Green Coffee Bean & Weight Loss

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    Green Coffee Bean & Weight Loss


    via Science Daily

    ScienceDaily (Mar. 27, 2012) Scientists have just reported striking new evidence that green, or unroasted, coffee beans can produce a substantial decrease in body weight in a relatively short period of time.

    In a study presented at the 243rd National Meeting & Exposition of the American Chemical Society (ACS), the world's largest scientific society, Joe Vinson, Ph.D., and colleagues described how a group of overweight or obese people who consumed a fraction of an ounce of ground green coffee beans each day lost about 10 percent of their body weight.

    "Based on our results, taking multiple capsules of green coffee extract a day -- while eating a low-fat, healthful diet and exercising regularly -- appears to be a safe, effective, inexpensive way to lose weight," Vinson said at the ACS meeting, being held in San Diego the week of March 26. He is with the University of Scranton in Pennsylvania.

    The study involved 16 overweight or obese people aged 22-26 years who took capsules of the extract or capsules containing a placebo, an inactive powder, for a total of 22 weeks. The subjects alternated between a low dose and a higher dose of the extract. The low dose consisted of 700 mg of the coffee extract, and the high dose was 1,050 mg. It was a so-called "cross-over" study in which people cycled through the two doses and the placebo, each for six weeks. Such studies have advantages because each person serves as his or her own "control," improving the chances of getting an accurate result.

    All of the participants were monitored for their overall diet (calories, food eaten, etc.) and exercise over the study period. "Their calories, carbohydrates, fats and protein intake did not change during the study, nor did their exercise regimen change," Vinson said.

    Participants lost an average of 17 pounds during the 22 weeks of the study. It included an average of a 10.5 percent decrease in overall body weight and a 16 percent decrease in body fat. Vinson noted that weight loss might have been significantly faster, except that participants received the placebo and the lower dose of green coffee extract for part of the study period.

    Vinson pointed out that previous studies have shown weight loss with green coffee. But this was the first to use higher amounts of the coffee extract and the first to measure the response to various doses. Based on those studies, Vinson believes that green coffee beans' effects likely are due to a substance called chlorogenic acid that is present in unroasted coffee beans. Chlorogenic acid breaks down when coffee beans are roasted (usually at a temperature of 464-482 degrees Fahrenheit). Roasting gives coffee beans their distinctive color, aroma and flavor. Green coffee beans, in contrast, have little aroma and a slightly bitter taste.
    Original study

    Randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled, linear dose, crossover study to evaluate the efficacy and safety of a green coffee bean extract in overweight subjects

    Background
    Adult weight gain and obesity have become worldwide problems. Issues of cost and potential side effects of prescription weight loss drugs have led overweight and obese adults to try nutraceuticals that may aid weight loss. One promising nutraceutical is green coffee extract, which contains high concentrations of chlorogenic acids that are known to have health benefits and to influence glucose and fat metabolism. A 22-week crossover study was conducted to examine the efficacy and safety of a commercial green coffee extract product GCA at reducing weight and body mass in 16 overweight adults.

    Methods
    Subjects received high-dose GCA (1050 mg), low-dose GCA (700 mg), or placebo in separate six-week treatment periods followed by two-week washout periods to reduce any influence of preceding treatment. Treatments were counterbalanced between subjects. Primary measurements were body weight, body mass index, and percent body fat. Heart rate and blood pressure were also measured.

    Results
    Significant reductions were observed in body weight (−8.04 2.31 kg), body mass index (−2.92 0.85 kg/m2), and percent body fat (−4.44% 2.00%), as well as a small decrease in heart rate (−2.56 2.85 beats per minute), but with no significant changes to diet over the course of the study. Importantly, the decreases occurred when subjects were taking GCA. Body mass index for six subjects shifted from preobesity to the normal weight range (<25.00 kg/m2).

    Conclusion
    The results are consistent with human and animal studies and a meta-analysis of the efficacy of green coffee extract in weight loss. The results suggest that GCA may be an effective nutraceutical in reducing weight in preobese adults, and may be an inexpensive means of preventing obesity in overweight adults.

    Keywords: green coffee bean extract, chlorogenic acid, body mass index, weight loss, body fat mass, blood pressure, heart rate

    Full Text Here - Randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled, linear dose, crossover study to evaluate the efficacy and safety of a green coffee bean extract in overweight subjects
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    Via the text



    HD=1g/day, LD=700mg/day and PL=placebo and they switched treatment arms at 6 and 14 weeks.

    So this now begs the question, what is the MOA at work here?

    Perhaps an appetite suppressing effect?

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    Nope, doesn't look like it. So let's digger deeper and see if pubmed as anything else on this

    The effect of chlorogenic acid enriched coffee on glucose absorption in healthy volunteers and its effect on body mass when used long-term in overweight and obese people.Abstract

    The results from a clinical study performed in 12 healthy volunteers with different coffee products containing glucose show that instant coffee enriched with chlorogenic acid induced a reduction in the absorption of glucose of 6.9% compared with the control. No such effects were seen with normal or decaffeinated instant coffee. In a second, comparative, randomized, double-blind, 12-week study we investigated the effect on the body mass of 30 overweight people, compared with normal instant coffee. The average losses in mass in the chlorogenic acid enriched and normal instant coffee groups were 5.4 and 1.7 kg, respectively. We conclude that chlorogenic acid enriched instant coffee appears to have a significant effect on the absorption and utilization of glucose from the diet. This effect, if the coffee is used for an extended time, may result in reduced body mass and body fat when compared with the use of normal instant coffee.
    So possibly the chlorogenic acid in the green coffee is preventing the full utilization of the calories?
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    Also appears to lower blood pressure

    The blood pressure-lowering effect and safety of chlorogenic acid from green coffee bean extract in essential hypertension.Abstract

    Chlorogenic acids (CGA) in green coffee bean extract (GCE) reduce blood pressure in spontaneously hypertensive rats and humans. The authors examined the blood pressure-lowering effect and safety of CGA in patients with mild hypertension through a placebo-controlled, randomized clinical trial. Subjects (n = 28) were randomized to receive treatment with CGA (140 mg/day) from GCE or placebo. Blood pressure, pulse rate, body mass index, routine blood test, hematochemistry, urinalysis, and subjective symptoms were recorded throughout the study. In the CGA group, but not the placebo group, blood pressure (systolic and diastolic) decreased significantly during the ingestion period. There was no difference in body mass index and pulse rate between groups, nor were there any apparent side effects. Thus, CGA from GCE is effective in decreasing blood pressure and safe for patients with mild hypertension.
    And also raises homocysteine

    Consumption of high doses of chlorogenic acid, present in coffee, or of black tea increases plasma total homocysteine concentrations in humans.BACKGROUND:

    In population studies, high intakes of coffee are associated with raised concentrations of plasma homocysteine, a predictor of risk of cardiovascular disease. Chlorogenic acid is a major polyphenol in coffee; coffee drinkers consume up to 1 g chlorogenic acid/d.
    OBJECTIVE:

    We studied whether chlorogenic acid affects plasma total homocysteine concentrations in humans. For comparison we also studied the effects of black tea rich in polyphenols and of quercetin-3-rutinoside, a major flavonol in tea and apples.
    DESIGN:

    In this crossover study, 20 healthy men and women ingested 2 g (5.5 mmol) chlorogenic acid, 4 g black tea solids containing approximately 4.3 mmol polyphenols and comparable to approximately 2 L strong black tea, 440 mg (0.7 mmol) quercetin-3-rutinoside, or a placebo daily. Each subject received each of the 4 treatments for 7 d, in random order.
    RESULTS:

    Total homocysteine in plasma collected 4-5 h after supplement intake was 12% (1.2 micromol/L; 95% CI: 0.6, 1.7) higher after chlorogenic acid and 11% (1.1 micromol/L; 95% CI: 0.6, 1.5) higher after black tea than after placebo. Total homocysteine in fasting plasma collected 20 h after supplement intake was 4% (0.4 micromol/L; 95% CI: 0.0, 0.8) higher after chlorogenic acid and 5% (0.5 micromol/L; 95% CI: 0.0, 0.9) higher after black tea than after placebo. Quercetin-3-rutinoside did not significantly affect homocysteine concentrations.
    CONCLUSIONS:

    Chlorogenic acid, a compound in coffee, and black tea raise total homocysteine concentrations in plasma. Chlorogenic acid could be partly responsible for the higher homocysteine concentrations observed in coffee drinkers. Whether these effects on homocysteine influence cardiovascular disease risk remains to be established
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    Ding, Ding, Ding here we go.

    Via the Full Text

    The mechanism(s) of the significant effects of GCA on weight loss, BMI, percent body fat, and heart rate are unknown. There have been some recent articles indicating that chlorogenic acid and its metabolite, caffeic acid, inhibit amylase at mM concentrations in vitro which, if it occurred in the gastrointestinal tract in vivo, would inhibit sugar absorption from starch consumption and thus decrease caloric input. That chlorogenic acid has a significant influence on glucose metabolism was well demonstrated by Rodrigues de Sotillo et al when they were able to demonstrate a significant improvement in glucose tolerance in Zucker rats. This relative deprivation of glucose could possibly explain the reduction in BMI as well as fat content seen in their other rat study and in our human study. Another group has clearly demonstrated that chlorogenic acid may in fact have an antagonistic effect on human glucose transport. Based on the dietary data in our study, the product was not an appetite suppressant. Extracts of green coffee beans inhibited pancreatic lipase in vitro with a 50% inhibitory concentration of 43 μM polyphenols. In support of this result, caffeinated but not decaffeinated coffee supplementation in humans produced a decrease in lipoprotein lipase.
    so it messes with glucose uptake, transport and storage.. Sort of like Alli except for glucose instead of fatty acids
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    Awesome find. Coffee Bean keeping at it!
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    Thank you for taking the time to post this up, I've been curious what all the talk was about.
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    Good find judo. I know a certain tv doctor talking about this a little while ago.
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    Josh, I haven't had time to read the full-text due to finals week, but would you surmise that interference with glucose metabolism, though beneficial in untrained subjects, could hamper performance in hypocaloric bodybuilders looking to maintain strength/lbm?
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    Interesting..Been looking into this...gonna have to give this a try in an upcoming cut

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    Great post
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Josh, I haven't had time to read the full-text due to finals week, but would you surmise that interference with glucose metabolism, though beneficial in untrained subjects, could hamper performance in hypocaloric bodybuilders looking to maintain strength/lbm?
    Interested.
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    Good stuff right here, Josh!
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Josh, I haven't had time to read the full-text due to finals week, but would you surmise that interference with glucose metabolism, though beneficial in untrained subjects, could hamper performance in hypocaloric bodybuilders looking to maintain strength/lbm?
    If it is in fact preventing the full ultilization of calories consumed and then we combine that with an individual already in a calorie deficit, then yes I would imagine it could hamper performance. Could the effect it has on glucose metabolism also contribute? I suppose, but at what significance I do not know. I would assume it would really depend on the rest of individuals diet. I cant see this effecting a low carb guy the same way it would effect a high carb guy with regards to fat loss and performance. The participants in the above study took in carbs at 50% of their diet.

    The untrained comment is another factor here. Again, I imagine there will be a difference but how significant of a difference, I do not know.
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    Seems to also have an effect on 11&#223;-HSD1

    Coffee inhibits the reactivation of glucocorticoids by 11beta-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase type 1: a glucocorticoid connection in the anti-diabetic action of coffee?

    Recent epidemiological studies demonstrated a beneficial effect of coffee consumption for the prevention of type 2 diabetes, however, the underlying mechanisms remained unknown. We demonstrate that coffee extract, corresponding to an Italian Espresso, inhibits recombinant and endogenous 11beta-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase type 1 (11beta-HSD1) activity. The inhibitory component is heat-stable with considerable polarity. Coffee extract blocked 11beta-HSD1-dependent cortisol formation, prevented the subsequent nuclear translocation of the glucocorticoid receptor and abolished glucocorticoid-induced expression of the key gluconeogenic enzyme phosphoenolpyruvate carboxykinase. We suggest that at least part of the anti-diabetic effects of coffee consumption is due to inhibition of 11beta-HSD1-dependent glucocorticoid reactivation.

    PMID 16814782
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Josh, I haven't had time to read the full-text due to finals week, but would you surmise that interference with glucose metabolism, though beneficial in untrained subjects, could hamper performance in hypocaloric bodybuilders looking to maintain strength/lbm?
    Interesting question. I feel it did for me. I stopped using it for that reason.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    so it messes with glucose uptake, transport and storage.. Sort of like Alli except for glucose instead of fatty acids
    and you don't **** your pants
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    and you don't **** your pants
    Oily discharge FTW!
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    Impressive write up, peaked my interest in this compound.

    I've seen it added to a variety of fat burners, but I just assumed the effects were minimal, or suggested (i.e. Raspberry Ketones, diiodo's, etc.) Perhaps I'll have to pick some up.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valhalla86 View Post
    Impressive write up, peaked my interest in this compound.

    I've seen it added to a variety of fat burners, but I just assumed the effects were minimal, or suggested (i.e. Raspberry Ketones, diiodo's, etc.) Perhaps I'll have to pick some up.
    Yea there are a handful of formulated products which contain GCE (such as Fat Free) and it is also available in caps on its own
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    Good post here as always from Josh.
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    More on GCE

    Inhibitory effect of green coffee bean extract on fat accumulation and body weight gain in mice.

    Abstract
    BACKGROUND: An epidemiological study conducted in Italy indicated that coffee has the greatest antioxidant capacity among the commonly consumed beverages. Green coffee bean is rich in chlorogenic acid and its related compounds. The effect of green coffee bean extract (GCBE) on fat accumulation and body weight in mice was assessed with the objective of investigating the effect of GCBE on mild obesity.

    METHODS: Male ddy mice were fed a standard diet containing GCBE and its principal constituents, namely, caffeine and chlorogenic acid, for 14 days. Further, hepatic triglyceride (TG) level was also investigated after consecutive administration (13 days) of GCBE and its constituents. To examine the effect of GCBE and its constituents on fat absorption, serum TG changes were evaluated in olive oil-loaded mice. In addition, to investigate the effect on hepatic TG metabolism, carnitine palmitoyltransferase (CPT) activity in mice was evaluated after consecutive ingestion (6 days) of GCBE and its constituents (caffeine, chlorogenic acid, neochlorogenic acid and feruloylquinic acid mixture).

    RESULTS: It was found that 0.5% and 1% GCBE reduced visceral fat content and body weight. Caffeine and chlorogenic acid showed a tendency to reduce visceral fat and body weight. Oral administration of GCBE (100 and 200 mg/kg. day) for 13 days showed a tendency to reduce hepatic TG in mice. In the same model, chlorogenic acid (60 mg/kg. day) reduced hepatic TG level. In mice loaded with olive oil (5 mL/kg), GCBE (200 and 400 mg/kg) and caffeine (20 and 40 mg/kg) reduced serum TG level. GCBE (1%), neochlorogenic acid (0.028% and 0.055%) and feruloylquinic acid mixture (0.081%) significantly enhanced hepatic CPT activity in mice. However, neither caffeine nor chlorogenic acid alone was found to enhance CPT activity.

    CONCLUSION: These results suggest that GCBE is possibly effective against weight gain and fat accumulation by inhibition of fat absorption and activation of fat metabolism in the liver. Caffeine was found to be a suppressor of fat absorption, while chlorogenic acid was found to be partially involved in the suppressive effect of GCBE that resulted in the reduction of hepatic TG level. Phenolic compounds such as neochlorogenic acid and feruloylquinic acid mixture, except chlorogenic acid, can enhance hepatic CPT activity.
    Chlorogenic acid exhibits anti-obesity property and improves lipid metabolism in high-fat diet-induced-obese mice.

    This study investigated the efficacy of chlorogenic acid on altering body fat in high-fat diet (37% calories from fat) induced-obese mice compared to caffeic acid. Caffeic acid or chlorogenic acid was supplemented with high-fat diet at 0.02% (wt/wt) dose. Both caffeic acid and chlorogenic acid significantly lowered body weight, visceral fat mass and plasma leptin and insulin levels compared to the high-fat control group. They also lowered triglyceride (in plasma, liver and heart) and cholesterol (in plasma, adipose tissue and heart) concentrations. Triglyceride content in adipose tissue was significantly lowered, whereas the plasma adiponectin level was elevated by chlorogenic acid supplementation compared to the high-fat control group. Body weight was significantly correlated with plasma leptin (r=0.894, p&lt;0.01) and insulin (r=0.496, p&lt;0.01) levels, respectively. Caffeic acid and chlorogenic acid significantly inhibited fatty acid synthase, 3-hydroxy-3-methylglutaryl CoA reductase and acyl-CoA:cholesterol acyltransferase activities, while they increased fatty acid beta-oxidation activity and peroxisome proliferator-activated receptors alpha expression in the liver compared to the high-fat group. These results suggest that caffeic acid and chlorogenic acid improve body weight, lipid metabolism and obesity-related hormones levels in high-fat fed mice. Chlorogenic acid seemed to be more potent for body weight reduction and regulation of lipid metabolism than caffeic acid.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Josh, I haven't had time to read the full-text due to finals week, but would you surmise that interference with glucose metabolism, though beneficial in untrained subjects, could hamper performance in hypocaloric bodybuilders looking to maintain strength/lbm?
    Interesting point, and the thought did cross my mind- the glucose uptake angle in hypocaloric athletes is interesting, but may be something that could potentially be circumvented by nutrient timing (thinking out loud)- nitric oxide increases skeletal muscle uptake of glucose independent of insulin- so maybe AAKG or something else that increases NO post-workout (instead of pre-) to over-ride the lowering of glucose uptake if it is a factor- caffeine can have the same effect as well, so I have given a decent amt. of thought to this, and how to circumvent this mechanism in a non-insulin dependant manner.......
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    So then having an addition of NO supplementation could then potentially negate the drawback of chlorogenic acid's effect? I think its worth a trial.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrganicShadow View Post
    So then having an addition of NO supplementation could then potentially negate the drawback of chlorogenic acid's effect? I think its worth a trial.
    If there are any glucose-uptake issues, this would potentially negate them, if timed correctly- goes the same for any type on insulin-insensitivity issues you may incur with pre-wo caffeine as well... Thing that makes this interesting is that NO actually seems to have more of a focused/targeted effect on skeletal muscle than some of the herbal products that allow for GLUT4 translocation- many of the herbals seem to have at least some spillover of glucose into adipose- I am going to see if the same thing holds true for NO-related GLUT4 translocation or not- the second study seems to state that NO has the opposite effect:

    Biol Pharm Bull. 2007 Nov;30(11):2120-5.
    Berberine activates GLUT1-mediated glucose uptake in 3T3-L1 adipocytes.

    Kim SH, Shin EJ, Kim ED, Bayaraa T, Frost SC, Hyun CK.
    Source

    School of Life and Food Sciences, Handong Global University, Pohang, Kyonbuk, Korea.

    Abstract

    It has recently been known that berberine, an alkaloid of medicinal plants, has anti-hyperglycemic effects. To explore the mechanism underlying this effect, we used 3T3-L1 adipocytes for analyzing the signaling pathways that contribute to glucose transport. Treatment of berberine to 3T3-L1 adipocytes for 6 h enhanced basal glucose uptake both in normal and in insulin-resistant state, but the insulin-stimulated glucose uptake was not augmented significantly. Inhibition of phosphatidylinositol 3-kinase (PI 3-K) by wortmannin did not affect the berberine effect on basal glucose uptake. Berberine did not augment tyrosine phosphorylation of insulin receptor (IR) and insulin receptor substrate (IRS)-1. Further, berberine had no effect on the activity of the insulin-sensitive downstream kinase, atypical protein kinase C (PKCzeta/lambda). However, interestingly, extracellular signal-regulated kinases (ERKs), which have been known to be responsible for the expression of glucose transporter (GLUT)1, were significantly activated in berberine-treated 3T3-L1 cells. As expected, the level of GLUT1 protein was increased both in normal and insulin-resistant cells in response to berberine. But berberine affected the expression of GLUT4 neither in normal nor in insulin-resistant cells. In addition, berberine treatment increased AMP-activated protein kinase (AMPK) activity in 3T3-L1 cells, which has been reported to be associated with GLUT1-mediated glucose uptake. Together, we concluded that berberine increases glucose transport activity of 3T3-L1 adipocytes by enhancing GLUT1 expression and also stimulates the GLUT1-mediated glucose uptake by activating GLUT1, a result of AMPK stimulation.

    Cardiovasc Diabetol. 2011 Jul 22;10:68.
    Increased nitric oxide availability attenuates high fat diet metabolic alterations and gene expression associated with insulin resistance.

    Razny U, Kiec-Wilk B, Wator L, Polus A, Dyduch G, Solnica B, Malecki M, Tomaszewska R, Cooke JP, Dembinska-Kiec A.
    Source

    Department of Clinical Biochemistry, Jagiellonian University Medical College, Kopernika 15a Street, 31-501 Cracow, Poland. urazny@cm-uj.krakow.pl

    Abstract

    BACKGROUND:

    High fat diet impairs nitric oxide (NO) bioavailability, and induces insulin resistance. The link between NO availability and the metabolic adaptation to a high fat diet is not well characterized. The purpose of this study was to investigate the effect of high fat diet on metabolism in mice with decreased (eNOS-/-) and increased (DDAH overexpressed) NO bioavailability.
    METHODS:

    eNOS-/- (n = 16), DDAH (n = 24), and WT (n = 19) mice were fed a high fat diet (HFD) for 13 weeks. Body weight, biochemical parameters, adipokines and insulin were monitored. The matrigel in vivo model with CD31 immunostaining was used to assess angiogenesis. Gene expression in adipose tissues was analyzed by microarray and Real Time PCR. Comparisons of the mean values were made using the unpaired Student t test and p < 0.05 were considered statistically significant.
    RESULTS:

    eNOS-/- mice gained less weight than control WT and DDAH mice. In DDAH mice, a greater increase in serum adiponectin and a lesser increment in glucose level was observed. Fasting insulin and cholesterol levels remained unchanged. The angiogenic response was increased in DDAH mice. In adipose tissue of DDAH mice, genes characteristic of differentiated adipocytes were down-regulated, whereas in eNOS-/- mice, genes associated with adipogenesis, fatty acid and triglyceride synthesis were upregulated.
    CONCLUSIONS:

    Our results indicate that increased NO availability attenuates some HFD induced alterations in metabolism and gene expression associated with insulin resistance.
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    Im all about Berberine. I have a tub of it just need to find a way to either cap it or parachute it because the taste is awful.

    My preferred cutting techniques are usually high protein/fat (~40%/40%) so with the above would say taking pre workout NO wouldnt help me much. Gotta get on that berberine then.
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    Oh Atrogin
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Oh Atrogin
    Is this comment about berberine and if so is it in reference to this PMID: 20522589?
    "The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance." - Socrates
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    Is this comment about berberine and if so is it in reference to this PMID: 20522589?
    Indeed
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Indeed
    I will say, this does seem to be a legitimate concern with berberine. Decreased muscle protein synthesis and increased muscle protein degradation is definetely not something we want but with just about all berberine studies this one uses the murine model and focuses on diabetics. Berberine is a very interesting ingredient that has much promise for its use but the evidence for it just isnt that clear and is limited. I really wish there was more non diabetic human research on this stuff

    Now as for the one above, the authors did note the effects happened to both diabetic and non-diabetic mice. To me it appears to be a result of AMPk which in turn stimulates the atrogin-1 expression. But wouldnt this be a problem with anything that increases AMPk? Via the study it looks like the stimulation of AMPk leads to mTOR complex-1 (TORC1) inhibition by way of the phosphorylation of raptor which results in the reduced protein synthesis and enhanced protein degradation as well as an expression of atrogin-1. Even the authors of the study note, "We recognize that our findings from experiments utilizing mice or cultured cells may not reflect events occurring in patients with type 2 diabetes. Reports of protein turnover in diabetic or insulin-resistant patients find no muscle wasting unless the patients are elderly or sedentary (29–32). Even though obese patients with type 2 diabetes were shown to exhibit some impairment in ATP production, it has also been found that intensive insulin therapy did not change leucine kinetics when compared with results achieved with conventional insulin therapy (33). However, our results do indicate that antidiabetes drugs can cause unexpected consequences, including changes in protein metabolism." Have you done the HED math work to see what the dose of berberine they were using on the mice converts to in humans? As you I am sure you know rodent to human conversion is usually a problem with rodent trials as most times the dose used on rodents is significantly less than the dose a human might use. Then there is also the problem of extrapolating the results from trials and applying them to individuals as even the ingredients with strong science behind their use sometimes will fall short to a individual. I mean look at creatine. There are dozens of studies showing creatine supplementation improves lean body mass and strength and yet there are still a significant amount of individuals who dont get these results with its use. Another thing of concern is the inhibition of liver enzymes but with most of the studies showing this decreased/inhibited enzyme activity they are using massive doses. Anecdotally though I have used berberine several times and never had a problem with it.
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    intersting read
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    Most of the time when you're reading about negative effects if a given stimulus its administered in mass quantities almost unattainable by diet and supplementation unless the individual has that kind of inventory and actively trying to reach those doses. Some studies I've read also talk the same way about the benefits of some things but require a ridiculous amount. These are often rat studies with numbers converted to human ratios or studies where the clients are introduced to massive loads.

    In our cases, a lot of studies we look at are geared toward diabetics. Especially those articles on carbohydrates metabolism and the prevention of skeletal muscle atrophy. Those clients have a few variables we, hopefully, don't have to deal with so there's an offset hormonal constituent to account for in these studies. I do wish more researh could be done on non diabetics to eliminate variables and focus just on the metabolic pathways... But usually research is driven for clinical significance because that's what pays the bills.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    Seems to also have an effect on 11-HSD1

    Our Vatt Attack extract is based off the extraction methods of this study...
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    Quote Originally Posted by USPowders

    Our Vatt Attack extract is based off the extraction methods of this study...
    Which instill have some powder of and will be using in a few weeks

    Love vat attack
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