hair lost

[Brolic]

Im on the 3rd week of my pct from hdrol . A few people at work and few family members made commets about my hair line..
Im def loseing my hair,, they called it "corners pockets"


what doe you think is casuing this? how can i stop this?

 

[Rugger]

the best way to stop it is with finasteride aka propecia. But that takes a month or two to manifest, so you might be **** outta luck! pay to play.

 

[Brolic]

where do i get it from??

 

[ozarkaBRAND]

where do i get it from??

Research chem I believe.

 

[TripDog]

Carefull with that stuff, it can cause man boobies, totally kill mr.penis, destroy energy and drive.....run a low dose of aromatase inhibitor with it.

 

[JBerto]

Finasteride + Minoxidil

BUT, if you start with it, you must take it forever.

 

[Brolic]

can i just use the rongian foam

 

[Rugger]

Carefull with that stuff, it can cause man boobies, totally kill mr.penis, destroy energy and drive.....run a low dose of aromatase inhibitor with it.

That's not very likely. I've been on propecia for over 6 months and have experienced 0 sides. My dermo told me those sides occur in like 2% of patients.

 

[JBerto]

I'm on propecia for 4 years with no sides

 

[TripDog]

That's not very likely. I've been on propecia for over 6 months and have experienced 0 sides. My dermo told me those sides occur in like 2% of patients.

I'm sure at low doses its fine, I had a bad experience with it in the past so I was just posting my observation.

 

[Rugger]

I'm sure at low doses its fine, I had a bad experience with it in the past so I was just posting my observation.

low dose? I take the recommended 1mg daily..................................................how much were you taking?

 

[TripDog]

low dose? I take the recommended 1mg daily..................................................how much were you taking?

More than that

 

[cynic]

I was under the impression that H-drol, aka 4-chloro-17a-methyl-androst-1, 4-diene-3-17b-diol, did not convert to DHT?
If this is that case, wouldn't that mean that hair loss shouldn't really be an issue on this product?

 

[Ninjo]

I was under the impression that H-drol, aka 4-chloro-17a-methyl-androst-1, 4-diene-3-17b-diol, did not convert to DHT?
If this is that case, wouldn't that mean that hair loss shouldn't really be an issue on this product?

That's what I thought as well. I only take Propecia when I run something like Pheraplex and always dose it at 1mg/day.

 

[TripDog]

Propecia will ONLY help with compounds that use the 5 alpha enzyme (test,EQ) It will do nothing with pheraplex, and halodrol is very mild with hair issues.

 

[Brolic]

i not sure why im losing hair... but will the rogain foam **** they sell at walmart work?

 

[Rugger]

i not sure why im losing hair... but will the rogain foam **** they sell at walmart work?

If you use it twice a day, every day, for the rest of your life then it will work(maybe). Propecia is the same way, but it's only 1 pill a day and the pill is smaller than a tic-tac. I'll go with the latter!

 

[TripDog]

Propecia is going to help 10x more than rogaine. I heard it's rather pricey from a doctor, but can be obtained other ways

 

[cynic]

I was under the impression that H-drol, aka 4-chloro-17a-methyl-androst-1, 4-diene-3-17b-diol, did not convert to DHT?
If this is that case, wouldn't that mean that hair loss shouldn't really be an issue on this product?

Can anyone else comment on this?

 

[ReaperX]

Complete hair loss isn't 100% understood. It has been researched that the DHT build up in the scalp eventually chokes out the hair folicle. This would indicate that it is a step by step process. Not a 'wake up one morning and all my hair is gone' type of deal.

If you are prone to hair loss then taking androgens will accelerate this issue.

TripDog is right, fina works only with compounds that are not 5 alpha reduced.

The original idea of fina is that it prevents your OWN NATURAL TESTOSTERONE from converting to DHT.

When you start taking 40g of test each week, well I'm guessing that you are going to need more fina to compensate for the mega amounts of test you are blasting into your body.


I read a bunch of random studies while at work and one of them seem to have indicated that estrogen might also have a potential for hair loss. I don't have the study with me or remember it specifically. Estrogen, yeah I found that odd as well. Might be a playback feed.....who knows.


When I took Furazadrol which is a 5 alpha reduced compound, I started shedding very noticibly. Again this is a 5 alpha reduced compound yet for some reason I was shedding...didn't make sense. Oh yeah then the spike in blood pressure went up and I got nose bleeds. Cool.


If you take a 5 alpha reduced compound, it prevents conversion to DHT, that's it, nothing more than that. I don't know if this actually will eliminate the potential for hair loss. I don't think it will 100% as I'm going to speculate that there is more to the story than DHT, it is just that the only information that seems to be current is that DHT is the culprit.



Typically fina is taken in .5mg-1mg. Normal males have testosterone in....400-600 range ? Is that fair to assume ? I'm not sure if the dosing of fina is based off normal male test. ranges. If so, there might need to be some conversion when introducing 750mg-1,000mg of test a week. (This seems to be the typical amount used each week).



hugs and kisses,

-ReaperX

 

[TripDog]

Any hormone/steroid with a moderate/ high androgenic rating can and will cause shedding,acne, prostate issues etc. DHT is one of many androgens. Halodrol is rather mild, while pheraplex/dmt is roughly 2x more androgenic than testosterone.

 

[ReaperX]

Fina seems to get a bad reputation for causing permanent sexual side effects. (i.e. permanent loss of libido). Not saying that this is true for everyone, however it is something that has been reported.

 

[Brian5225]

Okay, I got a couple of questions with this.

1) He's in his 3rd week of PCT from a halo clone and now he's having the problem. So what would this be caused from? Because it doesn't seem like it would be a halo>DHT problem, because the halo has been cleaning out of his body for a while now. So if it is DHT, where is it coming from?

2) Reaper, what did you do for the hair loss?

 

[TripDog]

Okay, I got a couple of questions with this.

1) He's in his 3rd week of PCT from a halo clone and now he's having the problem. So what would this be caused from? Because it doesn't seem like it would be a halo>DHT problem, because the halo has been cleaning out of his body for a while now. So if it is DHT, where is it coming from?

Hormonal fluctuations can cause hairloss.

 

[Brian5225]

Hormonal fluctuations can cause hairloss.

Once it is lost, and hormones are stabilized, will the hair regrow naturally?

 

[TripDog]

usually it will just thin on a cycle, and once the cycle stops it will re-thicken. Lost hair can come back, but if the root is shed it will not. I am no expert on the subject but have done a lot of research.

 

[Brian5225]

Hmm... I've always wondered if it could come back. I mean technically, couldn't Brolic just wait it out, and hope it comes back? I mean it's kind of crude, and a hopeless way of looking at things, but if you haven't got the resources, what other choice have you got...

 

[TripDog]

its genetic makeup man, some people can use a ton of gear and not loose much at all.

 

[Brian5225]

Yeah, I remember my father telling me back in the day that injectables made his hair thin like crazy, but with my oral usage I haven't had any problems with it.

 

[Brolic]

Propecia is going to help 10x more than rogaine. I heard it's rather pricey from a doctor, but can be obtained other ways

poiny me in the right direction

 

[ReaperX]

I wasn't going to use fina so I took a bunch of Saw Palmetto instead. I question how effective Saw Palmetto actually is, but nonetheless I just took it anyway and got off the stuff.


There was also something that I read that said when you are stressed that it produces antibodies that weaken the hair root and it falls out.


Your hair follicle is what you need to be worried about and that is what is embedded into the scalp and where hair grows from. DHT is what eventually chokes out the follicle.


There's no point in taking fina if you are/did take a 5 alpha reduce compound. It isn't going to help any and you are putting yourself at risk by using it.


Typically your hair will re-grow back. Mine did very quickly after I got off Furazadrol.

 

[ReaperX]

http://www.medicinenet.com/finasteride-oral_hair_growth/article.htm

 

[rabican]

a few questions...:

-just to clearify, you guys are saying fina wont help w/ hdrol?

-could his hair loss be from his high doses of hdrol 75-10mg ED?

-does fina cause any initial shedding like rogaine does? (thats why id never do rogaine)

-would running 1/2 pill of propecia or 1 pill every other day throughout a hdrol cycle counter act any hair loss?

thanks.

 

[ReaperX]

H-Drol is 5 alpha reduced. Many different designers out there are already. Fina is an antiandrogen which acts by inhibiting type II 5-alpha reductase, the enzyme that converts testosterone to dihydrotestosterone (DHT).


So to answer your question, no it will not do anything except inhibit your own natural testosterone from converting to DHT.


I'm not sure about your other questions. Best idea would be to ask a doctor or someone who has used the product before.


Something tells me that people will just associate Fina with decreasing hair loss and take it anyway with already 5 alpha reduced compounds.

 

[rabican]

...I see thanks!
so fina would to a waist of brolic to try to get a hold of. I'm curious if saw palmetto would help him...

 

[ReaperX]

Saw Palmetto has shown some health benefits, plus it is relatively harmless and cheap so it is worth buying, IMO.


Fina dosen't work magically. It takes time to work. On top of that it is really used during a cycle, not afterwards. Well, I guess you could use it afterwards, but the idea is to have been using it for a substantial time before ever cycling.

For Brolic, maybe Saw Palmetto and Nizoral shampoo.

Minox may or may not be helpful. I'm not sure. I never used it myself.

 

[ReaperX]

due to H-Drol being 5 alpha reduced already, his hair loss is most likely not from DHT, so it is possible that the whole situation is reversible. No promises of course.


Brolic is overly paranoid ever since he started the cycle. You can tell in all his posts, and taking a picture of his breast/nipple and other weird statements. He's a hypochondriac. I really don't take his statements too seriously. Sorry, but that's the truth. Ur crazy bro. :fool2:

 

[rabican]

would the saw palmetto in cycle support be sufficient (if hes taking CS) or would extra supplementation be suggested?

 

[ReaperX]

The Saw Palmetto in cycle support is >45% so it is a pretty decent extract.



I'm not really sure what would be effective, or how effective saw palmetto is. I haven't really comitted too much time to learning about it to be honest with you. Been busy with other stuff lately. I just picked up some at Wal-greens.


Your guess is as good as mine.


Someone else who knows a lot about saw palmetto should chime in.

 

[Dr_C2]

Go to your familt doctor and...

tell him you are worried about your hair lossand there is male pattern baldness in your family.

Ask him to script you Proscar. Proscar is the 5 mg version of Propecia (1.25 mg) and here's the kicker, almost all health insurance plans cover Proscar b/c it is approved for the treatment of prostrate enlargement.

No health plans that I am aware of cover Propecia.

Now, take your 5 mg Proscar and cut it into 4 pieces with a pill cutter and take 1.25 mg daily.

I've used Proscar/Propecia for the past 13 years with amazing results. I was one of the original subjects who particpated in the phase III clinicals for propecia back inthe mid 90's (thanks to my brother).

I have run doeses from 5 mg daily to 1.25 mg with no sides what so ever.

I don't know where this gyno thing is coming from b/c I have never seen an elevation in my estrogen levels. Actually the opposite my test bumpped up.

If you are going to run test cycles, I would suggest you double you propecia does and take 1.25 mg in the morning and 1.25 mg at night. It only has a half life of about 8 hours. If you want the most protection, get Avodart. It is about 10% more effective than propecia and blocks both DHT isomers.

Regards,

 

[teribleturtle]

I wasn't going to use fina so I took a bunch of Saw Palmetto instead. I question how effective Saw Palmetto actually is, but nonetheless I just took it anyway and got off the stuff.


There was also something that I read that said when you are stressed that it produces antibodies that weaken the hair root and it falls out.


Your hair follicle is what you need to be worried about and that is what is embedded into the scalp and where hair grows from. DHT is what eventually chokes out the follicle.


There's no point in taking fina if you are/did take a 5 alpha reduce compound. It isn't going to help any and you are putting yourself at risk by using it.


Typically your hair will re-grow back. Mine did very quickly after I got off Furazadrol.

So I am having a similar problem, I took jungle warfare for 3 weeks back in march at the recomended dosage, it is now june and i am still noticing lots of hair shedding, I also noticed that the hair on the front of my forehead and widows peak ( I had a very weird and extremely low and closed in hairline) has pretty much disappeared. There is no history of MPB on both sides of my family so this has gotten me worried. Also body hair and facial hair is continuing to grow and thicken, which is strange because before I pretty much had no body/facial hair.

Also when I quit JW i quit the moment I noticed shedding no tapering off or PCT, is it possible that a lack of PCT left my hormone screwed up?? Have you ever heard of anything like my situation where steroid sides (shedding, growing body hair) still remain months after the steroids were taken??

 

[cynic]

TT,

I've been following along with your situation since you started JW. First off, I'm really sorry that it has effected you like this. I also took JW a while back before it came out that there was 6-DMT in it. I also experienced some shedding from it, however fortunately for me, it has stopped. A couple of things to think about: human hair naturally thins out a bit during the hotter months, so if you live anywhere where it is pretty cold in the winter and pretty hot in the summer, this may be a small part of it. Also, I'm pretty sure that you have become hyper-aware of the fact that you are shedding. What I mean is that I doubt you checked obsessively before you learned that JW could cause hair loss (I know I am guilty of this), so there may be a chance that you are not shedding as bad as you may think. I'm not doubting that you are losing hair, and I'm not questioning that JW was the cause. I would really suggest that you get blood work done if you really think that your hormones are out of wack...that is the only way that you are going to know for sure. Also, try to relax a bit...the stress isn't helping your hair situation in the least. I've read every one of your posts since you started losing hair, and you are freaking out (somewhat understandably so), but its not helping. But seriously, get blood work, then reassess the situation. I have definitely heard of people having long term effects from hormonal products. Was JW the first hormonal supp you have taken (including test-boosters, anything with nettle root, AI's, ATD's, etc.)?

 

[ReaperX]

So I am having a similar problem, I took jungle warfare for 3 weeks back in march at the recomended dosage, it is now june and i am still noticing lots of hair shedding, I also noticed that the hair on the front of my forehead and widows peak ( I had a very weird and extremely low and closed in hairline) has pretty much disappeared. There is no history of MPB on both sides of my family so this has gotten me worried. Also body hair and facial hair is continuing to grow and thicken, which is strange because before I pretty much had no body/facial hair.

Also when I quit JW i quit the moment I noticed shedding no tapering off or PCT, is it possible that a lack of PCT left my hormone screwed up?? Have you ever heard of anything like my situation where steroid sides (shedding, growing body hair) still remain months after the steroids were taken??

The reason why men have that little 'hair skit' on the sides of the head is because the front/top of the scalp seems to be more prone to DHT build up.

If you are losing hair as fast as you are saying that you are, then jungle warfare must have been extremely androgenic. I remember when I got some bottles of it, I was reluctant to use it which was a good thing.


To be totally honest with you, I don't know what that 6-DMT substance is in it, or if there wasn't something else laced into it. It appears to have been very androgenic and has had that effect on you.

After I stopped taking Furazadrol, my shedding stopped about 4-5 days later so it was relatively quick. I was just noticing that a lot of hair was falling out while I was on it and it stopped once I got off of it.


I'm not sure what to tell you, but here's some stuff you can to do help prevent the problem from mitigating further:


1. Nizorol shampoo. Make sure you get the 2% active. Most places sell 1%, but you want the 2%

2. Saw Palmetto. I use nature's bounty. I take 6 capsules/ED which is like 1.8g/ED or something like that.

3. Minox (Rogain). I don't use this, but your situation seems like it might warrent its usage.


My hair isn't falling out. It is still very thick and I have a lot, but it is all about preventative though.

 

[rabican]

ReaperX what nizoral shampoo do you suggest? (which brand)

How effective is Nizoral A-D by Nizoral? or Nizoral 2% Dandruff Shampoo 120mL (4oz) by Nizoral?

-----

also i read that a side effect of nizoral is hair loss, is this like a shedding phase at the beginning? if so does this hair come back and stay back when you discontinue the use of nizoral?

 

[ReaperX]

http://www.nizoralshampoo.com/buy-nizoral.htm


It's got 2% keto and within a reasonable price. This is what I use. I don't know exactly how much of a difference 1%-2% of keto works. Personally, I've had decent results with both.


The stuff you see at Wal-greens is probably 1%.


If you use this product, I cannot stress this enough. MAKE SURE YOU GET A GOOD QUALITY CONDITIONER.

The anti-dandruff has a tendency to dry out hair, but having a good conditioner will help.


Personally, I use nizorol every other day, so my hair dosen't dry out too much.

First day: Nizorol
Second day: Garner Fructase shampoo
Third day: Repeat


If you start shedding once you use Nizorol, it is because your 'exfoliating' your scalp if that makes sense. It is temporary and new healthy hair should grow in.


hope that helps.

 

[rabican]

If you start shedding once you use Nizorol, it is because your 'exfoliating' your scalp if that makes sense. It is temporary and new healthy hair should grow in.

And this will regrow and not go away once i discontinue the use of nizoral (after a AAS cycle)?

 

[ReaperX]

Allegedly minox has a regressive results once discontinued. I don't think Nizorol is that way, and theoretically your hair should be fine even after discontinuation.


I don't know in regards to A.A.S. and hair loss. That's just one of the risks you have to take.

 

[rabican]

;[ thanks bro

 

[teribleturtle]

TT,

I've been following along with your situation since you started JW. First off, I'm really sorry that it has effected you like this. I also took JW a while back before it came out that there was 6-DMT in it. I also experienced some shedding from it, however fortunately for me, it has stopped. A couple of things to think about: human hair naturally thins out a bit during the hotter months, so if you live anywhere where it is pretty cold in the winter and pretty hot in the summer, this may be a small part of it. Also, I'm pretty sure that you have become hyper-aware of the fact that you are shedding. What I mean is that I doubt you checked obsessively before you learned that JW could cause hair loss (I know I am guilty of this), so there may be a chance that you are not shedding as bad as you may think. I'm not doubting that you are losing hair, and I'm not questioning that JW was the cause. I would really suggest that you get blood work done if you really think that your hormones are out of wack...that is the only way that you are going to know for sure. Also, try to relax a bit...the stress isn't helping your hair situation in the least. I've read every one of your posts since you started losing hair, and you are freaking out (somewhat understandably so), but its not helping. But seriously, get blood work, then reassess the situation. I have definitely heard of people having long term effects from hormonal products. Was JW the first hormonal supp you have taken (including test-boosters, anything with nettle root, AI's, ATD's, etc.)?

Well before JW I took Animal Stak 2 which was fine, it gave me no sides and made me a bit more aggressive, then someone told me about JW which was supposed to be safe and natural, first day I took it I kinda had a bad feeling as I got extreme lethargy, headaches, and a super elevated libido unlike anything I ever experienced, but again i was told I would be totally fine. 3rd week is when the weird stuff started happening, in addition to bad acne and agression, I noticed that the front portion of my hairline thinned out significantly. Before JW I would have to "line up" or "shape" my hairline every day because hair would grow out fast and thick within a day, now I dont do that because the hair fell out and hasnt came back. Some are mentioning that maybe my hairline is maturing and is considered normal, I am trying To be optimistic and hope it is simply maturing, but I also wonder whether steroids can cause a juvenile hairline to mature. I am also wondering if I am just overly sensitive to androgens or if JW caused me to become permanently sensitive to androgens due to the fact that it has caused me to start growing more body and facial hair.