PrimordialPerformance's DermaTherm PCT and beyond-semi sponsored-

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    This weekeng was full of two brutal workouts. legs on Saturday, Back on Sunday. My body is feeling the pain today. Could barely get out of bed, after 7.5 hours of sleep I still felt like I was beaten.

    However, Post workout Sunday sunday was my refeed. It was much more then I normally give myself, but I wanted to eat. I ate 35 wings. 25 with hot sauce and 10 plain. that meal alone was around 2200-2300 cals. Thats the first time in 14-15 weeks Ive ate over a two hundred cals over my daily norm. Even my refeeds are usually upped carbs by 50 or so and I eat slightly fattier food I wouldn't normally eat.

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    The idea of 30 wings has me salivating right now.
    Just inject.
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    we have a place called "Fire on the mountain" here in Portland.......best wing place.....I mean ridiculous!

    -Matt
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    Buffallo Wild Wings is our goto here, its decent.
    Just inject.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HereToStudy View Post
    Buffallo Wild Wings is our goto here, its decent.
    Love me their deep fried pickles when I allow myself to have them!
    “Beastmode is when you can not possibly go any further, but then you make a conscious choice to move forward”.
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    Man today was one of those days, kids sick 103 temp all last night, wife's birthday, and called into a meeting this morning on my day off.

    With all that, I hit a slow ride this morning for 35 minute and 9 miles; then hit a meeting met the wife for a late brunch, tanned, and then hit weights. Did a upper body workout of front delts, rear delts, bicep, triceps, traps and then calves. Very fast paced 2 excersises per muscle group.

    Felt good when I left. Rushed home got ready and we went to a movie. We saw end of watch. It's very good movie but bad ending.

    Still applying DermaTherm post shower at night. Then pre workout in evenings. Really enjoying the pre workout application. Nice deep burn.

    I am looking about the same wich I am happy with. Have to hold On To gains and want to keep the bf low during pct.

    I feel stronger now then on cycle. Body is harder must be from the ai and serm. Will post up some two week out pct photos soon.
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    Hope your kid feels better soon bud, thanks for the update

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    Thanks ryansm He is doing much better today. He is still sluggish due to no energy. But he's back to eating and looks much better.

    I had an adventure last night. I got out of the shower and went to apply my DermaTherm I put it in my hand and as I sent to put it on my stomach and it dripped off my hand down to my crotch. That was one helluva burn. Holy cow I stood in front of a fan for 30 minutes.

    I hit the gym this morning did 35 min on the stair master and abs. Felt great with a good deep burn. I took my shirt off in the locker room and wow were my abs vascular. They were nice and red from the DermaTherm but the veins were everywhere. Very impressive.

    Came home from the gym and did about 1.5 hours of yard work the burn stayed the entire time. It's an adicting feeling. I really like it.

    Resting up now to hit the gym for legs tonight. Gonna smash them. I Love legs I feel like it just takes everything to keep going and when I finish it gives me th same feeling I use to have after a football game or pt test.
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    Oh man, I can only imagine the pain with last nights adventure.
    Just inject.
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    Name:  exhaustion.JPG
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    complete exhaustion when I was done with legs, I was soaked head to toe, sweated a lot more then normal.

    my leg routine:

    Squats: 135x20, 225 x 10, 275x5, 275x5, 275x5, 225x10, 135x10

    Hack Squats (Hammer Strength) Heels together toes pointed out: 225x8 for 3 sets

    Single leg hamstring curl (standing) superset with leg extensions:
    100x10 3 sets 140x10 3 sets

    Lying hamstring curl super set sitting calves
    135x10 3 sets 150x failure toes in, out, and straight

    Dead Lifts
    225x10, 315x 8, 365x5

    I was dead afterwards. Could barely walk and feeling it today.


    As far as DermaTherm, I am loving it. Woke up this morning shredded. slowly but surely I am getting leaner in the midsection. My strength is great for PCT its not down at all. I am weighing in at 213 to 215. still hovering in the 8-9% category. will test in another week. I really like that I feel dermatherm when my workouts get intense, it adds to it.
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    Christ, I would be dead after that session too. Good work.
    Just inject.
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    Updated Body Shots

    Week 2 of PCT started so I figuered it was time to post photos.
    Really didnt like how these turned out, shoty lighting and grainy. excuse the iPhone, its the 4 so camera isnt that great.

    Since last photos, I have completed two weeks PCT. I have upped cals 400cals while on PCT I am around 2400, 55P, 20C, 25F , then back and leg day 2600cal, 50P, 30C, 20F. My protein is either Hydrolized Whey, Chicken Breast/Tenderloins, Salmon, Lean Sirloin, Ground Lean Turkey. My carbs are Rolled Oats, Sweet potato, vegi's, and Fruits. My fats are Almonds, Cashews, Avacados, and PB. I make my diet on monday for the week and individually package it, except for dinner.

    I have been doing a 1 meal refeed a week usually sunday afternoon post workout. But I am going to stop that for the next three weeks.

    Attachment 67608
    I feel alittle bloated today, but didnt want to post photos selectively. I would like them to go every two weeks. I ate a Double Meat Roast Beef 6" Sub with cheese, spinach, green peppers, and mustard last night. It was pretty much my dinner due to being in a meeting till 830pm. I thionk the high sodium in that is why I feel so bloated. I also ate two cans of Tuna yesterday, it was a hectic day. October is a busy month for us at work.


    Attachment 67609
    Try to show the vasuclarity I have in the obliques. It can be pretty impressive after a cardio session, this was after no workout, when I am dryed out from sweating it is even more vascular.
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    For some reason, the attachments are not working for me...anyone else?
    Just inject.
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    I will repost them. I don't know why it didn't put them in like normal.
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    Today was a good day. Started with fasted cardio stair master 45 min, abs, and calves. I tanned then went home, ate, and fell asleep. It felt great to have a day just to lay around.

    During this mornings workout I had a nice burn, skin turned nice and red. I am liking the way derma therm is working. Apply it and still feel it hours later. Weight has been consistent at 213- 215.

    Since on pct I feel really good. I ve gained strength surprisingly. Maybe it's the added calories.

    I need to research some new oblique exercises. While I am this lean I really want to make them pop. Abs look good obliques have good veins but want more striations and muscle.

    I haven't forgot about the photos they are on my work computer so I will repost them Wednesday morning.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 02sixxer View Post
    I will repost them. I don't know why it didn't put them in like normal.
    Pictures have been strange on AM since they did the last major update.
    Just inject.
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    photos from last week
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    I ve been using the derma therm for a while now, I really have enjoyed the product thus far. I feel it has really aided in my leaness during PCT.

    I have decided that I am going to compete in Mens Physique in November. Its a smaller NPC event then what I have planned for April. I am very surprised that I have remained this lean through PCT and even gained strength. This is the best I ve felt during a pct. I was in the gym yesterday, after my workout I went into the locker room and started talking to a good friend of mine who bodybuilds and we got to talking about the November show. For a while now he has been telling me to compete there simply for experience before a much larger show,

    He wanted to see my mid section, so I took off my shirt. I am probably 3% lower then him and he is competeing in body building for the November show. He instilled a little more confidence in me. He has been competing for a while and watched the Physique class come and grow. He thinks I am far above the curve in prepping. He said he wouldnt get any lower in BF% until the last few days. He said he would stop the sodium and take a water pill to dry me out a bit. But just maintain tiill then. I feel I would want to drop about 2% before the show.

    My goal was to compete at 5% in Mens Physique for April. I am hanging around the 8.5-9% area. Since I ve been on pct I added caories, and it have really done me well in strength, I havent gained any weight. I have consistently weighed 213-215 lbs for a while now. Lately in the mornings I wake up very shredded more then I was on Epi. If I dried out, I could imagine how shredded I would look. I drink about 2 gallons a day, I drink 1 gallon out of a jug, plus 48 ounces of BCAA a day (2 24 ounce shakers), 24 oz of Pre workout (1 24ounce Shaker), 24 oz - 48 oz during workout, plus the little I take in with my shakes. I still feel in the mornings I look really good. Right after waking up I drink 40 oz of water. I drink 20 ounces then get ready for work, then drink another 20 ounces before I leave the house.


    How big of a difference does it make to dry out pre contest. I don't have water pills. Would water/sodium depletion give me more striations, but keep vascularity. I know I dont want to be as lean as a body builder, I also want to keep good shape and not look flat. If you guys have any advice on this I would appreciate any.
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    Wow incredible condition bud. Good luck in physique. I unfortunately cant answer the prep questions, as I am unfamiliar.
    Just inject.
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    Physique guys that do WELL --- do in fact get pretty damn lean, so I would say -- strive to get even leaner by November....

    Drying out doesnt need to be over complicated and is as simple as a few adjustments. For a very very simplistic way to dry out naturally...

    Water remains high last week (2 gals)

    Sodium is Hi (as it should be throughout prep)

    Carbs should be low in the final 2 days to further flush water and sodium

    Sodium is REDUCED ONLY Friday (1 day out)

    Water gets drank Hi all the way Til friday night around 9 pm...

    Next morning --- sip only iced black coffee...

    -Matt

    Quote Originally Posted by 02sixxer View Post
    I ve been using the derma therm for a while now, I really have enjoyed the product thus far. I feel it has really aided in my leaness during PCT.

    I have decided that I am going to compete in Mens Physique in November. Its a smaller NPC event then what I have planned for April. I am very surprised that I have remained this lean through PCT and even gained strength. This is the best I ve felt during a pct. I was in the gym yesterday, after my workout I went into the locker room and started talking to a good friend of mine who bodybuilds and we got to talking about the November show. For a while now he has been telling me to compete there simply for experience before a much larger show,

    He wanted to see my mid section, so I took off my shirt. I am probably 3% lower then him and he is competeing in body building for the November show. He instilled a little more confidence in me. He has been competing for a while and watched the Physique class come and grow. He thinks I am far above the curve in prepping. He said he wouldnt get any lower in BF% until the last few days. He said he would stop the sodium and take a water pill to dry me out a bit. But just maintain tiill then. I feel I would want to drop about 2% before the show.

    My goal was to compete at 5% in Mens Physique for April. I am hanging around the 8.5-9% area. Since I ve been on pct I added caories, and it have really done me well in strength, I havent gained any weight. I have consistently weighed 213-215 lbs for a while now. Lately in the mornings I wake up very shredded more then I was on Epi. If I dried out, I could imagine how shredded I would look. I drink about 2 gallons a day, I drink 1 gallon out of a jug, plus 48 ounces of BCAA a day (2 24 ounce shakers), 24 oz of Pre workout (1 24ounce Shaker), 24 oz - 48 oz during workout, plus the little I take in with my shakes. I still feel in the mornings I look really good. Right after waking up I drink 40 oz of water. I drink 20 ounces then get ready for work, then drink another 20 ounces before I leave the house.


    How big of a difference does it make to dry out pre contest. I don't have water pills. Would water/sodium depletion give me more striations, but keep vascularity. I know I dont want to be as lean as a body builder, I also want to keep good shape and not look flat. If you guys have any advice on this I would appreciate any.
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    Yeah, I want to be lean for November. I dont think 5% is going to happen, but thats my goal. Starting to up reps, cardio, and lean the diet a little more.

    I think with three weeks to cut and 5 days to prep, I can change my body. The down fall is being on PCT. I dont want to cut carbs for the next three weeks because I have felt really strong in the gym, coming from lower carbs, I think it has helped to add a little more in. I am still on the low side averaging around 125-150. Last week out I was going to cut carbs to 50g a day for MON-Thurs, Friday Carb Load with 50g carbs per meal for 5 meals, and continue high water till 9pm as you stated.

    Workout and Cardio are def going to play a role now. I have been just working to maintain for the last several weeks, not even thinking of competeing till next year.
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    Don't think like you won't reach the 5%, just tell yourself you will.
    Just inject.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 02sixxer View Post
    Yeah, I want to be lean for November. I dont think 5% is going to happen, but thats my goal. Starting to up reps, cardio, and lean the diet a little more.

    I think with three weeks to cut and 5 days to prep, I can change my body. The down fall is being on PCT. I dont want to cut carbs for the next three weeks because I have felt really strong in the gym, coming from lower carbs, I think it has helped to add a little more in. I am still on the low side averaging around 125-150. Last week out I was going to cut carbs to 50g a day for MON-Thurs, Friday Carb Load with 50g carbs per meal for 5 meals, and continue high water till 9pm as you stated.

    Workout and Cardio are def going to play a role now. I have been just working to maintain for the last several weeks, not even thinking of competeing till next year.
    Had you known about this last minute show you coulda stayed on .....

    But it is not seeming to affect you negatively as you are in great shape!!!!

    -Matt
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattPorter View Post
    Had you known about this last minute show you coulda stayed on .....

    But it is not seeming to affect you negatively as you are in great shape!!!!

    -Matt
    Yeah, I am kicking myself in the a$$, but I amgoing to just dig deep these next three weeks. I am doing much better then expected with PCT. Really enjoying my workouts, and i do have to say DermaTherm has a bit to do with that. We all like instant gratification, and the burning sensation is what I compare that too. I work hard, I feel something happening, so I worke harder.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 02sixxer View Post
    Yeah, I am kicking myself in the a$$, but I amgoing to just dig deep these next three weeks. I am doing much better then expected with PCT. Really enjoying my workouts, and i do have to say DermaTherm has a bit to do with that. We all like instant gratification, and the burning sensation is what I compare that too. I work hard, I feel something happening, so I worke harder.

    Very good to hear --- and honestly DermaTherm is perfect for a guy like you who is ALREADY LEAN!

    Keep applying to the stubborn areas and the good news is --- you should technically be

    holding water in the areas applied due to yohimbine's affect on aldosterone.

    Once you cease its usage you will clear any water and see those areas lean and dry!

    I try to get in good enough shape that EVEN while using topical yohimbine I still look dry

    -Matt
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattPorter View Post
    Very good to hear --- and honestly DermaTherm is perfect for a guy like you who is ALREADY LEAN!

    Keep applying to the stubborn areas and the good news is --- you should technically be

    holding water in the areas applied due to yohimbine's affect on aldosterone.

    Once you cease its usage you will clear any water and see those areas lean and dry!

    I try to get in good enough shape that EVEN while using topical yohimbine I still look dry

    -Matt
    Yeah, I found it interesting with dermatherm that you didn't realize how good the results were until a couple days after ceasing. I saw progress on, but alot more at the end.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HereToStudy View Post
    Yeah, I found it interesting with dermatherm that you didn't realize how good the results were until a couple days after ceasing. I saw progress on, but alot more at the end.
    That's really encouraging!
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    Started cardio 45 min ED on stair stepper. I was on fire Sunday after cardio. Also hitting 2 gals a day of water right now.

    On work days, I hit abs for 10 min as soon as I wake up before getting ready for work. Off days I will still start with fasted cardio, abs, cales.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 02sixxer View Post
    Started cardio 45 min ED on stair stepper. I was on fire Sunday after cardio. Also hitting 2 gals a day of water right now.

    On work days, I hit abs for 10 min as soon as I wake up before getting ready for work. Off days I will still start with fasted cardio, abs, cales.
    I really need to get myself in the havit of doing this, I just suck at getting up early.
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    Yesterday went well, got off work, applied DermaTherm, Changed and hit the gym. Did back, rib cage, abs, obliques, and cardio.

    My workout felt weak, I was disapointed with my back workout,

    Started with Bent over BB rows, 3sets of 12 then Reverse grip 3 sets of 12 light weight 155lbs.

    Then supersetted Lat pull downs and Row Pull downs on HammerStrength 3 sets each 10-12 reps

    Next I tripple setted, Staight leg deads, Hyperextensions, and pullovers for the rib cage.
    4 sets Deads 10 reps, Hypers 10 reps, Pullovers 12-15 reps

    Then did some T bar rows with obliques

    then abs and cardio.

    I did 25 minute stair stepper and 20 minutes on the stationairy bike. back to back. Goal was 45 stair stepper but I was tired after work.

    I wore a sweater while doing cardio, my midsection was hotter then ever. It was a very good burn.
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    Workout sounded pretty good to me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HereToStudy View Post
    Workout sounded pretty good to me.
    Yeah I was worn out, work beat me up yesterday. I think I just felt worn out. Plan on hitting Shoulders, Tri's and Bi's tonight. Hopefully I can get in the zone.

    I will finish up with abs and cardio.

    Abs in the morning is feeling good.
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    I will train ABS YEAR AROUND NOW.

    I used to only train them while dieting -- simply because I had them built from heavy lifting...

    Well -- I had someone preach to me that abs always need attention all year for lower back support and lifting heavier.

    Also -- who doesnt want deeply etched bricks? Mine were always good when lean, but I want them great.

    -matt
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattPorter View Post
    I will train ABS YEAR AROUND NOW.

    I used to only train them while dieting -- simply because I had them built from heavy lifting...

    Well -- I had someone preach to me that abs always need attention all year for lower back support and lifting heavier.

    Also -- who doesnt want deeply etched bricks? Mine were always good when lean, but I want them great.

    -matt

    How many times a week you hit them?
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    Quote Originally Posted by HereToStudy View Post
    How many times a week you hit them?
    We train calves and abs on alternating days...

    Every other day...

    Maybe I "appear' leaner than I am from more deeply developed abs...

    Who knows -- but they look nice for my off-season

    A good BB'r should NEVER be ashamed or insecure to peel off his shirt anytime of year.

    -Matt
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    That's seems to be a smart approach abs one day and calves another.

    When should I cut out the DermaTherm pre show. A week out?
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattPorter View Post
    We train calves and abs on alternating days...

    Every other day...

    Maybe I "appear' leaner than I am from more deeply developed abs...

    Who knows -- but they look nice for my off-season

    A good BB'r should NEVER be ashamed or insecure to peel off his shirt anytime of year.

    -Matt
    Appreciate it, will start implimenting this as well.

    Sixxer - I will let matt comment on the pre-contest.
    Just inject.
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    02sixxer's Avatar
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    Well I changed my diet a bit, hitting very low cals, but still getting a good amount of protein. The 45 min. of cardio on the stair stepper is pretty difficult. But the hardest part is keeping the heart rate manageable. I am trying to stay around 130 bpm but it keeps shooting up to 140+.

    I am sitting at 213lbs still but hopefully I will be down a bit by monday. Hitting about 2 gals of water a day.

    Yesterday, I had a great chest workout. I was very surprised with what I benched. My partner was maxing so when he started with 315 lbs I did it first and was surprised I hit it 3 times easily. Especialy with the caloric deficiency and being on pct. I was actually surprised with the whole workout. I was pretty stong and had good endurance. I felt energized which is nice.
  39. Registered User
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    Cut out Dermatherm target -- 5 days before contest

    -Matt
    Buy IronMagLabs products and SAVE with matt15

    Buy BlackStone Labs product and SAVE with matt10


  40. Primordial Performance Rep
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    HereToStudy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattPorter View Post
    Cut out Dermatherm target -- 5 days before contest-Matt
    Good to know, I feel this question comes up often.
    Just inject.
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