Coop's Corner #3: So you want vascularity?

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    Coop's Corner #3: So you want vascularity?


    Today's topic is adopted from a post I made on BB.com last year, with additions:

    Vascularity is a superficial phenomenon created by veins, not arteries. Therefore, the skeletal muscle "pump" (I'm not talking about a pump you get while lifting; I'm talking about the phsyiological mechanism of bloodflow through skeletal muscle during isotonic exercise -> muscle contraction facilitates increased venous bloodblow) is important, which means that the amount of contractions per unit time + bloodflow demand of the tissue will dictate the skeletal muscle aspect of vascularity.


    What people don't realize is that bloodflow to the skin (mediated almost entirely by the SNS) makes a huge difference in superficial vascularity. Bloodflow to the skin is increased via sympathetic disinhibition when central bodyheat rises + sweat glands are stimulated. So the overall training intensity and ambient temperature will also dictate a significant portion of vascularity.


    Bodyfat %, while commonly cited, is a little fickle because it follows an inverse U-shaped curve. Obese individuals and extremely lean individuals have excellent superficial venous visibility...and you really need to start approaching either extreme to notice a benefit in this regard.


    Summary:


    -Amount of isotonic contractions
    -Training intensity/tissue demand
    -Core temperature (therefore, thermogenic ingredients can improve vascularity) and ambient temperature
    -Bodyfat % (minimal impact unless at extremes)


    To add to the supplement list, GMS would actually be exceptional at improving vascularity because it directly increases the volume of the ECC (including the plasma), and thus increases blood volume (which is mostly pooled in veins). In addition to this, one might actually observe that stimulants and products that increase cardiac output can increase vascularity (cardiac output=venous return).

    Good supplements for increasing vascularity:

    -iForce Hemavol
    -Analyzed Supplements Micronized GMS
    -Athletix High Volume
    -Controlled Labs Glycergrow
    -PES Enhanced
    -USPLabs Jack3d Advanced
    -Nitrate products like iForce KNO3 or Max Pump
    -Agmatine products like Analyzed Supplements, SNS, or iForce Agmatine
    -Sodium-rich intraworkout drinks
    -Capsaicin-based products -> topical application of something like eviscerate will stimulate local thermoreceptors and significantly boost vascularity to the region
    -Caffeine + DMAA
    http://pescience.com/
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    The above is my own opinion and does not reflect the opinion of PES

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    I think products like Ur-Spray, Pump Spray, and TAA should be brought into this conversation as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigGame84 View Post
    I think products like Ur-Spray, Pump Spray, and TAA should be brought into this conversation as well.
    TAA brings an interesting side to it. Support of angiogenesis I believe. Although I didn't notice this as I used it as a recomper at a higher bf, I have seen the pics of TruthorNothing and he gets an impressive look at his bf%...I guess this could tie into the U shaped curve.

    Edit: at the risk of sounding dumb(or dumber) I guess these wouldn't work as far as the point of blood flow...more so a way to make it possible for more vessels for these products to stimulate blood flow.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Today's topic is adopted from a post I made on BB.com last year, with additions:

    Vascularity is a superficial phenomenon created by veins, not arteries. Therefore, the skeletal muscle "pump" (I'm not talking about a pump you get while lifting; I'm talking about the phsyiological mechanism of bloodflow through skeletal muscle during isotonic exercise -> muscle contraction facilitates increased venous bloodblow) is important, which means that the amount of contractions per unit time + bloodflow demand of the tissue will dictate the skeletal muscle aspect of vascularity.

    What people don't realize is that bloodflow to the skin (mediated almost entirely by the SNS) makes a huge difference in superficial vascularity. Bloodflow to the skin is increased via sympathetic disinhibition when central bodyheat rises + sweat glands are stimulated. So the overall training intensity and ambient temperature will also dictate a significant portion of vascularity.

    Bodyfat %, while commonly cited, is a little fickle because it follows an inverse U-shaped curve. Obese individuals and extremely lean individuals have excellent superficial venous visibility...and you really need to start approaching either extreme to notice a benefit in this regard.

    Summary:

    -Amount of isotonic contractions
    -Training intensity/tissue demand
    -Core temperature (therefore, thermogenic ingredients can improve vascularity) and ambient temperature
    -Bodyfat % (minimal impact unless at extremes)

    To add to the supplement list, GMS would actually be exceptional at improving vascularity because it directly increases the volume of the ECC (including the plasma), and thus increases blood volume (which is mostly pooled in veins). In addition to this, one might actually observe that stimulants and products that increase cardiac output can increase vascularity (cardiac output=venous return).

    Good supplements for increasing vascularity:

    -iForce Hemavol
    -Analyzed Supplements Micronized GMS
    -Athletix High Volume
    -Controlled Labs Glycergrow
    -PES Enhanced
    -USPLabs Jack3d Advanced
    -Nitrate products like iForce KNO3 or Max Pump
    -Agmatine products like Analyzed Supplements, SNS, or iForce Agmatine
    -Sodium-rich intraworkout drinks
    -Capsaicin-based products -> topical application of something like eviscerate will stimulate local thermoreceptors and significantly boost vascularity to the region
    -Caffeine + DMAA
    Great info coop!
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    awesome topic, thx for sharing the knowledge OP
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigGame84 View Post
    I think products like Ur-Spray, Pump Spray, and TAA should be brought into this conversation as well.
    I am not sold on the ursolic acid, but TAA can enhance bloodflow locally, yes
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Today's topic is adopted from a post I made on BB.com last year, with additions:

    Vascularity is a superficial phenomenon created by veins, not arteries. Therefore, the skeletal muscle "pump" (I'm not talking about a pump you get while lifting; I'm talking about the phsyiological mechanism of bloodflow through skeletal muscle during isotonic exercise -> muscle contraction facilitates increased venous bloodblow) is important, which means that the amount of contractions per unit time + bloodflow demand of the tissue will dictate the skeletal muscle aspect of vascularity.


    What people don't realize is that bloodflow to the skin (mediated almost entirely by SNS) makes a huge difference in superficial vascularity. Bloodflow to the skin is increased via sympathetic disinhibition when central bodyheat rises + sweat glands are stimulated. So the overall training intensity and ambient temperature will also dictate a significant portion of vascularity.


    Bodyfat %, while commonly cited, is a little fickle because it follows an inverse U-shaped curve. Obese individuals and extremely lean individuals have excellent superficial venous visibility...and you really need to start approaching either extreme to notice a benefit in this regard.


    Summary:


    -Amount of isotonic contractions
    -Training intensity/tissue demand
    -Core temperature (therefore, thermogenic ingredients can improve vascularity) and ambient temperature
    -Bodyfat % (minimal impact unless at extremes)


    To add to the supplement list, GMS would actually be exceptional at improving vascularity because it directly increases the volume of the ECC (including the plasma), and thus increases blood volume (which is mostly pooled in veins). In addition to this, one might actually observe that stimulants and products that increase cardiac output can increase vascularity (cardiac output=venous return).

    Good supplements for increasing vascularity:

    -iForce Hemavol
    -Analyzed Supplements Micronized GMS
    -Athletix High Volume
    -Controlled Labs Glycergrow
    -PES Enhanced
    -USPLabs Jack3d Advanced
    -Nitrate products like iForce KNO3 or Max Pump
    -Agmatine products like Analyzed Supplements, SNS, or iForce Agmatine
    -Sodium-rich intraworkout drinks
    -Capsaicin-based products -> topical application of something like eviscerate will stimulate local thermoreceptors and significantly boost vascularity to the region
    -Caffeine + DMAA
    Completely agree with this statement
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    Completely agree with this statement
    x2

    Much appreciated Coop.
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    Would yohimbe also work to increase vascularity since it also increases blood flow?
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    great write up Coop.

    Hemavol + Potassium Nitrate = ftw!


    Now I just have to try Enhanced + Hemavol and hear what all the epic hype has been about
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    Quote Originally Posted by VaughnTrue View Post
    great write up Coop.

    Hemavol + Potassium Nitrate = ftw!


    Now I just have to try Enhanced + Hemavol and hear what all the epic hype has been about
    It's so gooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooood. Pumps for days and focus for eons.
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    Quote Originally Posted by VaughnTrue View Post
    great write up Coop.

    Hemavol + Potassium Nitrate = ftw!

    Now I just have to try Enhanced + Hemavol and hear what all the epic hype has been about
    hemavol + potassium nitrate gives me the best pumps even while training fasted
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    Quote Originally Posted by VaughnTrue View Post
    great write up Coop.

    Hemavol + Potassium Nitrate = ftw!

    Now I just have to try Enhanced + Hemavol and hear what all the epic hype has been about
    Poops for days for me, can barely tolerate ~1g Agmatine these days :/
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bryancap77 View Post
    Poops for days for me, can barely tolerate ~1g Agmatine these days :/
    stick to 1 scoop Hemavol? LOL never heard that reaction before from agmatine
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    Quote Originally Posted by VaughnTrue View Post
    great write up Coop.

    Hemavol + Potassium Nitrate = ftw!

    Now I just have to try Enhanced + Hemavol and hear what all the epic hype has been about
    I like enhanced. Makes me liquipoo tho. But it's a one and done kinda deal so as long as I leave enough time before the Gym and I'm not squatting I'm good to go

    I've yet to try hemavol but I just spent 150 on cutting materials so I'm going to have to wait for another order.
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    Quote Originally Posted by VaughnTrue View Post

    stick to 1 scoop Hemavol? LOL never heard that reaction before from agmatine
    For some reason too much Agmatine gives me some G.I. distress. Maybe I'm just an unlucky dude.

    (And I was referencing using enhanced plus hemavol btw not the nitrates)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bryancap77 View Post
    For some reason too much Agmatine gives me some G.I. distress. Maybe I'm just an unlucky dude.

    (And I was referencing using enhanced plus hemavol btw not the nitrates)
    You're not alone. 2 grams of agmatine will give me sharts.
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    I'm at 3G agmatine on workout days 0-1 on non wrk out days/cardio days
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    While it isn't the first product people chase for vascularity, our Eviscerate series (OG and Smolder) definitely provide a nice boost in vascularity.

    Thanks for explanation on topical capsaicin, Coop!
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    Bodybuilder Toney Freeman has a product called X-Pain. It really works well I used it a lot this spring. Some of the summer too. I enjoyed it it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleGauge1 View Post
    Bodybuilder Toney Freeman has a product called X-Pain. It really works well I used it a lot this spring. Some of the summer too. I enjoyed it it.
    How does topical pain relief relate to vascularity?
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    Somebody on another forum was asking a question vascularity a few days prior, and I copied and posted a similar comment you wrote previously and everyone was giving your ghost reps.

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    How effective is GlyoCarn?
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    Quote Originally Posted by lupis122 View Post
    How effective is GlyoCarn?
    Not very
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    Quote Originally Posted by lupis122 View Post
    How effective is GlyoCarn?
    It's GPLC. You'll have to be dosing daily @ 3-4 grams for over a month before any appreciable effects will happen, if any (going by the study). It's also a pretty expensive ingredient relatively speaking.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kissdadookie View Post
    It's GPLC. You'll have to be dosing daily @ 3-4 grams for over a month before any appreciable effects will happen, if any (going by the study). It's also a pretty expensive ingredient relatively speaking.
    If I recall, isn't the study done on 4.5g? That gets quite expensive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aaronuconn View Post
    If I recall, isn't the study done on 4.5g? That gets quite expensive.
    The data is also extremely underwhelming
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    Quote Originally Posted by aaronuconn View Post
    If I recall, isn't the study done on 4.5g? That gets quite expensive.
    Study was done at 4.5 but I think general consensus has been 3-4 grams daily having had some notable effect for most people after dosing for a month plus. Definitely not worth it IMHO from value perspective.

    I do however have an absolute sh*t ton of the stuff and it's flavoured. Need to run a log for it but I'm waiting for my cut to start that :P

    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    The data is also extremely underwhelming
    Agreed, I feel that the stuff has more general health benefits than performance benefits if anything.
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    I read something once that said eating large amounts of carbohydrates, increases vascularity. Is that just bro science or is there any fact to that?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigcountry08 View Post
    I read something once that said eating large amounts of carbohydrates, increases vascularity. Is that just bro science or is there any fact to that?
    Don't necessarily have to eat a large amount but I would guess that the carbs would spike your insulin which will then increase blood flow. A meal usually gets my veins popping in general with or without exercise.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigcountry08 View Post
    I read something once that said eating large amounts of carbohydrates, increases vascularity. Is that just bro science or is there any fact to that?
    There's fact to that. Many will observe vascularity with GDAs for a similar reason
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    Great info
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    How does topical pain relief relate to vascularity?
    x2???? only thing i can think of is topical capsaicin????????
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    Topic # 4????

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    Couldn't find what's in X-Pain but it is homeopathic.
    Don't think it will increase vascularity.
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebigt View Post
    x2???? only thing i can think of is topical capsaicin????????
    Not capsaicin though lol. Who knows why he said it

    Quote Originally Posted by mw1 View Post
    Topic # 4????
    Trying to think of something unique to keep this thing going
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    How much agmatine is too much?
    I take 2g preworkout. Then if I'm going out later I'll want another boost in vascularity.
    What happens if you take more?
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    Quote Originally Posted by FL3X MAGNUM View Post
    How much agmatine is too much?
    I take 2g preworkout. Then if I'm going out later I'll want another boost in vascularity.
    What happens if you take more?
    Human studies have used close to 4 grams daily longterm with no ill effect besides mild GI issues
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    If I pull my belly button out, will my butt fall off?
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