PWO Stack Essentials ?

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    Hi guys so I want to buy some bulk products to make my own mix of a PWO. I already have caffeine pills so I want to add the following:

    Beta alanine
    Arginine (pump)
    And possibly ALCAR or LCAR (if needed, alcar for a metabolism/test boost would be nice )

    Should I remove alcar or lcar and replace them or should I go with just beta A and arginine. Anything else I should stack?

    I like pump and focus in my stack so anything else that would help I'll buy to add in. Thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by EatMoar
    Hi guys so I want to buy some bulk products to make my own mix of a PWO. I already have caffeine pills so I want to add the following:

    Beta alanine
    Arginine (pump)
    And possibly ALCAR or LCAR (if needed, alcar for a metabolism/test boost would be nice )

    Should I remove alcar or lcar and replace them or should I go with just beta A and arginine. Anything else I should stack?

    I like pump and focus in my stack so anything else that would help I'll buy to add in. Thanks
    Drop arginine and replace with agmatine (500-1000 gram)and citrulline malate (6-8 gram). If you want to talk about pumps . Some people like to add LCLT but I like ALCAR also.
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    Thanks, I'll order tonight. I always found that CM, which is in hemavol, doesn't give me pumps. Its weird. I haven't had great pumps with CM at all.
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    And you mean MG not grams right lol 1000g is a lot to intake that would be skin splitting !
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    You might like Creatine Nitrate stacked with Agmatine and then some strong stimulants
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    Did you dose Hemavol at 2 scoops? If so then you honestly you probably won't find much to help you with pumps (as that includes strong doses of Agmatine, Norvaline, Citrulline, and GMS).

    SAN CM2 plus ALCAR would cover all you listed plus adding Creatine Nitrate which may help aid in the pump you are looking for (while presenting many benefits regardless of pump). If you really want focus something like Focus XT (which contains ALCAR) + CM2 would be a nice combo.

    Keep in mind Beta Alanine needs to be dosed daily if you decide to pick some up.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bolt10
    Did you dose Hemavol at 2 scoops? If so then you honestly you probably won't find much to help you with pumps (as that includes strong doses of Agmatine, Norvaline, Citrulline, and GMS).

    SAN CM2 plus ALCAR would cover all you listed plus adding Creatine Nitrate which may help aid in the pump you are looking for (while presenting many benefits regardless of pump). If you really want focus something like Focus XT (which contains ALCAR) + CM2 would be a nice combo.

    Keep in mind Beta Alanine needs to be dosed daily if you decide to pick some up.
    Hmm should I just go with focus XT, beta A and some agmatine. I dosed it at 1 scoop I was scared to go with two scoops lol.
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    You've got some great responses. I'd go with Agmatime (no arginine), a creatine product, beta alanine, and I'd put some BCAA's in there as well. I agree that CM doesn't give the best pumps, other creatines seem to do a better job of that. In fact, citrulline at the right amount is going to be your best bet for pumps. I'd also opt for Tyrosine in a gram quantity coupled with caffeine and possibly another synergistic stim. I used to pop 2-3 grams tyrosine and it seemed to help improve focus enhancement.

    What are going to do post workout? I feel CM is better post workout from my experiences.
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    Quote Originally Posted by hossjob
    You've got some great responses. I'd go with Agmatime (no arginine), a creatine product, beta alanine, and I'd put some BCAA's in there as well. I agree that CM doesn't give the best pumps, other creatines seem to do a better job of that. In fact, citrulline at the right amount is going to be your best bet for pumps. I'd also opt for Tyrosine in a gram quantity coupled with caffeine and possibly another synergistic stim. I used to pop 2-3 grams tyrosine and it seemed to help improve focus enhancement.

    What are going to do post workout? I feel CM is better post workout from my experiences.
    For post workout I take my weight gainer and have a meal. Why CM post workout ?
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    I typically just buy a formulation that has the ingredients that I trust already in it. I find that its less of a pain in the ass and taste better.
    But, for the sake of answering your specific question I'd say in my experience

    glycerol. you need to keep hydrated when using this to keep from cramping but, it pulls subq water into the blood stream and in turn vasodilates and also helps volumize

    agmatine sulfate. L-arginine is converted to agmatine. You'll find that not only does this give great pumps but will act as a nutrient partitioner and aid in the release of hgh and igf1

    Creatine. Im old school. Monohydrate has the most science backing it so I feel that it still offers the most benefits when used properly.That being said I prefer taking it with a carb. which leads me to my next one..

    Waximaize Starch. Waxi is a complex carb that drops through the gut extremely fast. As it does this it pulls nutrients with it. This increases their absorption and performance.

    Multi Mineral complex with at least a gram of calcium and a tsp of salt. You better believe that nothing will effect your pump or blood volume more than hydration and having the right electrolytes is king. These also play a huge role in make a good contraction especially calcium. Salt in the most important electrolyte and most bodybuilders who eat clean regularly don't get enough.

    Again I prefer to take a supplement that already includes everything that I want in it. I usually add the calcium and salt if I'm precontest. LG Sciences offers two pre workouts that have great ingredients and depending on your desired results or if your cutting or bulking will benefit you. Not to mention you can find them usually for just under 30$ Check out Epic and Anadraulic state GT
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    Quote Originally Posted by EatMoar

    For post workout I take my weight gainer and have a meal. Why CM post workout ?
    Don't take CM postworkout. And ya I meant 500-1000 mg (agmatine) and 6-8 gram (CM). My bad on that part.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigMikeC
    I typically just buy a formulation that has the ingredients that I trust already in it. I find that its less of a pain in the ass and taste better.
    But, for the sake of answering your specific question I'd say in my experience

    glycerol. you need to keep hydrated when using this to keep from cramping but, it pulls subq water into the blood stream and in turn vasodilates and also helps volumize

    agmatine sulfate. L-arginine is converted to agmatine. You'll find that not only does this give great pumps but will act as a nutrient partitioner and aid in the release of hgh and igf1

    Creatine. Im old school. Monohydrate has the most science backing it so I feel that it still offers the most benefits when used properly.That being said I prefer taking it with a carb. which leads me to my next one..

    Waximaize Starch. Waxi is a complex carb that drops through the gut extremely fast. As it does this it pulls nutrients with it. This increases their absorption and performance.

    Multi Mineral complex with at least a gram of calcium and a tsp of salt. You better believe that nothing will effect your pump or blood volume more than hydration and having the right electrolytes is king. These also play a huge role in make a good contraction especially calcium. Salt in the most important electrolyte and most bodybuilders who eat clean regularly don't get enough.

    Again I prefer to take a supplement that already includes everything that I want in it. I usually add the calcium and salt if I'm precontest. LG Sciences offers two pre workouts that have great ingredients and depending on your desired results or if your cutting or bulking will benefit you. Not to mention you can find them usually for just under 30$ Check out Epic and Anadraulic state GT
    Hm I'll take a look at hat big mike thanks . Lol its all good bayne I know what you meant. Well I'll see, if I can find a product with everything I want in it is buy it. If not I'll add in whatever isn't there . That sounds like a good plan. Thanks for all the help fellas
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    Quote Originally Posted by kbayne View Post
    Drop arginine and replace with agmatine and citrulline malate..
    I thought that right off the bat. Good advice.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigMikeC View Post
    I typically just buy a formulation that has the ingredients that I trust already in it. I find that its less of a pain in the ass and taste better.
    But, for the sake of answering your specific question I'd say in my experience

    glycerol. you need to keep hydrated when using this to keep from cramping but, it pulls subq water into the blood stream and in turn vasodilates and also helps volumize

    agmatine sulfate. L-arginine is converted to agmatine. You'll find that not only does this give great pumps but will act as a nutrient partitioner and aid in the release of hgh and igf1

    Creatine. Im old school. Monohydrate has the most science backing it so I feel that it still offers the most benefits when used properly.That being said I prefer taking it with a carb. which leads me to my next one..

    Waximaize Starch. Waxi is a complex carb that drops through the gut extremely fast. As it does this it pulls nutrients with it. This increases their absorption and performance.

    Multi Mineral complex with at least a gram of calcium and a tsp of salt. You better believe that nothing will effect your pump or blood volume more than hydration and having the right electrolytes is king. These also play a huge role in make a good contraction especially calcium. Salt in the most important electrolyte and most bodybuilders who eat clean regularly don't get enough.

    Again I prefer to take a supplement that already includes everything that I want in it. I usually add the calcium and salt if I'm precontest. LG Sciences offers two pre workouts that have great ingredients and depending on your desired results or if your cutting or bulking will benefit you. Not to mention you can find them usually for just under 30$ Check out Epic and Anadraulic state GT

    Another good post. There is a small company out there called Morphogen Nutrition that has a product called Alphagen. Great product. Basically all the Pre Workout stuff that is proven to work in "scientific" studies is in it, at the "scientifically PROVEN doses". Now, it does not contain agmatine. It does though have creatine mono, beta alanine, arginine, citrulline and a few other ingredients. Bang for your buck, and ingredients dosed right, it's a great product.

    I also agree with adding a carbohydrate if you are not cutting. I'm not a fan of WMS just because it gave me heart burn, many people love it. You could do WMS, karbolyn, hydrolyzed brown rice solids, etc... And I love glycerol. I used to use a preworkout product that had glycerol in it and it gave the best pumps.
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    Epic has 10grams of glycerol per serving! Gnarly pumps!
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigMikeC View Post
    Epic has 10grams of glycerol per serving! Gnarly pumps!
    thats a real simple complex. I may have to give that a try.
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    Controlled Labs Glycergrow has glycerol monostearate with 7.5 grams per 3 scoops and its an insane deal. $20 some bucks for 120 servings.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kbayne View Post
    Controlled Labs Glycergrow has glycerol monostearate with 7.5 grams per 3 scoops and its an insane deal. $20 some bucks for 120 servings.
    An awful ingredient.OP, try this:Caffeine TabBronkaid TabSNS Citrulline MalateSNS ALCAR
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    An awful ingredient.OP, try this:Caffeine TabBronkaid TabSNS Citrulline MalateSNS ALCAR
    Mmmhhmmmm...

    Caution, OP. With Coop's suggested stack, you may experience the best workouts of your life.
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    Quote Originally Posted by domore View Post
    Mmmhhmmmm...Caution, OP. With Coop's suggested stack, you may experience the best workouts of your life.
    Damn AM formatting ruining my post lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Damn AM formatting ruining my post lol
    Finally ordered my tubs of Focus XT. I went with Cotton Candy and Pink Lemonade. Mixing bulk nootropics gets tiring.
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    Why is glycerol bad? Time to research :P does it have to be SNS products coop?
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    Quote Originally Posted by EatMoar View Post
    Why is glycerol bad? Time to research :P does it have to be SNS products coop?
    Nope, though anecdotally, I prefer our citrulline malate over other brands
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    Quote Originally Posted by domore View Post
    Finally ordered my tubs of Focus XT. I went with Cotton Candy and Pink Lemonade. Mixing bulk nootropics gets tiring.
    Prepare yourself. Gone are the days of getting chills on your forearms because your nootropic combo tastes so gross.
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    Quote Originally Posted by domore View Post
    Finally ordered my tubs of Focus XT. I went with Cotton Candy and Pink Lemonade. Mixing bulk nootropics gets tiring.
    Focus XT look nice, i would order some of that but after beast mode i dont like products with DMAE and huperzune A. They give me shortness of breath and a bad head ache after :\
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Prepare yourself. Gone are the days of getting chills on your forearms because your nootropic combo tastes so gross.
    They should arrive tomorrow. I feel like a little kid in a candy store.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69
    An awful ingredient.OP, try this:Caffeine TabBronkaid TabSNS Citrulline MalateSNS ALCAR
    I was considering trying CL Glycergrow especially because the price point but now I'm scared (to waste money lol) but is it a bad product or just inferior to some others?
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    Quote Originally Posted by EatLiftGrow View Post
    I was considering trying CL Glycergrow especially because the price point but now I'm scared (to waste money lol) but is it a bad product or just inferior to some others?
    IMO (and this is pretty much Coops thoughts as well I believe) GMS is a pretty useless ingredient.

    I have a tub of GG but only use it when I run ArA pre-workout for emulsification.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bolt10 View Post
    IMO (and this is pretty much Coops thoughts as well I believe) GMS is a pretty useless ingredient.

    I have a tub of GG but only use it when I run ArA pre-workout for emulsification.
    Did not know that. Will keep this in mind for sure though.
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    I should note I believe it holds some possible benefits for endurance athletes but I am not one of those.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bolt10

    IMO (and this is pretty much Coops thoughts as well I believe) GMS is a pretty useless ingredient.

    I have a tub of GG but only use it when I run ArA pre-workout for emulsification.
    Thanks for the info brotha.... Just saved me some dough.

    TIME TO BUY BULK INGREDIENTS!

    Coop.... Your stack is greatly considered :-)
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    Quote Originally Posted by EatLiftGrow View Post
    Thanks for the info brotha.... Just saved me some dough.

    TIME TO BUY BULK INGREDIENTS!

    Coop.... Your stack is greatly considered :-)
    If Coop offers advice, you must take it!
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    I went with alphamine and beta A .completely off the topic of this thread but I couldn't help myself! But I'm gonna order coops stack in a couple weeks too
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    Glycerol in any form is largely worthless unless you need help:

    a. stabilizing blood pressure
    b. increasing renal water reabsorption (during states of extreme dehydration like a marathon).

    Glycerol acts osmolytically in the extracellular space to constrict the myocyte, with the net effect being muscular DEhydration and compression...the opposite of what you want. That, and it adds the most unenjoyable 6g of saturated fat to your diet.
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