What Kind of gear can do this?
01-01-2003 02:27 AM
A good article on synthol and interview if you want to briefly read it, its long, but it does mention Milo's useage of synthol. I bolded it......
Site Enhancement: The Final Word
Part II of II
By Jason Meuller and Trevor Smith
What follows is the second part of the interview I did with Trevor Smith from Nuclear Nutrition on site enhancement. To the best of my knowledge, this is the most comprehensive article ever done on this topic, and should serve as a primer for anyone interested in site enhancement. Having said that, I received numerous emails from people asking me why I had to cover a topic such as this, given that it's clearly detrimental to bodybuilding. Is it? I don't really care whether it is or not, it's not my place to judge. The bottom line is, site enhancement is a part of the sport. We can ignore it, stick our heads in the sand, and hope it goes away, or we can take the bull by the horns and address the issue straight on.
In case you haven't yet noticed, I'm a take the bull by horns kind of guy. For those of you who think that the use of "Pump and Pose" products are going to hurt bodybuilding, wake up!!! The world of sports is all about bigger, stronger, faster. Bodybuilding is no exception. 30 years ago, I'm sure people wondered how in the world bodybuilders could possibly take their development to a higher level. Today we wonder the same thing. 10 years from now, I'm sure the Mr. Olympia of 2010 will make Ronnie Coleman look like the winner of the novice class at the county show. And as bodybuilders continue to push the envelope of human (and chemical) development, bodybuilding will become even more of a cult sport. Would I have it any other way? NO!! I like feeling like I'm a part of a select group of people. Having said that, those of you who think that site enhancement products are the death knell of bodybuilding are sadly mistaken. So you mean Aunt Mary and Uncle Joe won't be taking a trip to the Mr. O this year because those steroid and hormone filled monsters actually had the temerity to artificially inflate muscles using oil? CBS, NBC, and ABC won't be duking it out over the broadcast rights for the Arnold Schwarzenegger Classic to air opposite the Super Bowl? Say it ain't so!
Until the powers that be take steps to ensure that NO competitor is using these products, they're here to stay. And since I really doubt that the IFBB is going to start requiring full body MRI's of each competitor, GET USED TO IT! Quite frankly, I'm hoping some of the pros that are mutilating their body with this stuff will read this article so they can at least have some idea of the proper methodology of site injection. Nuff said, on with the interview…
DISCLAIMER- All of the products referred to in the article are interview are meant for topical use only. Using them in a fashion inconsistent with their labeling probably violates half a dozen local, state, and federal laws. What's discussed in this interview is not meant to be used as a course of action, and is purely for entertainment purposes only. Do not inject any of these products!!
AE: Do you have any personal knowledge of the sterility (or lack of) of any of the site enhancement products on the market? I had a conversation with Deep Injection (one of the writers for Nuclear Nutrition) and he told me that the reason Milos Sarcev almost died was not because he injected directly into a major blood vessel, but because the product he was using was dirty and caused an immediate systemic infection.
Trevor: I believe I covered this in one of your previous questions. As far as sterility of these products, I can only tell you that I have spoken to people who have used Esik-Kleen and everyone of them that I spoke to got an abscess from that ****. One of the pros that use my product, Christian Lobarede, told me that he couldn’t decide which stuff was more useless: The Esik Kleen, or Liquid Muscle. Deep Injection himself got an abscess from the Esik-Kleen as did Milos Sarcev (he also almost died from it). Now I have had the conversation with Deep Injection also that he felt Milos’ problem was not that he main-lined 3cc’s of that Esik-Kleen, but that he had an anaphylactic response to the product because of something that is in it and due to its non-sterility. Deep Injection did tell me that when he first used Esik-Kleen, that he immediately gasped for air the same way Milos described, and had a hard time breathing and the area became very red and swollen and irritated. Now, of course, I cannot prove this, but you and I both know that Deep Injection is not a liar. And Milos himself told me that he had the same reaction after he accidentally shot into his blood stream. Incidentally, had the person who was applying the shot to Milos’ triceps simply drew back, blood will have shot into the barrel of the syringe and he would have known he hit a vein or something. I am not a scientist, but my guess is that Milos’ problem was two-fold. It sounds like Deep Injection is correct in his assertion that Milos had an anaphylactic response to the injection and also, that he encountered problems when he inadvertently injected it into a major blood vessel or vein.
AE: Your product, Site Enhancement Oil Plus, contains the following ingredients: Caprillic Acid, Capric Acid, Shark Oil, Silica, and a super diol stack. What is the purpose of each of these ingredients?
Trevor: Medium chain triglyceride oil is composed of a series of chains of capric and caprillic acids put together. Some of these are 12 octanoic or 8 octanoic…, which basically means they differ in length. Now the higher quality M.C.T. oils contain mostly 8 octanoic and these are best suited for occupying the spaces between muscle fibers and causing the lifting and spreading action I described before. My product contains almost exclusively the 8 octanoic chains in terms of the capric and caprillic acids. My chemist describes the different lengths like gasoline or motor oil grades. Really good high quality M.C.T oil is expensive as hell, whereas you can get cheap **** M.C.T. oil, which is low grade. At the end of the day, they can both be called M.C.T. Oil. I list it as caprillic acid and capric acid so everyone understands that my product contains only the highest quality oil chains and not the stuff you can buy at G.N.C. My product contains benzyl alcohol to further insure sterility and also to act as a mild irritant to cause the muscle fibers to inflame slightly and create more spaces for the oils to occupy. The "super diol stack" is simply a pro-hormone blend. In an ideal world, I would have been able to put in some sustenon and deca, but hey I can’t so I put in the pro-hormone s in the off chance that they may cause localized anabolism and also because pro-hormone s are all the rage today and I wanted to give more bang for the buck. The shark oil was put in there because, again it is a highly clean oil and it is beneficial to the body as well—it too is very ****ing costly--, so I figured why not have an oil that will assist in the lifting and spreading action and actually be beneficial to the body as well.
Silica is added in micro amounts to allow for permanency of the gains made by use of the product. It won’t happen over night, but if used over the long haul, you will get a percentage of the gains that stay behind even after the body metabolizes the capric and caprillic acid and shark oil. Which brings me to a point I want to make. Chris Clark did an interview in MuscleMag which he stated his product would produce gains that last 2-3 years after one application. That is absolute ****ing bull****! I hope everyone realizes this. The body will recognize the oil in the muscle as fat—which is what it is—and it WILL metabolize it. If you ask people who are dieting for a show, they will tell you that they have to use "Pump and Pose" products at larger doses and more frequently because their fast burning metabolisms—due to the strict contest prep—are metabolizing the oils at a much faster rate. Chris Clark also stated in that same interview that "a guy in South Africa with 28 inch arms" used his product exclusively, when in fact I know people who know the guy he is implying but not naming. His name is Jacko Strauss. Yes he has 28 inch arms. They look asinine, but hey to each his own. However, the reality of the situation is that Jacko doesn’t use Chris Clark’s product….he supposedly dumps in 50ml of OLIVE OIL into his arms…every day. Now the guys I spoke with swore to me on that fact, but who the **** knows for sure. He certainly wouldn’t be the first person to do something like that. I just hope to Christ your readers don’t go raiding their mother’s cupboard for the ****ing Bertoli. It is totally unsterile! Chris Clark also implied that he "ran tests on this guy" and that "an M.R.I. showed that his arms were total muscle and that the oils were absorbed into the muscle fibers and just made them bigger." What a ****ing idiot and a liar. Here’s a little inside information. Did you notice Greg Zulak doesn’t write for Muscle Mag anymore? Well the reason is, he had a contract that allowed them to change and dictate what he wrote in his column. Which is why there was all that stupid sex talk and **** in there. So basically, if he said a product sucked, and they wanted to say it was good to suit their own (i.e. Muscle-Tech’s) needs they would change it. Turns out when Greg did the interview with Chris Clark, he thought Chris Clark was a ****ing joke and that whenever Greg asked to see the research and test results he claimed to have done (like the M.R.I. on "the guy with 28 inch arms from South Africa) he conveniently did not have them around and had to go "look for them" Why do I have a feeling they are in the same place as Paul Borreson’s degree in Pharmacology, Biochemistry and Honorary Doctorate?
AE: Let's say someone has a prescription for steroids (like me). I know I get tired of injecting in my glutes, but don't really have any idea of where to put the oil in other body parts, specifically my calves, biceps, triceps, and deltoids. Can you explain to me exactly where I would need to inject in each of these body parts? And are there any other body parts I should consider injecting?
Trevor: First of all I need to make if perfectly clear that what matters most when doing site injections, whether it is with real gear or something like Site Enhancement Oil Plus (even though I sell the product for external use only) is the LENGTH OF THE NEEDLE! Remember the "lifting" action we talked about before, in order to achieve that you have to get down low into the belly of the muscle. For this a minimum of a 1-inch needle is necessary, although I personally would recommend a 1.5-inch, as it will get deeper and lift more from the bottom. Remember you want muscle pushed up, you don’t want oil sitting on top of the muscle. People get squeamish when doing site injections for some reason and try to lessen the trauma by using a short pin. The end result is that water balloon effect with absolutely no definition showing. My suggestion is that if you are bothered by the injections, use a smaller gauge like a 23 or even a 25. It will take longer to inject the oil, but will cause less scar tissue and will not hurt as much.
O.K. let’s start with the biceps. What you want to do is understand that when you flex the muscle, whether you have a short head, or a long head to your biceps, the muscle will be at it’s densest and most concentrated in the "peak" of the biceps. THIS IS THE ONLY PLACE THE INJECTION SHOULD EVER GO: A: BECAUSE THAT IS WHERE THE MOST MUSCLE TISSUE IS WHICH WILL ALLOW YOU TO GO DEEPER AND GET A BETTER LIFTING EFFECT AND B: BECAUSE IT WILL FALL IN LINE WITH THE GENETIC DESIGN OF YOUR BICEPS. So you simply flex your arm, locate the peak, relax the arm and lay it out on a table in front of you, and go straight down into the area you marked as the "peak". People are always trying to change the shape of the arm that they were born with rather than just trying to make the shape they were born with big as ****ing hell. So what if you don’t have high peaks, Sergio had ****ty peaks, but his arms were ****ing awesome and full. And so what if you arms aren’t awesome and full and you have a short head with a higher peak, that is what Ronnie Coleman and Robbie Robinson’s arms are like…..except they made their arms ****ing huge. People try injecting into the peak, on the inside of the biceps, on the outside of the biceps, on the inside down low by the insertion and on the outside down low by the insertion. Guess what, at the end of the day it looks like they had a water balloon implanted into their arm. Only go into the peak of the biceps. People with small arms should start off with 2-3ml while people who have some meat there can go 3-5ml
The Triceps: Now you can use two places here, but you should only focus mostly on the "peak" of the triceps…which is to say the big lateral head of the triceps. So what you do is flex your arm in the mirror again, and locate the peak of the triceps, which is the polar opposite of the biceps peak. You have a friend mark it with their finger, and then let the arm hang by your side. Your friend will then go in from behind of you and perform the injection, going straight into the area he marked as the "peak" of the triceps. Again, people with small arms should start off with 2-3ml while people who have some meat there can go 3-5ml. You can also do the very upper most part of the horseshoe of the triceps. This you can perform yourself, although because you are dealing with a very small muscle that is already close to the surface, you can get away with using a shorter needle….but this is the only area that you can do so with. Also, do not use more than 1-1.5 ml in this area because it is so small.
The Lateral Delt: Yes you can do the front and rear delts, but I only suggest doing the lateral delt because it is what is responsible in giving you the "capped" look to your shoulders that you are trying to achieve. Also, the rear delt is a very small muscle that is so vital to the movement of the arm, that it is not wise to cause a lot of micro-trauma in the form of injections as it can result in a tear which can put an end to your career as a bodybuilder real fast. So, we will focus on the lateral delt. Now with your arm hanging straight down at your side, simply trace your clavicle with your other hand all the way to the end until you come to the shoulder joint, which you can feel with your fingers. Now just past the shoulder joint is the wonderful, fleshy lateral delt. This is the ONLY place a smart person will inject anything because you will not hit any nerves here and there is a pocket there (provided by mother nature) that is the perfect spot to shoot in your gear or oils. Therefore, to insure that you get under that lateral delt and into this pocket, you want to go straight down into the area just past the shoulder joint with your pin as if someone dropped a needle from the ceiling. Because this is a larger muscle (hopefully) you can go 3-5ml.
The calves: Now understand that if you are not used to doing site injections into your calves that you will have a hard time walking after you do so for the first time. Sitting in a chair, you would simply go into both the inside and outside of the calf muscle. Straight in, with the needle parallel to the floor. Keep the amounts at 1-2ml for the inside and 1-2ml for the outside of the calf.
As far as any other places to go, I will share a little known fact with you and your readers. Lee Haney used to take all of his shots and put them into his pecs. Basically the way you would do this is you would flex your pecs as if you were doing a side chest and mark the area in the upper chest where the pec bunches up the most. Then relax and inject into the area with the needle parallel to your body. Since you are automatically getting under the majority of the muscle injecting this way, you need only go in about an inch…maybe even less. You can do the same thing in the lower chest…just be sure to go right above the nipple line.
AE: I know your product is meant for topical use only, but I've heard that people are actually injecting it! Although this is a horrible misuse of your product, what kind of frequency and volume of injections are you hearing that people have used?
Trevor: Pray-tell….is that true?!! Are they actually injecting my Site Enhancement Oil Plus and achieving 2-3 inch gains or more in their biceps, triceps, calves and delts? Oh my god!
Well, if one were to do such a thing. They would follow the above procedures I described and would do so in the following fashion.
Week 1: 3-5 times per week (depending on pain threshold) to build up the levels anywhere from 2-5mls depending on size of the arm and experience. Also, the calves should only be done once or twice in this first week due to the pain associated with walking after doing them.
Weeks 2- 8: Twice a week (except calves..only once per week) using 3-5mls again depending on the size of the arm and experience
At this point it would be wise to give your body a rest for a good 4 weeks although you and I both know that some people do not bother doing so. But those who are smart always give their bodies a break. No matter what it is they are doing. It should also be noted that it would be smart to always do your site injections AFTER YOU TRAINED THAT PARTICULAR BODYPART or a couple of days before. So if you train biceps on Tuesday, you would do your first injection after you trained biceps on Tuesday night and then your next injection say Thursday or Friday or Saturday or Sunday.
AE: One of the most interesting theories I've seen proposed was in the interview with Chris Clark you mentioned. Do you think there is any possibility that heavy use of SEO will lead to permanent gains in size over time? As I told you, I've had many conversations with Chris Clark, and the guy definitely has the P.T. Barnum mentality (There's a sucker born every minute). However, it just seems to me that by injecting huge amounts of oil over months and months, it would cause a stretching of the muscle tissue that would induce permanent growth. What are your thoughts on this?
Trevor: Well as I explained with my product, the inclusion of silica will mean that even after the oil gets metabolized, you will have a percentage of gains that will stay. But you do have to use it for a while; you can’t just use one bottle and expect to get the permanent results. As you stated, the stretching of the tissue will induce permanent size increases and growth….the same way if I put you on a procrustean bed ( a Medieval torture device designed to stretch a person to death) you would gain a few inches in height.
AE: I think there's a general misconception out there about how much product it takes to see significant gains. For example, I went through an entire bottle of site enhancement oil and only gained 1/2 on each arm. We're always hearing stories of bodybuilders adding 2-3 inches on their arms with this stuff. Realistically, what kind of use are we talking about to see those kind of gains? And, once those gains are achieved, what kind of maintenance schedule is necessary to keep the increase in size?
Trevor: Well you have to understand that everyone is different. Since you have some meat on your arms already, you will have more area to put oil into and need more to have it disperse through the tissue and cause the lift and stretch. Therefore, one bottle might only result in a smaller gain. However, someone with 16-inch arms can gain 2-3 inches off of one bottle because it has such a dramatic impact on the smaller arm. I mean if you weigh 300 lbs. and gain 10 pounds, it is not going to be as noticeable than if someone weighs 100 pounds and gain 10 pounds. The 10 pounds on the 100 pound person represents a 10% bodyweight gain….whereas the 300lb person would have to gain 30lbs to achieve the same look. I hope that makes sense. It is the same with the Site Enhancement Oil Plus in relation to arm size. I have people—Deep Injection included—that have got dramatic results just from one bottle. Deep injection’s arm literally was up 2 inches within 3 weeks. However, he continued with the use of the Site Enhancement Oil Plus 2-3 times per week for a period of 2 and a half to 3 months though and now he is literally maintaining his gains with one 5ml application once every other week. So I would say to get the 2-3 inch gains, one would need to go at least 8 weeks and depending on the size of the arm use 3-5ml per application at least twice a week, although loading in the first week 3-5 times into the desired area.
AE: When I was using the SEO, my arms looked very watery and soft. This is despite the fact that I as injecting using a 1.5" needle. However, about a week after I stopped using the product, the extra fluid dissipated, but the additional size did not. My arms looked as hard as ever, but now were 21" instead of their previous 20.5". Is this common, and what would be the physiological mechanism for this?
Trevor: Again, and I am not trying to cop out with an easy answer, but everyone is different. Everyone’s body reacts in a different manner and while I am no doctor, I believe that the reason you experienced the “watery” effect is do not to the product itself, but rather to the whole injection process. You see, your body interprets an injection the same way it interprets a stab wound from a “Rambo” style combat knife. Basically, although it is on a much smaller scale, the body thinks it’s been wounded because it has. There are a whole host of physiological responses that the body triggers when this happens such as swelling and fluid retention to keep the problem contained and allow the body’s repair and defense mechanisms to go to work. I can only speculate then that this what you were experiencing. As soon as you stopped the injections, the body was no longer experiencing trauma to the area on a continual basis and was given time to heal the “stab wounds”. Once this happened the edema to the area subsided. Now is this a common occurrence? Not with everyone, but I would have to think since we are all similar biologically that it does occur in a percentage of the people.
AE: Trevor, I'd just like to thank you for your candor and willingness to discuss this topic. I personally think this is one of the best articles that we've ever done for Anabolic Extreme, and it wouldn’t have been possible without your help.
Trevor: It was my pleasure. I hope your readers find the information we've covered useful in some way.
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01-01-2003 02:50 AM
01-01-2003 02:55 AM
I didn't doubt wojo after he said he read about it in Flex. I just thought this was a rumor that was floating around. I have lost some respect for Milos after seeing this. He has been one of my all time favorites.
01-01-2003 03:17 AM
milos is a very intelligent guy..he does consultations over the phone through qfac..even has a few years of med school behind him i guess he got sick of being overlooked and tried to get his..i still respect the guy myself but that did make me look at him diffrerntly
01-02-2003 02:31 PM
Homebrew Help, Inc.
Thise stretch marks look awsoem.. What a loser..... Talk to ya...
01-11-2003 03:33 PM
01-12-2003 05:44 PM
For anyone interested, this is the website
of the guy in the picture.
01-13-2003 01:33 AM
I think this just about sums up modern competitive body-building. Never mind symmetry, forget aesthetics, quality - who needs that? Just get freaky big and get some attention.
With the likes of Frank Zane & Al Beccles etc, we could have more than one body-type on stage, and they would both be something to aspire to.
This is just bloody stupidity.
01-13-2003 01:49 AM
read this **** and laugh from bicepmania
05-25-2003 07:45 AM
i would be embarrased to look like that retard, everyone knows there is nothing real about those retarded looking arms. no thanks ill take my puny 16's ...........
07-06-2003 05:03 PM
07-06-2003 07:56 PM
I once knew a homeless guy in Miami that had elephantitus of the nuts and he would ride around on a beat up beach cruiser with his nuts hanging over the sides of the seats almost touching the pedals. Nuts like cantalope! We asked him why he used to let his nuts blow in the breeze like that and he would drukenly say "because its cool". Little did he know. This clown reminds me of how stupid some people can really be.
His arms look like inoperable tumors that have grown out of control. You know what I mean. Like when a little homeless dog or something runs up to you and you think it would make a cool pet till it turns around and you see some god awful growth on it. Thats what this guys arms look like. GOD-AWFUL GROWTHS!!!
Cut those ****ing things off and donate them to science.
Look at this ****, strugling on 55's. I see more veins on his head then his arms.
HAAAAAA, I hate criticizing too, but damn.
07-06-2003 08:02 PM
Why wont pics post? I guess cause hes making everyone sick. Ohh well check link for more dumbass.
07-06-2003 08:32 PM
07-06-2003 09:25 PM
heh, this guy actually thinks he looks good? wtf???
lookin at those pics from that link, u can tell he has an ego the size of the continent of Africa. makes me wanna jump into the screen and slap the $hit out of em.
i hate people like that. even in the gym if i see a bigger guy trying to sike out a beginner, ill step in and make him look like a dumbass. theres not a reason in the world why u should even consider shooting synthol. nonetheless show it off an try to be hardcore. can anybody say "mental counseling"?
07-06-2003 10:25 PM
someone needs to post the picture of the guys bicep that blew up becase of synthol
07-06-2003 10:45 PM
I love his store and how he says I don't use it but I sale ithttp://www.bicepmania.net/index.cfm?pageID=6
07-07-2003 04:03 AM
that guy looks like ****. It just looks like a balloon in his bicept, no cut at all. when that swelling goes away hes gonna have the worst strech marks.
why not just earn your **** the real way?
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