PWO supp companies, PLEASE stop with the caffeine! - AnabolicMinds.com

PWO supp companies, PLEASE stop with the caffeine!

  1. zv3
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    PWO supp companies, PLEASE stop with the caffeine!


    I have purchased almost every popular PWO supp under the sun and I can't adjust the dosages I need because of the caffeine content! I am a larger-size guy (240lbs -250lbs) and need more of the ingredients in the pwo but NOT the added caffeine! I am trying to get away from taking so much of the stuff, but the products just have too much caffeine in them and it's VERY hard to get more ingredient WITHOUT taking in more caffeine! I take Condense and to get the ingredients (2 scoops) I need I would have to take in 400mg of caffeine! Some companies appear to have 2 versions of their pwo, one with caffeine and one without. Millennium Tech has Ragnarook, and the new PES pwo appears to have a lower caffeine content than normal.

    I also sometimes take fat-burners (which almost always have caffeine in them) so stacking this with pwo's that have caffeine give me too much of the stuff! I would like some flexibility to increase the dosages but NOT caffeine!! Controlled Labs also has Blue-up caffeine free, which I have. I think we are raising a generation of kids on too much caffeine destroying their adrenal glands at an early age. Caffeine is so cheap that
    we should be allowed to use the dosages we want in the form of caffeine pills if needed. To me, it's almost a cheap way to give a product "energy" when it's just caffeine. Some of the more popular pwo's (I won't name them) are popular because of too much caffeine it appears. When I looked at the ingredients in one of the most popular pwo's, there was NOTHING remarkable in the formula that made it popular, but it just had a TON of caffeine in it!

    Does anyone know if Condense will come in a caffeine-free version? What do you guys use that's caffeine-free?

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    Check out PowerMax, with 2 scoops you get a good dose of the major players without the overpowering stimulation. You could go up to 3 scoops and still not get jittery with PowerMax.

    We offer free samples so send an email to info@performaxlabs.com and they will have 2 sample pack(4 scoops) sent out ASAP!!
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    Have you ever tried or looked into stim-free focus xt?
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    Formutech Volatile is really lightly stimmed and I never have any issues with one or two scoops.

    Also, if you know what specific ingredients you want more of (i.e. agmatine, beta alanine, c-o-p, etc...) why dont you grab some bulk tubs of those and just add them to a single scoop of a pre mixed pre workout powder?
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    If your looking stim free PWO check out IForce Nutrition Hemavol !!! Crazy pump
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    I usually add bulk products to stim pre-workouts if they do not contain the adequate amount of actives in the amounts I take.

    Some of my favorite non-stim forumlas that can be added to pretty much any stim products include Genomyx Protocol and Iforce Hemavol.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigEdNJ View Post
    If your looking stim free PWO check out IForce Nutrition Hemavol !!! Crazy pump
    Quote Originally Posted by bolt10 View Post
    I usually add bulk products to stim pre-workouts if they do not contain the adequate amount of actives in the amounts I take.

    Some of my favorite non-stim forumlas that can be added to pretty much any stim products include Genomyx Protocol and Iforce Hemavol.
    yeah Hemovol is a really effective stack on top of any stimmed pwo
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    Quote Originally Posted by zv3 View Post
    I have purchased almost every popular PWO supp under the sun and I can't adjust the dosages I need because of the caffeine content! I am a larger-size guy (240lbs -250lbs) and need more of the ingredients in the pwo but NOT the added caffeine! I am trying to get away from taking so much of the stuff, but the products just have too much caffeine in them and it's VERY hard to get more ingredient WITHOUT taking in more caffeine! I take Condense and to get the ingredients (2 scoops) I need I would have to take in 400mg of caffeine! Some companies appear to have 2 versions of their pwo, one with caffeine and one without. Millennium Tech has Ragnarook, and the new PES pwo appears to have a lower caffeine content than normal.

    I also sometimes take fat-burners (which almost always have caffeine in them) so stacking this with pwo's that have caffeine give me too much of the stuff! I would like some flexibility to increase the dosages but NOT caffeine!! Controlled Labs also has Blue-up caffeine free, which I have. I think we are raising a generation of kids on too much caffeine destroying their adrenal glands at an early age. Caffeine is so cheap that
    we should be allowed to use the dosages we want in the form of caffeine pills if needed. To me, it's almost a cheap way to give a product "energy" when it's just caffeine. Some of the more popular pwo's (I won't name them) are popular because of too much caffeine it appears. When I looked at the ingredients in one of the most popular pwo's, there was NOTHING remarkable in the formula that made it popular, but it just had a TON of caffeine in it!

    Does anyone know if Condense will come in a caffeine-free version? What do you guys use that's caffeine-free?
    Jack3d Micro has 125mgs caffiene per scoop
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    dont like stims??? :-\
    Muscle Marinade would prob tune up up. try Hemoval its good.
    GAME ON! MOVAH FUKAZ!
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    Quote Originally Posted by zv3 View Post
    I have purchased almost every popular PWO supp under the sun and I can't adjust the dosages I need because of the caffeine content! I am a larger-size guy (240lbs -250lbs) and need more of the ingredients in the pwo but NOT the added caffeine! I am trying to get away from taking so much of the stuff, but the products just have too much caffeine in them and it's VERY hard to get more ingredient WITHOUT taking in more caffeine! I take Condense and to get the ingredients (2 scoops) I need I would have to take in 400mg of caffeine! Some companies appear to have 2 versions of their pwo, one with caffeine and one without. Millennium Tech has Ragnarook, and the new PES pwo appears to have a lower caffeine content than normal.

    I also sometimes take fat-burners (which almost always have caffeine in them) so stacking this with pwo's that have caffeine give me too much of the stuff! I would like some flexibility to increase the dosages but NOT caffeine!! Controlled Labs also has Blue-up caffeine free, which I have. I think we are raising a generation of kids on too much caffeine destroying their adrenal glands at an early age. Caffeine is so cheap that
    we should be allowed to use the dosages we want in the form of caffeine pills if needed. To me, it's almost a cheap way to give a product "energy" when it's just caffeine. Some of the more popular pwo's (I won't name them) are popular because of too much caffeine it appears. When I looked at the ingredients in one of the most popular pwo's, there was NOTHING remarkable in the formula that made it popular, but it just had a TON of caffeine in it!

    Does anyone know if Condense will come in a caffeine-free version? What do you guys use that's caffeine-free?
    Try caffeine free fastwitch it's a good pre from what I remember
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    Yeah, caffeine isn't going anywhere. It's going to be a mainstay in almost every pre-workout released. You do have some stim free or lower stim options already suggested or making your own powder as also suggested. Just realize it's incredibly unlikely that companies are going to start making a lot of caffeine free pre-workout products. It's in about 99% of all pre-workouts.
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  12. zv3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoforce View Post
    Yeah, caffeine isn't going anywhere. It's going to be a mainstay in almost every pre-workout released. You do have some stim free or lower stim options already suggested or making your own powder as also suggested. Just realize it's incredibly unlikely that companies are going to start making a lot of caffeine free pre-workout products. It's in about 99% of all pre-workouts.
    Your probably right, but I do see a shift AWAY from heavily-stimmed products. At least some companies are offering a stim-free alternative, wish Condense would offer stim-free. I actually see some companies advertising their non-stimmed products in a positive light.
    I see a couple caffeine-free products on the Planet, maybe I will take the leap and test a couple.
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    Enhanced seemed to have a low caffeine content with good doses of other actives if the *** label was accurate.

    Stimulant-Free Focus XT is a great option right now, along with iForce Hemavol
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    The above is my own opinion and does not reflect the opinion of PES
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    Quote Originally Posted by zv3 View Post
    Your probably right, but I do see a shift AWAY from heavily-stimmed products. At least some companies are offering a stim-free alternative, wish Condense would offer stim-free. I actually see some companies advertising their non-stimmed products in a positive light.
    I see a couple caffeine-free products on the Planet, maybe I will take the leap and test a couple.
    unfortunately i agree...supp companies are losing their balls when it comes to strong stims!!!
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    Enhanced has 125 mg, even if dosing 2 scoops it would only be 250mg.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BPjohn123 View Post
    Enhanced has 125 mg, even if dosing 2 scoops it would only be 250mg.
    Psshh read the title bro
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    Quote Originally Posted by FL3X MAGNUM

    Psshh read the title bro
    Read the thread bro
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    Quote Originally Posted by BPjohn123 View Post

    Read the thread bro
    No.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FL3X MAGNUM

    No.
    Lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by BPjohn123 View Post
    Enhanced has 125 mg, even if dosing 2 scoops it would only be 250mg.
    This is IMO the perfect range for me. The naive caffeine user has a yerkes dodson curve peaking at around 100mg for weightlifting, so they can go with 1 scoop, whereas us more experienced users can benefit from 2 scoops.
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    That's how I feel also, I don't like to go much over 100mg caffein when I workout. I would also like to have a bigger "selection" of no stim pre workouts!
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    I have heard some good feedback about Bodyforge by Neogenix for a non stim non caffeine pwo a friend had to lose caffeine because of oddly enough he had a chronic white noise ringing in his ears that went away when he dropped the caffeine. He uses this a loves it.
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    As said before, caffeine is here to stay; and it has more benefits than just an increase in energy (counteracts Adenosine for example) but there are stim-free alternatives dependant on what you want out of your PWO. Caffeine free focus XT is my go-to before a study session (if your after that kind of focus; in the gym it really keeps your mind on what you want to achieve etc) or Hemavol (for pumps etc.). Plenty of good options for whatever your after
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    Quote Originally Posted by zv3 View Post
    Your probably right, but I do see a shift AWAY from heavily-stimmed products. At least some companies are offering a stim-free alternative, wish Condense would offer stim-free. I actually see some companies advertising their non-stimmed products in a positive light.
    I see a couple caffeine-free products on the Planet, maybe I will take the leap and test a couple.
    As well you should. We don't need these massive amounts of stims in pre-workouts that so many companies seem to be fond of. Number one I don't think it's that healthy for users and number 2 I don't think it's that beneficial. Note that I'm talking about the companies that underdose many different ingredients but mega dose that one.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoforce View Post
    As well you should. We don't need these massive amounts of stims in pre-workouts that so many companies seem to be fond of. Number one I don't think it's that healthy for users and number 2 I don't think it's that beneficial. Note that I'm talking about the companies that underdose many different ingredients but mega dose that one.
    there are 2 reasons for that:
    1. you can feel it working almost immediately...almost every review i have read rates the stim effect.
    2. it sells...go to a gas station and see how many energy [caffeine] products are available. why? because many people want them and buy them!!!

    i agree their should be stim free options...but anyone who thinks that supps today are heavy on stims hasn't been around supps very long, imo. 4-5 years ago the stim formulas in supps would make todays stim formulas look like kool aid.
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebigt View Post
    there are 2 reasons for that:
    1. you can feel it working almost immediately...almost every review i have read rates the stim effect.
    2. it sells...go to a gas station and see how many energy [caffeine] products are available. why? because many people want them and buy them!!!

    i agree their should be stim free options...but anyone who thinks that supps today are heavy on stims hasn't been around supps very long, imo. 4-5 years ago the stim formulas in supps would make todays stim formulas look like kool aid.
    Agreed. My main point was that "stopping" with the caffeine isn't going to happen. Now some companies might offer stim free versions and some companies might start making ones with less caffeine. But the idea that they will stop just isn't going to happen. There is a reason it is in 99% of pre-workouts after all.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoforce View Post
    Agreed. My main point was that "stopping" with the caffeine isn't going to happen. Now some companies might offer stim free versions and some companies might start making ones with less caffeine. But the idea that they will stop just isn't going to happen. There is a reason it is in 99% of pre-workouts after all.
    no arguement from me...i like the idea of stim free formulas being available for those that want them....my wish is that if they Are going to put stims in they go big, lol...at least let us who love big stim effects to have that option also!!!!
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    Id like to see more stim free products!
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    CORE is about to release a pre-workout and I know Doug is making a stim and stim free version, and I agree its nice to see companies *starting* to go that route. Or you could do half and half serving if you want a lighter day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelV View Post
    Id like to see more stim free products!
    indeed..and there should be, imo.


    but remember, if this thread were promising a new revolutionary stim product that had ephedra like effects, it would be 70 pages by now!!!
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    The 'stim' in all these products are what sells them. People feel the effect of a stimulant and the placebo effect takes over. "Oh, feel that buzz, I'm gonna have a great work out now" It's total BS, but it makes the Supp Companies millions of dollars.

    When in reality caffeine and other stims do nothing to make you stronger, quite the opposite in fact, especially over the long run.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoforce View Post
    As well you should. We don't need these massive amounts of stims in pre-workouts that so many companies seem to be fond of. Number one I don't think it's that healthy for users and number 2 I don't think it's that beneficial. Note that I'm talking about the companies that underdose many different ingredients but mega dose that one.
    That's my problem, to me it's almost a form of "cheating" to use so much caffeine but not to adequately dose the other ingredients. 100 -200mg of caffeine is good enough for me. People are getting "hooked" on so much caffeine and they are judging how good the pwo products are based on the "stim" feeling, which is just cheap caffeine! I use fat-burners which have caffeine in them, so it's hard to use a pwo and fat-burners together because of the possibility of using too much caffeine. Plus doesn't using too much caffeine burn-out your adrenal glands?

    I like the PES Enhanced approach, they use just enough caffeine so that even at 2 scoops (which I always need for most products) I wont be running on pure caffeine! To me, the higher-quality pwo's use lower dosage caffeine, or none at all. I've had some bad caffeine withdrawal taking to much, and I do some sort of exercise 6 days a week so that is a lot of caffeine! Hemoval is great, so is Ragnoorak from MT. I am still working on what dose works for me using the Focus XT I have. One scoop does not seem to be enough at this time to get me going.

    If Condense would come out with a caffeine-free version I would be all over that!!
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