COOP-thoughts on TMG?

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    Betaine For Muscle Growth And Fat Loss From Ergo Log

    Bodybuilders who take a daily 2.5 g betaine for six weeks will improve their body composition. Sports scientists from Coastal Carolina University draw this conclusion in the Journal of the International Society of Sports Nutrition. But how betaine stimulates muscle build-up and fat breakdown at the same time remains a mystery. Bodybuilders who take a daily 2.5 g betaine for six weeks will improve their body composition. Sports scientists from Coastal Carolina University draw this conclusion in the Journal of the International Society of Sports Nutrition.

    But how betaine stimulates muscle build-up and fat breakdown at the same time remains a mystery. The reason most nutritional scientists are interested in betaine has to do with the role it plays in converting the potentially dangerous amino acid homocysteine [structural formula shown here] into a harmless compound. The figure below shows this process.

    Bodybuilders who take a daily 2.5 g betaine for six weeks will improve their body composition. Sports scientists from Coastal Carolina University draw this conclusion in the Journal of the International Society of Sports Nutrition. But how betaine stimulates muscle build-up and fat breakdown at the same time remains a mystery.

    Homocysteine is further converted into homocysteine thiolactone [formula shown here], which inhibits the synthesis of muscle proteins, probably mainly by interfering with the functioning of the insulin receptor. [[J Mol Endocrinol. 2005 Feb;34(1):119-26.]

    Bodybuilders eat large amounts of animal protein, which means they ingest large amounts of methionine. Maybe, the researchers reasoned, that's what causes them produce so much homocysteine thiolactone that betaine supplementation speeds up their muscle growth.

    The researchers tested their hypothesis by doing an experiment with two dozen experienced recreational bodybuilders – men aged between 18 and 35. All of the men followed the same intensive training schedule for six weeks. Half of them were given a placebo; the other half took 2.5 g betaine every day. At the end of the six weeks the bodybuilders who had taken betaine had lost a couple of percent fat mass. On top of that, the betaine supplementation also resulted in a significant increase in lean body mass. The scans that the researchers did showed that the bodybuilders in the betaine group had also gained more muscle in their arms.

    The amount of homocysteine thiolactone [HCTL] was lower in the betaine users in week 2, week 4 and week 6 of the study in comparison to the amount they had at the start of the study [BL]. The researchers observed no significant effects of betaine on maximal strength or power.

    Despite the effects they observed on the concentration of homocysteine thiolactone, the researchers don't think they have uncovered the mechanism through which betaine improves muscle mass and breaks down fat. At the start of the experiment the participants’ concentration of homocysteine thiolactone was 0.028 nanomoles per millilitre. That's low. The range is 0.011 to 0.473 nanomoles per millilitre. "Based on the small differences in HCTL changes, betaine supplementation may have impacted body composition via other mechanisms", the researchers write.

    One possibility the researchers suggest is that betaine works as a natural synthol. "Because betaine is a powerful osmolyte, the increases in lean mass may have been due to cellular swelling without an appreciable increase in myofibril protein accretion." The research was financed by DuPont, a manufacturer of betaine. A DuPont Nutrition & Health employee participated in the study. Source: J Int Soc Sports Nutr. 2013 Aug 22;10(1):39. Soruce: http://www.ergo-log.com/betaine-give...-less-fat.html
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    There's a good amount of research out on Betaine/TMG. Definitely good stuff and backed by studies which is always nice.

    Not coop but throwing my 2 cents in.
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    OP~You answered your question in your post ha

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    What was the question? Lol
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    Anyone recall if it was TMG that LG used to put in their lipotropic protein...? I think i recall there being betaine listed and then saying it was good for fat loss...
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    Quote Originally Posted by schizm View Post
    Anyone recall if it was TMG that LG used to put in their lipotropic protein...? I think i recall there being betaine listed and then saying it was good for fat loss...
    Yea im pretty sure it was betaine and maybe skme green tea polyphenols i think? Not completely sure in the last part.
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    Quote Originally Posted by schizm View Post
    Anyone recall if it was TMG that LG used to put in their lipotropic protein...? I think i recall there being betaine listed and then saying it was good for fat loss...
    It was betaine I remember that stuff. Bc I always used to think Butane as I guzzled it down .... Bc that's the type of shti I remember. Nothing useful.
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    he has posted on TMG before in several post and is in favor for its use. One of the few supplements that have some decent human data supporting it
    "The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance." - Socrates
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    TMG is absolutely legit. Been a fan even before the recent studies. It will improve strength, LBM, and health. And it is dirt cheap. Use it
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    The above is my own opinion and does not reflect the opinion of PES
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    TMG is absolutely legit. Been a fan even before the recent studies. It will improve strength, LBM, and health. And it is dirt cheap. Use it
    brb updating cart
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    Awesome place to replug that SNS will be releasing some in the near future
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    Awesome place to replug that SNS will be releasing some in the near future
    Very nice.

    I guess I should plug it's in Purus Condense at the amounts shown in the studies. Plus it's tasty
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    TMG is absolutely legit. Been a fan even before the recent studies. It will improve strength, LBM, and health. And it is dirt cheap. Use it
    So predictable lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grambo View Post

    Very nice.

    I guess I should plug it's in Purus Condense at the amounts shown in the studies. Plus it's tasty
    i love condense. Definitely a top product
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post

    i love condense. Definitely a top product
    Is it safe to use with ephedrine (bc of the nitrates)? Could I use condense as my 200mg C?
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    Quote Originally Posted by chedapalooza View Post
    Is it safe to use with ephedrine (bc of the nitrates)? Could I use condense as my 200mg C?
    Yes. The nitrates make it easier on your heart if anything
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    The above is my own opinion and does not reflect the opinion of PES
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    TMG is absolutely legit. Been a fan even before the recent studies. It will improve strength, LBM, and health. And it is dirt cheap. Use it
    Do you recommend a certain source, is betaine hcl good
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    Quote Originally Posted by aceroni View Post
    Do you recommend a certain source, is betaine hcl good
    Betaine anhydrous is the compound everyone is talking about. Do not go and take 2.5g of hcl
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    Awesome place to replug that SNS will be releasing some in the near future
    Stop talking about it until it is out.

    Love TMG. It is pretty cheap too so no reason to not give it a shot. I've been a big fan since giving it a go at 2.5g after talking to the TMG genius of the board (Zir) about it last year.
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    Quote Originally Posted by chedapalooza View Post
    Is it safe to use with ephedrine (bc of the nitrates)? Could I use condense as my 200mg C?
    Just to back it up you definitely can. I did it yesterday!
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    TMG is absolutely legit. Been a fan even before the recent studies. It will improve strength, LBM, and health. And it is dirt cheap. Use it
    Yup, just order a bottle of tmg, 1g/cap 100caps for cheap
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grambo View Post

    Very nice.

    I guess I should plug it's in Purus Condense at the amounts shown in the studies. Plus it's tasty
    Condense Is the best BEST tasting pre w/o on the market, though cotton candy focus xt is neck n neck for taste with it.
    No cotton candy flav condense.
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    Next purchase will be Condense & Live Long's 100g bulk TMG for non workout days...until SNS releases our TMG...boom! Ballin!
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    Quote Originally Posted by chedapalooza View Post

    Is it safe to use with ephedrine (bc of the nitrates)? Could I use condense as my 200mg C?
    I tossed in 25mg of 1,3 dim with a sample of condense a while back, good times...
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    Yup, just order a bottle of tmg, 1g/cap 100caps for cheap
    From?
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post

    From?
    Now foods, some random health store.
    Also got a bottle of cal/mag chelate.
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    Quote Originally Posted by aceroni View Post
    Do you recommend a certain source, is betaine hcl good
    Use anhydrous
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Use anhydrous
    do you use a certain brand coop?
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    Quote Originally Posted by bolt10 View Post

    Stop talking about it until it is out.

    Love TMG. It is pretty cheap too so no reason to not give it a shot. I've been a big fan since giving it a go at 2.5g after talking to the TMG genius of the board (Zir) about it last year.
    Lol but its so exciting!!
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    How long do you typically use tmg for? The studies were six week trials, correct? Would there be any benefit or negatives to running it longer?
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    Should this be taken pre or post workout?
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Engineer View Post
    Should this be taken pre or post workout?
    Pre workout
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    Awesome place to replug that SNS will be releasing some in the near future
    wonderful place to plug the fact I love our version in Max Pump, that we have had out for awhile now

    great pricing at Nutra too

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    Quote Originally Posted by aceroni View Post
    How long do you typically use tmg for? The studies were six week trials, correct? Would there be any benefit or negatives to running it longer?
    nothing definitive to my knowledge, seems to work better the longer you use it tho (to a point of course)

    I would say 12-16 weeks cycles, then 4-6 week break
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Engineer View Post
    Should this be taken pre or post workout?
    I split my doses up. You could try a single dose of 2-3 grams but may cause some GI distress.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kbayne View Post
    I split my doses up. You could try a single dose of 2-3 grams but may cause some GI distress.
    So 1.5 pre with ArA and then 1.5 post/morning?
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Engineer View Post
    So 1.5 pre with ArA and then 1.5 post/morning?
    Ya looks good. I go 1.25 pre and post.
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    I used 3g preworkout for about two weeks and did not experience any GI issues

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    Quote Originally Posted by snagencyV2.0 View Post
    wonderful place to plug the fact I love our version in Max Pump, that we have had out for awhile now

    great pricing at Nutra too

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    Do you guys license betaine nitrate from Thermolife? Looks like the only product out there with betaine nitrate, but I try to only buy to buy nitrate products that aren't patented (Iforce potassium nitrate) or from brands who pay their licensing fees.
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    Quote Originally Posted by De__eB View Post
    Do you guys license betaine nitrate from Thermolife? Looks like the only product out there with betaine nitrate, but I try to only buy to buy nitrate products that aren't patented (Iforce potassium nitrate) or from brands who pay their licensing fees.
    that's an issue that I really do not delve into, as there is litigation in process over some disputed factors

    to answer your question tho, no we license nothing from TL
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