"Stimulant Break" Necessary, Science or BroScience?

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by Synapsin View Post
    Stim breaks are virtually pointless to me and my lifestyle. The benefits of stimulants (like caffeine) largely outweigh the negatives when used at reasonable doses and there should be no reason for someone to stop using them unless they are experiencing adverse effects.

    Thank you so much!. Appreciate your input in here!


  2. Adrenal fatigue is not real. Stim breaks don't make sense, people drink multiple cups of coffee a day and they're fine. I think its pointless. However I take a day off of caffeine here and there but I see no point.
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by T-Bone View Post
    I don't agree. The energy can still be there, even if you don't "feel it". Just because you don't "feel it" doesn't mean its not working. What most people "feel" when they first start taking a stimulant are side effects from stimulants. Jitters, "tunnel vision". Once those effects wear off though, it doesn't mean the product stopped working. For instance someone can take a pre-workout, and say I didn't "feel anything" from it. Yet, for some reason they seem to have increased reps and decreased rest between sets, yet because they felt no increase in heart, jitters, or what they themselves believe what "energy" feels like they think the product doesn't work. Or they could feel those symptoms the first couple times they try the product, but after a week or two no longer feel those symptoms and think the product stopped working, time for a break, because my body "got used to it". Yet they are still getting the increased reps and decreased rest time.
    What he is saying is actually correct. When you take caffeine, the body upregulates certain enzymes whose job it is to deactivate caffeine. Over time, you need more caffeine to elicit the same effect because of this upregulation.
    Similarly, the body upregulates central adenosine receptors and so caffeine literally decreases in potency. Thus making you need more to continue to reap the effects of Caffeine. When you decrease your dose, you enter caffeine withdrawal which includes headaches etc until adenosine receptors return to baseline.
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  4. Quote Originally Posted by T-Bone View Post
    I agree with you on this. I'm just questioning other benefits besides energy, and whether or not long term use is actually dangerous, or could there actually be some benefits of continued use as long as you don't consistently raise the dosage. Like with the pre-workout enhanced. I've seen reports of people that say they have been using it for over a month straight with no need to increase dosage. Still the same energy at the same dosage. Also what about all the non stimulant type ingredients included in fat burner and pre-workouts?. I just have these questions in my head is all.
    Oh I see, yes the other effects of caffeine can still be reaped regardless of the energy hit.
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  5. Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    What he is saying is actually correct. When you take caffeine, the body upregulates certain enzymes whose job it is to deactivate caffeine. Over time, you need more caffeine to elicit the same effect because of this upregulation.
    Similarly, the body upregulates central adenosine receptors and so caffeine literally decreases in potency. Thus making you need more to continue to reap the effects of Caffeine. When you decrease your dose, you enter caffeine withdrawal which includes headaches etc until adenosine receptors return to baseline.
    Do we have any idea how long a break we need to return to baseline? I essentially hit heavy stims during the week and try to stay relatively stim free during the weekend when I'm not working.
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by Synapsin View Post
    Stim breaks are virtually pointless to me and my lifestyle. The benefits of stimulants (like caffeine) largely outweigh the negatives when used at reasonable doses and there should be no reason for someone to stop using them unless they are experiencing adverse effects.

    Yep!

  7. Quote Originally Posted by EatMoar View Post
    Adrenal fatigue is not real. Stim breaks don't make sense, people drink multiple cups of coffee a day and they're fine. I think its pointless. However I take a day off of caffeine here and there but I see no point.

    Agreed.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by Geoforce View Post
    Do we have any idea how long a break we need to return to baseline? I essentially hit heavy stims during the week and try to stay relatively stim free during the weekend when I'm not working.
    Actually, I just read that adenosine receptors may not be the cause for tolerance.. I was basing it off these: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6298543; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3003486 however this study found that adenosine receptors were not the culprit for tolerance: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1846425

    It is possible to prevent tolerance by keeping the dosage low, however (i.e. a cup of coffee a day can continue to elicit its effects indefinitely).
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  9. Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    Actually, I just read that adenosine receptors may not be the cause for tolerance.. I was basing it off these: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6298543; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3003486 however this study found that adenosine receptors were not the culprit for tolerance: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1846425

    It is possible to prevent tolerance by keeping the dosage low, however (i.e. a cup of coffee a day can continue to elicit its effects indefinitely).
    Doesn't work for me as well as my weekday doses (depending on what I'm running) may be pretty high. I frequently run E/C stack with some breaks, but even on those breaks from E/C I'll use something like Dexaprine, Alphamine, Thermogum, etc Pretty much take weekends off as I said.
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  10. have to listen to the joe rogan experience podcast w/ dave asprey....the first time he was on, he says adrenal fatigue does happen from coffee, but it's not from the stimulants in the coffee, it's the way it's processed and shipped, the coffee gets mold on it which is actually the factor for the adrenal fatigue and few other things

    he actually sells a coffee that he claims is processed and never had the mold on it.....if thats true for all stimulants or for the caffeine in most supplements, i'm not sure but i tend to buy into what the guy is saying, my friend bought his coffee and described it as a different type of "high"
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  11. Quote Originally Posted by Young Gotti View Post
    have to listen to the joe rogan experience podcast w/ dave asprey....the first time he was on, he says adrenal fatigue does happen from coffee, but it's not from the stimulants in the coffee, it's the way it's processed and shipped, the coffee gets mold on it which is actually the factor for the adrenal fatigue and few other things

    he actually sells a coffee that he claims is processed and never had the mold on it.....if thats true for all stimulants or for the caffeine in most supplements, i'm not sure but i tend to buy into what the guy is saying, my friend bought his coffee and described it as a different type of "high"

    I'll listen to Synapsin and Mr.Cooper69, thanks. They have brains. I don't know about Joe Rogan.....I just never thought of that guy as "Smart".

  12. Quote Originally Posted by T-Bone View Post
    I'll listen to Synapsin and Mr.Cooper69, thanks. They have brains. I don't know about Joe Rogan.....I just never thought of that guy as "Smart".
    ehh suite yourself....but it's not joe rogan making the claims, it's dave asprey
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  13. Quote Originally Posted by Young Gotti View Post
    have to listen to the joe rogan experience podcast w/ dave asprey....the first time he was on, he says adrenal fatigue does happen from coffee, but it's not from the stimulants in the coffee, it's the way it's processed and shipped, the coffee gets mold on it which is actually the factor for the adrenal fatigue and few other things

    he actually sells a coffee that he claims is processed and never had the mold on it.....if thats true for all stimulants or for the caffeine in most supplements, i'm not sure but i tend to buy into what the guy is saying, my friend bought his coffee and described it as a different type of "high"
    Dave Asprey is a ****ing fool Im sorry to inform you. His coffee mold theory is utterly retarded. Even Rogan was very skeptical of him in later JRE podcasts (after he had time to do research and not just take Asprey at his word).

    The guy is an IT professional turned salesperson. He has many claims and most are without supporting evidence.

  14. Quote Originally Posted by mmats View Post
    Dave Asprey is a ****ing fool Im sorry to inform you. His coffee mold theory is utterly retarded. Even Rogan was very skeptical of him in later JRE podcasts (after he had time to do research and not just take Asprey at his word).
    Joe Rogan questions everything (see what i did there?) but at the end of the day joe still sells dave's coffee on his site. Most of the second podcast was questioning dave about other things dave talked about and not about the coffee though. Either way Dave isn't the only one who talked about mold on coffee beans, its just the easiest way for someone to access some of the information
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  15. Quote Originally Posted by Young Gotti View Post
    Joe Rogan questions everything (see what i did there?) but at the end of the day joe still sells dave's coffee on his site. Most of the second podcast was questioning dave about other things dave talked about and not about the coffee though. Either way Dave isn't the only one who talked about mold on coffee beans, its just the easiest way for someone to access some of the information
    Well that is disappointing that Joe promotes that crap still. Though I guess I shouldnt expect much more from Joe than entertainment anyways.

    Dave Asprey just irks me. Here is an excerpt from his website - "You don’t like the taste of bad coffee for the same reason you don’t like the taste of gasoline: your body is telling you it’s toxic." I guess this is the extent of scientific method for Dave. Taste good = good for you , taste bad = bad for you. I picture Dave in a cave wielding a club as he says that. I wonder what Dave's theory is on stim breaks.

  16. Quote Originally Posted by mmats View Post
    Well that is disappointing that Joe promotes that crap still. Though I guess I shouldnt expect much more from Joe than entertainment anyways.

    Dave Asprey just irks me. Here is an excerpt from his website - "You don’t like the taste of bad coffee for the same reason you don’t like the taste of gasoline: your body is telling you it’s toxic." I guess this is the extent of scientific method for Dave. Taste good = good for you , taste bad = bad for you. I picture Dave in a cave wielding a club as he says that. I wonder what Dave's theory is on stim breaks.
    thats too bad...i think joe rogan is awesome and one of the only ppl who says it like it is, and dave asprey are some of my favorite podcasts that he's done
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  17. Quote Originally Posted by mmats View Post
    Well that is disappointing that Joe promotes that crap still. Though I guess I shouldnt expect much more from Joe than entertainment anyways.

    Dave Asprey just irks me. Here is an excerpt from his website - "You donít like the taste of bad coffee for the same reason you donít like the taste of gasoline: your body is telling you itís toxic." I guess this is the extent of scientific method for Dave. Taste good = good for you , taste bad = bad for you. I picture Dave in a cave wielding a club as he says that. I wonder what Dave's theory is on stim breaks.
    thats too bad...i think joe rogan is awesome and one of the only ppl who says it like it is, and dave asprey are some of my favorite podcasts that he's done
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  18. And boom goes the pseudoscience

  19. Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    And boom goes the pseudoscience

    Yeah!

  20. Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    And boom goes the pseudoscience
    That's the best kind of science. Like bleach to cure autism! Pseudoscience is kewl!

  21. Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    And boom goes the pseudoscience
    What an absolute joke.
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  22. Subbed for coops info
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  23. Quote Originally Posted by Bryancap77 View Post
    Subbed for coops info
    Why? He's already spoken on this topic so many times. He like the rest of us is a stim junkie

  24. I'm relatively new :/ sorry.. Just pertains to a situation I'm currently in, and as he said himself, science Is subject to change, and nothing is ironclad. Just wondering if there are any new ideas on the subject!
    NASM Certified Personal Trainer

  25. Quote Originally Posted by EatMoar View Post
    Why? He's already spoken on this topic so many times. He like the rest of us is a stim junkie
    If you keep a watchful eye, I "liked" a post in this thread . The issue is quite complex, but stimulants in the sense that we know and use (e.g. caffeine, ephedrine, etc) are not an issue.
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