Craze, ECA, DMAA.

[DarthGainer]

I know all the press and so on with Craze but simple question for those guys with more knowledge than myself. Is taking Craze any more dangerous than taking ECA or DMAA . Serious question not trolling.

 

[DJBeanPole]

I've taken all three... and I'd say...

 

[andrew732]

craze is fine.... lots of haters in industry

 

[lronFist]

craze is fine.... lots of haters in industry

^Hiring reps like these, who needs enemies?

 

[Oscar]

While I don't particularly like craze I haven't heard of any real adverse effects

 

[rhino67jg]

I've been using craze from its release, and have had absolutely no side effects from it. I usually stack it with hemavol, but just recently began to stack it with high volume. I'm in no way a rep or work for driven sports. I just use a good solid product which works well for me.

 

[Fitnessvol]

Craze

I'm by no means a ds rep but I love craze and was crushed when bb.com stopped selling it. I may bury my last can and poor out a lil protein when I finish it. Craze was my ish

 

[smoker145]

craze is fine.... lots of haters in industry

Lol yea it's all a witch hunt. Matt Cahill is a family man and a good bro after all. He's innocent as innocent can be.........

 

[DarthGainer]

Thanks guys.
Lets not turn this into a Matt Cahill thread though please. I just really want to know if its a dangerous product even if used responsibly. I never had a problem with ECA or DMAA but good lord the crash from DMAA was unreal. I never get a crash with craze.

 

[andrew732]

Lol yea it's all a witch hunt. Matt Cahill is a family man and a good bro after all. He's innocent as innocent can be.........

no one is saying the dude is sly free but the man accusing him is notorious for this non sense. When people need rehab for this stuff or getting back horrible results from ct scans is the day you know that craze is truly harmful. Just like dmaa, it is not that big of an issue if consumed properly.

 

[smoker145]

no one is saying the dude is sly free but the man accusing him is notorious for this non sense. When people need rehab for this stuff or getting back horrible results from ct scans is the day you know that craze is truly harmful. Just like dmaa, it is not that big of an issue if consumed properly.

Lmao, so a professional athlete failing a drug screening and in a result can't compete or is suspended is not a big deal? It's also highly illegal to put any ingredient in a product that is not stated on the label, you know, like the methamphetamine analog Cahill used.
And what vandetta does dr elsohly have with ds again? He has already stated that he will back his findings in a court of law. Seems odd that he would risk destroying his reputation and possibly going to prison for nothing.
But keep on supporting Cahill, you know, the man who has already gone to jail in the past for killing one of his customers.

 

[Geoforce]

I can't see how people could still be backing Cahill up at this point and admittedly that is after I'd "forgiven" him for past mistakes.

Bottom line (like with most of our supps) the long term safety of many ingredients is a guessing game at best. We know this going in. People are adults and can make their own decisions, but this guy is finally done with his products.

 

[lronFist]

no one is saying the dude is sly free but the man accusing him is notorious for this non sense. When people need rehab for this stuff or getting back horrible results from ct scans is the day you know that craze is truly harmful. Just like dmaa, it is not that big of an issue if consumed properly.

^Does this guy still work for PES?

If so, I am seriously disappoint.

 

[pyrobatt]

Lmao, so a professional athlete failing a drug screening and in a result can't compete or is suspended is not a big deal? It's also highly illegal to put any ingredient in a product that is not stated on the label, you know, like the methamphetamine analog Cahill used.
And what vandetta does dr elsohly have with ds again? He has already stated that he will back his findings in a court of law. Seems odd that he would risk destroying his reputation and possibly going to prison for nothing.
But keep on supporting Cahill, you know, the man who has already gone to jail in the past for killing one of his customers.

Oh dear. Okay I see your point but please see mine. I will spare you the links to what im about to tell you and condense the info.

Are you aware that roughly 80%of college and 90% of pro athletes are taking steroids,epo,growth hormone,beta blockers,ect.. They also take drugs to fake the test. For instance you can get rid of steroid metabolites and come in at the approved test range and still use steroids.

My point? The governing body of the sports has a drug ban list. Anything that is not on that list is fair game. Pure stupidity to take a precursor to amphetamine without making sure its not on the ban list. Yes...metabolites of amphetamine are on the ban list. For mentioned person should have taken their career more seriously.

 

[lronFist]

My point? The governing body of the sports has a drug ban list. Anything that is not on that list is fair game. Pure stupidity to take a precursor to amphetamine without making sure its not on the ban list. Yes...metabolites of amphetamine are on the ban list. For mentioned person should have taken their career more seriously.

Your point is nonsensical because the amphetamine-like compound wasn't on the label.

 

[pyrobatt]

Your point is nonsensical because the amphetamine-like compound wasn't on the label.

I believe it was the designer stimulant on the label. If it was not then I apologize but I do wonder why you would risk your career with a new preworkout. Atleast wait a couple months before trying it to see what others say about it. Also in alot of governing bodys too high a caffeine content can disqualify you too.

 

[lronFist]

I believe it was the designer stimulant on the label. If it was not then I apologize but I do wonder why you would risk your career with a new preworkout. Atleast wait a couple months before trying it to see what others say about it. Also in alot of governing bodys too high a caffeine content can disqualify you too.

I agree with you in principle, although the compound-in-question was definitely not on the label. If it was, Cahill would have been locked up years ago.

 

[laneanders]

You wouldn't get the same kind of effects from Craze as ECA or DMAA. The most energy I've ever gotten from a supplement was Dexaprine + Ephedrine, as for Craze I didn't get the euphoric effects a lot of people claim to have had from it. Mainly I just got the tunnel vision aspect.

 

[Quadzilla99]

While I don't particularly like craze I haven't heard of any real adverse effects

A ton of people started threads on multiple forums because they had adverse effects

 

[smoker145]

A ton of people started threads on multiple forums because they had adverse effects

QFT

 

[DarthGainer]

I was so in denial when I made this thread, I think it was addictive no matter what others will say. I was making excuses just to use it. took it and 5 hours passed like it was 20 minutes. Something I noticed when I used this everyday was I got no doms at all?

 

[996ttelise]

Love reading this stuff. Haha, there is nothing wrong with Craze. Some of you guys buying 10 tubs of it at a time and paying a $ 150.00 a tub for it is not an indication of anything. Besides, Tardive dyskinesia or Dystonia is not a big deal since those that have it don't really notice it and only others around them do.

 

[jbryand101b]

Lmao, so a professional athlete failing a drug screening and in a result can't compete or is suspended is not a big deal?

That same athlete Is and will continue to use performance enhancing drugs, only reason he or she got busted was cause they didn't know they were using something like that when tested.

If you believe pro athletes aren't using some form of illegal ped, well, I got some ocean front property in Nevada right next door to the easter bunny an Santa Claus ill sell you.

 

[jbryand101b]

Craze doesn't have nothing on crystal meth.

Don't get your hopes up, or panties in a bunch.

Just stick with focus xt an condense

 

[bdcc]

I don't understand how anyone can make an educated statement that all professional athletes are using some form of PEDs.

Sure, there is prevalent use in some sports but out of interest how many cricket teams do you know and how confident are you that all of them are taking PEDs?

 

[996ttelise]

Thanks guys.Lets not turn this into a Matt Cahill thread though please. I just really want to know if its a dangerous product even if used responsibly. I never had a problem with ECA or DMAA but good lord the crash from DMAA was unreal. I never get a crash with craze.

I have read studies that says Heroin and IV opiates are not dangerous if used responsibly.

-----

A popular sports supplement sold as a workout booster to help users “train beyond” their limits contains a banned substance derived from methamphetamine, according to tests conducted by researchers from Harvard Medical School and elsewhere and published Monday in the journal Drug Testing and Analysis.

Whether the product, a powder called Craze, poses any health risks remains unknown because it has never been tested in rigorous studies. But the finding adds to growing concerns about workout supplements after another supplement, OxyELITE Pro, was linked last week to 24 cases of liver failure in Hawaii and one death.

Two athletes who used Craze last year were banned from international competitions after failing World Anti-Doping Agency drug tests. That prompted the Harvard researchers to purchase Craze from a GNC store and two websites, and their testing found that the products contained 21 to 35 milligrams per serving of a stimulant called N,alpha-diethylphenylethylamine, or N,alpha-DEPEA.

Craze workout booster contains banned stimulant, Harvard study finds - Metro - The Boston Globe

 

[Oscar]

As a recovered opiate addict I've gotta say Iv opiates cannot be used responsibly

 

[996ttelise]

As a recovered opiate addict I've gotta say Iv opiates cannot be used responsibly

I agree. I have just read articles saying the APAP is more harmful to the body than the synthetic opiates with which it is combined. The naturals are supposed to be even cleaner so to speak. The primary health risk is infection at IV site.

That is kind of my point though. Controlled substances may not necessarily be physically harmful, but still pose great risks or dangers so I think the wrong questions are being asked.

 

[jbryand101b]

I don't understand how anyone can make an educated statement that all professional athletes are using some form of PEDs.

Sure, there is prevalent use in some sports but out of interest how many cricket teams do you know and how confident are you that all of them are taking PEDs?

Cricket. He's funny. Wonder how many stadiums here in the us are getting filled with cricket games.

Ny bad, when I think of pro sports, cricket is not it.

Taking my words too seriously. Knew I should of edited it, cause some genius was going to hang on every word.

 

[bdcc]

Jesse Ryder is a cricketer hence me using it as the example.

 

[jbryand101b]

Jesse Ryder is a cricketer hence me using it as the example.

Cricketer, hence why I've never heard of him.

 

[bdcc]

Lmao, so a professional athlete failing a drug screening and in a result can't compete or is suspended is not a big deal? It's also highly illegal to put any ingredient in a product that is not stated on the label, you know, like the methamphetamine analog Cahill used.
And what vandetta does dr elsohly have with ds again? He has already stated that he will back his findings in a court of law. Seems odd that he would risk destroying his reputation and possibly going to prison for nothing.
But keep on supporting Cahill, you know, the man who has already gone to jail in the past for killing one of his customers.

That same athlete Is and will continue to use performance enhancing drugs, only reason he or she got busted was cause they didn't know they were using something like that when tested.

If you believe pro athletes aren't using some form of illegal ped, well, I got some ocean front property in Nevada right next door to the easter bunny an Santa Claus ill sell you.

I don't understand how anyone can make an educated statement that all professional athletes are using some form of PEDs.

Sure, there is prevalent use in some sports but out of interest how many cricket teams do you know and how confident are you that all of them are taking PEDs?

Jesse Ryder is one of a few who has tested positive for said ingredient and received a suspension.

You said all pros take drugs. I pointed out it is less likely for him to do so as cricket is not a sport which has as high a need for it as physically dominated sports such as NFL players.

You imply I am being smart and trying to catch you out.

I am simply talking about one of the big cases that has been in the media. If you hadn't heard of him it makes more sense not to comment than make a blanket statement that all pros are using PEDs. In cricket, it is unlikely.

 

[smoker145]

Cricket. He's funny. Wonder how many stadiums here in the us are getting filled with cricket games.

Ny bad, when I think of pro sports, cricket is not it.

Taking my words too seriously. Knew I should of edited it, cause some genius was going to hang on every word.

USA isn't the only country with sports. Cricket is pretty popular in other countries around the world. Just because it's not at all popular in the USA, doesn't mean it's not popular or loved by other nations.
Bottom line is it's a big deal that he was suspended because of detonate.

 

[Oscar]

I'm an american with no knowledge of cricket but even I know that its the second most popular sport in the world

 

[jbryand101b]

Sorry, when I think of professional athletes, I don't think of cricket. My bad.

If there is an elite level, I'm sure there are players who are using performance enhancing drugs, and its prob in the 90% still.

 

[smoker145]

Sorry, when I think of professional athletes, I don't think of cricket. My bad.

If there is an elite level, I'm sure there are players who are using performance enhancing drugs, and its prob in the 90% still.

Where are you getting this figure? 90%? There's no question that in every sport there are bound to be rule breakers, but to make a statement claiming 90% of professional athletes cheat.... I hope you have some data to back your claim

 

[rob112]

I'll bet the best Bocce Ball players could use Craze no problem. I'll go ahead and say that and horse shoes are the only safe sports from Craze. Outside of that your jimmies will be rustled.

 

[smoker145]

I'll bet the best Bocce Ball players could use Craze no problem. I'll go ahead and say that and horse shoes are the only safe sports from Craze. Outside of that your jimmies will be rustled.

Lol bro. Crochet might be fine too

 

[rob112]

Lol bro. Crochet might be fine too

You know most race horses are on PEDs?

 

[smoker145]

You know most race horses are on PEDs?

Jockeys take the opposite of steroids. It's all about Being small in that sport

 

[jbryand101b]

Where are you getting this figure? 90%? There's no question that in every sport there are bound to be rule breakers, but to make a statement claiming 90% of professional athletes cheat.... I hope you have some data to back your claim

"1995 poll of 198 sprinters, swimmers, powerlifters and other assorted athletes, most of them U.S. Olympians or aspiring Olympians: You are offered a banned performance-enhancing substance, with two guarantees: 1) You will not be caught. 2) You will win. Would you take the substance?

One hundred and ninety-five athletes said yes; three said no.

Scenario II: You are offered a banned performance-enhancing substance that comes with two guarantees: 1) You will not be caught. 2) You will win every competition you enter for the next five years, and then you will die from the side effects of the substance. Would you take it?

More than half the athletes said yes."

AWARE THAT DRUG TESTING IS A SHAM, ATHLETES SEEM TO RELY MORE THAN EVER ON BANNED PERFORMANCE ENHANCERS
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1009868/index.htm

and that's from 95. with all the advancements in performance enhancing drugs readily available now, well, goes without saying.

 

[jbryand101b]

Jockeys take the opposite of steroids. It's all about Being small in that sport

performance enhancing drugs are more than steroids. and yes, even jockeys have been caught using ped's.

 

[smoker145]

"1995 poll of 198 sprinters, swimmers, powerlifters and other assorted athletes, most of them U.S. Olympians or aspiring Olympians: You are offered a banned performance-enhancing substance, with two guarantees: 1) You will not be caught. 2) You will win. Would you take the substance?

One hundred and ninety-five athletes said yes; three said no.

Scenario II: You are offered a banned performance-enhancing substance that comes with two guarantees: 1) You will not be caught. 2) You will win every competition you enter for the next five years, and then you will die from the side effects of the substance. Would you take it?

More than half the athletes said yes."

AWARE THAT DRUG TESTING IS A SHAM, ATHLETES SEEM TO RELY MORE THAN EVER ON BANNED PERFORMANCE ENHANCERS
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1009868/index.htm

and that's from 95. with all the advancements in performance enhancing drugs readily available now, well, goes without saying.

So before there was a strong stance in baseball... 1995 and other sports. Yes there was testing, but not like there is today with actual punishments and more frequent random screenings. Those are hypothetical questions as well. Where's the testing showing these numbers? I'd like to a static saying of all the athletes tested in this one sport, 90% failed for etc etc
Times are very different than they were in 1995.

Plus that is a ridiculously small sample. 198? Your gonna need more than hypothetical questions. Plus in those questions it says " you won't be caught". There's obviously no gaurantee like that in the real world

 

[jbryand101b]

one example: lance Armstrong, the most tested athlete in the world, never failed a drug test. finally admitted he's been using ped's his entire career, even when he was a nobody. it's what you have to do to be at that level.

if you don't believe, you don't believe it. that's fine. keep the dream alive.

sorry if that small survey using various athletes isn't enough (im guessing you didn't read the entire article), and the countless random cases of athletes constantly being caught cheating.

times are different your right. there are new ped's being developed faster than they can come up with test for them.

 

[smoker145]

Plus in your 2nd scenario it's already down to above half, not 195 yes and 3 no. That's because in the real world there are no gaurantees you won't be caught and you'll win every time.

 

[smoker145]

one example: lance Armstrong, the most tested athlete in the world, never failed a drug test. finally admitted he's been using ped's his entire career, even when he was a no body. it's what you have to do to be at that level.

if you don't believe, you don't believe it. that's fine. keep the dream alive.

Again, 1 athlete in a sport with 1000s of athletes. Show me an actual stat showing that of all athletes tested in a sport, 90% tested positive

 

[smoker145]

one example: lance Armstrong, the most tested athlete in the world, never failed a drug test. finally admitted he's been using ped's his entire career, even when he was a nobody. it's what you have to do to be at that level.

if you don't believe, you don't believe it. that's fine. keep the dream alive.

sorry if that small survey using various athletes isn't enough (im guessing you didn't read the entire article), and the countless random cases of athletes constantly being caught cheating.

Yup. " small survey" and " random" cases. Did it say in the " study" you posted, how many of those 198 were on peds? And not just " if a genie granted you a wish......

 

[jbryand101b]

Again, 1 athlete in a sport with 1000s of athletes. Show me an actual stat showing that of all athletes tested in a sport, 90% tested positive

1 athlete, never caught, tested more than any other athlete. if this isn't enough proof, he never failed. he's one guy. one. how many more do you think have been doing it?

 

[smoker145]

1 athlete, never caught, tested more than any other athlete. if this isn't enough proof, he never failed. he's one guy. one. how many more do you think have been doing it?

He was caught. The evidence was more than overwhelming. That's why he admitted it after countlessly denying use. And he was striped of his titles and now owes a large sum of money.
I'm not arguing there aren't ped users in sports.

Once again, show me a stat saying 90% uses

 

[bdcc]

Where are you getting this figure? 90%? There's no question that in every sport there are bound to be rule breakers, but to make a statement claiming 90% of professional athletes cheat.... I hope you have some data to back your claim

This is my stance. Yes, it is prevalent but people assume the level of prevalence based on their own perception, not on fact or research.

90% of professional athletes could be using PEDs but unless I have any objective research to back that up I am not going to make the claim that 90% are definitely using.