Getting rid of gyno n getting bigger than IC.....if thats even possible.

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Starting this thread now since I ask question in my log and they're never answerd, and to bring light to just how hard it is to make Irish Cannon look like a little girl.

I'm going to give it my all tho!!!!

I am also trying to get rid of pubertal gyno with epistane. My case is not very bad but hoping this will kill it and add some LBM too, while slimming down a bit.

I haven't run a cycle in almost 7 months and only 1 cycle in the past 13 months or so......

I will also be finishing off X-Factor with Episate. I've already been on it for 25+ days (i just started my 2nd bottle the other day)

Im going to be running a lot of stuff...here's the list!

Beverly Int
-Ultra 40's
-Mass Amino's

USPLabs
Anabolic Pump/Yellow Gold (have an use both)
Bulk P-Slin
Bulk 1-Carboxy
Bulk Cissus-RX

NutraPlanet
-Creatine mono
-AAKG
-GMS
-Tyrosine
-Beta-Alanine (when x-factor is over)
-BCAA's
-Glutamine
-CLA

X-Factor
1000mg/day

Epistane
8 weeks
20/20/30/30/30/30/40/40

LG Sciences Liq Masterdrol
8 weeks (pulsed)
300mg pre-workout

Cycle Support
1-2 scoops/day (have been doing this since april)

I think thats everything.
 
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DIET

DIET: FIRST 5 WEEKS

IC is a big mofo so Im going to be bulking here a little.

30min before Breakfast
1 Anabolic Pump
2 Leviathan
2gr Tyrosine
5gr Creatine
1/2t Bulk 1 Carboxy
1/4 Bulk CissusRX


Breakfast:
6 egg whites
2 whole eggs
2 slices ezekiel bread
-4 Ultra 40's
-4 Mass Amino's
-1 X-factor
-10mg Epistane
-1gr CLA


* 2 leviathan before meal 3
Meal 2 & 3:
6-8oz chicken
1/3 cup brown rice
-1gr CLA

15min Before Pre-Workout Meal
1/4t Bulk P-Slin

Pre-Workout Meal (about 1.5hr before workout)
8oz Chicken
1/2 cup Brown Rice
-4 Ultra 40's
-4 Mass Amino's
-2 X-Factor
-10mg Epistane


Pre-Workout Stack
5gr Creatine Mono
5gr AAKG
6gr GMS (work my way up to that....add 1gr each day)
3gr Taurine
2gr Tyrosine
3gr Beta-Alanine (will add when im done with x-factor)
1 serving Liq Masterdrol
1/2t Bulk 1 Carboxy
1/4 Bulk CissusRX


Immedietly Post Workout
10gr BCAA's
10gr Glutamine
5gr Creatine Mono
3caps NeoVar

~15min later
Post Workout Meal
1t. PeptoPro
2 scoops Whey Isolate
1/2 cup Ezekiel Cereal
1TBS Honey
4oz Soy Milk (unsweetend)
-4 Ultra 40's
-4 Mass Amino's


Meal 6:
8-10oz Ground Beef
cheese n taco seasoning

Meal 7:
1/2 cup 1% cottage cheese
2 scoops Dymatize Elite 12hr Protein
-2gr CLA

Before Bed
1/4t. Bulk 1 Carboxy
1/4t. Bulk CissusRX
 
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Training DC style here

Mon: Workout A
Tue: Abs/cardio
Wed: Workout B
Thur: Abs/cardio
Fri: Workout A
Sat: cardio
Sun: maybe cardio
Mon: Workout B
etc.....

Workout A (Chest/Shoulders/Tri's/Back Width/Back Thickness)
Workout B (Bi's/Forearms/Calf/Hamstrings/Quads)

Workout Rotation

Workout A: 1/2/3
Chest: Incline BB/ Flat BB/Hammer Decline
Shoulders: Smith Overhead Press/ Hammer Iso Overhead/ DB Overhead
Triceps: CG Bench/ Skull Crushers/Reverse Grip Bench (smith)
Back Width: Lat Pull Down/ Pull-Ups/ Neutral Grip Pull Downs
Back Thickness: Rack Deads/ T-Bar Row/ Full Deads

Workout B: 1/2/3
Bi's: Straight BB Curl/ DB curls/ CG Preacher Curl
Forearms: Pin-Wheel curls/ Reverse Grip Curl/Hammer DB Curls
Calf: Neutral/toes in/Toes out
Hamstrings: Lying Leg Curl/Seated Leg Curl/Iso Leg Curl
Quads: Hack Squat/ Smith tip-toe squat/ Full Squat
 
1HP

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I would drop the 1-C , soymilk and masterdrol if its all about killing your gyno..

Good luck!!
 
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Subbed! Interesting stack :) Good luck!
 
1HP

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what is 1-c?? you mean IC?
Bulk 1 Carboxy.

I read some threads where its stated that increased GH aids in gyno formation when elevated estro levels are present. I dont know actually if it contributes but better be safe then sorry?

Also boosting dopamine levels and potentially ending up with reduced levels after cycle could maybe increase prolactin and aid to the whole delayed gyno rebound thing. I think this happened to me actually.

Take it for whats its worth ;) broscience
 
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It's liquid masterdrol=DHT so I should be cool.

I have not started everything yet, still on the basics but started training DC the other day here's todays workout....splits wont be like this. Its only because I am leaving town for a week all above starts when I get back

Skull Crushers
95lbs
12x5x3

Straight BB Curl
65lbs
11x5x3

Calf Raise
160x12 (DC Style)

Lying Leg Curl
110lbs
11x5x3

Hack Squats
6plates
9reps

2plates + quaters
20reps (waaaay to light but my knees where killing me..no wraps)
 
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We went out for dinner tonight and I had 14oz New York Strip, 25oz of Sam Adams and some fries( literally only had maybe 7)....nothing too horrible but going to hit up 45min of cardio 2maro morning before I leave anyways.

Next week is going to be rough to stick to a respectable diet but I'll do my best.
 

Irish Cannon

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Uh-oh! You're running that Epi AND Masterdrol! I guess I have to work extra hard now. Good luck with everything dude. Get growing. :) - I hope Epi does the trick for your gyno. Have you ran it before?
 
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Uh-oh! You're running that Epi AND Masterdrol! I guess I have to work extra hard now. Good luck with everything dude. Get growing. :) - I hope Epi does the trick for your gyno. Have you ran it before?
Thanks brother....best to you too!

Nope never before and I got's me 2 bottles!!!

Hows yours doing? I remember you saying it did a pretty good job on it, and from looking at ur pics ours look'd similar in its degree to mine. Actually it's part of the reason I pick'd it.
 
1HP

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It's liquid masterdrol=DHT so I should be cool.
Yeah but that's an extra risk for estro a few months post cycle.

My gyno grew considerably from an estro rebound following a cycle of "The One". Lumps have tripled in size and struggling to get them down. Estro rebounds are fking nasty.. Funny thing The One almost eliminated my gyno on cycle, but now it's back with a vengeance..

Just saying if killing gyno is your main goal.. ;) Anyways the best of luck with your cycle, may the gains be with you ;)
 

Irish Cannon

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Yeah but that's an extra risk for estro a few months post cycle.

My gyno grew considerably from an estro rebound following a cycle of "The One". Lumps have tripled in size and struggling to get them down. Estro rebounds are fking nasty.. Funny thing The One almost eliminated my gyno on cycle, but now it's back with a vengeance..

Just saying if killing gyno is your main goal.. ;) Anyways the best of luck with your cycle, may the gains be with you ;)
I would probably second this. If gyno killing is the main goal, do away with everything else. I'd run some Formestane alongside the Epi and leave it at that.
 

Irish Cannon

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Alright then.....2 votes for no Liq Masdterdrol?

DONE DEAL.....Now I have one problem. WTF am I going to do with this Liq Masterdrol :think:
You can either save it or give it to a friend that knows what they're doing.
 

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Yeah but that's an extra risk for estro a few months post cycle.

My gyno grew considerably from an estro rebound following a cycle of "The One". Lumps have tripled in size and struggling to get them down. Estro rebounds are fking nasty.. Funny thing The One almost eliminated my gyno on cycle, but now it's back with a vengeance..

Just saying if killing gyno is your main goal.. ;) Anyways the best of luck with your cycle, may the gains be with you ;)
Just curious; did you use the 2nd gear for PCT or did you go with something else? I am running The One right now and want to avoid using a SERM. I am planning on going with the 2nd gear and DTH for PCT, but if you got the gyno even while using the 2nd gear I may opt to use this bottle of Formex I have instead. What is your opinion?
 
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Just curious; did you use the 2nd gear for PCT or did you go with something else? I am running The One right now and want to avoid using a SERM. I am planning on going with the 2nd gear and DTH for PCT, but if you got the gyno even while using the 2nd gear I may opt to use this bottle of Formex I have instead. What is your opinion?
Yeah I used 2nd gear but taking any other AI wouldnt have made a difference. Estrogen rebounds from being supressed for a long time. The One being some from of DHT and supresses estrogen, then when you get off that you keep estrogen surpressed even longer by taking an AI for pct like 2nd gear(6bromo), formex(formestane), ATD, etc etc, they all surpress estrogen, thats the point.

Search around for "delayed gyno". I would never again use an AI for pct, especially not for something that surpresses estrogen itself by whatever mechanism, like epistane, The One, liquid masterdrol ;) I would serm, and make damn sure I got extra serm in the closet for IF you get some nasty rebound 2 months post PCT. Got me off guard and out of serm the last time, it's considerably bigger now darnit..

I dont like taking serms, they're unhealthy, I actually like the Primordial Performance PCT approach for being a serm-less pct without estro surpression, but when gyno hits you you better have a serm on hand or you're probably screwed ;)
 
1HP

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For you distilled water, from another board on epistane vs gyno. I might try this in the near future, low dose epistane (20mg ED) + raloxifene (60mg ED).

Many people have posted that their gynecomastia has decreased due to using the product Epistane/Havoc.

On Epistane.com: "Epistane™ works by binding and deactivating the ERβ so that no estrodiol-elicited effects can be carried out in the cell. In the case of breast tissue ERβ is the primary target receptor responsible for growth and proliferation. Epistane™ binds to the ERβ and not only disables the receptor from binding to estradiol, it actually puts the cell in an estrogen deprived state, which decreases the cells viability and leads to a decrease in size and eventual cell death."

Notice the part I selected in bold, the claim that ERβ is the primary target receptor responsible for growth and proliferation. After I did some googling, I found some studies that disagreed.

"Estrogen Receptor alpha, beta and Progesteron Receptor Expression in Gynecomastia Using Immunohistochemical Staining.

Department of Surgery, Uijongbu St. Mary's Hospital, The Catholic University of Korea, Uijongbu, Korea.
Department of Clinical Pathology, Uijongbu St. Mary's Hospital, The Catholic University of Korea, Uijongbu, Korea.

PURPOSE: Gynecomastia is a common male breast abnormality and primarily occurs in puberty and senescence. The obvious etiological role of hormonal changes in gynecomastia, plus the discovery of estrogen receptor in normal and neoplastic breast, has spurred several investigations of ER content in male gynecomastic tissues. The results have been inconsistent and the fraction of ER-positive specimens has varied from 0~90%. METHODS: Immunohistochemical hormonal receptor analysis using monoclonal estrogen receptor (ER) alpha, beta and progesteron receptor (PR) was performed on the breast tissues of 58 patients with gynecomastia between January 1995 and January 2000 in the Department of Surgery, Uijongbu St. Mary's Hospital. These results were statistically compared with clinical data. RESULTS: 48 cases (82.8%) were ERalpha positive and 55 cases (94.8%) were ERbeta positive and PR positivity was noted in 55 cases (94.8%). There was negative relationship between ERalpha and age, PR and location. CONCLUSION: This study demonstrates that intracellular steroid receptors are present in most gynecomastic tissues. Additionally, it supports the general assumption that estrogen and progesteron may be two of the hormones responsible for the development of gynecomastia."


This study shows that ERα and ERβ receptors are found in gynecomastic tissue, not just ERβ. Could this be why not everyone is seeing the gynecomastia reduction that others are seeing? Epistane/Havoc do a great job at blocking the ERβ, while the ERα is left unblocked. While the ERβ is blocked, perhaps Estradiol starts attaching to the ERα, keeping the gynecomastia alive. Even worse, continued use of a product blocking only ERβ, may cause the creation of more ERα sites, because Estradiol attaches to both. Don't get me wrong here, I am on Epistane right now and am enjoying it. I am just trying to figure out a better treatment for reducing and possibly eliminating gynecomastia for myself and others alike. Perhaps those who see the gynecomastic tissue reduction while using Epistane/Havoc have a higher density of ERβ instead of ERα. Perhaps those old studies we read about how Tamoxifen cured the gynecomastia in only a fraction of test subjects happend to have a higher density of ERα. In those same old studies, Tamoxifen caused partial regression in some of the test subejects. Maybe Tamoxifen did get rid of all the ERα rich tissue, while the ERβ tissue remained healthy, still functioning off of Estradiol. I'm not certain though of course. This is all just a somewhat educated guess.

Because we are not going to use Immunohistochemical hormonal receptor analysis to figure out the density of which type of estrogen receptor that we have in our breast tissue, why not use two medications, one that blocks ERα and Epistane/Havoc to effectively block ERβ?

I did somemore googling and found that Raloxifene binds preferentially to the ERα. (see study at the very bottom also wikipedia says this under the search term "estrogen receptor")

Estradiol binds to both the ERα and ERβ.

Using Raloxifene and Epistane or Havoc would block both types of estrogen receptors, the ERα and ERβ.

With both estrogen receptors blocked, I think the chances of defeating gynecomastia would be far greater.


I also came across this article below, that talks about Testosterone's role in mammary tissue. Now think about this. Being on Epistane/Havoc is going to cause eventual shutdown. Wouldn't it be wise to use Testosterone along with both the ERα and ERβ blockers, Raloxifen and Epistane/Havoc respectively? It makes sense to me. And also another note about the study below, it says that Progesterone did not alter Estradiol's effect of creating gynecomastia, well in monkeys at least.

"Testosterone inhibits estrogen-induced mammary epithelial proliferation and suppresses estrogen receptor expression
JIAN ZHOU, SIU NG, O. ADESANYA-FAMUIYA, KRISTIN ANDERSON and CAROLYN A. BONDY1

This study investigated the effect of sex steroids and tamoxifen on primate mammary epithelial proliferation and steroid receptor gene expression. Ovariectomized rhesus monkeys were treated with placebo, 17ß estradiol (E2) alone or in combination with progesterone (E2/P) or testosterone (E2/T), or tamoxifen for 3 days. E2 alone increased mammary epithelial proliferation by ~sixfold (P<0.0001) and increased mammary epithelial estrogen receptor (ER{alpha}) mRNA expression by ~50% (P<0.0001; ERß mRNA was not detected in the primate mammary gland). Progesterone did not alter E2’s proliferative effects, but testosterone reduced E2-induced proliferation by ~40% (P<0.002) and entirely abolished E2-induced augmentation of ER{alpha} expression. Tamoxifen had a significant agonist effect in the ovariectomized monkey, producing a ~threefold increase in mammary epithelial proliferation (P<0.01), but tamoxifen also reduced ER{alpha} expression below placebo level. Androgen receptor (AR) mRNA was detected in mammary epithelium by in situ hybridization. AR mRNA levels were not altered by E2 alone but were significantly reduced by E2/T and tamoxifen treatment. Because combined E2/T and tamoxifen had similar effects on mammary epithelium, we investigated the regulation of known sex steroid-responsive mRNAs in the primate mammary epithelium. E2 alone had no effect on apolipoprotein D (ApoD) or IGF binding protein 5 (IGFBP5) expression, but E2/T and tamoxifen treatment groups both demonstrated identical alterations in these mRNAs (ApoD was decreased and IGFBP5 was increased). These observations showing androgen-induced down-regulation of mammary epithelial proliferation and ER expression suggest that combined estrogen/androgen hormone replacement therapy might reduce the risk of breast cancer associated with estrogen replacement. In addition, these novel findings on tamoxifen’s androgen-like effects on primate mammary epithelial sex steroid receptor expression suggest that tamoxifen’s protective action on mammary gland may involve androgenic effects.—Zhou, J., Ng, S., Adesanya-Famuiya, O., Anderson, K., Bondy, C. A. Testosterone inhibits estrogen-induced mammary epithelial proliferation and suppresses estrogen receptor expression."

--------------------------------------------------------------

I am on Epistane right now, 40mg a day. I have pubertal gynecomastia. There may be some reduction, as I have been on Epistane for about 10 days now, but nothing spectacular. I injected 100mg of Testosterone Prop. today and will continue every other day at the same dose. It is a low dose of Testosterone, but still high enough for this purpose. I am also going to use Raloxifene for the rest of the cycle. I will keep everyone updated with my results.




------------------------------------------------------
To develop compounds that are antagonists on ER(alpha), but not ER(beta), we have added basic side-chains typically found in nonsteroidal antiestrogens to pyrazole compounds that bind with much higher affinity to ER(alpha) than to ER(beta). In this way we have developed basic side-chain pyrazoles (BSC-pyrazoles) that are high affinity, potent, selective antagonists on ER(alpha). These BSC-pyrazoles are themselves inactive on ER(alpha) and ER(beta), and they antagonize E2 stimulation by ER(alpha) only. We investigated seven basic side-chain substituents on various alkyl-triaryl-substituted pyrazoles, and the most ER(alpha)-selective compound was methyl-piperidino-pyrazole (MPP). ER(alpha)-selective antagonism was observed on diverse reporter-promoter gene constructs containing estrogen response elements that are consensus, nonconsensus (pS2), or comprised of multiple half-estrogen response elements (NHERF/EBP50) and on genes in which ER works indirectly by tethering to other DNA-bound proteins (TGF(beta)3). In contrast to these BSC-pyrazoles, the antiestrogens trans-hydroxytamoxifen, raloxifene, and ICI 182,780 suppress E2 activity via both ER(alpha) and ER(beta). The most effective BSC-pyrazole, MPP, fully antagonized E2 stimulation of pS2 mRNA in MCF-7 breast cancer cells, consistent with the fact that these cells contain almost exclusively ER(alpha). These compounds should be useful in studying the biological functions of ER(alpha) and ER(beta) and in selectively blocking responses that are mediated through ER(alpha).
 

Irish Cannon

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No reason to low dose the Epi. If it's going to work to reduce gyno, it will do it at a higher dose as well. I'm living proof. I've ran it twice and saw a reduction even in the 60mg range as well as 30mg.
 
1HP

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No reason to low dose the Epi. If it's going to work to reduce gyno, it will do it at a higher dose as well. I'm living proof. I've ran it twice and saw a reduction even in the 60mg range as well as 30mg.
Hmm interesting, I read some log somewhere of a guy where epi@20mg diminished his gyno but 40mg made it flare backup again. Might have been because some other mechanism ofcourse, estro rebound or something, maybe even rebound from a previous cycle. Who knows most guys cycle 3-4 times a year, sometimes even more, and if estro rebounds like 2 months after pct who knows what they're using at that time and what effects the rebound has. Might even make you accuse a dry compound of being a wet one? lol
 
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Finally back home, but it'll be short lived. Im heading back out wed-tue. I know my diet and training will still be 100% on this trip so im not worried.

Only issue will be lack of updates. Also I have found out here in cali red meat is cheap (better cuts for close to $3/lb when on sale) and chicken is expensive (close to $3/lb when not on sale). So, Im probably going to be switching to 100% red meat for protein meat soucres. Plus after eating it all last week, its damn good!
 

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For you distilled water, from another board on epistane vs gyno. I might try this in the near future, low dose epistane (20mg ED) + raloxifene (60mg ED).
::lightbulb::
 
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Workout out sunday this week because of my travel and plans later in the week

WORKOUT 1A (11-15RP)

Incline BB Bench
225lbs
8x3x2
13RP

Smith Overhead Press Front
185lbs
7x4x3
13RP

Smith CG Bench
185lbs
10x4x3
17RP

Lat Pull Down
165lbs
9x5x3
17RP

Rack Deads
315x12
335x9

Picked up some Top Round today for 3.29/lb!!! Guess what was on sale too...chicken but for 3.99/lb :think:
 
thenomad

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Good Luck man! I hope you reach your goal, but IC is pretty stacked! He gets bigger every time i see him, his beard normally does too.
 
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Good Luck man! I hope you reach your goal, but IC is pretty stacked! He gets bigger every time i see him, his beard normally does too.
Yea I know, I was reading thru IC's log and he was looking kinda burnt out so I madea friendly challenge.

I havent posted a picture on here since I was pretty diced last august and im 25lbs heavier now so........is IC bigger than me???? We wont know til the end of august (Inservt eveil laugh)

But no IC is a huge mofo, I am also accepting prayers in this log...because im gonna need em
 
thenomad

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Yea I know, I was reading thru IC's log and he was looking kinda burnt out so I madea friendly challenge.

I havent posted a picture on here since I was pretty diced last august and im 25lbs heavier now so........is IC bigger than me???? We wont know til the end of august (Inservt eveil laugh)

But no IC is a huge mofo, I am also accepting prayers in this log...because im gonna need em
word.
here's one:
Lord, please protect DW as he attempts to reach his goal of getting massive. We ask that he may remain safe and injury-free for the duration of his cycle. May he always remember to put you first. Thank you for your son who you sent to die for our sins. Amen.
 
celc5

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I agree with IC. Nothing squashed my lump like Formestane and that was On cycle with Pmag. The lump came back in pct with a vengance (aPCT and Sustain), and please don't let this jinx me, but after pct it went down over the past 5-7 days with zero hormonal supplementation.

We can theorize all day about 1C is good or bad for gyno, 20mg vs. 40mg epithio... IMO, it's all random hormonal flux and none of us have any frickin clue whatsoever what supps help and what won't. I know I sure don't, so DW, you're plan is as good as any of the others that I've seen brotha :cheers:
 

Irish Cannon

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I agree with IC. Nothing squashed my lump like Formestane and that was On cycle with Pmag. The lump came back in pct with a vengance (aPCT and Sustain), and please don't let this jinx me, but after pct it went down over the past 5-7 days with zero hormonal supplementation.

We can theorize all day about 1C is good or bad for gyno, 20mg vs. 40mg epithio... IMO, it's all random hormonal flux and none of us have any frickin clue whatsoever what supps help and what won't. I know I sure don't, so DW, you're plan is as good as any of the others that I've seen brotha :cheers:
Word. I can only speculate as to what I've seen for myself. It seems different things work for everyone.
 
1HP

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I agree with IC. Nothing squashed my lump like Formestane and that was On cycle with Pmag. The lump came back in pct with a vengance (aPCT and Sustain), and please don't let this jinx me, but after pct it went down over the past 5-7 days with zero hormonal supplementation.

We can theorize all day about 1C is good or bad for gyno, 20mg vs. 40mg epithio... IMO, it's all random hormonal flux and none of us have any frickin clue whatsoever what supps help and what won't. I know I sure don't, so DW, you're plan is as good as any of the others that I've seen brotha :cheers:
I read a disturbing article on resveratrol having very strong estrogenic effects (like 8-fold stronger then estrogen) on breast tissue when you have low estrogen levels. I'm not going to stack resveratrol based products with anything surpressing my estrogen. Could be you need something as strong as letrozole to make that happen but I rather not take any chances.
 
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I read a disturbing article on resveratrol having very strong estrogenic effects (like 8-fold stronger then estrogen) on breast tissue when you have low estrogen levels. I'm not going to stack resveratrol based products with anything surpressing my estrogen. Could be you need something as strong as letrozole to make that happen but I rather not take any chances.
I see where you're coming from. I think I was a non-responder to Sustain anyway, so no need for me to add res for anything ever again. But ya, once pct was completed and the Sustain was taken out, the lump started to go back down. Formestane DEFINATELY crushed the lump, but it seems as if I find a way to ef it up afterwards every time with something that causes problems. I dunno :dunno:
 
1HP

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I see where you're coming from. I think I was a non-responder to Sustain anyway, so no need for me to add res for anything ever again. But ya, once pct was completed and the Sustain was taken out, the lump started to go back down. Formestane DEFINATELY crushed the lump, but it seems as if I find a way to ef it up afterwards every time with something that causes problems. I dunno :dunno:
Actually my gyno came from pp 1T stacked with sustain, so who knows. Although it really shouldnt cause problems since estro affinity for breast tissue is much stronger then resveratrol, I think it was something like 7000 times stronger. So in theory it shouldnt cause problems with estrogen around. But then again who knows.. I love resveratrol so I hope I can find a way to take it safely. Also SA probably doesnt even produce decent plasma levels of resveratrol according to the guys at imminst.org. So I would assume its effects to be mainly from the 7,8 benzoflavone, but AGAIN who knows ;)
 
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Cutting back on carbs a little....they have me feeling slightly lethargic and bloated.

Workout B1

Barebell Curls
75lbs
10x4x3
17RP

DB Pinwheel Curls
40x10
SS

Hammer Seated Calf Raise
80lbsx10 DC Style

Lying Leg Curls
120lbs
10x4x3
17RP

Hack Squats
6platesx12reps
4platesx20reps

Moving up on all weights :dance:
 
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Diet has been great and I feel alot better with the lower carbs today. However, I did add some during my workout (WMS/Creatine/PeptoPro). Tyrosine is making me sweat like a mofo, so I hope its doing somthing :D.

Finally "feeling" strong and big again.

I will be starting GlycerGrow also next week....6 scoops pre-workout. It's suppose to help with the DC style workout and stretching to add more lbm. I figure this is as great of a time as any to test this theory.
 
monsterbox

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I would DEFINITELY include 50/50/50/25/25/25/25.....7 weeks or so of Clomiphene at a low dosage. This is what people do for a "restart". I'm actually on this now, for low-T levels. Add nolva/AI or whatever else you want the first 4 weeks...then just stay on the SERM for a while. It has no sides at the low dose, and after 8 weeks of any strong PH you will be severely shut down.


After being on clomid solo for the past 6 weeks at 25mg/day, I feel totally different than I have my whole life. This should be a staple supplement. I dont understand why people only run their pcts for 4 weeks. Just because you had a 4 week cycle doesn't mean a 4 week pct is enough.
 
celc5

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DW,
I'm a big Tyrosine fan myself. That's probably why I like Slingshot, because of the tyrosine "awake" or "alert" feeling. How much are you dosing and do you dose it consistently?

If I use a mid level dose, let's say 1g, and I dose it consistently, after about 5 days I can't turn my brain off to sleep though. When I dose maybe two or 3 times per week, it only takes 500mg to get the alert effect and it doesn't affect sleep.

I've never experienced the stim effect that some describe and I've never noticed increased sweating. Maybe it's dose dependent and I just never go high enough???
 
Distilled Water

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DW,
I'm a big Tyrosine fan myself. That's probably why I like Slingshot, because of the tyrosine "awake" or "alert" feeling. How much are you dosing and do you dose it consistently?

If I use a mid level dose, let's say 1g, and I dose it consistently, after about 5 days I can't turn my brain off to sleep though. When I dose maybe two or 3 times per week, it only takes 500mg to get the alert effect and it doesn't affect sleep.

I've never experienced the stim effect that some describe and I've never noticed increased sweating. Maybe it's dose dependent and I just never go high enough???
Yea I'd say dose dependent for sure. For a while i was inconsistent with it but for the last few weeks I have been on it everyday...some days I miss my morning dose but for the most part every day.

Im doing ~2gr 2x's/day.....its actually 2t. of Nutra bulk 300mg per 1/4t and its a rounded measure for me.

In past years I was doing 500mg to 1500mg a day (split in 2 doses) and never go the sweats as bad as I do now.

I know what you mean about the alertness. After work im drained and really need somthing to get me going but if i do caffeine it keeps me up...after about 30min i feel great.
 
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Took a half day at work to get ready for my traveling.

I did 45min cardio today and im sore as all get out. The X-Factor DOMS is KILLING ME!!! So should really stat seeing results. Things I notice now from it are more easily obtained pumps really. Strength is at a steady climb and no realy recomp but my diet isn't really geard that way.

Diet will get a little sketchy again but nothing too crazy. Keepin them protein grams high and sugar/fat to a minimum.
 
Distilled Water

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Back and ready to get after it.

I trained while I was out of town, workouts were so-so but this DOMS is killing me fo's real. I have taken 3 days off and im actually feeling pretty good. I'll hit workout A3 tomorrow.

I may have broken a finger but not sure. My buddy was jumped by 4 guys outside of the bar this past weekend and I came running to the resuce, crushing skulls. In the process I messed up my right hand pretty bad and split open some of my left knuckles.

I'll know tomorrow how much it'll hinder me in the gym.
 
celc5

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DW... myyyy hero :D

Dunk it in an ice bath for 5 minutes 5-6 times per day. The faster you get the swelling down, the better for pain, range of motion, pressure on small ligaments in your fingers etc etc etc Ice Ice Ice Even if you don't see swelling, it's probably still inside the joint.
 
flightposite

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head bustin haha im suba dub dubed
 
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Yea it was crazy. First ever brawl i've been a part of. I usually pass on that type of stuff but he was out numbered big time.

Workout A3

Decline Hammer
230lbs
10x3x2
15RP

Overhead DB Press
55lbs
13x5x3
21RP

Hammer Dip Machine
180lbs
10x4x2
16RP

Pull Ups
BW
8x3x2
13RP

T-Bar Row
4 plates
6reps

I had to change the exercises because of my hand. I simply could not grip it. I have been incing a little but will do more. Great pump and felt strong.

Diet has been great today and will continue to be for the next 7 weeks.....scales slowly moving north :afro:
 
Lou22

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hey has the epistane helped with your gyno at all? or did i miss something in th thread.
 

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So far nothing but it's only been about 10days. I was going to re assess the situation after 4 weeks to give it time to do work.
I've seen a reduction starting in Week 3 on both cycles. Give it some time.
 
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I've seen a reduction starting in Week 3 on both cycles. Give it some time.
Awesome, thanks for the heads up on that.

Unlike you, I think I have some scar tissue in there. Its like a small "line" running from the edge of my nipple down to my armpit but is only maybe 1" long?

I was going to try and get surgery this summer to remove it but had about 1k to pay back from unexpected things that happened during the school year regarding family. I've figured i've been living with this for 10+years....whats one or two more?
 

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