New Gel Penetration Enhancers??
07-23-2003 12:22 AM
Last edited by chosen5; 08-02-2003 at 11:11 PM.
07-23-2003 08:27 AM
Brewing Anabolic Minds
First, let me address your toxiticity/carcinogen question:
- OSHA has specified a PEL (permissible exposure limit, skin) to be 30 mg/m2. Each squirt from an LG brew will deliver ~18 mg so we are within limits. Keep in mind, OSHA sets the limits based on an assumed occupation with constant exposure so they feel as though 30 mg on the skin is acceptable and we have used about half of that amount (18 mg).
- The compound is listed in group 2B ("possible carcinogen") and does not meet the criteria for a select carcinogen. One fact you're not taking into account in those studies that indicate a carcinogenic effect is the amount of exposure as well as the length of exposure. Look a little deeper and you will find that the extremely high levels maintained for extended times are used to INDUCE the activity. Bottom line is don't take a bath in DMFA and definitely don't fall asleep in the tub if you do!
- For a moment let's compare the sides associated with our old friend DMSO:
may cause vomiting, chills, headache, and dizziness...vomiting, abdominal pain, and lethargy...itching, scaling, and a transient burning sensation...irritation with redness, pain, and blurred vision...Chronic exposure to dimethyl sulfoxide can cause damage to the cornea of the eye.
Yet it is used daily to great success given the proper ratio and the fact most do not overused or abuse it....DMFA is the same. It lists the possible bad effects as a matter of convention and it is up to you to sort through and determine the amount that is acceptable to you so as to eliminate or reduce the possibility of replicating those bad sides.
Would you let some bro say, "I gained 40 pounds of mass in a 12 week cycle!" without questioning him as to what he was on and how much? My point here is not only is the effect of great importance but also the dose. In the case of DMFA, look at the studies and compare the exposure amounts and length of time to what would be typical of an LG brew. You will see the amounts are not even in the same ballpark...hell, not even in the same world. I have seen one study go as high as 40,000 mg of exposure for a RAT for weeks at a time before carcinogenic activity was recorded. My only question is HOW THEY GOT 40 GRAMS OF DMFA ON A RAT?? That is over 42 mL of pure DMFA...there is not enough skin area on a rat unless it were forced to literally swim in it! Use these numbers as your baseline for comparison: .18 mg applied, 5 minutes exposure time
If you have any questions ask them quick since I will be gone after Friday with only sporadic visitation on the board.
07-23-2003 08:44 AM
Thanks Chemo!! Vivid explanation once again! We are going to miss your wisdom around these parts. Already looking forward to your return.
Part of the Taurus Nutrition team.
AnabolicEffects.com- the pursuit of the anabolic life.
07-23-2003 09:26 AM
Well I thought the new formula also has Octyl Salicylate in it. Is there any chance we could get the recipe for the new formula before you leave?? The beta testing looks to be going pretty well.
07-23-2003 10:29 AM
Last edited by chosen5; 08-02-2003 at 11:08 PM.
07-23-2003 10:42 AM
Last edited by chosen5; 08-02-2003 at 11:10 PM.
07-23-2003 11:02 AM
Last edited by chosen5; 08-02-2003 at 11:09 PM.
07-23-2003 01:12 PM
Interesting to say the least! I remember chemo saying he bought it by gram or something so i was thinking it was a powder. DMSO isn't supposed to be used as this stuff is supposed to cause no irritation and have a even better absorbtion rate that dmso would.
07-23-2003 01:32 PM
Last edited by chosen5; 08-02-2003 at 11:14 PM.
07-23-2003 01:37 PM
Well, I hope another big difference is that it doesn't make your breath smell like a$$ like DMSO does. That is my main reason for wanting to try it.
07-23-2003 01:43 PM
Last edited by chosen5; 08-02-2003 at 11:12 PM.
07-23-2003 01:43 PM
FYI - one of the new PE's has been clinically proven to be 150% as effective as DMSO. - Another quote from bdc Originally posted by Chemo I need twenty volunteers to test the new recipe.&nbsp; The formula is COMPLETELY re-engineered for MAXIMUM effectiveness.&nbsp; I have included two penetration enhancers that exceed or meet the increased absorption that&nbsp;is realized by accidental spills of other solvents into the bottle!&nbsp; Unfortunately, they also meet or exceed the skin irritability as well.
So, I need the volunteers to provide feedback with respect to the original recipe.&nbsp; Areas of particular interest are skin irritation and effectiveness when compared to the original line of products.
I will be offering 4 oz. versions of T-1 PRO (5 grams 1-test/2.5 grams 4-AD in 120 mL lotion) so that most can compare apples to apples.&nbsp; Even though I would love to offer these free of charge&nbsp;I can't do that...since the new PE's are sold on a gram basis and are more expensive than the current market rate of gold!&nbsp; The original T-1 PRO member price was ~$70 so this beta will be sold for $35 (half) + $5 for the new PE's = $40 (free shipping though)
To the&nbsp;bros that want to take that step to a higher level of performance...take a step forward.&nbsp; Post your reservation in this thread.
I will need past experience with BDC lotions, current cycle plan, cycle goals, current stats, and diet.
The beta testers will be briefed as to the new ingredients and recipe with a full explanation of what each does for the formula.&nbsp; I will also include personal hints, tips, and tricks to increase effectiveness beyond that which is afforded by the new recipe.
I thought i read that a user was experiencing not irritation that's why i posted that. Forgot what was originally posted.
07-23-2003 01:45 PM
Sorry meant to highlight this :
since the new PE's are sold on a gram basis and are more expensive than the current market rate of gold!&
07-23-2003 01:53 PM
Last edited by chosen5; 08-02-2003 at 11:20 PM.
07-23-2003 01:54 PM
Last edited by chosen5; 08-02-2003 at 11:23 PM.
07-23-2003 02:08 PM
Reading through studies give me a head ache lol. I just like to hear from someone posting about the article as they tend to speak english hehe. I doubt he gave different bottles out as everyone reacts different to different things, the purpose of the beta is to directly compare to old t1 pro.I think 1-test is what causes the most irritation to begin with the i've been running transdermal right now for three weeks with no irritation (also very little isopropyl). 1-test just burns like a mofo but most will just figure it's from dmso.
07-24-2003 02:14 PM
Homebrew Help, Inc.
You wil get no smell with the DMFA. From the reports back the irritaion is signifigantly lower than the DMSO. Also it is a powder. The stuff you found chosen has been liquified I guess somehow. Maybe disolved in ISO or something. Hopefully chemo will post the exact recipe before he goes.. TTY
07-24-2003 03:14 PM
Last edited by chosen5; 08-02-2003 at 11:24 PM.
07-24-2003 03:19 PM
Homebrew Help, Inc.
he was waiting for all the feedback to come in. Then he was called up. I think the last of the input came in this week. I think he was waiting on Npursuit's feedback and I know that it is positive.. TTY
07-30-2003 08:18 AM
I am just wondering if Chemo or any of the beta testers (that were supposed to be told of all the ingredients) have released the new recipe. I assume all the feedback was good.
Anyone have the recipe??
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