come up with the best "non pump" endurance formula!

[ScienceGuided]

Endurance and strength,non pump.

one specific product,1-2 ,,individual bulk caps/powders,etc etc.. whatever and however much you want.


go.

 

[Mooserider]

Bump

I cant deal with the pump products. Can't get a good contraction.

 

[VaughnTrue]

Compete will be out soon. That is all you will need

 

[Jonbero]

Beta-alanine 2500mg
Creapure 5g
Betaine Anhydrous 2500mg
L-Carnitine-L-Tartrate 2000mg
Caffeine 200mg
1,3-dimethylamylamine 50mg

Wadup

 

[ScienceGuided]

Compete will be out soon. That is all you will need

very interested.

 

[ScienceGuided]

Beta-alanine 2500mg
Creapure 5g
Betaine Anhydrous 2500mg
L-Carnitine-L-Tartrate 2000mg
Caffeine 200mg
1,3-dimethylamylamine 50mg

Wadup

doesn't look to bad to me! def dropping the dmaa,not sure if I want caff or at least that high.....

 

[Jonbero]

doesn't look to bad to me! def dropping the dmaa,not sure if I want caff or at least that high.....

I really like my stimulants

But yeah some people don't take them as well as others, I feel nothing from 100mg of Caffeine

 

[ScienceGuided]

I really like my stimulants

But yeah some people don't take them as well as others, I feel nothing from 100mg of Caffeine

don't get me wrong,I have a very high tolerance and love stims. Just for what im thinking,Im looking in a different direction... when I say endurance,I don't mean 45 min of cardio. Im talking some hardcore endurance....

 

[Jonbero]

don't get me wrong,I have a very high tolerance and love stims. Just for what im thinking,Im looking in a different direction... when I say endurance,I don't mean 45 min of cardio. Im talking some hardcore endurance....

Hmm

Ok I'm thinking

BCAA's 10g (4-1-1 or 8-1-1)

Beta-alanine 2500mg
Creapure 5g
Betaine Anhydrous 2500mg
L-Carnitine-L-Tartrate 2g
Taurine 2g
Citrulline Malate 2g

 

[StackedCop]

Compete will be out soon. That is all you will need

Haha beat me to it iforce gonna dominate!

 

[ScienceGuided]

Hmm

Ok I'm thinking

BCAA's 10g (4-1-1 or 8-1-1)

Beta-alanine 2500mg
Creapure 5g
Betaine Anhydrous 2500mg
L-Carnitine-L-Tartrate 2g
Taurine 2g
Citrulline Malate 2g

looks even better.... will start throwing out an idea or two of my own...

might go with creapure or MCC,that I know for sure.

 

[VaughnTrue]

very interested.

I hope I can release the profile soon. I have been itching to for months!

 

[ScienceGuided]

I hope I can release the profile soon. I have been itching to for months!

should be good,have my hopes up.

 

[th3futur3]

Compete will be out soon. That is all you will need

I have a feeling iForce is going to just totally rectify every supplement issue may have with total coverage. 6-7 years down the road...only one brand left...iForce haha!

 

[ScienceGuided]

cit malate is out im thinking

 

[mr.cooper69]

If I told you, I'd have to kill you.

 

[Jonbero]

If I told you, I'd have to kill you.

Cmon coop... I must know

 

[mr.cooper69]

Of everything listed in this thread (and that's all I'll comment on ), Beta-alanine, LCLT, high-dosed taurine, and citrulline malate are all winners. The endurance benefits of citrulline far outweigh any pumps you may get, but if you are that worried about pumps, simply supplement pure malic acid without the citrulline.

 

[ScienceGuided]

Of everything listed in this thread (and that's all I'll comment on ), Beta-alanine, LCLT, high-dosed taurine, and citrulline malate are all winners. The endurance benefits of citrulline far outweigh any pumps you may get, but if you are that worried about pumps, simply supplement pure malic acid without the citrulline.

was hoping I could get you involved in this. Exactly what I was thinking,yes that is a concern of mine.

had a few more ideas too.....

 

[JudgementDay]

Cordygen UltraV02 + Formula-X, this combo does wonders for me with endurance training.

 

[ScienceGuided]

Cordygen UltraV02 + Formula-X, this combo does wonders for me with endurance training.

Cordygen Ultra is a good product.

 

[ScienceGuided]

surprised a few things have not come up yet....

 

[Jonbero]

Ribose
Vitargo
Magesium, Sodium and Potassium

 

[ScienceGuided]

Ribose
Vitargo
Magesium, Sodium and Potassium

-not bad.

-def that or something along those lines.

- what do you think about glycerphosphates? :scratchchin:

 

[Bolanrox]

i keep thinking about that (was it Navy SEAL) article about how creatine was detrimental for anything endurance based

 

[ScienceGuided]

i keep thinking about that (was it Navy SEAL) article about how creatine was detrimental for anything endurance based

I find MCC works very well for not only endurance,but keeping strength and muscle mass high!

 

[rms80]

RPM GSE, L-Arginine, Caffeine, Naringin, Theobromine, and Cocoa- works great for endurance work, and has been around forever:
J Strength Cond Res. 2010 May;24(5):1306-12.
[h=1]Effects of arginine-based supplements on the physical working capacity at the fatigue threshold.[/h]Camic CL, Housh TJ, Zuniga JM, Hendrix RC, Mielke M, Johnson GO, Schmidt RJ.
[h=3]Source[/h]Human Performance Laboratory, Department of Nutrition and Health Sciences, University of Nebraska-Lincoln, Lincoln, Nebraska, USA. [email protected]

[h=3]Abstract[/h]The purpose of the present study was to examine the effects of daily oral administration of arginine-based supplements for 4 weeks on the physical working capacity at the fatigue threshold (PWCFT). The PWCFT test is an electromyographic (EMG) procedure for estimating the highest power output that can be maintained without neuromuscular evidence of fatigue. The study used a double-blind, placebo-controlled design. Fifty college-aged men (mean age +/- SD = 23.9 +/- 3.0) were randomized into 1 of 3 groups: (a) placebo (n = 19); (b) 1.5 g arginine (n = 14); or (c) 3.0 g arginine (n = 17). The placebo was microcrystalline cellulose. The 1.5-g arginine group ingested 1.5 g of arginine and 300 mg of grape seed extract, whereas the 3.0 g arginine group ingested 3.0 g of arginine and 300 mg of grape seed extract. All subjects performed an incremental test to exhaustion on a cycle ergometer to determine their PWCFT before supplementation (PRE) and after 4 weeks of supplementation (POST). Surface EMG signals were recorded from the vastus lateralis using a bipolar electrode arrangement during the incremental tests for the determination of the PRE and POST supplementation PWCFT values. There were significant mean increases (PRE to POST) in PWCFT for the 1.5 g (22.4%) and 3.0 g (18.8%) supplement groups, but no change for the placebo group (-1.6%). These findings supported the use of arginine-based supplements, at the dosages examined in the present investigation, as an ergogenic aid for untrained individuals.

 

[PuZo]

Hemavol is a good endurance formula.

 

[BoneDaddy]

Drive by AppNut has always given me ridiculous endurance

 

[ScienceGuided]

Drive by AppNut has always given me ridiculous endurance

cordyceps is def in the mix for sure.

 

[mr.cooper69]

Strong nitpicking of arginine studies lol. Want me to post the vast majority that conflict that one study (in trained individuals, I might add)?

Naringin won't enhance performance (again, check the majority of the studies and the methodology).

Theobromine/Cocoa...eh. Nothing caffeine can't do really.

I do agree with caffeine and GSE...good choices.

Ribose won't enhance endurance.

Electrolytes won't directly enhance endurance.

 

[ScienceGuided]

Strong nitpicking of arginine studies lol. Want me to post the vast majority that conflict that one study (in trained individuals, I might add)?

Naringin won't enhance performance (again, check the majority of the studies and the methodology).

Theobromine/Cocoa...eh. Nothing caffeine can't do really.

I do agree with caffeine and GSE...good choices.

Ribose won't enhance endurance.

Electrolytes won't directly enhance endurance.

well I don't want any agmatine,arginine,etc... Im not sure if im being clear perhaps lol.... agreed 200mg of sns caff works as good as it all!

for a few reasons( non endurance related) im thinking electrolytes will be in there one way or another....

 

[baldwanus]

i remember talking about this with coop a while back.......i understand not wanting a "pump" product, but he made a solid argument for hemavol being one of the best endurance formula's available

cit-mal for vasoregulatory function, norvaline to amplify the cit-mal, agmatine for CNOS expression......and then GMS works really well in an endurance situations

going off of memory here, hopefully he can comment more on it.

 

[ScienceGuided]

all valid points,just other options I had in mind...

gms is a decent option...

 

[mr.cooper69]

i remember talking about this with coop a while back.......i understand not wanting a "pump" product, but he made a solid argument for hemavol being one of the best endurance formula's available

cit-mal for vasoregulatory function, norvaline to amplify the cit-mal, agmatine for CNOS expression......and then GMS works really well in an endurance situations

going off of memory here, hopefully he can comment more on it.

Yep, you nailed it pretty much. Hemavol and MAN Body Octane (stim-free) are two A+ endurance formulas.

 

[mr.cooper69]

all valid points,just other options I had in mind...

gms is a decent option...

If you want a list, PM me .

 

[ScienceGuided]

body octane stim free is pretty good,agreed.Taste is not bad at all either

 

[flightposite]

If we are talking pure endurance and non stim. I would say beta alanine and Drive. The cordyceps really increase my endurance in a way other endurance based products haven't before. Plus the added test boosting and thyroid stimulation really helps with leaning out.

 

[ScienceGuided]

I don't mind stims here and there for this purpose,would prefer to leave it alone though.

BA is def in the picture,playing around with doses and timing.

 

[flightposite]

I don't mind stims here and there for this purpose,would prefer to leave it alone though.

BA is def in the picture,playing around with doses and timing.

In that case I would highly suggest Drive or cordygen. Both excellent non stim endurance products.

 

[3utcher]

Hmm

Ok I'm thinking

BCAA's 10g (4-1-1 or 8-1-1)

Beta-alanine 2500mg
Creapure 5g
Betaine Anhydrous 2500mg
L-Carnitine-L-Tartrate 2g
Taurine 2g
Citrulline Malate 2g

Def not a high leucine BCAA . At least valine (and maybe isoleucine) does great for booth energy and endurance. Leucine is overlooked. Otherwise it looks good.

Ribose
Vitargo
Magesium, Sodium and Potassium

Ribose have vasodilatory properties .

 

[ScienceGuided]

yea Ribose is a no go