help w/weight loss advice for chubby friend

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    help w/weight loss advice for chubby friend


    Ok I have a friend at work that is constantly asking me to help them set up on a clean diet and workout program but he is also inquiring on supplementation assistance. I'm a pretty firm believer that you have to get your diet and work out routine in check before going to supplements or they will be pointless to take. That being said he seems pretty motivated to use supplements and I'd rather give solid advise then for him to take something that will put too much stress on his body.

    His stats(guessing on some of this):
    Age low 40s
    Height 5'9
    Weight: guessing north of 230
    High bf%
    Very stressful job
    Wife and kids

    He told me that his doctor said he is very healthy as far as pb, cholesterol etc. That being said what would be a good non stimulant weight loss supp for this person?

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    Like you said, let him get his diet and training in lone first before he looks towards supplements.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aaronuconn View Post
    Like you said, let him get his diet and training in lone first before he looks towards supplements.
    Yep I already said that above thanks.....
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    Only thing I've used in the past few years is alphamine which cuts me up between cycles but I personally don't want to recommend a stimulant to someone as overweight as he is. Any recommendations?
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    Quote Originally Posted by aaronuconn View Post
    Like you said, let him get his diet and training in lone first before he looks towards supplements.
    Agreed. Like to add, not only get diet and training in line first and foremost but stick with it for awhile and THEN look into supplementation.

    Quote Originally Posted by rphash49 View Post
    Only thing I've used in the past few years is alphamine which cuts me up between cycles but I personally don't want to recommend a stimulant to someone as overweight as he is. Any recommendations?
    Supps are not going to do anything other than maybe give some placebo confidence boost at this point for your friend, seriously.
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    you could let him try TT-33, its non stim fat burner. mind if I ask why non stim?
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    Diet is KEY first and foremost. Get that together then we'll talk.
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    I would tell him to stick with staples first...

    Creatine, Fish oil, protein powder, and maybe pop some caffeine" I know you said stim free but come on does he skip coffee also?"
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    Of course he can have coffee. He doesn't even need all of what you mentioned. Creatine will only hold water which will in turn make him believe he is not losing weight. I would say no to the creatine.
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    Give him tic tacs and tell him he's beta testing the newest fat loss supp from whatever company. If he's 5'9, a fat 230 and dead set on supplements, knee jerk reaction is that he wants the easy way out. Throw in some decent protein and teach him how to make pudding, pancakes, waffles, etc. Supps are great, but it sounds like he needs to learn a bit of hard work first.
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    Quote Originally Posted by todd muelheim View Post
    Give him tic tacs and tell him he's beta testing the newest fat loss supp from whatever company. If he's 5'9, a fat 230 and dead set on supplements, knee jerk reaction is that he wants the easy way out. Throw in some decent protein and teach him how to make pudding, pancakes, waffles, etc. Supps are great, but it sounds like he needs to learn a bit of hard work first.
    lol Right on the money Todd!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanaeZ82 View Post
    Of course he can have coffee. He doesn't even need all of what you mentioned. Creatine will only hold water which will in turn make him believe he is not losing weight. I would say no to the creatine.
    He is trying to get his diet and work routine in check as the first poster stated. Creatine does not only cause you to hold water it does have other physiological benefits.

    Creatine supplementation enhances muscular performance during high-intensity resistance exercise.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9216554

    Effect of creatine supplementation and resistance-exercise training on muscle insulin-like growth factor in young adults.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18708688

    Long-term creatine intake is beneficial to muscle performance during resistance training.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9390981

    Effects of creatine supplementation on muscle power, endurance, and sprint performance.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11828245
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    If you notice all your links are to HIGH INTENSITY, YOUNG, ENDURANCE training. He is NOT there yet.

    If he wants to take it, fine, have him take it. I was just stating my personal opinion and results on Creatine.
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    I have had a few friends like that too. I tell them that they need to try and go 1 month of strict dieting so they understand that supplements are just that, supplements. Most of the time they insist on just taking stuff or they already are since they have been trying to lose weight and get in better shape but are lacking something. 9 time out of 10 its nutrition. So here is what I do for my friends/clients:

    Nutrition plan set to follow the training program I put them on.

    Add a thermo, I prefer and use iForce Nutrition Dexaprine XR.
    Starting off with 1 capsule in the morning upon waking up.

    Quality whey protein which I use iForce Nutrition Protean. Love all the flavors, and the macros fit perfect. Not to mention I also give them various dessert recipes that I use with the Protean to curve those cravings.

    Finally a sleep aid. If they prefer to train in the morning, I just use ZMA which I feel everyone could benefit from. iForce does a great job of having a good ratio of B6, Magnesium and Zinc. If they train at night, I advise something to help a little more including the ZMA which is Lights Out from iForce.

    All of these products I use myself, so I can stand by them and help my friends/clients use them correctly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanaeZ82 View Post
    If you notice all your links are to HIGH INTENSITY, YOUNG, ENDURANCE training. He is NOT there yet.

    If he wants to take it, fine, have him take it. I was just stating my personal opinion and results on Creatine.
    Please do not take this as me picking a fight I simply prefer studies and scientific responses over non science based opinions.

    There are many health benefits to creatine those were just the first few I have in my notes. It may hold water in some I see that point, but you are minimizing the many health benefits by stating it will only make him hold water. An unhealthy individual should start by trying to become healthy.

    Also in my notes...creatine has many more health benefits then I think most realize even for instance in patients with congestive heart failure. < not so health men.

    Creatine supplementation improves muscle strength in patients with congestive heart failure.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16599263

    The effect of dietary creatine supplementation on skeletal muscle metabolism in congestive heart failure.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9597411
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    Quote Originally Posted by veaderko View Post
    I have had a few friends like that too. I tell them that they need to try and go 1 month of strict dieting so they understand that supplements are just that, supplements. Most of the time they insist on just taking stuff or they already are since they have been trying to lose weight and get in better shape but are lacking something. 9 time out of 10 its nutrition. So here is what I do for my friends/clients:

    Nutrition plan set to follow the training program I put them on.

    Add a thermo, I prefer and use iForce Nutrition Dexaprine XR.
    Starting off with 1 capsule in the morning upon waking up.

    Quality whey protein which I use iForce Nutrition Protean. Love all the flavors, and the macros fit perfect. Not to mention I also give them various dessert recipes that I use with the Protean to curve those cravings.

    Finally a sleep aid. If they prefer to train in the morning, I just use ZMA which I feel everyone could benefit from. iForce does a great job of having a good ratio of B6, Magnesium and Zinc. If they train at night, I advise something to help a little more including the ZMA which is Lights Out from iForce.

    All of these products I use myself, so I can stand by them and help my friends/clients use them correctly.
    I myself fell victim to the idea of trying to out train and over supplement a bad diet for the first few months back after years away from bodybuilding....
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    Quote Originally Posted by harbonah View Post
    I myself fell victim to the idea of trying to out train and over supplement a bad diet for the first few months back after years away from bodybuilding....
    Yeah so did I. When i first started out I tried to supplement my way to loosing fat by taking a thermo. Problem is that pizza and beer didn't help me get the body I am currently proud to have now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by veaderko View Post

    Yeah so did I. When i first started out I tried to supplement my way to loosing fat by taking a thermo. Problem is that pizza and beer didn't help me get the body I am currently proud to have now.
    Exactly. Plus, if you throw everything and the kitchen sink at the problem right off the bat, what do you have left down the line? Give the guy a thermo off the bat and he'll bitch about sweating within a week and then complain that his abs aren't showing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by veaderko View Post
    Yeah so did I. When i first started out I tried to supplement my way to loosing fat by taking a thermo. Problem is that pizza and beer didn't help me get the body I am currently proud to have now.
    Exactly, I kept trying to up my cardio and increase the fat burners instead of fixing my diet... The worst part is I knew better when I was doing it also.. to many years away from bodybuilding leads to some bad habits.
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    I can say after fixing my diet that I did toss the kitchen sink against the problem, So I could get on stage as fast as I could but meh I am the all or nothing kind of person...
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    Quote Originally Posted by harbonah View Post
    I can say after fixing my diet that I did toss the kitchen sink against the problem, So I could get on stage as fast as I could but meh I am the all or nothing kind of person...
    Stage ready kitchen sink throwing=logical
    Fat guy asking for crutches before he tries to walk kitchen sink throwing= :-(
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    Quote Originally Posted by todd muelheim View Post
    Stage ready kitchen sink throwing=logical
    Fat guy asking for crutches before he tries to walk kitchen sink throwing= :-(
    LOL I started as a fat guy it took a bit to get stage ready....lol
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    I know you stated he wants a non stim. But I found taking half a pill of DexaprineXR by iForce in the beginning of the day helped my friend Michael lose some weight. Not as fast as if he took the recommended dose but he was very stim intolerant.


    He also did cardio at lunch 3-4 times a week. His diet was pretty weak though
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    Thank you to everyone that posted exactly what I already said in the original post lmao. Yes diet is the most important part if not 90%+. Workout routine and sleep also are imperative in weight loss and overall health. I get asked daily how I do it or how do I get a six pack or how do I get in shape etc and I always say the same thing. #1 you must eat right...... I know it, I live it and I preach it so now that is out of the way.... He was a college athlete 15+ years ago so he understands hard work and I guarantee you he is motivated. I'm not wanting to recommend a stim supplement because the guy is really out of shape and with the hard work he is putting in I don't want the guy to have a heart attack. He Is going to use a supplement if I like it or not. Ok best recommendation so far is tic tacs. Can anyone top that lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by rphash49 View Post
    Thank you to everyone that posted exactly what I already said in the original post lmao. Yes diet is the most important part if not 90%+. Workout routine and sleep also are imperative in weight loss and overall health. I get asked daily how I do it or how do I get a six pack or how do I get in shape etc and I always say the same thing. #1 you must eat right...... I know it, I live it and I preach it so now that is out of the way.... He was a college athlete 15+ years ago so he understands hard work and I guarantee you he is motivated. I'm not wanting to recommend a stim supplement because the guy is really out of shape and with the hard work he is putting in I don't want the guy to have a heart attack. He Is going to use a supplement if I like it or not. Ok best recommendation so far is tic tacs. Can anyone top that lol
    My question is, since you state that you've been through the thick of it already and understand what is required to get in shape, then you should also be well aware that there's really no supplement that your friend can take right now that would really give any appreciable effect. So with that in mind, why recommend him supplements which would not have any appreciable effects for him this early in the game? It's practically like having your friend part ways with his money in exchange for placebo TBH.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kissdadookie View Post

    My question is, since you state that you've been through the thick of it already and understand what is required to get in shape, then you should also be well aware that there's really no supplement that your friend can take right now that would really give any appreciable effect. So with that in mind, why recommend him supplements which would not have any appreciable effects for him this early in the game? It's practically like having your friend part ways with his money in exchange for placebo TBH.
    That's why I posted the question. If the answer at the end of the day is that they are a waste of money I'm fine with that and I will advise him to stick to the training and diet plan we laid out. I've used multiple products to build muscle and can advise to it. I don't have experience with weight loss supps because I don't use them which is why I'm asking.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rphash49 View Post
    That's why I posted the question. If the answer at the end of the day is they are a waste of money I'm fine with that and I will advise him to stick the the training and diet plan we laid out. I've used multiple products to build muscle and can advise to it. I don't have experience with weight loss supps because I don't use them which is why I'm asking.
    Fat burners, thyroid boosters, GDAs, etc. could help but for your friend right now, there's not going to be much appreciable effects thus I would suggest not to have him waste money on these supplements right now. All his progress are going to be coming from his training and diet right now as well as well into the future. The supps will be something to look into later on when your friend actually gets into shape in which he may get appreciable results from the supplements.

    Be a good friend and just lay it out straight to your friend
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    Quote Originally Posted by kissdadookie View Post

    Fat burners, thyroid boosters, GDAs, etc. could help but for your friend right now, there's not going to be much appreciable effects thus I would suggest not to have him waste money on these supplements right now. All his progress are going to be coming from his training and diet right now as well as well into the future. The supps will be something to look into later on when your friend actually gets into shape in which he may get appreciable results from the supplements.

    Be a good friend and just lay it out straight to your friend
    Sounds good thanks
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    Quote Originally Posted by harbonah View Post
    Please do not take this as me picking a fight I simply prefer studies and scientific responses over non science based opinions.

    There are many health benefits to creatine those were just the first few I have in my notes. It may hold water in some I see that point, but you are minimizing the many health benefits by stating it will only make him hold water. An unhealthy individual should start by trying to become healthy.

    Also in my notes...creatine has many more health benefits then I think most realize even for instance in patients with congestive heart failure. < not so health men.

    Creatine supplementation improves muscle strength in patients with congestive heart failure.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16599263

    The effect of dietary creatine supplementation on skeletal muscle metabolism in congestive heart failure.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9597411

    I'm sorry mine wasn't a "science based opinion". I was stating off of my experience in taking it. To each his own. I don't feel this person is ready for all of this yet is all I'm saying.
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    you said hes healthy as far as the dr reported. good blood pressure and cholesterol. I believe as long as hes not on any medication the best thing to do is get him a stimed fat burner. just follow directions on the label, he will thank u. plus he will actually feel the product wich is more likely to keep him motivated thus he will see some progress. a little bit of fat burner and a whole lot of placebo can go along way to getting into shape.
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    First of all I would like to say it takes a lot of effort to post about your issues. I wish you all the best. I may have a solution for you. TrimDownAdvanced is a fat burner that works really well. This plus a good diet and exercise program and proper nutrition may be just what you need to succeed. Good luck
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleGauge1 View Post
    First of all I would like to say it takes a lot of effort to post about your issues. I wish you all the best. I may have a solution for you. TrimDownAdvanced is a fat burner that works really well. This plus a good diet and exercise program and proper nutrition may be just what you need to succeed. Good luck
    Actually it was really no effort at all. I even did it with one hand using my mobile. You didn't even read the original post did you lol. Anyway I'm going to stick to what I originally told my friend and that he needs to focus on diet, exercise and sleep.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleGauge1 View Post
    First of all I would like to say it takes a lot of effort to post about your issues. I wish you all the best. I may have a solution for you. TrimDownAdvanced is a fat burner that works really well. This plus a good diet and exercise program and proper nutrition may be just what you need to succeed. Good luck
    Would anavar stack well with that?
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    Quote Originally Posted by rphash49 View Post
    Actually it was really no effort at all. I even did it with one hand using my mobile. You didn't even read the original post did you lol. Anyway I'm going to stick to what I originally told my friend and that he needs to focus on diet, exercise and sleep.
    One handed typing on my phone takes me forever. Teach me your ways.
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    Quote Originally Posted by aaronuconn View Post
    One handed typing on my phone takes me forever. Teach me your ways.
    Ok you caught me I used both hands. I was just trying to be a dick
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    I've seen success with a combination of:
    1) detoxing (try a good detox program usually 20+ days of just fruits/vegetables/protein bars etc.)
    2) regular weight/cardio mix
    3) raspberry ketone
    4) healthy diet
    - green coffee extract is pretty good too.
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    Quote Originally Posted by wtrankin View Post
    I've seen success with a combination of:
    1) detoxing (try a good detox program usually 20+ days of just fruits/vegetables/protein bars etc.)
    2) regular weight/cardio mix
    3) raspberry ketone
    4) healthy diet
    - green coffee extract is pretty good too.
    Face meet palm
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    Quote Originally Posted by todd muelheim View Post
    Face meet palm
    Indeed
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    Quote Originally Posted by wtrankin View Post
    I've seen success with a combination of:
    1) detoxing (try a good detox program usually 20+ days of just fruits/vegetables/protein bars etc.)
    2) regular weight/cardio mix
    3) raspberry ketone
    4) healthy diet
    - green coffee extract is pretty good too.
    ^lol at this! Detox with protein bars....
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    Quote Originally Posted by rphash49 View Post
    ^lol at this! Detox with protein bars....
    Man I have been doing it wrong this whole time. I need to try a detox, especially if protein bars are involved
    iForce Nutrition Anabolics Minion Member
    iTrain. iCompete. iDominate
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