A very good conversation am I following closely coop & usprep man. Have I been researching long hours on these very same things, large vineyards are my family owning in Italy with resveratrol in moderate wine it is there on a balance proportion. Like antioxidants speaking on here. I find that multi question a vexing good one, know some doctors proponents some not like coop here.
Hard very much so is it nutrients for some to get in food, then I have to look in the multi for every component individually to asses it.
"To your wife you should kiss try today"-Touey
And agreed about your supplementing comment. If I were to take a vitamin/antioxidant supplement I'd probably take a mainstream multivitamin like Centrum. Cheap, low-dose and the quality control is probably OK too.Thiol-based antioxidant supplementation alters human skeletal muscle signaling and attenuates its inflammatory response and recovery after intense eccentric exercise.
Michailidis Y, Karagounis LG, Terzis G, Jamurtas AZ, Spengos K, Tsoukas D, Chatzinikolaou A, Mandalidis D, Stefanetti RJ, Papassotiriou I, Athanasopoulos S, Hawley JA, Russell AP, Fatouros IG.
Democritus University of Thrace, Department of Physical Education and Sport Sciences, Komotini, Greece.
The major thiol-disulfide couple of reduced glutathione (GSH) and oxidized glutathione is a key regulator of major transcriptional pathways regulating aseptic inflammation and recovery of skeletal muscle after aseptic injury. Antioxidant supplementation may hamper exercise-induced cellular adaptations.
The objective was to examine how thiol-based antioxidant supplementation affects skeletal muscle's performance and redox-sensitive signaling during the inflammatory and repair phases associated with exercise-induced microtrauma.
In a double-blind, crossover design, 10 men received placebo or N-acetylcysteine (NAC; 20 mg · kg(-1) · d(-1)) after muscle-damaging exercise (300 eccentric contractions). In each trial, muscle performance was measured at baseline, after exercise, 2 h after exercise, and daily for 8 consecutive days. Muscle biopsy samples from vastus lateralis and blood samples were collected before exercise and 2 h, 2 d, and 8 d after exercise.
NAC attenuated the elevation of inflammatory markers of muscle damage (creatine kinase activity, C-reactive protein, proinflammatory cytokines), nuclear factor κB phosphorylation, and the decrease in strength during the first 2 d of recovery. NAC also blunted the increase in phosphorylation of protein kinase B, mammalian target of rapamycin, p70 ribosomal S6 kinase, ribosomal protein S6, and mitogen activated protein kinase p38 at 2 and 8 d after exercise. NAC also abolished the increase in myogenic determination factor and reduced tumor necrosis factor-α 8 d after exercise. Performance was completely recovered only in the placebo group.
Although thiol-based antioxidant supplementation enhances GSH availability in skeletal muscle, it disrupts the skeletal muscle inflammatory response and repair capability, potentially because of a blunted activation of redox-sensitive signaling pathways. This trial was registered at clinicaltrials.gov as NCT01778309.
Agreed a cheap centrum introduced into a diet high if a variety of fruits, veggies, grains and legumes than add the chicken, fish or beef..
A bit off topic i believe "adrenal fatigue" is a phantom phenomenon and what is really happening is nutrient deficiencies in our a very acidic Protein rich diet that extracts some important vitamins/minerals into our urine.
I think there's such a fine tipping point where antioxidants become oxidative that we may never find optimal levels..and then some oxidative processes are very important as has been mentioned. I do take antioxidants(GTE, Pine Bark, ubiquinol) and do generally think they're beneficial but I go at it from an anti-inflammatory perspective. If it lowers my inflammatory responses, then its generally good, IMO. Trying to focus on free radicals is like playing wack-a-mole.
what about Pterostilbline
in his book the body opus he lays out the iso caloric diet in detail. that was like what 1995 ish? almost 20 yrs ago... he was surely ahead of his time back then.
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WRT antioxidant supplementation in general ....Yes,antioxidants such as ALA,Green tea extract,Resveratrol,NAC,Vit.C are counterproductive towards improving one's body composition but with antioxidants and exercise,timing is everything.It is critical to NOT supplement with antioxidants within a few hours before or after weight training.
As far as detrimental effects towards general well being and health,as others have already stated in this thread,a liberal approach to anti-oxidant supplementation is not wise.Green tea extract,resveratrol,NAC + Vit. C have a myriad of other health benefits well past their antioxidative properties.As long as you're not throwing back ALA with every CHO heavy meal and so on,bro-bot style...and instead utilize a properly timed,conservative dosing strategy with such,the concerns become invalid.
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