High prolactin

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    L-dopa + pyridoxal phosphate >>> dopamine + pyridoxal phosphate + CO2

    So for dopamine biosynthesis from L-dopa, pyridoxal phosphate is essential.
    Brah, it's been proven. A high quality L-Dopa product is superior for PRL control when compared to Dopa/B6. This isn't opinion or anecdotal evidence anymore. Same reason clinical applications tell you not to dose B6 with L-Dopa...

    I'm sure you're familiar with mr.cooper69 aka. Cyrus?

    Quote Originally Posted by Diesel0022 View Post
    Alright, I am going to quote Cy word for word from the text messages

    It started on here, he stated that he "preferred dopadex", when compared to L-Dopa/P5P together.

    And straight from the text messages "Using l-dopa with p5p is not optimal"


    I confirmed with him before I posted this to make sure it was ok
    You should not administer B6 with L-Dopa if you want L-Dopa to take on its full effects.

    L-Dopa converts to Dopamine. Dopamine cannot cross the blood brain barrier. If you arent increasing brain dopamine levels, how are you doing anything for hormone release?

    So, you want the conversion of L-Dopa to Dopamine to occur in the brain, NOT outside of the brain. When you combine B6 with L-Dopa it does in fact enhance this conversion, but it makes more of it happen OUTSIDE of the brain, not inside. So B6 makes L-Dopa less effective for bodybuilding purposes.

    Inhibition of l-Dopa-Induced Growth Hormone Stimulation by Pyridoxine and Chlorpromazine

    Abstract

    One gram of l-dopa was administered orally to 12 male control subjects and induced an increase of growth hormone (GH) secretion. The l-dopa-induced GH response was inhibited by an intravenous infusion of pyridoxine, but pyridoxine did not inhibit the GH response to hypoglycemia. Chlorpromazine also inhibited l-dopa-induced GH stimulation. Glucose concentrations were unaffected by l-dopa, chlorpromazine, and pyridoxine administration in these subjects. The mechanism of the suppressed l-dopa-induced GH response by pyridoxine appears to be mediated by peripheral acceleration of the conversion of l-dopa to dopamine, while that of chlorpromazine appears to be mediated through hypothalamic centers. Pyridoxine and chlorpromazine should be added to the list of other factors affecting the response to L-dopa-induced GH stimulation.




    Failure of vitamin B6 to reverse the l-dopa effect in patients on a dopa decarboxylase inhibitor

    Abstract

    Seven patients with Parkinsonism previously on l-dopa were placed on a regimen of l-dopa and alpha methyl dopa hydrazine (a dopa decarboxylase inhibitor). Two of these patients had previously shown marked clinical deterioration of the l-dopa improvement when given pyridoxine. None of the seven patients receiving alpha methyl dopa hydrazine demonstrated any change in their condition when given pyridoxine. The failure of vitamin B6 to reverse the clinical effect of l-dopa in patients receiving both l-dopa and a peripheral dopa decarboxylase inhibitor suggests that reversal of the l-dopa effect induced by vitamin B6 is due to increasing the activity of the enzyme dopa decarboxylase outside the central nervous system.




    ON THE MECHANISM OF THE NULLIFICATION OF CNS EFFECTS OF l-DOPA BY PYRIDOXINE IN PARKINSONIAN PATIENTS


    Abstract

    Administration of either Levodopa (l-DOPA) or pyridoxine increased the concentration of dopamine in the basal ganglia of rats. However, administration of pyridoxine to rats pretreated with l-DOPA for several days resulted in a reversal of the l-DOPA-induced elevation of dopamine. Pretreatment of rats with Ro 4-4602 (an inhibitor of peripheral aromatic amino acid decarboxylases) enhanced the l-DOPA-induced rise in the CNS level of dopamine. This effect was also reduced substantially after the administration of pyridoxine. We interpret these results to indicate that the antagonistic effect of pyridoxine on the beneficial effects of l-DOPA in the CNS is centrally mediated as a result of decreased formation of dopamine.





    Now you're asking: If P5P crosses blood brain barrier and so does L-Dopa shouldn't it enhance dopamine formation on both sides?



    Yes, but, it also increases Dopamine conversion OUTSIDE the BBB by a much larger amount (more blood outside the brain than inside) so the net effect is negative. That's why you want an L-Dopa source that includes a decarboxylase inhibitor. Bulk 1-Carboxy from USP has that, and is a much more concentrated source of L-Dopa than just straight Mucuna. Decarboxylase inhibitors prevent excess conversion within the body.
    Now for the complications. (Aren't there always complications
    in life?) The final reaction to the neurotransmitter in both the
    case of dopamine and serotonin, is decarboxylation, and the same
    enzyme (the aromatic L-amino acid decarboxylase) is involved in
    both conversions. This decarboxylase enzyme is present in the
    liver, and it acts in the case of L-DOPA to convert the compound
    to dopamine before it can make it into the brain (and if this
    happens, the L-DOPA is wasted). The decarboxylase enzyme uses B6
    as a cofactor for this reaction, and for this reason a
    Parkinson's disease patient taking L-DOPA cannot take more than
    the RDA of B6, because doing so would act to neutralize
    oral L-DOPA too quickly. These days, almost all Parkinson's
    patients on L-DOPA take the drug in a combination with an
    artificial decarboxylase inhibitor, called Carbidopa (the
    combination is called Sinemet). But even with Carbidopa,
    Parkinson's patients are advised not to exceed a daily dose of B6
    of 25 mg, since more will overwhelm the Carbidopa effect, and
    cause pharmacologic L-DOPA to be destroyed in the liver before it
    can get into the brain.
    "I believe that when the body is strong, the mind thinks strong thoughts." - Henry Rollins
    Team En Vitro


  2. If you're quoting mr.cooper, then I can too

    Cooper states [How much L-Dopa for prolactin control]

    "Have you looked at the dose of l-dopa in the product? It is not the primary modality (Vitex is the major player here, which has clinical use in controlling prolactin at the suggested dose). L-dopa and p5p are in the product to ensure that the user is not deficient in major substrates for dopamine synthesis, as deficiency in dopamine can cause dysregulation of prolactin. Side effects from peripheral decarboxylation at the dose of l-dopa used should be non-existent, and no, you will not get full-on dopamine synthesis outside of the CNS with both substrates being totally consumed. There is a study on this dosing pattern, and it is merely a percentage that undergoes peripheral decarboxylation (again, a non-issue at this dose of l-dopa, especially with Vitex being present in the formula).

    Also, the testboosting/GH boosting effects of mucuna are not isolated to l-dopa by any means. In fact, l-dopa vs mucuna studies show pretty different results in terms of hormones in subjects. Hence the 50% and not 99% extract, as other useful constituents are present"
    Serious Nutrition Solutions Representative
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    •   
       


  3. The cool thing about my quote from him? Post-SNS repping

    But, if your moral compass is that ****ed up to push an inferior product to meet post quota, than by all means, as you were.

    brb studies dont mean **** on anabolic minds...
    "I believe that when the body is strong, the mind thinks strong thoughts." - Henry Rollins
    Team En Vitro

  4. Also read mr.coopers rebuttals here:

    Inhibit-P SNS
    Serious Nutrition Solutions Representative
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  5. If you feel Inhibit P is better for you then buy
    If you feel straight L-dopa is better then buy that.............

    Serious Nutrition Solution ~~

    mw at seriousnutritionsolutions dot com
    mike at competitiveedgelabs dot com

    •   
       


  6. Again, he was with SNS at the time.

    Have you looked into working for axis labs?
    "I believe that when the body is strong, the mind thinks strong thoughts." - Henry Rollins
    Team En Vitro

  7. Quote Originally Posted by Diesel0022 View Post
    Again, he was with SNS at the time.

    Have you looked into working for axis labs?
    And now he is with PES so the same logic could apply to the Dopadex

    Serious Nutrition Solution ~~

    mw at seriousnutritionsolutions dot com
    mike at competitiveedgelabs dot com


  8. Quote Originally Posted by Diesel0022 View Post
    Again, he was with SNS at the time.

    Have you looked into working for axis labs?
    What is it with people and turning this into an insult contest simply because I rebutted your points using the same source.
    Serious Nutrition Solutions Representative
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  9. Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post

    What is it with people and turning this into an insult contest simply because I rebutted your points using the same source.
    People don't like to have real debates. They think they do but they really don't.
    Use Code Montego15 for 15% off at milehighkratom.com

  10. Quote Originally Posted by mw1 View Post
    And now he is with PES so the same logic could apply to the Dopadex
    Fair point, so lets negate that source as it tends to sway. We'll stick to studies and what not

    Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    What is it with people and turning this into an insult contest simply because I rebutted your points using the same source.
    I recall posting studies and clinical data, I have yet to see the same from you
    "I believe that when the body is strong, the mind thinks strong thoughts." - Henry Rollins
    Team En Vitro

  11. Quote Originally Posted by Diesel0022 View Post
    Fair point, so lets negate that source as it tends to sway. We'll stick to studies and what not
    As an aside, I think you're sig is meant to say Team En Vivo? Or is that a new crew?
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  12. I was just havin some fun picking on cyrus and them
    "I believe that when the body is strong, the mind thinks strong thoughts." - Henry Rollins
    Team En Vitro

  13. Quote Originally Posted by Diesel0022 View Post
    Again, he was with SNS at the time.

    Have you looked into working for axis labs?
    So are you saying nothing Cyrus says about a product the current company he reps for holds any water?

    Was he lying?

    Should I disregard all his posts about PES products?
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  14. Quote Originally Posted by warbird01 View Post
    So are you saying nothing Cyrus says about a product the current company he reps for holds any water?

    Was he lying?

    Should I disregard all his posts about PES products?
    I'd be wrong to say either way.
    "I believe that when the body is strong, the mind thinks strong thoughts." - Henry Rollins
    Team En Vitro

  15. Quote Originally Posted by Diesel0022 View Post
    I was just havin some fun picking on cyrus and them
    Oh, lol.
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  16. Quote Originally Posted by Diesel0022 View Post
    brb studies dont mean **** on anabolic minds...
    Studies showing the effects of vitex+b6+l-dopa effects on prolactin? I haven't seen any?

  17. Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    You can ship L-dopa for as little as $12.95 from Nutraplanet
    I don't think I'm going to import am illegal product in my country :/

  18. Hey there.

    Dissociation of growth hormone and prolactin response to levodopa during pyridoxine administration.

    AuthorsDelitala G, et al. Show all Journal
    Biomedicine. 1977 Jul;27(6):219-22.

    Affiliation
    Abstract
    500 mg of levodopa was administered orally to 8 normal subjects and induced an increase of growth hormone (GH) and a decrease of prolactin (PRL) secretion. The levodopa-induced GH release was inhibited by an intravenous infusion of pyridoxine; on the contrary, the PRL response to levodopa was enhanced by pyridoxine infusion. This dissociation of GH and PRL responses to levodopa during pyridoxine infusion appears to be mediated by peripheral acceleration of the conversion of levodopa to dopamine. Since dopamine does not penetrate the blood-brain barrier, the enhanced PRL decrease observed during pyridoxine infusion might be explained only on the basis of a mechanism of action exerted by dopamine on extra blood-brain barrier sites.
    L-Dopa + B6 = Less GH increase
    L-Dopa + B6 = Greater Prolactin decrease.

    Tell me again why dopadex would be better for Prolactin reduction?
    SNS Representative - [email protected] .com

  19. Quote Originally Posted by Qonix View Post

    I don't think I'm going to import am illegal product in my country :/
    Oh its illegal where you are? Hmm. Ill see what I can suggest as an alternative
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  20. Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    Oh its illegal where you are? Hmm. Ill see what I can suggest as an alternative
    Yea. I could order it from amazon uk but idk if there would be any risk in that

  21. Quote Originally Posted by Qonix View Post
    Yea. I could order it from amazon uk but idk if there would be any risk in that
    There are at least 2 UK merchants selling L-DOPA products that are 98% or 99% Mucuna extract.

    Why is it so hard for you to type in Google "buy dopadex uk" and look at first few results to find an UK seller?

  22. Quote Originally Posted by Qonix View Post
    Yea. I could order it from amazon uk but idk if there would be any risk in that
    If its illegal, then your customs may seize it.
    Serious Nutrition Solutions Representative
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  23. Just buy b6 and vitex if l-dopa is banned Im your country.

    Simple.

  24. Interesting thread.
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  25. Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    Just buy b6 and vitex if l-dopa is banned Im your country.

    Simple.
    What's vitex
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