Jake's HPTA by IRONCHAMPUSA Log

Jakethaniel

Jakethaniel

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I would like to start off by saying thank you to koi1214 and everyone at IRONCHAMPUSA for giving me this opportunity.

I am going to be running IRONCHAMPUSA's HPTA for 30 days at 6 tabs a day, 3 tabs in the AM and another 3 in the PM on an empty stomach.

I am a natural lifter, 20 years old and mainly focus on strength training.
The other supplements I will be using will be fearn lecithin granules, vitamin D, and fish oil(after today because it is my last workout with ARA).

Goals:
Today I made a long running goal of Benching 300, so I will move the goal of this run to Benching 315.
I am also getting over pain I have been having in my right glute for a long time during squatting, so I will be working on building my squat back up. If I can continue squatting the way I have been the goal will be a Beltless 355 for 5 reps, but I will have to see where my strength really is.
Another goal is to get my pumped arms to 18 inches. My last few workouts have had them at 17.7-75 inches, so we will see where I can get them to using HPTA.

Training:
I just finished Smolov Intense Phase for Bench Press. I did this as an experiment, but I was not very consistent with the program because it was a rough month with things going on in my personal life, but it looks like I have still made at least a 5 pound PR.

Sorry I digress, but this means for this run I will be starting a different program. I am probably either going to go with Smolov jr which I was able to make a 10 pound PR with the previous month or back to 797m which when I used it I was able to add ~30 pounds to my bench and ~40-50 to my deadlift over 3-4 months, so I know they are both effective programs.

For my squat I have been working up to a 5 rep adding 20 pounds every workout, eventually I will follow it with some volume when I feel that my glute is prepared. My last workout I worked up to 285 pain free which was very exciting. I will also probably throw in some deadlift training here and there to be sure that it does not fall off.

I am very excited to see how far I can push this supplement and how far it can push me!
 
Jakethaniel

Jakethaniel

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12/02/14 Day 1
-Paused Bench Press worked up to a PR of 300.
I felt good through the warmups and this PR felt easy, but then I went for 310 and I was stapled. This was fasted which is not foreign to me, but I was not planning on it being fasted.

Prior to this I drank some coffee, took 2 tablespoons of fearn lecithin granules, and took my first 3 caps of HPTA. I obviously can not give this PR to HPTA, but I am sure it will be pushing me to get some PR's later on in this month.

I will post my second workout for today later because I am splitting it into 2 parts since I maxed today, but this is not a usual occurrence.
 
Jakethaniel

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12/02/14 Day 1 Part 2
-Paused Bench Press worked up to 290 again.
Eh, I wanted to see if I could get 305, but it was just not happening. Maxing twice in a day has worked for me before, but I mainly just did it for fun today.

-Dips 3 sets of 8. 1 minute rests.
Threw these in today because I suck at them and since it is an in between program day I thought I would do them. Also I have pretty much just bench pressed for my chest, tri, and shoulder work for the past 2 months while doing smolov stuff, so I wanted to do something very different from bench while hitting the same muscles.

-DB Rows 62.5 for 2 sets of 50.
For these I use a weight from 20 reps to 50 reps, adding 5 reps each workout, then move the DB up 10 pounds.
These were pretty hard and exhausting.

-Seated Barbell Curls 85 for 3 sets of 8. 1 minute rest.
Kept very upright. These felt pretty good.

-Concentration Curls 22.5 for 3 sets of 12. Opposite arm as rests.
Felt pretty good, nice pump.

-Cross Body Hammer Curls 22.5 for 1 sets of 30.
I am experimenting with high rep biceps work.

-Band No Moneys 2 sets of 15.

Pumped arms were 18 inches! I really do not understand, but also I am very happy.
This means I am going to have to move my arm goal size up to 18.25 inches or at least a consistent 18.25.
I can possibly give this arm size PR to the HPTA because of possible increased vasodilation, but we will see what is to come.

This was a very exciting day for my training and a great start to this log for myself, although it kind of ruined 2 goals I wanted to use this product to reach by me reaching them already, but I guess that is a good thing! haha
 
thebigt

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2 goals reached already, damn!!!
congrats!!!
i am on 4th day of hpta and i felt it working at the end of 2nd day....this stuff hit me faster than i expected.
 
Jakethaniel

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2 goals reached already, damn!!!
congrats!!!
i am on 4th day of hpta and i felt it working at the end of 2nd day....this stuff hit me faster than i expected.
Thanks and awesome! Your log makes me excited to try VOLUME.

Also that should be perfect because I plan to train squats tonight after my second dose of HPTA for today.
 
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Thanks and awesome! Your log makes me excited to try VOLUME.

Also that should be perfect because I plan to train squats tonight after my second dose of HPTA for today.
still waiting for 2nd bottle of volume, together with hpta should be nothing but win!!!
 
Jakethaniel

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12/03/14 Day 2
-Beltless Squat worked up through 245, 265, 285 to 295 for 5 reps. Then I did 2 sets of 275 for 5.
So about 30 working reps.
These felt pretty good. My injured glute felt a little off on 295 and the 2 sets of 275.
I will be adding more volume as it continues to feel better.

-Thoracic Rolls? 3 reps each side super set with Ab Wheel for 10 reps, 2 sets.
These felt okay, but I am going to be super sore tomorrow because this is my first time doing abs in a while
By thoracic rolls I mean an exercise in which you lay with your arms and feet stretched in a line, then you roll yourself over by pressing one of your arms over to the opposite side while not using your legs at all. It is something my ART guy advised me to do and I decided I wanted to try it superset with my favorite core exercise.

Notes: I had some increased perspiration and a bit of an increased pump.

Feeling pretty good. I might take tomorrow off as a rest day depending on my soreness level and how tired I am. If not I will begin 797m for Bench Press.
 
Jakethaniel

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Day 3
I am planning on getting a mid day workout in, in a few hours and going to get a quick nap in before.

Some notes so far from today:
I have had an upset stomach and did not feel that great, but I do not believe that it is related to the product and I think it was more so related to anxiety over some stuff I had going on this morning. I just thought I would mention it, so I can monitor it because some sups take time for my stomach to get used to.

Also I am done seeing my ART guy, so I will probably get in a squat workout tomorrow or Saturday then I will get a deep tissue massage on it Sunday from a massage student/s for a good deal, then I feel like I will be ready to start hitting my squats hard. I will assess where I want to go with squat and dead training from there.

Something more related to the product is that I have been feeling more confident. Also I have been feeling, and this is the best way I can describe it, a shadowing excitement. I feel this mainly when thinking about training, but to try to explain it, it is like I am excited about something so much that it gives me energy and I want to tell people about it, but I do not know what I am excited about or what to say about it. Maybe it could be described as optimism.

Also possibly related is that I have only felt a bit of ab DOM's so far, so we will see how it progresses. This could be an indicator of some enhanced recovery because I have not hit them directly in over a month.
 
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Day 3
I am planning on getting a mid day workout in, in a few hours and going to get a quick nap in before.

Some notes so far from today:
I have had an upset stomach and did not feel that great, but I do not believe that it is related to the product and I think it was more so related to anxiety over some stuff I had going on this morning. I just thought I would mention it, so I can monitor it because some sups take time for my stomach to get used to.

Also I am done seeing my ART guy, so I will probably get in a squat workout tomorrow or Saturday then I will get a deep tissue massage on it Sunday from a massage student/s for a good deal, then I feel like I will be ready to start hitting my squats hard. I will assess where I want to go with squat and dead training from there.

Something more related to the product is that I have been feeling more confident. Also I have been feeling, and this is the best way I can describe it, a shadowing excitement. I feel this mainly when thinking about training, but to try to explain it, it is like I am excited about something so much that it gives me energy and I want to tell people about it, but I do not know what I am excited about or what to say about it. Maybe it could be described as optimism.

Also possibly related is that I have only felt a bit of ab DOM's so far, so we will see how it progresses. This could be an indicator of some enhanced recovery because I have not hit them directly in over a month.
i have been feeling what i call alpha male mentality-total confidence!!! any libido related effect?
 
Jakethaniel

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i have been feeling what i call alpha male mentality-total confidence!!! any libido related effect?
Semi(hah pun intended), the past 2 days I have not gotten a lot of sleep, because of time restraints not the product, which is usually a big factor in my erection quality, but I have still been able to get it full. I should be able to get a nice full night of sleep tonight and hopefully I will get my VOLUME tomorrow then I will be able to tell you guys how that goes. :stick: hah!
 
koi1214

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Semi(hah pun intended), the past 2 days I have not gotten a lot of sleep, because of time restraints not the product, which is usually a big factor in my erection quality, but I have still been able to get it full. I should be able to get a nice full night of sleep tonight and hopefully I will get my VOLUME tomorrow then I will be able to tell you guys how that goes. :stick: hah!
Let me know when you do get it!:banana:
 
Jakethaniel

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Decided to take yesterday off as a rest day so my next rest day could land on Sunday when I want to get my glute massage.
koi1214 Nothing yet today.
 
Jakethaniel

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12/05/14 Day 4
-Paused Bench Press 215, 225, 235 for 2. 245 for 3 sets of 3.
I was shooting for a 7 RPE on the top weight and I think I got it.

-Dips +10 pounds 4 sets of 6. 2 minute rests.
I am feeling really good about this. I suck at dips because I have never worked on them until now and I think they are starting to progress already.

-DB Bench Press 42.5's for 5 sets of 10. 1 minute rests.
I got a nice pump from this.

-DB Rows 72.5 for 5 sets of 20. 1 minute rests.
These were tiring. Nice pump.

-Seated Barbell Curls 90 for 3 sets of 8. 1 minute rests.
These were hard.

-DB Concentration Curls 22.5's for 2 sets of 12. Other arm as rest

-DB Crossbody Hammer Curls 22.5's for 2 sets of 30. Other arm as rest.
At this point these were very hard.
Arms were at about 17.9in.

-Band No Moneys 2 sets of 15.

Pretty good training day.

Notes:
Abs were not sore, so I believe there is some improved recovery because after not training them for so long they should have been super sore.
I do think I felt stronger today, but it is hard to really tell until I get to do my 1rm.
 
Jakethaniel

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12/06/14 Day 5
-Beltless Squats 245, 265, 285, 305 for 5. 275 for 2 sets of 5.
Yay went 10 pounds higher than last time and still no pain. Could have done 315 for 5, but I will save it and get it next time.
I focused on being explosive and even the 305 felt explosive.

Did not have time for anything else.

Notes:
I definitely felt stronger which I could tell from how explosive everything felt.
I also felt a lot more aggressive with the weights which is not a normal thing for me.


Day 6
I got some really long deep sleep, better than usual I think.
Did not get to go out and get the massage and the students only do them on Wednesday and Sunday and looks like I am not going to be able to get it done this Wednesday, but I will start adding more volume anyways and see how I feel.
koi1214 Still no VOLUME in the mail. Getting a little worried, but hopefully they are just backed up from the holidays.
 
koi1214

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12/06/14 Day 5
-Beltless Squats 245, 265, 285, 305 for 5. 275 for 2 sets of 5.
Yay went 10 pounds higher than last time and still no pain. Could have done 315 for 5, but I will save it and get it next time.
I focused on being explosive and even the 305 felt explosive.

Did not have time for anything else.

Notes:
I definitely felt stronger which I could tell from how explosive everything felt.
I also felt a lot more aggressive with the weights which is not a normal thing for me.


Day 6
I got some really long deep sleep, better than usual I think.
Did not get to go out and get the massage and the students only do them on Wednesday and Sunday and looks like I am not going to be able to get it done this Wednesday, but I will start adding more volume anyways and see how I feel.
koi1214 Still no VOLUME in the mail. Getting a little worried, but hopefully they are just backed up from the holidays.
PM me your addy and I will get you tracking# ASAP.
 
thebigt

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12/06/14 Day 5
-Beltless Squats 245, 265, 285, 305 for 5. 275 for 2 sets of 5.
Yay went 10 pounds higher than last time and still no pain. Could have done 315 for 5, but I will save it and get it next time.
I focused on being explosive and even the 305 felt explosive.

Did not have time for anything else.

Notes:
I definitely felt stronger which I could tell from how explosive everything felt.
I also felt a lot more aggressive with the weights which is not a normal thing for me.


Day 6
I got some really long deep sleep, better than usual I think.
Did not get to go out and get the massage and the students only do them on Wednesday and Sunday and looks like I am not going to be able to get it done this Wednesday, but I will start adding more volume anyways and see how I feel.
koi1214 Still no VOLUME in the mail. Getting a little worried, but hopefully they are just backed up from the holidays.
i am on day 8 or 9 of hpta, not sure...definately feeling effects!!!
 
Jakethaniel

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i am on day 8 or 9 of hpta, not sure...definately feeling effects!!!
Yeah, I saw while creeping on your log! hah

I am excited to test out what it is doing for my max strength in about a week.
 
Jakethaniel

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Day 7 12/08/14
-Paused Bench Press 225, 245, 255, 265 for 2. 275 for 2 sets of 2. 5 minute rests.
Damn, these felt really bad today because I really messed up my warm ups
I irritated my right shoulder with 95 because I accidentally hit the under side of the rack. Then when I went to do 225 one side had only 1 45 while the other had 2 45's and the 2 45 side was my right shoulder. I unracked it the opposite way to just to ensure symmetrical fatigue, I know it is kinda silly but it would have bugged me had I not.
I guess I should be happy 275 was going up for 2 after that.

-False Grip Close Grip Bench Press 225 for 3 sets of 5.
Not bad. I have not done these in around 3 months.

-Dips + 10 pounds 3 sets of 8. 1 minute rests.
Very Hard.

I might move my back and bicep work onto my squat day now that I am doing bench accessory work.

Tried dosing it a little different today partly because I had wanted to try it and partly because I did not have a chance in the morning. I also got my VOLUME today so I tried it out. So 6 HPTA and 3 VOLUME Pre-workout. I do not think this had anything to do with Bench feeling crappy today, but I probably will just keep the HPTA does spread into 3 in the am and 3 in the pm for now on.
koi1214 Got the VOLUME yesterday when I went home. Thanks again!
 
koi1214

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Day 7 12/08/14
-Paused Bench Press 225, 245, 255, 265 for 2. 275 for 2 sets of 2. 5 minute rests.
Damn, these felt really bad today because I really messed up my warm ups
I irritated my right shoulder with 95 because I accidentally hit the under side of the rack. Then when I went to do 225 one side had only 1 45 while the other had 2 45's and the 2 45 side was my right shoulder. I unracked it the opposite way to just to ensure symmetrical fatigue, I know it is kinda silly but it would have bugged me had I not.
I guess I should be happy 275 was going up for 2 after that.

-False Grip Close Grip Bench Press 225 for 3 sets of 5.
Not bad. I have not done these in around 3 months.

-Dips + 10 pounds 3 sets of 8. 1 minute rests.
Very Hard.

I might move my back and bicep work onto my squat day now that I am doing bench accessory work.

Tried dosing it a little different today partly because I had wanted to try it and partly because I did not have a chance in the morning. I also got my VOLUME today so I tried it out. So 6 HPTA and 3 VOLUME Pre-workout. I do not think this had anything to do with Bench feeling crappy today, but I probably will just keep the HPTA does spread into 3 in the am and 3 in the pm for now on.
koi1214 Got the VOLUME yesterday when I went home. Thanks again!
OK with VOLUME go 3 after breakfast and 3 before bed.On your activity days add an extra 3 VOLUME with the other 3.
Also I have been doing HPTA the same way as Volume.So that is 3 in the morning and 3 before bed..
 
thebigt

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OK with VOLUME go 3 after breakfast and 3 before bed.On your activity days add an extra 3 VOLUME with the other 3.
Also I have been doing HPTA the same way as Volume.So that is 3 in the morning and 3 before bed..
NICE!!!
 
Jakethaniel

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Day 8 12/09/14
Did not have time for squats because I took my girlfriend to a concert for part of her Christmas present. I only took one dose of volume before bed, but through the day, and especially after taking the volume at night, I could tell there was an increase in blood flood to Jake jr! hah

Going to get my squats done later tonight, since I am just seeing your dosing schedule now Koi, I will give 6 VOLUME pre-workout a try.
 
Jakethaniel

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Day 9 12/10/14
-Beltless Squats worked up to 295 for 5.
Stopped there because I had a bit of pain in my glute again.
I also did moved furniture and pulled up some carpet a few hours prior as well as driving 2 hours earlier this day and the prior day, so I am not disappointed. I stopped there with normal squatting.

-Jump Squats 95 for 5 sets of 3.
I liked these a lot and will probably focus my squatting work around them in a while when my glute is 100%.
This is my first time trying them and with the glute pain I decided to go really light.

-Ab Wheel 2 sets of 10. 1 minute rest.

Overall an alright workout, but I was feeling a little beatup.

I could definitely tell a difference pump wise from the 6 VOLUME pre-workout, but tomorrow I will go with the 3am and 3pm like HPTA
 
koi1214

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Day 9 12/10/14
-Beltless Squats worked up to 295 for 5.
Stopped there because I had a bit of pain in my glute again.
I also did moved furniture and pulled up some carpet a few hours prior as well as driving 2 hours earlier this day and the prior day, so I am not disappointed. I stopped there with normal squatting.

-Jump Squats 95 for 5 sets of 3.
I liked these a lot and will probably focus my squatting work around them in a while when my glute is 100%.
This is my first time trying them and with the glute pain I decided to go really light.

-Ab Wheel 2 sets of 10. 1 minute rest.

Overall an alright workout, but I was feeling a little beatup.

I could definitely tell a difference pump wise from the 6 VOLUME pre-workout, but tomorrow I will go with the 3am and 3pm like HPTA
I need to try 6 VOLUME preworkout.
 
Jakethaniel

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Day 10 12/11/14
Took a rest day to catch up on some sleep and get in an epsom salt bath.
Still noticing increased blood flow and fullness to Jake jr. One thing I had not mentioned, thebigt did in his log, there is definitely increased sensitivity, I think mainly from the HPTA.
 
Jakethaniel

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Day 11 12/12/14
-Had some fun with some tires and a tree stump while my girlfriend was in her gym. I did some tire flips and some presses with the stump.
Both things hit my shoulders pretty hard which was the intention of the day, also got a sick pump in my biceps. On the tire flips I pressed them hard to flip over after I lifted them up.

Hours later
-Overhead Press worked up to 135 for 5, then 115 for 5 sets of 5. 1.5 minute rests.
Very happy with this, I have not done overhead presses in about 3 months and back then it was right around these numbers. Not the best I know, but I am working on them.

-Lateral Raises 10's for 2 sets of 20. 1 minute rest.
Just wanted to get blood in there.

Overall an alright day, not much new to point out.
 
Jakethaniel

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Day 12 12/13/14
Took a rest day.

Day 13 12/14/14
-Paused Bench Press 225, 235, 240 for 2. 245 for 3 sets of 3.
Not bad.

-Dips +15 3 sets of 6. 3 minute rests.
Getting stronger on these pretty fast, so I am happy about that.

-Pull Downs 5 sets of 10. 1 minute rests.
I do not know the weight because I was using a random piece of equipment at my girlfriend's house, but it gave my back a nice pump.

Overall a good lifting day.
 
Jakethaniel

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Day 14 12/15/14
-Beltless Jump Squats worked up to 175 for 2, then 3 sets of 155 for 2.
I wanted to work up to a higher weight and do a few more back down sets, but I was running low on time.

Later on I got some more work done.

-Beltless Squats 245 for 3 sets of 6.
These were pretty hard. I was still fatigued from the jump squats. Also I have not really done over 5 reps in a long time.

Felt pretty good, some things were tighter than I wanted, but my glute still has to heal.
I measured my arms and they were ~17.75, so I am pretty excited to see what they are at fully pumped because they had a tiny bit of one from squats.

Day 15 12/16/14
Took another rest day because tomorrow is my first max day, so we will see where I am at.
Libido was very high today.
 
Jakethaniel

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Thanks guys! That means a lot coming from the two of you!
 
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Thanks guys! That means a lot coming from the two of you!
your results are verifying what i have been saying about the products, thank you!!!
 
Jakethaniel

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Day 16 12/17/14
-Paused Bench Press 250, 270, 280, 290, 300 for 1. 305x0
I am happy with 300 today. The 300 I hit on day one was after 2 consecutive peaking programs, so to keep the strength while taking more rest days than I wanted is great.
Also I was in a slightly fatigued state because this is part of a training day, so not a true 1rm like my last 300 single.

-Paused False Grip Close Grip Bench Press 235 for 3 sets of 3. 3 minute rests.
Felt pretty alright about these, but I always have trouble feeling tight on them.

-Dips +15 for 4 sets of 6. 1 minute rests.
Feeling very good about these, same weight as my last workout, but severely reduced rests.

-DB Rows 72.5 for 3 sets of 25. 2 minute rests.
Damn, these were pretty tough today.

-Concentration Curls 22.5 for 2 sets of 15. other arm as rest.
Pump was a little over 18 inches!

Overall a good lifting day. Added in some sugar free gelatin preworkout, nothing that I would feel right away, but thought I would make the note. I will note if I continue this.

Notes:
My legs ended up not getting sore when I really thought they would from my last workout.
Bicep pump felt very hard, which is not that usual.
Very happy with how things are going. I cannot say this is all the supps, but to not lose strength after Smolov jr followed by Smolov intense, is pretty awesome and I think is partly from this stuff.
 
thebigt

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jake, what day are you on?
 
thebigt

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very nice. :147:

thanks, jake!!!
 
Jakethaniel

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Day 17 12/18/14
I had a very long weird day, so I did not get to train, but I took and passed my NASM personal training certification test!!!!
 
Jakethaniel

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Day 18 12/19/14
-Overhead Press worked up to 145 for 3, followed by 130 for 3 sets of 3.
I am very happy with these. 145 was like my max a few months ago, and all I really did for shoulders the past 3 months was a ton of benching and maybe 3 overhead pressing workouts.

-Paused Bench Press 225 for 3 sets of 8. 3 minute rests.
Happy with these, the last set was pretty tough though.

-1-Arm DB Press 22.5 for 3 sets of 20. 1 minute rests.
Tried these a bit of a different way, I pressed the dumbbell a bit sideways towards over the center of my head for a harder contraction.

-Lateral Raises 10's for 3 sets of 20. 1 minute rests.

-Band Pull Aparts 4 sets of 20.

Over all an awesome day. I got a lot of shoulder volume in.

It is possible that I have had a boost in shoulder strength from the possible increase in testosterone. My thought there would be that there would be more testosterone to attach to the high number of androgen receptors in the deltoids.
 
thebigt

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Day 17 12/18/14
I had a very long weird day, so I did not get to train, but I took and passed my NASM personal training certification test!!!!
congrats!!!
 
thebigt

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Day 18 12/19/14
-Overhead Press worked up to 145 for 3, followed by 130 for 3 sets of 3.
I am very happy with these. 145 was like my max a few months ago, and all I really did for shoulders the past 3 months was a ton of benching and maybe 3 overhead pressing workouts.

-Paused Bench Press 225 for 3 sets of 8. 3 minute rests.
Happy with these, the last set was pretty tough though.

-1-Arm DB Press 22.5 for 3 sets of 20. 1 minute rests.
Tried these a bit of a different way, I pressed the dumbbell a bit sideways towards over the center of my head for a harder contraction.

-Lateral Raises 10's for 3 sets of 20. 1 minute rests.

-Band Pull Aparts 4 sets of 20.

Over all an awesome day. I got a lot of shoulder volume in.

It is possible that I have had a boost in shoulder strength from the possible increase in testosterone. My thought there would be that there would be more testosterone to attach to the high number of androgen receptors in the deltoids.
it is my opinion that adding l-carn to hpta to would be very beneficial!!!
 
Jakethaniel

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it is my opinion that adding l-carn to hpta to would be very beneficial!!!
That is a great idea, that did not even cross my mind! Thanks! I will have to add it end for the rest of my log.
 
thebigt

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That is a great idea, that did not even cross my mind! Thanks! I will have to add it end for the rest of my log.
when i added it got extra aggression in gym and better recovery, normally i get some boost in libido, but my libido is maxed out!!!
 
Jakethaniel

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Day 19 12/20/14
Took a rest day.

Day 20 12/21/14
Added in L-Carnitine today.

-Paused Bench Press 225, 235, 245 for 2. 255 for 3 sets of 3.
I was rushed, so 255 ended up feeling slow.

I did not get much done, but I felt strong and overall good.
 
thebigt

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Day 19 12/20/14
Took a rest day.

Day 20 12/21/14
Added in L-Carnitine today.

-Paused Bench Press 225, 235, 245 for 2. 255 for 3 sets of 3.
I was rushed, so 255 ended up feeling slow.

I did not get much done, but I felt strong and overall good.
glad you are feeling good!!!

i hate feeling rushed, lol.
 

Cjg

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Day 3 on Hpta 2am 2 pm.. Man libido is up already and notice a slight drying effect!!! Like Arimistane
 
thebigt

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Day 3 on Hpta 2am 2 pm.. Man libido is up already and notice a slight drying effect!!! Like Arimistane
fadogia and bulbine=fantastic....surprises you how fast it hits, huh?
 

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