i want the energy rush of a good pre workout but i don't want creatine

[dexterfan]

which supplement should I take? i don't want anything with creatine


basically because it increases dht and i'm scared as hell of balding.

 

[tnubs]

my family goes bald at 25 and i worry too. creatine hasnt made any difference. i really dont think u need to worry about it. but if u still are your best bet is going to be just taking caffeine and geranium solo. this is also the cheapest and most economical way to go about things. so here for $27 you have 90 full workouts worth of stimulants. you only need 1 cap of each per workout so this will last you forever and its gona be strong. if u want "pumps" without creatine look into citrulline malate, stuff is the bomb. so is glycerol monosterate or liquid vegetable glycerol.

caffeine caps:
http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/primaforce/caffeine-90-tabs-200-mg.html

geranium:
http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/nutraplanet/geranium-extract-60-mg-100-caps.htm

 

[Rahl]

^^Good solutions right there. I doubt you'll find a ready made "Preworkout" without some form of creatine in it.

 

[monstermash]

Or go with Black Cats from Applied Nutrition or Motivate from Anabolic Innovations

 

[MrKleen73]

Yep he covered my suggestions...

 

[Royd The Noyd]

AMS makes pump fixx and it contains no creatine. We had some competitors that prefer it without before shows. It also contains caffeine, and geranamine if thats what your looking for...

On sale at nutraplanet right now.

 

[dexterfan]

do stimulants have any effect on dht? i'm not aware of this but just thought i'd check with you guys.

i think i'll go with taking the ingredients seperately like suggested above, i don't trust most of these companies anyway

 

[subweevil]

I use White Flood when I'm off creatine. 1 Scoop is plenty for me. Good luck!!

 

[dexterfan]

my family goes bald at 25 and i worry too. creatine hasnt made any difference. i really dont think u need to worry about it. but if u still are your best bet is going to be just taking caffeine and geranium solo. this is also the cheapest and most economical way to go about things. so here for $27 you have 90 full workouts worth of stimulants. you only need 1 cap of each per workout so this will last you forever and its gona be strong. if u want "pumps" without creatine look into citrulline malate, stuff is the bomb. so is glycerol monosterate or liquid vegetable glycerol.

would taking one cap of caffeine, one cap of geranium and one cap of citrulline malate all at once work?

 

[freefall365]

would taking one cap of caffeine, one cap of geranium and one cap of citrulline malate all at once work?

Yes, they work great stacked. you could throw in some tyrosine too.

i never knew creatine increases DHT! :bigeyes:

I have no history/concern of balding so I welcome an increase in DHT when I can get it.

 

[Royd The Noyd]

would taking one cap of caffeine, one cap of geranium and one cap of citrulline malate all at once work?

Depends on the dose of each cap. Id dose CM at least 3 grams/day, and your not gonna get that from 1 cap...

 

[dexterfan]

i never knew creatine increases DHT! :bigeyes:

I have no history/concern of balding so I welcome an increase in DHT when I can get it.

studies say levels of DHT increased by 56% after 7 days of creatine


btw, I just ordered the primaforce caffeine, geranium and citrulline malate

How do I use them, all of them together? Or do I switch from caffeine to geranium so I don't build a tolerance or something

I'm thinking of using some of it for cardio because more than for strength training, I really need something to give me a push for cardio, I can't motivate myself to keep at it otherwise.

One time I took jack3d for cardio and i ran like forrest gump

 

[Royd The Noyd]

i never knew creatine increases DHT! :bigeyes:

I have no history/concern of balding so I welcome an increase in DHT when I can get it.

There was one recent study that showed this...if I recall correctly it wasnt to a concernable degree.

 

[dexterfan]

There was one recent study that showed this...if I recall correctly it wasnt to a concernable degree.

a 56% increase of dht levels within 7 days in't exactly "not to a concernable degree" if you're prone to mpb I WOULD THINK


no?

 

[Young Gotti]

RPM....recommend it to a buddy who doesn't like creatine due to him playing hockey and getting dehydrated or so he says, but he loves RPM and says it's like crack

 

[freefall365]

studies say levels of DHT increased by 56% after 7 days of creatine

can you link the study?


and yes take all of them together. geranium will build a tolerance 3x per week seems to be the sweet spot for a lot of people. you will run like forest gump on this stack. its bascially the same thing as jacked.

 

[BillFuel]

White Flood when I am not using creatine. Solid product, even better with 25mg of geranium added.

 

[dexterfan]

can you link the study?


and yes take all of them together. geranium will build a tolerance 3x per week seems to be the sweet spot for a lot of people. you will run like forest gump on this stack. its bascially the same thing as jacked.

Here you go (spaces because "To be able to post links or images your post count must be 50 or greater. You currently have 19 posts.

Please remove links from your message, then you will be able to submit your post")
h t tp://journals.lww.com/cjsportsmed/pages/articleviewer.aspx?year=2009&issue=09000&article=00009&type=abstract


thanks for the advice, I better get me some nice running shoes by the time my package gets here

 

[freefall365]

couldnt get the link to work but 2 seconds of googling and i found all kinds of stuff on this...

can't believe i missed the boat on this one.....

 

[MM11]

I like rpm more than any other pre work out with or without creatine. I hate geranium and it's showing up in everything these days. Rpm has my
Vote!

 

[Royd The Noyd]

a 56% increase of dht levels within 7 days in't exactly "not to a concernable degree" if you're prone to mpb I WOULD THINK


no?

You are correct, I just went back and read the FT as well as the reply from Dr. Green at UCLA. You could argue that because it appears more T is converting to DHT its possible less estrogen conversion is occuring as well.

Anyways have you never used creatine before? If so, did hair loss occur.

 

[kingdong]

White Flood.

 

[dexterfan]

couldnt get the link to work but 2 seconds of googling and i found all kinds of stuff on this...

can't believe i missed the boat on this one.....

i found out about this by making hairloss threads on bodybuilding forums :lol:

 

[dexterfan]

You are correct, I just went back and read the FT as well as the reply from Dr. Green at UCLA. You could argue that because it appears more T is converting to DHT its possible less estrogen conversion is occuring as well.

Anyways have you never used creatine before? If so, did hair loss occur.

i used some pre workout supplements with creatine (jack3d and anadraulic state gt) but only for one tub of jack3d and a half AND 1/3rd of a tub of anadraulic state

also in the past i tried to use some creatine but was never consistent. it's fair to say i didn't use a lot of creatine or not on a regular basis anyway


it was only a few months ago i started getting paranoid about my hairline. so quit anything with creatine at once. actually tossed the jack3d and anadraulic state in the garbage


use generic rogaine (minoxidil 3.75%) now since 3-4 months and hairloss seems stabilized for now.

can't say if i experienced more loss on creatine since i was never aware of my hair untill a few months ago, but the facts are in the studies


good luck

 

[djbombsquad]

Just cut your hair and problem solved.

 

[dexterfan]

Just cut your hair and problem solved.

a lot of big dents and stuff in my skull. damnit. one really big one


edit: one day i will get over all this stuff lol, it's just hard at first.

 

[tnubs]

yea, citrulline malate needs to be gotten in bulk powder. id actually suggest 5-8 grams pre workout for some very noticable pumps. got a sample of RPM and used it for the first time today after having no stimulants in my body for over a week. 5 caps felt good and i did have a sexy pump but that may have been from high volume training, but nice regardless.

 

[learn]

OP have you tried GAMEDAY from MAN Sports yet ?

yea, citrulline malate needs to be gotten in bulk powder. id actually suggest 5-8 grams pre workout for some very noticable pumps. got a sample of RPM and used it for the first time today after having no stimulants in my body for over a week. 5 caps felt good and i did have a sexy pump but that may have been from high volume training, but nice regardless.

Or with BodyOctane

 

[JudgementDay]

RPM+Hemovol, Whiteflood

 

[JeremyT]

i used some pre workout supplements with creatine (jack3d and anadraulic state gt) but only for one tub of jack3d and a half AND 1/3rd of a tub of anadraulic state

also in the past i tried to use some creatine but was never consistent. it's fair to say i didn't use a lot of creatine or not on a regular basis anyway


it was only a few months ago i started getting paranoid about my hairline. so quit anything with creatine at once. actually tossed the jack3d and anadraulic state in the garbage


use generic rogaine (minoxidil 3.75%) now since 3-4 months and hairloss seems stabilized for now.

can't say if i experienced more loss on creatine since i was never aware of my hair untill a few months ago, but the facts are in the studies


good luck

lollll. Man you need to relax. I would hardly believe one study that it raises DHT. There has been so many done on creatine, and I cannot remember ever before reading that claim. Even still throwing out all of your creatine and taking rogaine for a few months is pretty retarded.

 

[Royd The Noyd]

lollll. Man you need to relax. I would hardly believe one study that it raises DHT. There has been so many done on creatine, and I cannot remember ever before reading that claim. Even still throwing out all of your creatine and taking rogaine for a few months is pretty retarded.

That's because it's the first time they specifically looked at DHT...

 

[tnubs]

tried my second sample of RPM today (they sent me 2) and it really helped my energy and aggression in the gym. my endurance was definitely up. i recommend this stuff forreal, plus no crash. they have a sale on their site for 50% off that is still going on for a lil longer

 

[anthon88]

which supplement should I take? i don't want anything with creatine


basically because it increases dht and i'm scared as hell of balding.

RPM and Lit UP don't have creatine.

I am using white flood now and enjoying it (also has no creatine).