Natty Test Stack Androgel, DAA, Erase, Endosurge first log

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    Thumbs up Natty Test Stack Androgel, DAA, Erase, Endosurge first log


    Okay, I have been reading the boards for awhile and have decided to run this stack and log results. Low down: got my lab work back at free test 6.6 overall 330. Age 21 5'10 170 9% BF, doing crossfit 5 days per week HIIT. Eat strict paleo. IF from Leangains.

    Doc gave me a bunch of 1% 5g Androgel so I am going to be using it for 4 weeks. During which I will also be taking DAA(SNS caps and Nutra planet bulk),Erase, and Endosurge for 8 weeks. Additional supps: Xyzal(prescription anti histamine),4,000IU D3, Krill oil, Green Tea Extra, K2, some Orange Triad. Take 10g BCAA preworkout; whey and mono creatine post. Casein protein and magnesium powder before bed (8pm for IF). Usually drink alcohol in moderation few shots of whiskey, vodka, tequila diet soda no grains/gluten.

    Day 1: Did two packages of Androgel after workout about 6pm and felt great

    Day 2: Did 1 package Gel in am with a Roxy Lean by BPI pill I got for free. I felt good energy until the niacin/thiamin caused me to turn red itchy and feel like bawls. I couldn't even drink my daily coffee at work and usually can drink 4 or 5 cups black by noon no problem. Workout went poorly as I had tightness in chest and heart was being weird. Not cool. Don't know if it is the Roxy or Andro. Tomorrow will only be 1 package Androgel no Roxy. (still waiting on my shipment of Daa/Erase/Endosurge should be starting it Friday).

    Day 3 will be written tomorrow. I encourage any feedback or suggestions as I have time to kill.
    PS
    I did consider about running some Titanium XL, Anabeta or IGF-2 or maybe even some DHEA/LDOPA, but thought the endo/erase were sufficient. I am trying to stay lean/leaner but gain strength and ultimately bring my Testosterone to higher levels.

    8/25 Day 4: Drank a little beer last night oops… Did the filthy fifty WOD Saturday morning and felt pretty good. Heavy foam rolling for about 45 minutes to break up lactic acid and tissues. Noticing a little stiffness in the joints, cracking knuckles more often but not painful. Energy is good and sleep came on pretty easily at night.

    8/26 Day 5: It’s Sunday, went for light jog (3miles) in the morning but had bowel irritability that greatly hindered distance and speed…. Not sure if it was because I ate some questionable non paleo foods or the supps... Went to Church after and felt alert and focused. I rested the remainder of day.

    8/27 Monday Day 6: Sleep is remaining fantastic!!

    This is going to be the 3rd day in which I am taking a full 75mg of the Erase. Overall, I notice I am peeing more frequently and longer. Dehydrating a bit? Slightly more vascular in the forearms (I have always been so here) Not veiny anywhere else at this point. Body composition seems a little leaner in lower stomach. No painful nips or swelling that I can tell. Going to Crossfit in the afternoon and working late this evening with a possible softball game. Started chewing a little Thermogum and enjoying it at work.
    *I have been alternating caps and powder for the daa and have not made any conclusions except the pills look BA and the powder is only convenient if it is used in my pre workout shake.

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    Natty Test Stack Androgel, DAA, Erase, Endosurge 8 weeks


    Currently, my blood results are Free Test 6.6 & Overall T 330; consequently, they are low for my age. I have not done a “cycle” but at 16 ran some Winnie, sus-500, followed by nolva-xt… Not the best ran stack because I was new. Since then I have been all natural.

    Goal: Lose last bit of BF, gain strength and hormonal benefits of increased Testosterone while avoiding Estrogen/Prolactin effects.

    Moreover, my newest natty test stack is in response to low T. (Crossfit+Paleo lost 26 lbs. past 2.5 months)
    • Doing HIIT 5 days: M,Tu,W,rest,F,ST,rest at Crossfit.
    • Following a pretty strict Paleo/Primal lifestyle high grass-fed meats veggies quality fats and low carbs.
    • Also, follow Lean Gains 16 hour fast/8 hour eating window.

    Day looks like this:

    Wake 7am
    Work 730am
    EAT 12
    WOD 430pm
    Last meal 8pm
    Sleep 11pm

    I will be taking the following supplements:
    1-4week: 1% 5g Androgel
    1-8week: DAA, Endosurge, Erase and below

    3g DAA (SNS caps (SodiumDAA) and NP bulk powder)
    2/2/2 Endosurge
    1/1/1 PES ERASE (OG)

    Daily: Orange Triad 3 pills or 6 depends on day. + 4,000IU D3 Calceriferol, K2, Green Tea, Fish Oil.
    PREWO- 10g BCAA+1scoop Flashover
    Post- 1 scoop XF whey+ 4g Creatine
    Night: 600mg Magnesium, XF Casein 1g Creatine
    *antihistamine Xyzal for allergy shots.

    **Comment on anything and everything, I love reading and replying.
    Notice: I did look into supplementing L-Dopa but Endosurge has plenty. Looked into DHEA as well but didn’t see a big benefit. Thought about IGF-2 but need to learn more about the endocrinology and neural pathways. I am a Biomedical Engineer btw.
    Any thoughts on Anabeta? Titanium?




    8/22 Day 1: Only took the Androgel today since the daa/endo/erase has not arrived. Felt okay got a warm feeling after about 15minutes rest of day nothing noticeable.

    8/23 Day 2: Took my Androgel in the morning but included a ROXYLEAN sample I received and felt like bawlz! My body completely flushed from the thiamin/niacin I assume and had major depression low energy bad mood. Workout suffered tremendously.

    8/24 Day 3: Received the daa/endo/erase part of the stack wahooo! Took the entire proposed stack before workout and had fantastic energy levels. First time using Flashpoint and it provided good energy no crash. (First time using Flashover and I liked it) Did 2 reps 155 snatch every minute for 10 minutes. Did 2 reps 185 power clean into push press every minute for 10 additional minutes.

    8/25 Day 4: Drank a little beer last night oops… Did the filthy fifty WOD Saturday morning and felt pretty good. Heavy foam rolling for about 45 minutes to break up lactic acid and tissues. Noticing a little stiffness in the joints, cracking knuckles more often but not painful. Energy is good and sleep came on pretty easily at night.

    8/26 Day 5: It’s Sunday, went for light jog (3miles) in the morning but had bowel irritability that greatly hindered distance and speed…. Not sure if it was because I ate some questionable non paleo foods or the supps... Went to Church after and felt alert and focused. I rested the remainder of day.

    8/27 Monday Day 6: Sleep is remaining fantastic!!

    This is going to be the 3rd day in which I am taking a full 75mg of the Erase. Overall, I notice I am peeing more frequently and longer. Dehydrating a bit? Slightly more vascular in the forearms (I have always been so here) Not veiny anywhere else at this point. Body composition seems a little leaner in lower stomach. No painful nips or swelling that I can tell. Going to Crossfit in the afternoon and working late this evening with a possible softball game. Started chewing a little Thermogum and enjoying it at work.
    *I have been alternating caps and powder for the daa and have not made any conclusions except the pills look BA and the powder is only convenient if it is used in my pre workout shake.
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    8/28 Day 7: Overall feeling good and sleep is my biggest benefit. Weight fluctiated a little on the upside for the weekend, but nothing some IF cant fix. Been drinking lots of coffee and a few thermogum for the thermo effects. Joints are a little more dry than yesterday but not yet painful. Continue to dry in the skin area and still no gyno or nip problems.
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    Anyone recommend LCLT in the mix?
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    i was asking about LCLT and ALCAR earlier,,check my thread some good responses...both Carnitines from what i understand are big staples...Im ordering some goods this weekend.

    what exactly is androgel? obviously some sort of t booster
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    I just got on androgel recently and "the guys" ripped me a new one for taking DAA alongside it ....they said you can't raise/signal your endogenous test up even if its just 2.5 or 5G packets (pretty low dose of 2.5-5mg per day at 1% gel and 10% absorption) of androgel since it exogenous test....and low dose exogenous test will suppress your endogenous test just the same as high dose exogenous test would. I'm not 100% sold on that, while i take the 2.5g or 5g gel packs? I will continue the DAA...once I bump to 7.5g or 10g? (Hopefully ) I will for sure discontinue the DAA since that will be around 100mg per week give or take 25mg (depending on 10% or 20% or whatever percent absorption). but say I'm at 25-50mg per week? I figure DAA might still work at those VERY low dosages....but who knows what kind of absorption we are getting? hell could be 50% for all I know. Esp if people apply it to thin skin areas and areas where there are lots of veins and arteries...with DMSO...not that I do that....
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    This is not a natty stack if it consist of exogenous testosterone... if I were you I would drop androgel run a "real" natural stack and quit crossfit. I recommend something along the lines of a powerlifting or Olympic training. 5-3-1 DC Training or something else but definitely NOT crossfit
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    You might have a problem if you drink 5 cups of coffee by noon....... Can you function without any stims? ??!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay888999 View Post

    what exactly is androgel? obviously some sort of t booster
    androgel is a form of TRT/HRT (testosterone replacement therapy). it's in topical gel form instead of injections....but the gel % and absorption rate suck terribly. if you dose it high enough, and use some tricks of the trade, you can get some pretty good mg amounts from it though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tigersrb6754
    I am trying to stay lean/leaner but gain strength and ultimately bring my Testosterone to higher levels.
    Don't crossfit.....
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    but yeah, this isn't a natty cycle/stack , quite the opposite. anything with testosterone? probably shouldn't be called natty.
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    I do have to contend that the daa will do nothing if his is on androgel two packs a day..... the 5 cups of black coffee, thermo gum and Roxy lean really frightens me...... I hope he is not on hrt / trt. If he continues he might need a serm.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Callejul View Post
    I do have to contend that the daa will do nothing if his is on androgel two packs a day..... the 5 cups of black coffee, thermo gum and Roxy lean really frightens me...... I hope he is not on hrt / trt. If he continues he might need a serm.
    I think he just got a 4 week supply from his doctor? so I think its just a cycle with the androgel. unless he is going to get on it full time after the sample packs run out.
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    Correct, I am only using the 1packet per day of Androgel for 4 weeks everything else for 8 weeks. So I guess to be politically correct it is a "half" natural test boosting since the Androgel is being introduced for the first 4 weeks...

    Roxylean: If you read the post critically I had a sample in the mail, so I took [1] one Roxylean and documented the effects as it greatly perturbed my body. It is not a habitual supplement.
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    Day 8 8/28 + 8/29 Day 9: Got a new PR at Crossfit WOD set of 1 for 420lbs DL. This morning awoke kinda tired watching the stims today lol.
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    Pretty sure snatchs, cleans, and deadlights are oly lifts... This thread was not made to dispute crossfit fyi.
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    Do people recommend stopping the Androgel even though it would only be for 4 weeks and use just the daa/erase/endo I also picked up so lclt that I am running now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tigersrb6754 View Post
    Do people recommend stopping the Androgel even though it would only be for 4 weeks and use just the daa/erase/endo I also picked up so lclt that I am running now.
    maybe either choose androgel OR DAA and run one of them with the other stuff. if you do androgel you should run a SERM probably fo PCT...only 4 weeks of lower dose test....but will probably shut you down. maybe run the androgel for the cycle then run the DAA with PCT (with SERM). but not sure how much 4 weeks of 5g androgel will do for you.....really not sure on that....
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    So just stop the androgel now since I do not have a SERM and just run the remaining 8 weeks on DAA/LCLT/Erase/Endo. Im also doing prework out of flashover some Beta alanine/creatine/taurine
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    Androgel is not natty big boy. It will shut u down after a while and only provides low dose of test
    U would have to use like 5+ a day.
    GAME ON! MOVAH FUKAZ!
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplement-reviews-logs/231867-man-sports-gameday.html#post4047619
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    Quote Originally Posted by tigersrb6754 View Post
    So just stop the androgel now since I do not have a SERM and just run the remaining 8 weeks on DAA/LCLT/Erase/Endo. Im also doing prework out of flashover some Beta alanine/creatine/taurine
    yeah, I would not run androgel on a cycle if I did not have a SERM...its a good "test base" dosage (and its actually test, no conversion needed like DHEA topicals and other test base PH's)...but even that small amount of test will most likely shut you down somewhat, if it actually will? or how much? who is to really know. safest bet is to run a SERM. maybe just stockpile the stuff and run it later as a test base if you decide to run a cycle that requires PCT (like a harsher PH or DS cycle). you are gonna get shutdown anyways on such a cycle so the small doses of test will only do you good and your SERM will restart your HPTA (God willing )....
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    Quote Originally Posted by murk01 View Post
    Androgel is not natty big boy. It will shut u down after a while and only provides low dose of test
    U would have to use like 5+ a day.
    I feel you can get up over 100mg per week on 3-4 gel packs a day of the 2.5g....provided you increase the absorption by applying it the correct places and provide a better carrier....but everybody is different, and get different absorption rates, so there is no way to know for sure what you are getting.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WARBIRDWS6

    yeah, I would not run androgel on a cycle if I did not have a SERM...its a good "test base" dosage (and its actually test, no conversion needed like DHEA topicals and other test base PH's)...but even that small amount of test will most likely shut you down somewhat, if it actually will? or how much? who is to really know. safest bet is to run a SERM. maybe just stockpile the stuff and run it later as a test base if you decide to run a cycle that requires PCT (like a harsher PH or DS cycle). you are gonna get shutdown anyways on such a cycle so the small doses of test will only do you good and your SERM will restart your HPTA (God willing )....
    Good call on using it as test base never though of that
    GAME ON! MOVAH FUKAZ!
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplement-reviews-logs/231867-man-sports-gameday.html#post4047619
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    Thanks y'all for the feedback, I do appreciate it as it behooves myself more than anything. I am cutting out the Androgel; moreover, I did not take it this morning and do not feel like buying a SERM for such a "weak" product like Androgel. I just had some laying around and thought why not. Will continue to log progress of 8 weeks of the aforementioned products. With the introduction of new preworkouts.
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    I used Androgel for quite some time and went off of it with no SERM. Just a natty test cycle. My test levels recovered to my normal levels - only around 400. I think you'll be fine with no SERM. You ran a low dose for just a few weeks. I'm not a big Androgel fan for many reasons, but I have used it as a test base on 3 cycles now and think it does a great job at that.
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    Update


    So it has been several weeks now and noticing major dry skin. Some flaking as if I was sunburned but nothing major; localized to upper arms. Hands are very dry at the gym I have now ripped off skin twice, which blows. Observations: More alpha male feeling and increase to strength and endurance. I can finish a WOD and recover shortly after.

    New PR Deadlift 405lbs for 6 reps
    New Box PR for 3 WODs in past 2 weeks

    Doing the EOD WOD for Military Hero coming home this weekend 'crossfitconway.com/2012/09/eod-weaver-wod'
    Similar to Murph, gonna be fun this will be a testament to the test boost

    Overall I am almost halfway through the weight lose has plateaued diet is about 95% Paleo during the week 20% on the weekend continuing with IF. Joints are officially dried out so have been taking the Orange Triad again with plenty of Fish Oil.

    That is pretty much it need to start planning how to wean off everything but liking it for now. Thanks for the comments and advice
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    Gonna sub in on this.
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    Mood is good. Diet was terrible this weekend and have gained about a pound of weight. Anyways the joints feel better overall but wrists are sore every-time I lift. Lots of cardio past few days felt good. Overall, no major changes. Minor change would be I am craving junk food more often. Strength is still good flexibility fair recovery awesome. Just finished 1 of 2 bottles of Erase and Endosurge. Continue to alternate the DAA caps vs powder and don't have any definitive or quantitative evidence to support either. So 4 weeks to go suggestions how to tapper off at the end?
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    Quote Originally Posted by AngryOldMan View Post
    I used Androgel for quite some time and went off of it with no SERM. Just a natty test cycle. My test levels recovered to my normal levels - only around 400. I think you'll be fine with no SERM. You ran a low dose for just a few weeks. I'm not a big Androgel fan for many reasons, but I have used it as a test base on 3 cycles now and think it does a great job at that.
    how high did your testosterone result go while on the gel (TRT style not cycled)? and at what dosage of the gel?
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    Quote Originally Posted by WARBIRDWS6

    how high did your testosterone result go while on the gel (TRT style not cycled)? and at what dosage of the gel?
    I found that my test levels would climb after my script levels got bumped, but then they would slowly fall back to normal range. IIRC, the highest I ever got up to was around 650ish. Then my levels would fall and the doc would bump up my script. After getting up to the max dose, 10 pumps which is 12.5g I think, I got kinda discouraged. The levels dropped again, and that's when I decided to get off the train. I now save my script for a test base while cycling only. I am now in the low 400s naturally. But, while on TRT my my test ranged from about 500 up to 650. A little better, for me, but not enough to justify the cost and hassle. But, it does make for a great test base on cycle. Minimal sides and great results. I have no complaints with it used this way.

    If you're thinking Androgel can get you up to 800 range AND keep you there, I'd be very surprised. But, maybe with a low dose AI, and something like Endosurge to free up your total test, you might be able to get better results than I. Good luck.
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    Update I got about 4 weeks left, any advice for the weaning off of daa, erase, and endo? I am going to try the cycle armor that just came out super cheap so why not. Will continue with whey, casein, bcaa and preworkouts. New PR for snatch grip push press 275. New PR 3 RM FS 300 ass to ground.
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    Got my Cycle Armor today and its a really nice looking ingredient supplement we will see if I notice any changes for upper GI or anything. FYI at work I at 18 nutty buddies the little debby waffer things it suckkkkkkkksss. Its not the fullness but the fake taste and horrible feeling you get, try it.
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    Well I have about a week left at one dose of everything per day as a taper. Liked the results and gains immensely and would run this again. Definitely noticed the drying of joints and OT mitigated this well. Plan to get blood and bf results soon.
  

  
 

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