Did you know your SAAs are not actually SAAs?
- 07-15-2013, 11:38 PM
Did you know your SAAs are not actually SAAs?
From a prominent seller of SAAs:
"This amino acid blend is formed using the free-flow amino acids to replicate the series of aminos that appear in silk. They are not hydrolyzed from silk protein."
As if they weren't overhyped and mis-marketed enough, you aren't even getting actual SAAs, you're just getting a mix of amino acids meant to mimc SAAs.
That means no Sericin-L or Sericin-S polypeptides for you. Which kind of defeats the purpose of SAAs.
Go supplement industry!
- 07-16-2013, 12:05 AM
07-16-2013, 12:08 AM
07-16-2013, 12:23 AM
07-16-2013, 12:38 AM
So, not only is the industry completely misrepresenting the studies on the ingredient, nobody is even selling it?
Go supp industry!
07-16-2013, 09:10 AM
07-16-2013, 11:55 AM
07-16-2013, 01:44 PM
deeb, you come in here spouting a "he-said/she-said" intro, and then obviously go after FINAFLEX and me personally, acting as if you do not know who I am; while to the contrary we have discussed things on many occasions
I think you are used to how things are done on "some other website"..however here, I will not indulge your childishness
it is obvious you want no conversation nor education; if so, post a thread in the science section where it belongs, not here
now: for everybody else, would be glad to help educate..i cannot speak on what "other companies" are using, or who said what about whom..for FINAFLEX, we stand on the fact that we use true genuine SAA from the silk worm pupa
our product stands on its own
07-16-2013, 01:54 PM
I actually only posted about finaflex because I got about a dozen rep comments about you so I figure something must be up.
So you're saying that finaflex's SAA product contains actual hydrolyzed silk protein and polypeptides (sericin-L/S)?
07-16-2013, 02:00 PM
07-16-2013, 02:48 PM
Would any company rep that does sell sericin-derived peptides like to speak up?
What science backs the utilization of free form amino acids from silk worm as opposed to an SAA preparation made from hydrolyzed silk protein?
Because every published study in humans on silk amino acids, if you know, you actually read the text of the study, prepares their material by hydrolyzing silk protein, as opposed to using free form amino acids derived from silk protein.
I'd welcome BPI and TrueNutrition to chime in if Finaflex isn't sure.
07-16-2013, 02:59 PM
once again - you seem to enjoy and thrive on creating nothing but controversy deeb..sad stuff
from the company:
if it is your sole intent to run around trying to embarrass or call-out companies, you will not last long hereWe are using real free form amino acids from silk worms which are used in the actual korean study.
We can't say sericin or fibroin because we are using free form aminos. Free form aminos are different than peptide bond aminos, which would make them into protein. Sericin or fibroin are peptide bonded.
I am sure this does not matter to you however
try to have a good day, eh?
07-16-2013, 03:15 PM
Here, I'll provide the full text of the korean study for you, it's free.
Now then, If you'll navigate to the section on materials you'll find the following:
Seems pretty clear to me that the korean study does in fact use hydrolysated silk protein, which would include sericin peptides, and not simply free form amino acids.Materials:
A preparation of SAA from acid (HCl) hydrolysate of silk proteins was obtained from Worldway Co.,Ltd. (Jeoneui, Korea). The SAA preparation was mainly composed of Ala (34.36%)Gly (27.23%)Ser (9.58%) Val (3.49%)Thr (2.00%), and minor amino acids.23)
Thus thank you for providing a direct and concise quote demonstrating that your company does not use the material studied. Finaflex and TrueNutrition down, any other vendors want to contribute?
My original intent was and still is to find a company selling actual Sericin peptides, as studied in every piece of published literature I've looked at. I didn't even know Finaflex sold SAAs until a bunch of people said 'lolfinaflex' 'inb4 finaflex reps' etc in rep comments.
So, again, does anybody who sells actual sericin-peptides want to contribute to the conversation?
07-16-2013, 03:24 PM
sheesh, you just do not read very well, do you?
continue on your merry adventure then deeb, and please going forward, try to keep all this "he said/said" out of the picture, and "but all these rep comments" you claim you get (such a popular guy you are, for your whole 41 posts on this foum and 7 in this very thread! ) in the attempt to justify your own poor and childish behavior, going forward
if you have a valid point, simply stand on it and be a man, rather than pointing to all these "ghosts" for your support
thanks in advance
07-16-2013, 03:28 PM
You skipped the part where I provided a direct quote from the study your company references demonstrating for absolute fact that the study was performed on hydrolyzed silk protein and not free form amino acids from silk pupa.
I have a point, you're just being willfully ignorant of it.
But that's okay, You're just a marketing guy, I don't expect any more from you than I did when you were repping for USPLabs. Your job is to sell product.
Now then, is there a reason your company seems to be lying and stating that it is using the material studied in the Korean study when it would appear they are not? Or did they not even bother to read the full text and look at how the material was prepared? That's not unheard of in this industry.
Because I'm a consumer interested in buying a product that contains hydrolyzed silk protein, since you know, that's what the published data is on.
07-16-2013, 03:47 PM
and that fact is blatantly obvious to all who are reading this -- except for you, because you are so intent on coming back with a cutesy and demeaning reply
is a shame too; you have some insight into a few things, and I've long thought you had some potential in being able to really HELP ppl, instead of using your talents to destroy and demean
meh..soime ppl are beyong help
i'm all done here buddy, you carry on & take care of yourself, while you're still around
07-16-2013, 03:51 PM
And why are you trying to tell me what I am and am not trying to do?
I tried to find a company selling sericin-peptides, because I read the research and said 'hey this seems interesting'.
Then I looked at various products on the market, and they appear to be either free form amino acids from any source passed off as SAAs (TrueNutrition) or free form amino acids from silk protein (Finaflex) as opposed to hydrolyzed silk protein (the research ingredient).
This seemed odd to me, that among the hype over a new industry ingredient, nobody would be actually selling the ingredient, so I figured people could discuss that.
But it looks like you just want to throw up red herrings and try to undermine me personally as some sort of attempt to avoid defending the integrity of your product and answering entirely valid questions related to what exact ingredient you're using.
07-16-2013, 04:54 PM
You seem to have an answer and a perspective on Finaflex's product already, despite Snag's explanations. Why persist in your line of questioning? You don't accept Snag's explanations; fine. Why persist? And your explanation that you're looking for a company that sells SAAs etc. doesn't explain why you're baiting Finaflex; not to mention that cryptic comment about rep comments.
Don't worry Snags, he's after our PF3 product that hasn't even been released yet over on another forum. He's an equal opportunity pot stirrer.
Which I don't have a problem with, other than the tone with which you're inquiring/accusing.
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07-16-2013, 05:06 PM
07-16-2013, 05:07 PM
That said, now that snag has outed finaflex as selling free form aminos and not hydrolyzed silk peptides, why is this somehow okay?
Why is it okay to cite research on silk peptied while selling something different?
Why shouldn't people be called out for claiming they're using an ingredient used in a study, when they are in fact not using an ingredient that was studied?
That's not even being remotely honest to your consumers.
And it's why companies that bitch about government regulation have no leg to stand on.
The other odd thing about snag is that he didn't seem to mind the company targeting when he got fired from USPLabs and was spamming bb.com with hate directed at them. I guess it's different when he's the target of truth instead of being on the attack.
07-16-2013, 05:08 PM
07-16-2013, 05:11 PM
Also, I'm still looking for someone selling Sericin peptides. Surely at least one company is selling the right thing...right?
07-16-2013, 05:25 PM
07-16-2013, 05:35 PM
07-16-2013, 05:42 PM
deeb let's get one thing very clear
FINAFLEX has never deceived anyone; we state very clearly what our product is all about
do you see any mention of "hydrolyzed" or "sericin" on our products, our websites, or from me? no
to make such baseless accusation is ludicrous, and fabricated
as for these personal attacks you continue against me personally with:
you bring up something from couple yrs back, in an effort to, once AGAIN, make someone look poorly
such great lengths you are going to here, just wow
for the record: sure, I've made mistakes in my past, dealt with some things in poor manner..the dated issue you reference is certainly one of them
the difference here however is, I try to learn from them, and NOT continue on making the same mistakes over and over again
this is called GROWING UP
if you would live in the present, or know more about how I conduct myself on this board and in this date in time, perhaps you would truly be educated on all things snag..or, maybe not
in any event, just some clarification on your continued coming after me, after I have left thread
hopefully, you will take a moment to gather yourself, and just ignore me, if your distaste for me is so strong
trust that I will most certainly do the same for you
07-16-2013, 05:50 PM
Well I'm going to go ahead and ignore this thread because nothing good is coming from this.
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07-16-2013, 05:56 PM
and for all those who do wish further explanation on what our product is, since seems to have been bastardized here..
allow me to expand
despite contrary statements:
The study does use the below material....
The amino acid profile that we use is in our product is from actual silk worms not like what other companies are using to claim their SAA.
Hence the name silk amino acids not silk protein.
We use free form amino acids from silk worms for better and faster absorption because it is an amino acid product. We are not selling silk protein.
Other companies are using synthetic amino acids, mainly comprised of Alanine, glycine, serine, valine, and threonine.
Materials A preparation of SAA from acid (HCl) hydrolysate
of silk proteins was obtained from Worldway Co.,
Ltd. (Jeoneui, Korea). The SAA preparation was mainly
composed of Ala (34.36%)Gly (27.23%)Ser (9.58%)
Val (3.49%)Thr (2.00%), and minor amino acids.23
Definition of hydrolysis of protein...
Hydrolysis of protein
Proteins are made up of lots of amino acids joined together by peptide bonds.
Hydrolysis of the protein is what happens when the peptide bonds are broken.
We say the protein has been hydrolysed [lysis = splitting; hydro = water]. This process needs water and an enzyme.
The result of hydrolysis is smaller amino acid chains (peptides), and free amino acids.
The solution containing the protein pieced (small peptide chains and free amino acids) is called a hydrolysate solution.
07-16-2013, 05:58 PM
So does your product contain peptides or not?
Because earlier you said it was just free form animos.
Is it free form animos or free form aminos +peptides?
Its a simple question and may seem like nitpicking over details, but it makes all the difference in the world with respect to physiological effects...
07-16-2013, 06:11 PM
07-16-2013, 06:18 PM
Apologies, I really do just want answers about what exactly is in the SAA products on the market and which companies are actually selling the studied ingredient with sericin peptides.
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