Running M-drol at 30mg

Indiana Jones

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I'm about to start day 14 of M-drol at 10/20 with no real weight or strength gain. I'm gaining like a 1lb a week so I know that I'm eating enough. So I think I'm going to bump up the dosage to 30mg a week. I'm hardly experiencing any side effects other than back/calf pumps and 6mg of taurine is enough to get me through a workout. Cardio is impossible though. Thoughts on this ? I'm really disappointed because I was looking very forward to running M-drol
 
aquanutz

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If your mdrol was legit, you should be noticing it by the end of the second week. I wonder if you got a bunk batch...

What do you weigh?
 
Indiana Jones

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If your mdrol was legit, you should be noticing it by the end of the second week. I wonder if you got a bunk batch...

What do you weigh?
5'6 170lbs


I was told since I am experiencing back/calf pumps that the M-drol couldn't be bunk. But I don't know.
 

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Have you run superdrol before? I have noticed that it is very easy to build up a tolerance to it. I've run 30mg before and liked it, I say that if you've run it before then bump to 30.
 
Indiana Jones

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Have you run superdrol before? I have noticed that it is very easy to build up a tolerance to it. I've run 30mg before and liked it, I say that if you've run it before then bump to 30.

Not only have I not run Superdrol before, I was also a PH virgin before this cycle too. So I'm really shocked that I'm not feeling anything, no serious sides or gains.
 
pantera101

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I would give it more time.Maybe you're just not a SD responder though.Some swear to not respond to any designers too well.I'm on day 16 and I have seen positives at 10mg.
 

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Man you should have noticed somthing on mdrol,i gained 12 pounds in my 3 week cycle,and my strength went up like 20 pounds and my arms got some tone to them,the only thing i had was major back cramps.
 
pantera101

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Man you should have noticed somthing on mdrol,i gained 12 pounds in my 3 week cycle,and my strength went up like 20 pounds and my arms got some tone to them,the only thing i had was major back cramps.
I hat to rub it in indianajones,but my rack deads went up 40lbs last wo with 10mg's.You got some weight on you.So you should eat plenty.Assuming it's mostly muscle.You might just be a non responder,or a slow responder.
 
EasyEJL

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I'm about to start day 14 of M-drol at 10/20 with no real weight or strength gain. I'm gaining like a 1lb a week so I know that I'm eating enough.
not wanting to sound abrasive, but if you are gaining 1lb a week then you are eating enough to gain 1lb a week. If you are expecting to put on 4-5 lbs a week thats an extra 2000 calories a day to put down on top of what you normally eat. Superdrol isn't magic, it can't create muscle tissue out of air. What it can do is make sure that while you are taking in that extra 2000 calories a day it goes towards building muscle and not fat.
 
Indiana Jones

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I would give it more time.Maybe you're just not a SD responder though.Some swear to not respond to any designers too well.I'm on day 16 and I have seen positives at 10mg.
I guess I might just be a non responder. Btw I had you in mind this week, perplexed at how you're doing so well of 10mg and I'm seeing nothing at 20mg.

Man you should have noticed somthing on mdrol,i gained 12 pounds in my 3 week cycle,and my strength went up like 20 pounds and my arms got some tone to them,the only thing i had was major back cramps.
I wish.

not wanting to sound abrasive, but if you are gaining 1lb a week then you are eating enough to gain 1lb a week. If you are expecting to put on 4-5 lbs a week thats an extra 2000 calories a day to put down on top of what you normally eat. Superdrol isn't magic, it can't create muscle tissue out of air. What it can do is make sure that while you are taking in that extra 2000 calories a day it goes towards building muscle and not fat.
But the thing is man, from what I understand Superdrol and other PH/AAS are kind of like "magic". It's because you stop being natural at that point. That's why you see people on cycle actually lose fat and at the same time build muscle , which is unheard of if you're off cycle and not a beginner or very obese. I don't believe that the "Calories in = calories out" theory applies when you're on cycle. Your body has the ability to build muscle much more efficiently. ironguru on this site put on 11lbs in 3 weeks on superdrol while staying at the same bf% and only eating 2700 calories a day. And he was like 165lbs shredded at 7%.

And since I'm not even seeing strength gains at the gym, if I took in 2k extra calories a day I'd just get fat really quick. It would be different if I was feeling the effects of M-drol already.
 
EasyEJL

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Superdrol doesn't inherently (before muscle gains) give much strength gains. its a highly anabolic substance, not a highly androgenic one.

Truthfully I can't see how you can add 11lbs of mass without taking in enough raw materials to make up that 11lbs of mass. Its just against the laws of physics :) The anabolics really just allow it to grow in that short span of time, and perhaps a bit more efficiently, but not out of thin air.
 
pantera101

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That might be your problem IJ,is that you're relying on the m drol to do the work for you so to speak.They are not magic at all.They do wonders when your diet,rest.and traing are in order though.You have to want it,and it has to show in the gym and kitchen.You should always eat more than usual while on cycle.Your body can process the food better.Even train a little more cause you can recover faster.
A good trick to get your mind right is to act like you're not taking anything at all.It's easy to think it will do the work for you,but it wont.I even stated this in my log,that it's not all fun and games.I'm busting my a$$ in the kitchen and gym.
 
Indiana Jones

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That might be your problem IJ,is that you're relying on the m drol to do the work for you so to speak.They are not magic at all.They do wonders when your diet,rest.and traing are in order though.You have to want it,and it has to show in the gym and kitchen.You should always eat more than usual while on cycle.Your body can process the food better.
A good trick to get your mind right is to act like you're not taking anything at all.It's easy to think it will do the work for you,but it wont.I even stated this in my log,that it's not all fun and games.I'm busting my a$$ in the kitchen and gym.
how many calories are you eating daily ?
 
pantera101

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how many calories are you eating daily ?
I also edited in there that you should train a little more too,cause you can recover faster from it.

I don't count cals.I did at first and it helped to give me an idea of how much roughly equals what.I have a high metabolism and a physical job.I pretty much always eat as much as I can every 2-3 hrs.I am taking 2 shakes a day on top of meals,that have over 1,000 cals each.

I make one of those shakes in the morning and drink about a quarter of it.Another quarter an hour or so later before working out in the gym parking lot.Then the rest(1/2)after wo with cretine mono mixed in

Today I had the morning shake ofcourse,a jack in the box sirloin steak and egg buritto.Then 3 tacos and a big 'ol buritto with some oatmeal for complex carbs.Then some brisket and oatmeal while working.Then wendy's spicy shicken sandwich,med fries,chicken nuggets and med frosty.Now i'm going to have one of those 1,000+cal shakes and go to bed afterwards.It will be a little less cals actually,cause their wont be quite as much oatmeal.

I don't usually eat this much fast food in a day,but today kind of worked that way.I needed food fast cause I was comming up on the 3 hr mark and I was starving.We were working by a wendy's,so I got some.I usually have a water too instead of a frosty or coke,and a potatoe instead of fries.Wendy's fries dipped in their chocolate frosties are strangely amazing. :food:
 

maynehood171

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i eat about 3500-4000 calories a day with 250-300g of protein a day and LOTS of carbs. I am pulsing M-drol because I want to limit the sides but have gained 7lbs running into week 3 and my buddies say that I even look more lean! Funny as it's the same amount of food intake I used for a Havoc pulsed and actually gained noticeable fat but this m-drol being as potent as it is seems to be using it up pretty good...so up the food even more bro!
 
Indiana Jones

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I also edited in there that you should train a little more too,cause you can recover faster from it.

I don't count cals.I did at first and it helped to give me an idea of how much roughly equals what.I have a high metabolism and a physical job.I pretty much always eat as much as I can every 2-3 hrs.I am taking 2 shakes a day on top of meals,that have over 1,000 cals each.

I make one of those shakes in the morning and drink about a quarter of it.Another quarter an hour or so later before working out in the gym parking lot.Then the rest(1/2)after wo with cretine mono mixed in

Today I had the morning shake ofcourse,a jack in the box sirloin steak and egg buritto.Then 3 tacos and a big 'ol buritto with some oatmeal for complex carbs.Then some brisket and oatmeal while working.Then wendy's spicy shicken sandwich,med fries,chicken nuggets and med frosty.Now i'm going to have one of those 1,000+cal shakes and go to bed afterwards.It will be a little less cals actually,cause their wont be quite as much oatmeal.

I don't usually eat this much fast food in a day,but today kind of worked that way.I needed food fast cause I was comming up on the 3 hr mark and I was starving.We were working by a wendy's,so I got some.I usually have a water too instead of a frosty or coke,and a potatoe instead of fries.Wendy's fries dipped in their chocolate frosties are strangely amazing. :food:

well I'm taking in 3500 calories a day all from clean foods like brown rice, whole wheat bread, lean beef, chicken breasts, potatoes,milk, fruits ,etc. Roughly 40/40/20 macro break down

and about training more, I'm kind of getting some conflicting advice. Cause right when I started the cycle I purposely did start training more because like what you just said, recovery should be much better. But then some people here are telling me that I'm training too much and I should give my body more time to recover. I train 6 days a week.
 

maynehood171

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Thing with that is not on your muscles but mostly on your joints, ligaments, tendons. You should still be giving at least day or two for rest for each muscle group...remember...if you don't give your muscles enough time to heal...you won't gain
 
pantera101

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See what works for you.Not everyones the same.I hate it when someone says I've been doint this for x amount of time......you think thats allright?Well,if you're gaining yes,it's perfect.If you haven't gained in quite some time while keeping diet and training in check,then,and only then is something wrong.People can't tell you that you're doing too much.They can only speculate based on their body and what they have read.Which means nothing to you realy.Imagine if Ronnie Cooleman took others training advice.I heard tha dude went up and down a db rack doing raises like twice or something!

Everything always comes down to diet though.I view that as the only chore cause I love training.......most of the time.:)
 

maynehood171

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See what works for you.Not everyones the same.I hate it when someone says I've been doint this for x amount of time......you think thats allright?Well,if you're gaining yes,it's perfect.If you haven't gained in quite some time while keeping diet and training in check,then,and only then is something wrong.People can't tell you that you're doing too much.They can only speculate based on their body and what they have read.Which means nothing to you realy.Imagine if Ronnie Cooleman took others training advice.I heard tha dude went up and down a db rack doing raises like twice or something!

Everything always comes down to diet though.I view that as the only chore cause I love training.......most of the time.:)
Nicely said Pantera. Diet is THE KEY. Even think of it afterwards without test enhancers/roids in the picture. If you slack off diet while jacked or lets say...have noticeable muscle...bad diet - you will lose some if not all...point blank. My bro is a big boy, and he lost 15lbs total and def lots of noticeable muscle because he wasn't eating right for a month!
 
EasyEJL

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well I'm taking in 3500 calories a day all from clean foods like brown rice, whole wheat bread, lean beef, chicken breasts, potatoes,milk, fruits ,etc. Roughly 40/40/20 macro break down

and about training more, I'm kind of getting some conflicting advice. Cause right when I started the cycle I purposely did start training more because like what you just said, recovery should be much better. But then some people here are telling me that I'm training too much and I should give my body more time to recover. I train 6 days a week.
I used the calculator here

Basal Metabolic Rate and Daily Calorie Calculator - MuscleandStrength.com

and it comes up with 3140 calories a day as your base, assuming "very active" and that you are 21. So at 3500ish a day, 1lb a week is pretty reasonable.

granted those are just rough approximations. But even if we go with the idea that hormonal stuff makes your body more efficient, it still takes a significant amount of caloric intake to create a lb of muscle. I'd try raising your cals at least another 500-1000 a day.
 
witt51

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I used the calculator here

Basal Metabolic Rate and Daily Calorie Calculator - MuscleandStrength.com

and it comes up with 3140 calories a day as your base, assuming "very active" and that you are 21. So at 3500ish a day, 1lb a week is pretty reasonable.

granted those are just rough approximations. But even if we go with the idea that hormonal stuff makes your body more efficient, it still takes a significant amount of caloric intake to create a lb of muscle. I'd try raising your cals at least another 500-1000 a day.

the only thing about that formula is it doesnt take in consideration someones bodyfat %. we all know some one with more lbm will burn calories than someone the same weight but more fat. he needs just to increse calories slowly and monitor his bodyfat. i really dont think he will gain a bunch of fat just by slowly increasing calories like he thinks. its all about experimenting and knowing your body.just my $.02.
 
dkkon1

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Hey man, it seems like you're quick to pin your lack of gains on being a "non-responder", though this is possible it is unlikely, statistically at least. I mean we have newbs come in here and say "i just ate constantly and hit the gym every chance i got and i gained 14lbs" Assuming you know more than a newb, as far as what makes you grow, you should be gaining like crazy. If you're in pretty good shape and your BF% isn't sky high, 10lbs in 3 weeks at 10/20/20 should be easily attainable. Personally I took in almost 1800 cals above maintenance on my s-drol cycle and gained 13lbs in 3 weeks, but the important thing is my BF went from 8 to 7% while eating like a horse. Earlier you said that you thought that gear was kind of like magic, but you don't seem to believe that you can eat a bulking diet and not get fat. Something is missing in your regiment, if you're training good (you stated you were), if you're getting enough rest, if you're taking the m-drol properly (i know you are), then the only thing to look at is your inadequate diet, take in 1000 extra cals a day (as clean as possible) and if you start to see something you don't like (which i doubt, unless you hate the look of lean mass) start cutting down to 800 extra/day,600 extra/day, etc. You may have missed out on a lot of gains already but i would take this opportunity to do some trial and error to see what gets results, next m-drol cycle you'll know :).
 
Indiana Jones

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I used the calculator here

Basal Metabolic Rate and Daily Calorie Calculator - MuscleandStrength.com

and it comes up with 3140 calories a day as your base, assuming "very active" and that you are 21. So at 3500ish a day, 1lb a week is pretty reasonable.

granted those are just rough approximations. But even if we go with the idea that hormonal stuff makes your body more efficient, it still takes a significant amount of caloric intake to create a lb of muscle. I'd try raising your cals at least another 500-1000 a day.
I used that same calculation but my activity level is somewhere between lightly and moderately active. Other lifting at the gym, I don't do any physically demanding activities.
 
EasyEJL

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Didnt you say you were lifting hard 6 days a week? :)
 
LSU Gladiator

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A few years back, I took 1-AD and I gained about 10 lbs without eating much more than usual.

My freshman year in college I lived in a dorm and we had the university's meal plan where we could go eat buffet style 3x a day. I did a round with 1-tu (IDK if anyone remembers that stuff) and I put on about 18lbs. I know these two compounds probably had slightly different properties, but food makes the deal man. I think the whole "lean bulk" thing is harder than people give it credit for. Maybe 1lb a week is all that a person should expect when they're trying to lean bulk.
 
Indiana Jones

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Didnt you say you were lifting hard 6 days a week? :)
Yeah but I don't consider that be that much of a physically demanding exercise. I've made the mistake before of thinking "(hard exercise/sports 6-7 days a week" applies to lifting weights at the gym 6-7 days a week. I think it applies more so to playing a long game of basketball everyday or track practice, etc. Lifting weights probably only burns like 300 calories. In the past I tried going with "very active" and I stared putting on fat very quickly
 
witt51

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I used that same calculation but my activity level is somewhere between lightly and moderately active. Other lifting at the gym, I don't do any physically demanding activities.

ya would consider light if you just do a little cleaning and walk to class if you are in school. take in consideration you lift 6 days a week. if lifting hard and pushing yourself you need to take in consideration "afterburn effect".

what you are doing is not working and need a new approach. i think we all agree your diet is lacking so just take our advise and increase calories instead of making excuses.
 
Indiana Jones

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But either way I am going to raise my calories a bit and finish up this cycle, I have nothing to lose at this point.



edit: lol witt I made this post before reading yours.
 
pantera101

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Like I said earlier,I don't count cals.Branch Warren says he doesn't either.Not even when dieting.Theirs a simple aproach to it.
Not gaining fat or muscle=not enough
gaing too much fat=too much
gaining muscle with minimal bf=just right
Then just the opposite when dieting down.
Ofcourse you don't grow 24/7.I grow in spurts,and have read thats natural.So keep that in mind too.Whenyou're on a designer for a couple weeks though,you should be growing.
 

maynehood171

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Not bad, for eating about 3,500 calories and whatnot a day...got my bf tested today...11%...damn not bad...goes to show more of the importance of eating more than usual because I NEVER eat as much ON than when I'm off
 
Indiana Jones

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I know must have repulsed you guys to death by now, but let's talk hypotheticals. I'm going to raise my calories a lot, now say I do that for the next week or two and I'm not seeing any increased strength or muscle gains, but as I predict fat gains. So do I jump into full PCT mode and then wait time on + PCT to start or could I immediately start a cycle of P-plex, not sure if it would be bridged or not. And yeah I know M-drol/P-plex bridges are usually run the opposite way.
 
EasyEJL

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thats really a tough call. I think best would be to do the PCT + wait. so far there has not been a single batch of m-drol from cel that has lab tested to be bunk. validated by 3rd party labs each time its come back as superdrol.

They admitted to their recent batch m1,4add coming back bad, but that is the only time (and they had 3rd party tests results saying it was good initially, only to find out later the testing company didn't have a sample of m1,4 themselves to test vs).
 
Indiana Jones

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maybe it's not bunk and I'm just a non responder. BTW the batch number is p8352E0112
 
EasyEJL

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didn't ask before, are you getting back pumps or lethargy? and are you taking the 20mg together or separately? I'd get no back pumps or lethargy with the 2 10s taken separately, but if you take them together should get some.
 
Indiana Jones

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I'm getting back/calf pumps. Not really lethargy. And I spread the dosage out equally through out the day (10mg: am/10mg: pm)
 
EasyEJL

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well, if the back pumps aren't something that ormally happens, then its a sign that somthing is happening :)
 
Condition1

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I don't think there's a way around it with superdrol, you have to eat a bit more than you'd like to even if it means putting on a little bit of fat. If you want your gains, just wait until after PCT to cut some of the fat IMO.
 
pantera101

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maybe it's not bunk and I'm just a non responder. BTW the batch number is p8352E0112
Are you sure it's not
P8353
E0112?
Thats my batch,and i've never seen yours.Either a misprint or different batch.I guarantee you it's good either way.Do you have some fat on you now?I'm 180 at 5'8" with a little extra fat but nothing big.I ask cause some of the best advice i've been given and give others,is don't be scared to put on some fat while bulking.Maybe even quit working abs.Thats how I said fvck it!I don't want to be skinny with abs for the rest of my life.I want to be big,and thats going to take some serious eating.Now I don't want to be noticeably fat at all,and plan on staying leaner later than i am now.But thats much later when i'm much bigger.I'd rather look better in a short,or even long sleeved shirt,as opposed to only without a shirt.Thats just me though.
Once again though,170 for 5'6" is pretty heavy too,thats why I ask how much is fat?
 
BigAsian

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wow, you can get big and keep your abs...just dont eat mcdonalds everyday while your on cycle. im into week 3 of my m-drol cycle and i have run it 10/20/30 so far...and nothing. im gaining weight but only because of my eating. not because of m-drol. i have run m-drol before and i know i respond to it very well at 20mgs...i should not be at 30mgs but i am very sure my batch is crap. i gained 26lbs in 3 weeks the last time i ran mdrol. i am 3 days away from the end of a 3 week mdrol run with +4 lbs...something is wrong... no sides at all...and minimal strength gains again i attribute the gains only to my workout routine not to the compound.
 
Indiana Jones

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Are you sure it's not
P8353
E0112?
Thats my batch,and i've never seen yours.Either a misprint or different batch.I guarantee you it's good either way.Do you have some fat on you now?I'm 180 at 5'8" with a little extra fat but nothing big.I ask cause some of the best advice i've been given and give others,is don't be scared to put on some fat while bulking.Maybe even quit working abs.Thats how I said fvck it!I don't want to be skinny with abs for the rest of my life.I want to be big,and thats going to take some serious eating.Now I don't want to be noticeably fat at all,and plan on staying leaner later than i am now.But thats much later when i'm much bigger.I'd rather look better in a short,or even long sleeved shirt,as opposed to only without a shirt.Thats just me though.
Once again though,170 for 5'6" is pretty heavy too,thats why I ask how much is fat?
My bad that was a typo. The batch is P8353 E0112The scale says 170 but I'm a lot closer to 160. I know I'm holding in a lot of extra water and bloat. I was carb depleted for a little while before I started M-drol and I rapidly increased my calorie intake and bloated up a bit. I gave an estimate here the other day about being around 14% bf but I'm probably closer to 15-16%
 
Indiana Jones

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wow, you can get big and keep your abs...just dont eat mcdonalds everyday while your on cycle. im into week 3 of my m-drol cycle and i have run it 10/20/30 so far...and nothing. im gaining weight but only because of my eating. not because of m-drol. i have run m-drol before and i know i respond to it very well at 20mgs...i should not be at 30mgs but i am very sure my batch is crap. i gained 26lbs in 3 weeks the last time i ran mdrol. i am 3 days away from the end of a 3 week mdrol run with +4 lbs...something is wrong... no sides at all...and minimal strength gains again i attribute the gains only to my workout routine not to the compound.

what's your batch number ?

I'm making the same type of gains as you are too., but with some very minor sides.
 
Indiana Jones

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well, if the back pumps aren't something that ormally happens, then its a sign that somthing is happening :)

On very rare occasions in the past I had experienced some back pumps. But never as bad as now. And calf pumps are completely brand new to me. I had no idea what they were the first few days. I thought I had just worked my calves too hard.
 
pantera101

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wow, you can get big and keep your abs...
Thats what some say,but they're never very big.I don't work my abs and I eat prety dirty.I can still see the outlines of my abs though.I don't get outright fat,and i'm not suggesting others to,but you need to eat alot to grow.So when you're concerned about having ripped abs,your muscle growth is going to be minimal at best.I want it fast,so i eat and eat and eat.Most bb's have gotten rid of the idea of getting straight up fat in the off season,but most get to exactly where I am now to grow at optimal speeds.I hear alot saying if they start to lose their abs completely they'll do more cardio cause they don't want to go over 13%bf.(max bf to see outlines of abs)Then they diet down to what,3-5%?They don't stay like that cause they'd be half the size if they did.
 
Condition1

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You and Pantera have the same batch numbers. He's reporting great results at just 10 mgs, though he's eating a bunch.

It's either your diet or you're a non responder...

Bro I was getting 100g-150g protein from food and 150 from shakes (250-300 total daily). Milk, cottage cheese, eggs, chicken, steak and even sea food. Oatmeal and whatever "healthy" carb I can get my grubby little hands on. At 5' 7" I went from 158 to 178, I can tell you that it wasn't all muscle, some fat here but there was atleast 12-15lbs of muscle in there.

Enjoy the bulk food, this is the time you can get away with it (cleanish) :burg:
 

maynehood171

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maybe it's not bunk and I'm just a non responder. BTW the batch number is p8352E0112
I have 2 bottles of this batch and using one as we speak...I'm getting the back/calf pumps, oily skin...basically the works and up 8lbs in 3rd week pulsed
 

maynehood171

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i should not be at 30mgs but i am very sure my batch is crap. i gained 26lbs in 3 weeks the last time i ran mdrol. i am 3 days away from the end of a 3 week mdrol run with +4 lbs...something is wrong... no sides at all...and minimal strength gains again i attribute the gains only to my workout routine not to the compound.
:blink:Did you jump into lifting and steroids at the same time?:think:
 
pantera101

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:blink:Did you jump into lifting and steroids at the same time?:think:
That is a lot.Thats exactly your problem now though if you gained that much.You can't expect even ten lbs every time.After 10 cycles,you would have added 100lb's lbm!
 

maynehood171

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That is a lot.Thats exactly your problem now though if you gained that much.You can't expect even ten lbs every time.After 10 cycles,you would have added 100lb's lbm!
I would almost consider his benefits of m-drol done-for...haha
 
dawaro

dawaro

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IJ I think you are way too concerned about the fat gain. Remember it takes 3500 calories to make 1 pound of fat. If you increase you intake by 1000 calories a day over maintenance at the very worst case you are going to see a 2lb fat gain and that is without the m-drol. It is impossible to add lean mass without some kind of fat gain. You may burn the fat off but it is there at one time or another.
Also keep in mind days that you work out you are going to burn more calories. Roughly 18 cal/pound IIRC.
How much longer do you have on the cycle? 1-2 weeks? That is still enough time to salvage the cycle and get some decent gains. One of the oldest methods out there that doesnt seem to get discussed a lot here is adding/increasing milk in your diet. If you got a couple of weeks left I say add a gallon of milk a day and then send me a thank you after your cycle!
 

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