post and seemed to reference soldier in the singular. Wasn't there some long distance runner lady that also died? The report seemed to indicated that no pose significant risk at low recommended doses, but did state the finding were inconclusive and perhaps needed additional research. You are right about it being as safe as anything else. My recollection is that Jacked initially came under fire by millitary when people started popping positive or false positives for meth.
    yeah, you never know what people are doing. especially dieters. i know women who take diet pills that give them the runs. they crap 4 times a day, but they stick with it because theyre losing weight (probably from diarrhea). others exceed recommended dosages on top of insanely restricted diets. people are neurotic about losing weight, so i wish companies would stand by their products, if they believed they were safe, so that we'd know for sure.
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    I should have named this thread Aegeline AND Tembamide No More. Oh well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quadzilla99 View Post
    I prefer to make my conclusions first and then look at the evidence later, if at all
    Sounds like the senate. Pelosi if I recall. Let's just get the bill passed. Then read it lol. But I do want this all sorted out ASAP and I want my COOP BACK! Well..... Our coop I guess lol.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kissdadookie View Post
    I should have named this thread Aegeline AND Tembamide No More. Oh well.


    hindsight right?
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    Quote Originally Posted by thescience View Post
    well then you should support what i know about NH, not question the fact of it. and yeah, thats how controlled substances are disposed of in institutions. when a sleeve of optional morphine tablets expire, they dont pop them into the trash so that some opportunist can end up with them. you cant have social workers who handle the stuff for $10/hr stick them in a waste bucket and assure everyone they are disposed of. a nurse trainer oversees a ritual toilet flushing. its written into the protocall
    My point is that you can't blame the septic system. Most municipal septic systems don't filter out pharmaceuticals. It doesn't matter tho arguing with you is like throwing darts at my face...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spaniard View Post
    My point is that you can't blame the septic system. Most municipal septic systems don't filter out pharmaceuticals. It doesn't matter tho arguing with you is like throwing darts at my face...
    sorry youre having such a hard time making an arguement, if thats what youre saying. i can only assume youre done trying to muster up unfounded contradictions relating to my posts and the thread, since youre breaking out the personal attacks about how painful it is to engage me. my point is we dont know what to blame yet, and environment has everything to do with a disease whether oep is in the vincinity or not; thats why there were people in hawaii who hadnt taken oep who nevertheless contracted non-viral hepatitus. thats why there's an investigation. ceptic systems, areas with poor hygeine and lots of ignorance easy contribute to rise in body toxicity and comprimised livers. if you think all ceptic systems and public drinking water are equal, id love to see the data on that. again, im not determining the cause here. the fact that there was a voluntary recall and the company said they "believe" there are counterfit versions of their stuff is probably reason enough for me to blame the product, if i had to assign blame at this point
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    Quote Originally Posted by kissdadookie View Post
    I should have named this thread Aegeline AND Tembamide No More. Oh well.
    I wouldn't be surprised if it was the higenamine. Don't all formulas use that ingredient? Oep, Alphamine, and enhanced. I know pes is stressing aegeline but they pulled u.s. Formulas without it. Even if it's from the same plant or extracted from it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Afi140 View Post
    I wouldn't be surprised if it was the higenamine. Don't all formulas use that ingredient? Oep, Alphamine, and enhanced. I know pes is stressing aegeline but they pulled u.s. Formulas without it. Even if it's from the same plant or extracted from it.
    Enhanced, all lots, have aegeline.

    There's the recall thread from PES that specifies which lots of alphamine have aegeline as an ingredient, including the US version.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimbuick View Post
    Enhanced, all lots, have aegeline. There's the recall thread from PES that specifies which lots of alphamine have aegeline as an ingredient, including the US version.
    From what kissadookie said some had tembamide instead. Idk. I just want a good batch of Alphamine by February when I start to cut. Not reformulated either! Lol.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Afi140 View Post
    From what kissadookie said some had tembamide instead. Idk. I just want a good batch of Alphamine by February when I start to cut. Not reformulated either! Lol.
    I emailed one of the reps about the particulars of the recall, and for clarification on what to do if I wanted to return them (even though I don't recall which e-tailer it was purchased from).


    Quote Originally Posted by PES
    Some lots of Alphamine have aegiline in it. All Enhanced contains aegiline.

    The recall is voluntary. We have had no reported issues with it. I am also unsure why Versa-1 wasn't recalled when all the OEP products were.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Afi140 View Post
    From what kissadookie said some had tembamide instead. Idk. I just want a good batch of Alphamine by February when I start to cut. Not reformulated either! Lol.
    Here you go, all the important info is in here.


    Alphamine and Enhanced Return
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