Well, too soon... but... It`d came any away: anabeta or natadrol?

[anbes]

Basically those are the only 2 guys suposed to be natty anabolics. Natadrol has an androgenic profile too. I know there`s also Prime, but anabeta and natadrol are the newsts.
Comparing from whose used both, what are your thoughts?

 

[fightbackhxc]

go with both. stack the two. or do anabeta and triazol.

 

[fightbackhxc]

Get 2 bottles of X-Factor, it's far more "anabolic" than either of those two.

Hmmm that's an informative opinion. And u probably haven't used anabeta

 

[Milas]

Natadrol seems to be more androgenic (strength, but sides like acne, prostate swelling, MPB, etc.) while Anabeta is more anabolic (muscles get bigger). So, do you want to get more bigger (AnaBeta) or stronger (Natadrol)?

 

[Milas]

Are you being sarcastic? Science > anecdtoal reports from sponsored logs.

Theory > reality?

 

[Flabby]

Are you being sarcastic? Science > anecdtoal reports from sponsored logs.

Problem is that science is carried out and then communicated by people, some of whom are trying to sell you things ...

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplements/80044-excess-arachidonic-acid-3.html#post1110596

 

[Flabby]

Studies = reality. Theory = basis for studies.



I don't disagree one bit. It's a potent inflammatory agent. But it's also more anabolic than most purported "anabolics" out there. This isn't even an SNS product, I have no hidden agenda. XF works, plain and simple. The others...it's for you to decide.

I'm going to take a guess you didn't read the post I linked to. It said this:

That Abstract from the MN website was never published in a peer reviewed journal. It has its flaws in terms of evaluation of inflammatory markers. Good preliminary report, but should not be taken as "gospel" though it is touted heavily for marketing purposes.

It has promise but it is pathway that is not completely well understood in the setting of supplementation of a precursor that causes a concomintant increase in pro as well as anti-inflammatory signalling (as well as vasocontrictive and vasodilatory signals). Take alook at the great pathway posted up by the sinner.

So what happens when there is disarray of this pathway - we dont' know if this substance has caused this? How about those predisposed ot inflammatory disroders? Are there subsequent alterations in gene expression of these inflammatory cytokines over baseline, role in histamine release, etc.

Stay away if you have a fam history or predisposed to any inflammatory disorder (IBD, psoriasis, asthma, etc) - just one reason. But then again, that is the case for almost any supplement.

As for the ability for it to induce muscle hypertrophy, pubmed fails to reveal any in vivo human study published in a reputable journal demonstrating its safety and efficacy in any way shape or form. :aargh:

It sounds like you've already got your mind made up about what science supports or doesn't, but maybe the other readers out there will get something out of it.

 

[freezito]

I liked natadrol, leaned out nicely on it but I'm going to give the anabeta a whirl

 

[nattydisaster]

Science > anecdtoal reports from sponsored logs.

Studies = reality

Admittedly, the research on all 3 is extremely weak

You confuse me

 

[mr.cooper69]

You confuse me

What's the confusion? ArA has a scientifically sound MOA in comparison to the other two as far as I'm concerned.

Studies = reality. The studies on all 3 compounds are weak, so in reality, don't expect wonders from any of them.

Unfortunately this category and these supplements (along with all the ecdy stuff) is very poorly researched, poorly understood, and unreliable. Which is why I'll stick to my Erase and DAA .

 

[nattydisaster]

Skepticism is always expected, no doubt. Hell I am always the biggest skeptic of our own supplements when testing. We tried a number of other products that were worthless before the extract in AnaBeta was tested. Some with great research even. We wouldnt have put something on the market that was just "ok"...we found something special.

Not trying to convince you to buy it, just stating that while studies are a great starting point they aren't the end-all. Tons of stuff with good studies that never translates to the real world, also lots of stuff with 0 studies that works great. Look at all the prohormones out there. All based off of Vida which measured the weights of the rats prostate, LV, and seminal vesicle.

Not calling AnaBeta a prohormone by any means, but the SV, prostate, and body weight was measured in studies, just like steroids were in Vida. The principals are parallel. People accept vida like its law, but when something natural follows the same test guidelines doesnt mean it should be instantly void just because it is from nature.

 

[mr.cooper69]

Skepticism is always expected, no doubt. Hell I am always the biggest skeptic of our own supplements when testing. We tried a number of other products that were worthless before the extract in AnaBeta was tested. Some with great research even. We wouldnt have put something on the market that was just "ok"...we found something special.

Not trying to convince you to buy it, just stating that while studies are a great starting point they aren't the end-all. Tons of stuff with good studies that never translates to the real world, also lots of stuff with 0 studies that works great. Look at all the prohormones out there. All based off of Vida which measured the weights of the rats prostate, LV, and seminal vesicle.

Not calling AnaBeta a prohormone by any means, but the SV, prostate, and body weight was measured in studies, just like steroids were in Vida. The principals are parallel. People accept vida like its law, but when something natural follows the same test guidelines doesnt mean it should be instantly void just because it is from nature.

Understood. I'm not saying AnaBeta doesn't work. I'm saying that DAA + Erase does work. I understand that you wouldn't put out a product unless it was top notch like the other 3 in your line. I just personally wouldn't invest in it just yet. I've seen the same hype around ecdy, prime, etc...and they all did absolutely nothing for me. ArA did work for me, however. These non-hormonal anabolics seem to be way more hit or miss than any other categories of this industry.

 

[nattydisaster]

Understood. I'm not saying AnaBeta doesn't work. I'm saying that DAA + Erase does work.

4 DAA caps + 3 Erase/day has been my recent staple

 

[anbes]

Well, some fire outhere... Lol. Comparing caregories is complicated. Ara, which I can call as pre-prgl (prostaglandins) use to be a potential anabol compound. A lot of bb in the world used prgl, with a lot os side: dhiarreia, pain... The same as anaboloc--ra based ones! I do have my preocypations: allergies, anaphilaxy, since these new natty are extract from unknown plants.
Of course I ask my self why to try it, if u compare, products like jack3d is far way one thr most powerfull anabolic stuff, meaning that it promotes anabilism! U really put some muscle, u get stimmed. I dont know if anabeta, natadrol or prime or xfctor would do the same. But I was just asking to comparr those newest natties especially from who use them both. But now it is interesting to compare to othets too.
Tks

 

[Docmattic]

go with both. stack the two. or do anabeta and triazol.

I thought about doing this after my success with natadrol, i have a feeling they would stack well but decided not too due to the ammount of natadrol i have to take for 8 weeks. It did good for me but it took three weeks for me to recover from the cycle. I figure its probably not a good idea to do it again so soon.

What benefits would triazol add to anabeta? I dont know too much about triazole.

 

[Milas]

Well, some fire outhere... Lol. Comparing caregories is complicated. Ara, which I can call as pre-prgl (prostaglandins) use to be a potential anabol compound. A lot of bb in the world used prgl, with a lot os side: dhiarreia, pain... The same as anaboloc--ra based ones! I do have my preocypations: allergies, anaphilaxy, since these new natty are extract from unknown plants.
Of course I ask my self why to try it, if u compare, products like jack3d is far way one thr most powerfull anabolic stuff, meaning that it promotes anabilism! U really put some muscle, u get stimmed. I dont know if anabeta, natadrol or prime or xfctor would do the same. But I was just asking to comparr those newest natties especially from who use them both. But now it is interesting to compare to othets too.
Tks

Jack3d is anabolic? You might want to go back and read what's in there. It most certainly is not going to enhance anabolism any more than helping you with extra sets/reps. That's like saying caffeine is anabolic.

Though in a literal sense, food is the most anabolic substance available, so if you want gains/anabolism just eat more...

 

[ConcreteConny]

Jack3d is anabolic? You might want to go back and read what's in there. It most certainly is not going to enhance anabolism any more than helping you with extra sets/reps. That's like saying caffeine is anabolic.

Though in a literal sense, food is the most anabolic substance available, so if you want gains/anabolism just eat more...

:goodpost:

 

[nattydisaster]

Though in a literal sense, food is the most anabolic substance available, so if you want gains/anabolism just eat more...

Well said!

 

[anbes]

Jack3d is anabolic? You might want to go back and read what's in there. It most certainly is not going to enhance anabolism any more than helping you with extra sets/reps. That's like saying caffeine is anabolic.

Though in a literal sense, food is the most anabolic substance available, so if you want gains/anabolism just eat more...

I am adding muscle, ok and water, with the help of creatine and others. Well, so I am biologicaly "creatting" tissue (or adding proteins inside muscles fiber), so, it`s anabolism! Undesrtund ur point, but I think I made my self clear. The helpness of jack3d (better now) is extremelly anabolic. Asking if those nattys are better.... comparing...

 

[anbes]

And not to deffend the anabolics, but, CLA, omega 6, ends the road at Ara! borage oil (GLA - 1 step after CLA) does it too. So, I don`t know how much of ara is derived from omega 6 suplementations, especially when we intake 6g of cartamo oil (CLA)/day, but maybe x-factor is not so necessary, and cla could do everething... justo thoughts...

 

[Milas]

I am adding muscle, ok and water, with the help of creatine and others. Well, so I am biologicaly "creatting" tissue (or adding proteins inside muscles fiber), so, it`s anabolism! Undesrtund ur point, but I think I made my self clear. The helpness of jack3d (better now) is extremelly anabolic. Asking if those nattys are better.... comparing...

Creatine is an ergogenic, not an anabolic. It enables you to work harder and recover faster. I don't think anyone would argue the relative value of creatine for producing cheap results, but it's still not an anabolic.

If I get the point of your question, whether the nattys are "better" than Jack3d, I would say they are for increasing anabolic response. Given that you can't get much cheaper than creatine, that would be a better "bang for the buck." However, I'd rather use both for the relative cost and additive/synergistic improvements.

AnaBeta and Jack3d are nothing alike. It's hard to compare. Suffice it to say, if you're just starting out and haven't exercised you can see good gains from Jack3d (or just by working out and taking nothing). If you've been working out and using creatine, AnaBeta would give you a better benefit.

And not to deffend the anabolics, but, CLA, omega 6, ends the road at Ara! borage oil (GLA - 1 step after CLA) does it too. So, I don`t know how much of ara is derived from omega 6 suplementations, especially when we intake 6g of cartamo oil (CLA)/day, but maybe x-factor is not so necessary, and cla could do everething... justo thoughts...

I've used over 1500g of CLA and did not get any "anabolic" or other effect from CLA. I honestly don't know anyone who has been like "wow, I got GREAT results from CLA." I do know quite a few who have been "wowed" by ArA, myself included.

I think the metabolism of the Omega 6's from and into different constituents is not enough to draw conclusions. For example, if I took DHEA would it be like I was on 500mg Test Cyp? No, my body won't convert DHEA to the target hormone at a high enough rate, and in fact it will convert to less desirable hormones like estrogen.

 

[anbes]

Creatine is an ergogenic, not an anabolic. It enables you to work harder and recover faster. I don't think anyone would argue the relative value of creatine for producing cheap results, but it's still not an anabolic.

If I get the point of your question, whether the nattys are "better" than Jack3d, I would say they are for increasing anabolic response. Given that you can't get much cheaper than creatine, that would be a better "bang for the buck." However, I'd rather use both for the relative cost and additive/synergistic improvements.

AnaBeta and Jack3d are nothing alike. It's hard to compare. Suffice it to say, if you're just starting out and haven't exercised you can see good gains from Jack3d (or just by working out and taking nothing). If you've been working out and using creatine, AnaBeta would give you a better benefit.



I've used over 1500g of CLA and did not get any "anabolic" or other effect from CLA. I honestly don't know anyone who has been like "wow, I got GREAT results from CLA." I do know quite a few who have been "wowed" by ArA, myself included.

I think the metabolism of the Omega 6's from and into different constituents is not enough to draw conclusions. For example, if I took DHEA would it be like I was on 500mg Test Cyp? No, my body won't convert DHEA to the target hormone at a high enough rate, and in fact it will convert to less desirable hormones like estrogen.

Yep! U got my point. Maybe I made a mass when try to explain, but u said the word: wow!! Lol. That's what i am saying, i've used a lot of creat products and prewkt ones. I also used ph, real old achool hormes, proteins, some plants, but jack3d rwally impressed me. I cannot compare to ph or old school hormones, but to help with my anabolism (that sounds better) i asking if we really need something more then a good prewkt? Ok, i agree, jacked plus anabeta maybe it is more resultable! But comparing the final results of both alone...
Well, i'll give those nattys a try, and x-factor is really becaming an option. But i also wanna run anabeta, so it'll depend how it is gona be until i by something
Tks

 

[jumpshot903]

I can't comment on AnaBeta nor can really anyone its a new product not many people have tried it or run extensive logs on it, however it looks very promising. Branching of what someone said earlier AnaBeta looks like something more designed to build muscle as stated earlier and natadrol is proven to be very good for gaining strength while leaning out. My experience with Natadrol was great and just recently bought 5 bottles and will be running an 8-10 week cycle at 10 pills a day. So looking at each product you have to figure out your goals and go from there each product will yield different results.

 

[TheDarkHalf]

2 bottles of Prime + Anabeta. Prime at 9/day and anabeta at 4 day.

 

[Jbrooks]

4 DAA caps + 3 Erase/day has been my recent staple

hi Natty

4 caps DAA which product are you taking ?

Cheers

 

[schizm]

hi Natty

4 caps DAA which product are you taking ?

Cheers

I believe I've seen past posts of his that makes me think this one

http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/serious-nutrition-solutions/daa-180-capsules.html

but, obvisously he can confirm or deny that...appears NP only carries 2 capped (solo) DAA products and SNS is only one dosed 4 caps/day...

 

[nattydisaster]

hi Natty

4 caps DAA which product are you taking ?

Cheers

SNS DAA

Edit: See post above mine for link

 

[DAdams91982]

Get 2 bottles of X-Factor, it's far more "anabolic" than either of those two.

That is quite the blanket statement.

 

[mr.cooper69]

That is quite the blanket statement.

Sigh. I already said in another PES thread that I will not pass any further judgment on PES AnaBeta until I've seen more unsponsored logs or tried it myself. Sorry for my posting style, but I'm more used to BB.com where it is more common to voice your opinion on a supplement, positive or negative. As I said in the other thread, I truly am sorry and will not be posting any more about AnaBeta. Why do you feel the need to bump that post and create drama?

 

[DAdams91982]

Sigh. I already said in another PES thread that I will not pass any further judgment on PES AnaBeta until I've seen more unsponsored logs or tried it myself. Sorry for my posting style, but I'm more used to BB.com where it is more common to voice your opinion on a supplement, positive or negative. As I said in the other thread, I truly am sorry and will not be posting any more about AnaBeta. Why do you feel the need to bump that post and create drama?

Who said anything about voicing your opinion. You made a blanket factual statement that another product was far more anabolic without any experience or otherwise to back you up. Yes it is a different environment here, most people do not make factual statements here without something to back em up.

I personally do not care if you have a personal vendetta against AB, or if you wack off to mouse porn. The only thing that irked me was your statement as a fact.

There is no one here that is being hamstrung about voicing their opinion, but how people here go about it is different.

Oh, and I bumped it because this is the first time I have read it.

 

[mr.cooper69]

Who said anything about voicing your opinion. You made a blanket factual statement that another product was far more anabolic without any experience or otherwise to back you up. Yes it is a different environment here, most people do not make factual statements here without something to back em up.

I personally do not care if you have a personal vendetta against AB, or if you wack off to mouse porn. The only thing that irked me was your statement as a fact.

There is no one here that is being hamstrung about voicing their opinion, but how people here go about it is different.

Oh, and I bumped it because this is the first time I have read it.

Ok, I'm sorry, I'm not getting into this discussion again. I already apologized earlier. A personal vendetta against AB? When I recommend all other PES products AND use them? The statement obviously wasn't fact since there are not enough relevant studies on any of the compounds, as I went on to say if you read the thread...Maybe I should have included "IMO," I'm still learning how to communicate on these boards. As I'm sure you know, it's a very different culture. I only recently found out about how much AM has been through, which is why I am even more genuinely apologetic. This place needs more positive input, and as I said earlier, that is all I will be doing henceforth. If I have something negative to say, I just won't say it .

 

[TheDarkHalf]

Who said anything about voicing your opinion. You made a blanket factual statement that another product was far more anabolic without any experience or otherwise to back you up. Yes it is a different environment here, most people do not make factual statements here without something to back em up.

I personally do not care if you have a personal vendetta against AB, or if you wack off to mouse porn. The only thing that irked me was your statement as a fact.

There is no one here that is being hamstrung about voicing their opinion, but how people here go about it is different.

Oh, and I bumped it because this is the first time I have read it.

Agreed....you will be made a fool of on this site if you don't have something factual to back up a claim. Especially something outlandish as "XYZ supplement is more anabolic than ABC supplement". Show me the study or real world examples.

 

[Milas]

Agreed....you will be made a fool of on this site if you don't have something factual to back up a claim. Especially something outlandish as "XYZ supplement is more anabolic than ABC supplement". Show me the study or real world examples.

That's nonsense....... IMO.

 

[mr.cooper69]

Agreed....you will be made a fool of on this site if you don't have something factual to back up a claim. Especially something outlandish as "XYZ supplement is more anabolic than ABC supplement". Show me the study or real world examples.

Please see the above post. Come on guys...

And FYI, if we are getting into a scientific discussion, I can guarrantee you I will present all facts in a logical manner. In a thread asking which supplement is better such as this, it is impossible to have a "factual" response, so I'm not really sure what I did wrong in that regard.

 

[onemind1body]

Mr Cooper, ya f'd up, u apologized, and you analyzed what it was that got you into this whole mess in the first place. Let's give this guy a break fellas, if u read some of his other posts you will realize he is well educated in this arena and despite the way he went about his comment in this thread, he has been a contributing member that I for one would like to keep around.

 

[SweetLou321]

Lol at this thread

 

[DAdams91982]

Mr Cooper, ya f'd up, u apologized, and you analyzed what it was that got you into this whole mess in the first place. Let's give this guy a break fellas, if u read some of his other posts you will realize he is well educated in this arena and despite the way he went about his comment in this thread, he has been a contributing member that I for one would like to keep around.

I didn't even know there was a problem.. I was not attacking anyone, and have no beef with the man. I just commented on one statement he made.

The intertubez iz srs!

 

[EArch]

Have not used (nor really intened to) anabeta, but I used natadrol and got nothing out of it. I am not a fan of phyto-androgens, maybe anabeta will prove me wrong.