Nootropics

[madds87]

What combinations do yall use for studying/chillaxing/brain and memory function? Im making my own formula for chillin and have a huge on the job test coming up. I heard the nootropics at the right combo can make you focus real well and also make you feel real relaxe. I have peracitam (sp?) Bought it from here when it was on sale. Takes very little Nd knocks me out for sleeping...

[RealBigga]

SNS Focus XT with Piracetam sounds like fun.

[mr.cooper69]

I'd look into Focus XT by SNS. It is 2 for 30 bucks on the SNS website, has all your nootropic bases covered, and the flavoring is excellent. Stack it with your piracetam or some aniracetam for good results.

[madchemist]

Piracetam is a glutaminergic drug which effects the acetylcholine system by modulating neuronal calcium influx and upregulating enzymes (acetylcholine transferase) and growth promoting receptors (TrkB). It has nothing to do with focus/attention, which is more related to the reticular activating system and norepinephrine responsiveness.

[baldwanus]

as far as for studying/school purpses:

1 scooop Focus XT
2g piracetam
1 Cap SNS Hup A
1 Cap SNS Picamilon 150

for general around the house chilling, phenibut can be pretty awesome. just not something you wanna use for extended periods of time without taking a break

[itzDodge]

Piracetam is a glutaminergic drug which effects the acetylcholine system by modulating neuronal calcium influx and upregulating enzymes (acetylcholine transferase) and growth promoting receptors (TrkB). It has nothing to do with focus/attention, which is more related to the reticular activating system and norepinephrine responsiveness.

Still good for overall cognitive function tho right? I notice my vocabulary expands when I use piracetam consistently.

[mr.cooper69]

Still good for overall cognitive function tho right? I notice my vocabulary expands when I use piracetam consistently.

yes it is. he was more referring to the fact that ingredients like stimulants are what actually confer focus and alertness. piracetam seems to alter my thought processes in a positive manner (great for writing papers, terrible for interviews)

[J19891]

Piracetam is a glutaminergic drug which effects the acetylcholine system by modulating neuronal calcium influx and upregulating enzymes (acetylcholine transferase) and growth promoting receptors (TrkB). It has nothing to do with focus/attention, which is more related to the reticular activating system and norepinephrine responsiveness.

I've never heard piracetam's MOA summed up that way before, all the writing on it I've come across has led me to believe that there isn't a clear consensus on it's MOA but that it's thought to effect the acetylcholine system in some way. Assuming what you say is true, couldn't piracetam have excitotoxic potential?

[madchemist]

I've never heard piracetam's MOA summed up that way before, all the writing on it I've come across has led me to believe that there isn't a clear consensus on it's MOA but that it's thought to effect the acetylcholine system in some way. Assuming what you say is true, couldn't piracetam have excitotoxic potential?

It's MAO has been known for quite some time. It's an allosteric activator of the NMDA receptor, which means it potentiates the receptors activation after neuronal depolarization (i.e. magnesium displacement). It doesn't directly activate the receptor, and therefore would actually be excito-protective --> which is why it has been used in the setting of TBI.

[J19891]

It's MAO has been known for quite some time. It's an allosteric activator of the NMDA receptor, which means it potentiates the receptors activation after neuronal depolarization (i.e. magnesium displacement). It doesn't directly activate the receptor, and therefore would actually be excito-protective --> which is why it has been used in the setting of TBI.

Yeah, I did some googling after reading your posts, my prior research sources apparently sucked. I saw someone else making the case for it being neuroprotective due to its role as an allosteric modulator, but forgive my ignorance, why does it being an allosteric activator make it neuroprotective? If it's potentiating the NMDA receptors activation, wouldn't taking it with glumatine, DAA, or an amphetamine just be a recipe to fry your neurons?

[J19891]

I can see you're right, there are plenty of studies showing that positive allosteric modulators of the NMDA receptor are neuroprotective, I just don't get why. It seems like positive activation of that receptor should mean more calcium ions in the cell.

[madchemist]

Yeah, I did some googling after reading your posts, my prior research sources apparently sucked. I saw someone else making the case for it being neuroprotective due to its role as an allosteric modulator, but forgive my ignorance, why does it being an allosteric activator make it neuroprotective? If it's potentiating the NMDA receptors activation, wouldn't taking it with glumatine, DAA, or an amphetamine just be a recipe to fry your neurons?

It's excito-protective because it regulates the ionotropic influx frequency. Excitotoxicity generally refers to a particular state, mostly after a TBI, in which the neuron is bathed with glutamate. In this setting, glutamate is free to continually activate the AMPA/NMDA receptors and allow unchecked calcium entry. Free ionized calcium activates proteases and phospholipases which destroy the soma (as well as activating apoptotic enzymes) and cause degeneration or death. This process is tempered by co-activating regulators like D-serine or glycine, along with magnesium. Piracetam effects this cascade by preventing immediate re-activation, and thereby extend the time between calcium influx. In the context of a normal brain, however, it would actually be decreasing the time to re-activation.

Context is everything.

[J19891]

It's excito-protective because it regulates the ionotropic influx frequency. Excitotoxicity generally refers to a particular state, mostly after a TBI, in which the neuron is bathed with glutamate. In this setting, glutamate is free to continually activate the AMPA/NMDA receptors and allow unchecked calcium entry. Free ionized calcium activates proteases and phospholipases which destroy the soma (as well as activating apoptotic enzymes) and cause degeneration or death. This process is tempered by co-activating regulators like D-serine or glycine, along with magnesium. Piracetam effects this cascade by preventing immediate re-activation, and thereby extend the time between calcium influx. In the context of a normal brain, however, it would actually be decreasing the time to re-activation.

Context is everything.

I understand all that, but what I'm asking is how is it doing that? Why is it tempering the influx of calcium ions in people with TBI, even though its a positive modulator of the NMDA receptor? Why is it preventing reactivation at all?

[J19891]

Wait, I think I get it. So piracetam is an allosteric modulator in that it is exerting it's effect on the cofactors (mg, D-serine, glycine), which are required along with glutamate in order for the neuron to fire. Since piracetam is increasing the cofactors, it is increasing the number of synapses while still preventing an over-accumulation of calcium inside the cell, thereby preventing excitotoxicity. Am I seeing this correctly?

[madds87]

I bought some parecetam and I think its called vibracetam and Alpha gpc amazon has some sweet bulk orders. But I will have to check out the focus xt. Sounds like fun. I was trying to put together an ultimate pill with everything in it and I found a combination that sounds pretty sweet.
L tyrosine, d l phenylalanine, pentothenic acid, paba, dmae, rubidium, tocopherol, beta cerotine, manganese folic acid, copper gluconate, selenium. As an am pill. Then the pm pill will be, niacinmide, taurine, magnesium oxide, perodoxine, niacin, riboflavine, zinc beta cerotine, chromium, b12..... Seems like a good combo..... What yall think?

[flightposite]

yes it is. he was more referring to the fact that ingredients like stimulants are what actually confer focus and alertness. piracetam seems to alter my thought processes in a positive manner (great for writing papers, terrible for interviews)

Why bad for interviews?

[madchemist]

yes it is. he was more referring to the fact that ingredients like stimulants are what actually confer focus and alertness.

Correct. The only racetam capable of directly increasing focus is phenylpiracetam.

[mr.cooper69]

Why bad for interviews?

I don't know; it seems to make you think a little too much to yourself, rather than thinking outloud. Totally personal experience though, you may well respond quite differently.

Correct. The only racetam capable of directly increasing focus is phenylpiracetam.

Have you ever used phenylP and was it extremely hit or miss for you?

[flightposite]

I don't know; it seems to make you think a little too much to yourself, rather than thinking outloud. Totally personal experience though, you may well respond quite differently.

Have you ever used phenylP and was it extremely hit or miss for you?

I see. Thanks for your response. When I take piracetam with a stim I seem to be a better communicator so for me = good 4 interviews

[itzDodge]

I don't know; it seems to make you think a little too much to yourself, rather than thinking outloud. Totally personal experience though, you may well respond quite differently.

I am similar, I actually tend to stumble over my words a lot more when I've dosed piracetam consistently. I thought I was an anomaly in this instance lol, going to go with aniracetam for next semester and see if how I enjoy that.