[thebigt]

AnaBeta is great for a natty supplement, seems to be working very well for me!

yeah, me too.

[bdcc]

I outright deny the previous allegation.

I said he was a mighty pleasant fellow!

[Milas]

I outright deny the previous allegation.I said he was a mighty pleasant fellow!

Caught me again...And you sir are an upstanding chap! I just have to keep you on your toes!

[MrKleen73]

Nice lift Milas, yeah running can take it out of your legs for sure and for a few days at that.

[ScottyDoc]

Lean Gains seems alright, works better for some than others IMO. Worth a try.

Just curious (in your opinion) is Lean Gains working for you? If so, is it working as well for you as it is for Doug & Chris? I have plans to give Lean Gains a fair shake when I am done getting ripped up for Halloween! They keep trying to talk me into starting now, but from what I've seen, it takes a few weeks to really dial it in and I have my diet dialed in as to what has worked so many times before, I just don't want to fix something that isn't broke when Halloween is so important to me! My goals are never really to get much bigger, always trying to increase leg girth though, so I'll probably try it out to see if I can gain lean mass only while staying around 6% BF, to me, if that is successful, then it will have more than proven itself!

[Milas]

I'd say honestly my results have not been as stellar as Doug or Chris on LeanGains. I believe you could attribute most progress to diet control versus timing and LG. Personally, I can manipulate my calories during the day and clean up things here and there to cut, or add in oats and I add weight (something about me and oats!). I wouldn't say I've had TONS more freedom than what I typically do.

On the other hand, I've remained relatively lean and added muscle strength back after my last severe cut. I wouldn't say my bf% has magically gone down just through LG, or that I've miraculously built muscle/recomp. I think it's following the normal pattern of managed nutrition and exercise.

Honestly, I will likely drop LG at the end of this in favor of my normal eating patterns. Missing morning meals really sucks on workout days, and my wife notices I'm more irritable/testy/on-edge when I don't eat in the morning.

In my opinion, LeanGains is a way for people to control the amount of calories they take in, I feel it's really kinda hard to get enough calories to bulk on LG. With meals spread throughout the day, it's a lot easier for calories here and there to add up without people realizing it. With LG, you get a much shorter period of time and thus more controlled intake of calories.

I've learned some things from it, but there are some tried and true methods out there that can be just as effective as another. It's really up to what works for you and what can you maintain control over. There's no "miracle diet" IMO, it's calories in vs. calories out and the macro/micro nutrients that go with it, and some slight play in timing (mainly around workouts).

So, long story short is that it CAN work but it doesn't fit my preference or lifestyle, and my progress has been nothing out of the ordinary. IMO if you have something that works for YOU, stick with it until you stop making the progress you want, and try something different.

[Milas]

Day 23: 7/20 Back/Biceps

1.5 Scoops Modern BCAA
1 Scoop Maximize V2
1 cap AnaBeta

Deadlifts
135 x 10
225 x 10
315 x 10
405 x 7
455 x 3
405 x 6
315 x 12

WG Low Cable Row
160 x 10
200 x 10
220 x 10
240 x 10
240 x 10

CG Pull Down
140 x 10
160 x 10
180 x 10
200 x 10
220 x 9

Pull Down Machine
130 x 12
170 x 10
210 x 5

Straight Arm Pull Down
30 x 12
40 x 12
50 x 10

Rope Cable Curl
55 x 12 (5 sets)

Isolateral Curl Machine
100 x 10 (5 sets)


Well, deadlifts were stuck where they were at last week (actually 1 less rep at 405). My lower back was just feeling too sore. I may switch to do DLs every other week, I just don't feel like it was fully recovered today (maybe partially due to squats yesterday too). I'll probably switch to doing SLDL's on off weeks for hamstrings and stick with DLs every other week, that way I can get my fix without over-straining my LB.

Other lifts felt good, excellent contraction and mind-muscle connection on the CG Pulldown and WG Low Row, I could feel the muscles I wanted to work. Biceps were so-so, got a good pump but nothing exceptional to report.

Looking forward to lunch, I may go to the sushi buffet with wife/son, here's hoping!


So, with AnaBeta, what would happen if I took 3-6 in one serving? Want me to find out?

[bdcc]

Maybe you should cycle your posterior chain exercise in the same way the Westside Barbell guys do without the maximal lift aspect and keep a few of them on rotation.

[ScottyDoc]

I'd say honestly my results have not been as stellar as Doug or Chris on LeanGains. I believe you could attribute most progress to diet control versus timing and LG. Personally, I can manipulate my calories during the day and clean up things here and there to cut, or add in oats and I add weight (something about me and oats!). I wouldn't say I've had TONS more freedom than what I typically do.

On the other hand, I've remained relatively lean and added muscle strength back after my last severe cut. I wouldn't say my bf% has magically gone down just through LG, or that I've miraculously built muscle/recomp. I think it's following the normal pattern of managed nutrition and exercise.

Honestly, I will likely drop LG at the end of this in favor of my normal eating patterns. Missing morning meals really sucks on workout days, and my wife notices I'm more irritable/testy/on-edge when I don't eat in the morning.

In my opinion, LeanGains is a way for people to control the amount of calories they take in, I feel it's really kinda hard to get enough calories to bulk on LG. With meals spread throughout the day, it's a lot easier for calories here and there to add up without people realizing it. With LG, you get a much shorter period of time and thus more controlled intake of calories.

I've learned some things from it, but there are some tried and true methods out there that can be just as effective as another. It's really up to what works for you and what can you maintain control over. There's no "miracle diet" IMO, it's calories in vs. calories out and the macro/micro nutrients that go with it, and some slight play in timing (mainly around workouts).

So, long story short is that it CAN work but it doesn't fit my preference or lifestyle, and my progress has been nothing out of the ordinary. IMO if you have something that works for YOU, stick with it until you stop making the progress you want, and try something different.

Thank You, that is exactly what I was looking for!

[swollen87]

subd

keep killing it bro

[Milas]

Maybe you should cycle your posterior chain exercise in the same way the Westside Barbell guys do without the maximal lift aspect and keep a few of them on rotation.

Probably a good idea. I used to be able to hit squats day 1, DLs day 2, and SLDL day 3 without much problem. Now I can't even get through day 2! I'm getting prematurely old...

Thank You, that is exactly what I was looking for!

No problem. I am very direct and honest, but it's just one man's opinion.

subd

keep killing it bro

Thanks, I'm hoping for some new PRs soon, just gotta keep my body injury free (or close to it)! Maybe get some sleep too!!!

[MrKleen73]

I'd say honestly my results have not been as stellar as Doug or Chris on LeanGains. I believe you could attribute most progress to diet control versus timing and LG. Personally, I can manipulate my calories during the day and clean up things here and there to cut, or add in oats and I add weight (something about me and oats!). I wouldn't say I've had TONS more freedom than what I typically do.

On the other hand, I've remained relatively lean and added muscle strength back after my last severe cut. I wouldn't say my bf% has magically gone down just through LG, or that I've miraculously built muscle/recomp. I think it's following the normal pattern of managed nutrition and exercise.

Honestly, I will likely drop LG at the end of this in favor of my normal eating patterns. Missing morning meals really sucks on workout days, and my wife notices I'm more irritable/testy/on-edge when I don't eat in the morning.

In my opinion, LeanGains is a way for people to control the amount of calories they take in, I feel it's really kinda hard to get enough calories to bulk on LG. With meals spread throughout the day, it's a lot easier for calories here and there to add up without people realizing it. With LG, you get a much shorter period of time and thus more controlled intake of calories.

I've learned some things from it, but there are some tried and true methods out there that can be just as effective as another. It's really up to what works for you and what can you maintain control over. There's no "miracle diet" IMO, it's calories in vs. calories out and the macro/micro nutrients that go with it, and some slight play in timing (mainly around workouts).

So, long story short is that it CAN work but it doesn't fit my preference or lifestyle, and my progress has been nothing out of the ordinary. IMO if you have something that works for YOU, stick with it until you stop making the progress you want, and try something different.

Thank You, that is exactly what I was looking for!

Milas makes a lot of good points and several that I have mentioned before in the LeanGains thread. I don't think LG is magical as far as what it can do. I mean the science is there and it definitely works. It is MUCH easier for me, and I have more success on it than a typical diet.

I will say that people with slower metabolisms really seem to do well on LG but the guys like Milas who need 4000 cals to make maintenance are may not have as easy of a time with it. I have not seen anyone actually bulk with it yet. Nor do I know of anyone who actually knows what the recommendations for bulking on it are. However for cutting / recomping it works excellently and takes very little planning, and food choices are definitely open. I think people who try to get everything in with clean foods have a harder time with it as well because it is very easy to get full on oats, and fibrous foods.

I don't know that I would say that it is more effective than your typical body builder diet, however for me it is much easier to stick with much more forgiving on food choices and those things make it more effective for me. In other words for me I get more out of it than what I have to put into the making the diet work. I do think it is superior for keeping muscle during a cut, as well as keeping strength up. Muscle wasting and catabolism is going to be lower with this type of eating during a cut.

As far as bulking which is what Milas has been doing I really don't know, and don't know how Martin has the macros and calories set up for a lean bulk so I can not make any comments on the effectiveness for that. I would have to actually know we were doing what we should before I could say anything about the effectiveness on a bulk.

[ScottyDoc]

Milas makes a lot of good points and several that I have mentioned before in the LeanGains thread. I don't think LG is magical as far as what it can do. I mean the science is there and it definitely works. It is MUCH easier for me, and I have more success on it than a typical diet.

I will say that people with slower metabolisms really seem to do well on LG but the guys like Milas who need 4000 cals to make maintenance are may not have as easy of a time with it. I have not seen anyone actually bulk with it yet. Nor do I know of anyone who actually knows what the recommendations for bulking on it are. However for cutting / recomping it works excellently and takes very little planning, and food choices are definitely open. I think people who try to get everything in with clean foods have a harder time with it as well because it is very easy to get full on oats, and fibrous foods.

I don't know that I would say that it is more effective than your typical body builder diet, however for me it is much easier to stick with much more forgiving on food choices and those things make it more effective for me. In other words for me I get more out of it than what I have to put into the making the diet work. I do think it is superior for keeping muscle during a cut, as well as keeping strength up. Muscle wasting and catabolism is going to be lower with this type of eating during a cut.

As far as bulking which is what Milas has been doing I really don't know, and don't know how Martin has the macros and calories set up for a lean bulk so I can not make any comments on the effectiveness for that. I would have to actually know we were doing what we should before I could say anything about the effectiveness on a bulk.

Hell Bro, this is starting to sound like a really good theme for a LOG, "ScottyDoc's experimental LG-Bulk... Come learn with Us!!!" Believe me Chris, from everything you tell me, it sounds like the perfect daily diet for me, I'm talking about my every-day 90% of the year way I eat, but unless next year rolls around and I'm below 6% BF, I'll still switch over to my pre-contest bodybuilder-esk diet, I just won't have to do it 16 wks out, more like 6-8 wks out at the most if I can maintain 6%! No worries, I'm totally in this for the long haul and I have heard enough to like Lean Gains and play with it for a little while and see what I can take from it!

[DreamWeaver]

Milas makes a lot of good points and several that I have mentioned before in the LeanGains thread. I don't think LG is magical as far as what it can do. I mean the science is there and it definitely works. It is MUCH easier for me, and I have more success on it than a typical diet.

I will say that people with slower metabolisms really seem to do well on LG but the guys like Milas who need 4000 cals to make maintenance are may not have as easy of a time with it. I have not seen anyone actually bulk with it yet. Nor do I know of anyone who actually knows what the recommendations for bulking on it are. However for cutting / recomping it works excellently and takes very little planning, and food choices are definitely open. I think people who try to get everything in with clean foods have a harder time with it as well because it is very easy to get full on oats, and fibrous foods.

I don't know that I would say that it is more effective than your typical body builder diet, however for me it is much easier to stick with much more forgiving on food choices and those things make it more effective for me. In other words for me I get more out of it than what I have to put into the making the diet work. I do think it is superior for keeping muscle during a cut, as well as keeping strength up. Muscle wasting and catabolism is going to be lower with this type of eating during a cut.

As far as bulking which is what Milas has been doing I really don't know, and don't know how Martin has the macros and calories set up for a lean bulk so I can not make any comments on the effectiveness for that. I would have to actually know we were doing what we should before I could say anything about the effectiveness on a bulk.

I am just some sort of hyper-responder to this diet. To the point that it's freaking me out a bit... I mean it's easily changed me from and endo to a meso with less effort than I have ever used on any eating protocol. I'm leaner harder dryer (some of that is supps). This is the look I have been going for all my life and frankly I have pretty much already achieved it. Now I just want to see how far I can push it... man no extra cardio and I get to stuff my face!! You should have seen the look on the faces of people who were watching me chow down this weekend lol then I would say to them "Yah and I will continue to get leaner". They couldn't get their head around it. I did a lean bulk and gained 8 lbs in 4.5 weeks so I know it works that way too. Now it has always been easy for me to bulk up but now I can do it and lose a bit of fat while I do it leaving me bigger in the long run.

[bdcc]

Maybe your injury is down to bad karma.

If you want you can send me some money via paypal and all will be resolved.

[Milas]

Maybe your injury is down to bad karma.

If you want you can send me some money via paypal and all will be resolved.

Are you the Karma Police...

[Milas]

I am just some sort of hyper-responder to this diet. To the point that it's freaking me out a bit... I mean it's easily changed me from and endo to a meso with less effort than I have ever used on any eating protocol. I'm leaner harder dryer (some of that is supps). This is the look I have been going for all my life and frankly I have pretty much already achieved it. Now I just want to see how far I can push it... man no extra cardio and I get to stuff my face!! You should have seen the look on the faces of people who were watching me chow down this weekend lol then I would say to them "Yah and I will continue to get leaner". They couldn't get their head around it. I did a lean bulk and gained 8 lbs in 4.5 weeks so I know it works that way too. Now it has always been easy for me to bulk up but now I can do it and lose a bit of fat while I do it leaving me bigger in the long run.

You definitely are a hyper responder, and your results show it Doug. It's finding what's right for you and maintaining it that's important IMO. I'm all in favor of trying new stuff out, it's the spice of life after all, and it teaches us more about ourselves!

[EasyEJL]

I'd say honestly my results have not been as stellar as Doug or Chris on LeanGains. I believe you could attribute most progress to diet control versus timing and LG. Personally, I can manipulate my calories during the day and clean up things here and there to cut, or add in oats and I add weight (something about me and oats!). I wouldn't say I've had TONS more freedom than what I typically do.

On the other hand, I've remained relatively lean and added muscle strength back after my last severe cut. I wouldn't say my bf% has magically gone down just through LG, or that I've miraculously built muscle/recomp. I think it's following the normal pattern of managed nutrition and exercise.

Honestly, I will likely drop LG at the end of this in favor of my normal eating patterns. Missing morning meals really sucks on workout days, and my wife notices I'm more irritable/testy/on-edge when I don't eat in the morning.

In my opinion, LeanGains is a way for people to control the amount of calories they take in, I feel it's really kinda hard to get enough calories to bulk on LG. With meals spread throughout the day, it's a lot easier for calories here and there to add up without people realizing it. With LG, you get a much shorter period of time and thus more controlled intake of calories.

I've learned some things from it, but there are some tried and true methods out there that can be just as effective as another. It's really up to what works for you and what can you maintain control over. There's no "miracle diet" IMO, it's calories in vs. calories out and the macro/micro nutrients that go with it, and some slight play in timing (mainly around workouts).

So, long story short is that it CAN work but it doesn't fit my preference or lifestyle, and my progress has been nothing out of the ordinary. IMO if you have something that works for YOU, stick with it until you stop making the progress you want, and try something different.

Same for me, overall my mental focus suffers from not eating in the morning after working out as I start work right after very depleted. And I've seen maybe slight results, but nothing earth shattering beyond what i'd expect from dietary control. Then too, I was already pretty insulin sensitive to begin with, which is one of the big helps that IF gives. And even if its maximized my GH output, it may be that my maximal output isn't that much more than my normal and is still low...

[MrKleen73]

Yeah I definitely think it is all more about preference and natural inclinations. THis fits right in with how my body wants to run. I also want to try the method of having a small post workout meal in the AM then starting my feast later in the day. Kind of along the lines of Burn the Fat Build the Muscle, or the Warrior Diet for bodybuilding.

[DreamWeaver]

You definitely are a hyper responder, and your results show it Doug. It's finding what's right for you and maintaining it that's important IMO. I'm all in favor of trying new stuff out, it's the spice of life after all, and it teaches us more about ourselves!

Yah I am pretty happy about the way things are going. I know this works best for people like me, who a) don't need to eat frequently b) like to eat till they're very full and c) gain very easily.

Same for me, overall my mental focus suffers from not eating in the morning after working out as I start work right after very depleted. And I've seen maybe slight results, but nothing earth shattering beyond what i'd expect from dietary control. Then too, I was already pretty insulin sensitive to begin with, which is one of the big helps that IF gives. And even if its maximized my GH output, it may be that my maximal output isn't that much more than my normal and is still low...

My mental focus has improved by a fair margin not so much at first but as time goes on I am much more alert. It's actually when I eat I get more drowsy. Again as far bulking goes I gain easily and it does not require a large calorie surplus. I can easily do 4000 if need be all that aside and still I think that is probably too high for me anyway so no problems in that department.

[Milas]

Day 24: 7/21 Chest/Hamstring

1.5 Scoops Modern BCAA
1 Scoop Maximize V2
1 cap AnaBeta

Good Mornings
155 x 10 (5 sets)

Seated Leg Curls
130 x 12
150 x 12
170 x 12
190 x 10
210 x 8

GHR
bw x 10 (5 sets)

Dips
bw x 15
+25 x 15
+45 x 15
+70 x 15
+90 x 10
+115 x 5
+115 x 5

High Cable Cross Over
25 x 12 (5 sets)

Low Calbe Cross Over
25 x 12 (5 sets)


Put this in by memory, so numbers may be a bit off. Overall good effort on hamstrings and chest (at least what I can do). I tried neutral grip DB presses, but still put too much pressure on my shoulder. I want to be more recovered before I try anything that really bothers my shoulder.

[Milas]

Day 25-27: off

Took some time off, slept in on Friday and skipped arms/shoulder day. I was up late and didn't want to sacrifice rest for arms/shoulders when I've done bis/tris already, and my shoulder is still recovering.

Day 27 I didn't eat until 6PM, then went to Texas de Brazil and GORGED myself on endless piles of meat and potatoes!!! I took 1 cap AnaBeta before dinner and 3 caps during dinner. When I got home I LITERALLY passed out. I didn't help my wife with ANYTHING, like helping put our son to be. She said it was the last time she does a date night with me, LOL! I topped it all off with homemade banana bread and a greens/probiotic drink, SERIOUS food coma! I woke back up around 12:30AM and took care of some business, took another cap of AnaBeta, and went back to bed. Now THAT'S an anabolic meal!

[Milas]

Day 28: 7/25 Chest/Tris

1.5 Scoops Modern BCAA
1 Scoop Maximize V2
1 cap AnaBeta

Dips
bw x 15
+25 x 15
+45 x 15
+70 x 15
+90 x 12
+115 x 6 (rest pause x 3)
+90 x 8 (rest pause x 4)

Incline Bench Cable Fly ss w/ Flat Bench Cable Fly ss w/ Rope Press Down
22.5 x 12 / 22.5 x 12 / 60 x 12
25 x 12 / 25 x 12 / 60 x 12
27.5 x 12 / 27.5 x 12 / 60 x 12
30 x 12 / 30 x 12 / 60 x 12
30 x 12 / 30 x 12 / 60 x 12

Low Pulley Cable Cross-Over ss w/ Pushups (decline/flat/incline) ss w/ Overhead Cable Tricep Extension
20 x 12 / 10x10x10 / 35 x 12
25 x 12 / 10x8x8 / 40 x 12
27.5 x 12 / 8x6x6 / 45 x 12
30 x 10 / 6x5x5 / 50 x 12
35 x 8 / 5x5x5 / 55 x 12


Chest was dead after this, it was really taxing on the supersets. I'm really hoping with my time off from bench that I'll improve my inner, outer, and lower pec definition with all the dips and flys. I'm not expecting as much mass, but hoping for more crisp lines and maybe some power in lagging areas. We'll see, I've never done this before...

Triceps are getting a good workout too, doing a few different exercises. I felt it a lot more in my triceps today on dips, so I guess my chest is getting stronger on them and my triceps aren't keeping up? I try to lean forward a lot when doing dips to put more emphasis on chest, but maybe not enough today? Regardless, I like loading up the dip belt and going at it!

I took some update pics yesterday too, and measurements this morning. I'll be posting results soon...

[Milas]

Results after 1st bottle:

weight: 200 --> 204 (+ or - 2lbs)

Measurements (cold and unflexed):

Chest: 42.5" --> 43" (+0.5")
Arms: 14.5" --> 14.6" (+0.1")
Forearms: 12.5"
Waist: 34.5" --> 34.5" (same)
Neck: 15"
Left Leg: 23" --> 24" (+1")
Right Leg: 24" --> 25" (+1")
Left Calf: 15.5" --> 15.75" (+0.25")
Right Calf: 16" --> 16.5" (+0.5")


So the biggest improvement was in legs, which is right where I wanted it, and you'll notice it in the pictures when I load them. Also good improvement in chest given my situation with an injured shoulder preventing me from benching.

My wife noticed it really in my legs and shoulders. Arms didn't grow much, it was between 14.5" and 14.75" this time, so small improvement, but my arms RARELY grow much. I may need to put more emphasis on them...

I'm still disproportionate in my lower body, I'm going to have to step up my isolateral work to get my left caught up. Either that or I can look like the dude from "Lady in the Water" who only worked the one side of his body for the lulz... NAH!

So, from here, I'm looking forward to seeing what a 2nd bottle of AnaBeta will do! I might even extend out and add a 3rd bottle depending on how things are progressing!!! So far, I'd compare my time on AnaBeta to that of a low-dosed mild prohormone, like Bold or 1-Andro. Both work best 6-8 weeks, so I'm interested to see where I'll be at those points in time, but progress is on track...

[bdcc]

"Isolateral"? Two can play this game!

Great update. A quarter of an inch on arms is awesome. This is what I got on my run as well.

Love the detailed feedback. I would rep you for being meticulous but it doesn't have the feature on my phone.

[Milas]

"Isolateral"? Two can play this game!

Great update. A quarter of an inch on arms is awesome. This is what I got on my run as well.

Love the detailed feedback. I would rep you for being meticulous but it doesn't have the feature on my phone.

You could always just neg me for being a bloody Yank'!

Sounds like we are quite "similar" in many ways...

[bdcc]

I would never be racist. Even when you lot gang up on me.

Keep up the good work my man, great log. I might start negging people who don't supply lots of detail in their reviews in hope of making everyone step their games up!

[Milas]

I would never be racist. Even when you lot gang up on me.

Keep up the good work my man, great log. I might start negging people who don't supply lots of detail in their reviews in hope of making everyone step their games up!

American is a race now??? Is it because we speak American? I'm not racist either, I just don't like stupid people of any ethnicity!

All good fun, chap! I hope you take no offense at my digs to you, they are all said in good jest since I know you can take it (and dish it out)!

[ScottyDoc]

I'm still disproportionate in my lower body, I'm going to have to step up my isolateral work to get my left caught up. Either that or I can look like the dude from "Lady in the Water" who only worked the one side of his body for the lulz... NAH!

Funny that you say that because when someone posted one time about being disproportionate I searched high and low for a good picture or video of that and could not find one to save my life, I remember when I first saw that movie I was like Whoa, how did they do that, LoL!

[ScottyDoc]

Ask and though shall receive, found it...