Concerned with hair loss for next cycle

Tom 185

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I was planning on running a cycle like this:

750 Enanthate 1-13
500 EQ 1-12
40 Dianabol 1-5
((1mg Finasteride ED))

I am very concerned with hair loss so I was thinking of replacing the dianabol with some test prop 1-4 at 100mg eod, since finasteride doesn't block androgenic steroids..

any suggestions for a difference jumpstarter or alternative method?
 

same_old

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I was planning on running a cycle like this:

750 Enanthate 1-13
500 EQ 1-12
40 Dianabol 1-5
((1mg Finasteride ED))

I am very concerned with hair loss so I was thinking of replacing the dianabol with some test prop 1-4 at 100mg eod, since finasteride doesn't block androgenic steroids..

any suggestions for a difference jumpstarter or alternative method?
try tbol instead - it only reacts with 5AR a very small amount. still get goos gains from it though.

careful with the EQ - it is not affected by finasteride and for me at least, causes itchiness which leads to hairloss.

1mg finasteride ED is probably not enough to handle 750mg of test/week. try 3 or 5mg.

do you know if you are prone?
 

neverstop

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i've heard from some reputable bros on here that superdrol is pretty easy on the scalp,

5mg of finasteride is a ton, i had no idea people were taking that much...
 
xxtruxx1

xxtruxx1

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Waaaay too much Finasteride. I would shy away from Fina, there are some very negative side effects that come along with it's use. Superdrol is easy on the hairline, but I also had no problems with Test Prop. Both gave a slightly itchy scalp, but nothing out of this world. I also didn't really notice any increased shedding that I can remember. I'm prone to MPB in case you're wondering.
 

same_old

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Waaaay too much Finasteride. I would shy away from Fina, there are some very negative side effects that come along with it's use. Superdrol is easy on the hairline, but I also had no problems with Test Prop. Both gave a slightly itchy scalp, but nothing out of this world. I also didn't really notice any increased shedding that I can remember. I'm prone to MPB in case you're wondering.
we'll have to agree to disagree on the finasteride use, but the simple fact that you got itchy from test prop indicates that your circulating DHT was too high. when i run test i run it with .5mg dutasteride ED and i get NO itchiness, but still plenty of libido (test itself can support libido, even without DHT present)

i do agree though, that superdrol is strangely easy on the hairline. by it's structure i would think it'd be awful, but with the short duration of use it never seems to do any damage, as we know it takes a little while for androgens to actually degrade the follicles.
 
TeamSavage

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Waaaay too much Finasteride.
Why is that way too much finasteride? That (1mg) is the standard dose when it's prescribed as Propecia. Older men taking it as Proscar for BPH take 5mg daily, 5x that amount.
 

Tom 185

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yes i am prone

i ran four cycles before

1- 500 enanthate for 10 weeks
2- 500 enanthate and 300 eq for 10 and 9 weeks
3- Sust250 EOD for 10 weeks with superdrol 30mg for 4 weeks
4- 720 enanthate for 12 weeks, superdrol 40mg for 3 weeks

i just started seeing 5-10 hairs in my hands every time i looked at them while shampooing and rinsing them out during the end of the forth cycle

so tbol or sd?
 
TeamSavage

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I am prone to hair loss, and I didn't notice any shedding or itchiness while on Superdrol at 10/20/20/20. I was using minox (Rogaine) and Nizoral shampoo. In fact, I didn't notice any androgenic side effects except slightly increased libido.

I did notice itchiness and shedding while taking 4AD/1-test and M1T, so I would say Superdrol was very hair-friendly in my case. Hope that helps.
 
xxtruxx1

xxtruxx1

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Why is that way too much finasteride? That (1mg) is the standard dose when it's prescribed as Propecia. Older men taking it as Proscar for BPH take 5mg daily, 5x that amount.
I meant that the 5mg was too much for prevention sake when considering pros vs. cons (hair loss prevention characteristics of Finasteride vs. associated sides). Either way, Finasteride is not the most effective way to inhibit DHT in the scalp. There are more effective ways, which also have less sides, (topical Spiro for one) to inhibit DHT only in the scalp. I would check the Hair Loss Prevention Thread. Lots of good info in there.
 
TeamSavage

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I meant that the 5mg was too much for prevention sake when considering pros vs. cons
His post is showing 1mg ED, not 5mg. Perhaps he edited his post?

I agree that 5mg ED is too much... that dose can significantly increase estrogen levels, and may cause too much suppression of DHT.
 
motiv8er

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I personally didn't like finasteride. It slaughter my midnight pony. Do we know the effectiveness vs absorbtion for fina taken transdermally on the scalp? I would make sure you experiment what dose works for you, the lower the better. DHT has some bad qualities, but some really good ones too!! Not just for bodybuilding... My Dad is a brilliant old Doc and we have had the discussion before about what role dht plays in gene expression. Good luck!
 
wastedwhiteboy2

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fina kills my libido too. but it works better than anything topical for me. I get hair regrowth from it. I am at 1mg and working my way down from there. I did not realize it has such short a half life compared to duta.
 
swoody

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Superdrol is great for those concerned about hairloss... I am one of them. Ran the usual 10-20-20 cycle with topical spiro 5% and 5 mg of finasteride... actually had LESS hairloss than off cycle:jaw: 5 mg is a bit much for off cycle, but while on, alot of compounds supress libido anyway, so might as well be safe then sorry...
 

same_old

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I meant that the 5mg was too much for prevention sake when considering pros vs. cons (hair loss prevention characteristics of Finasteride vs. associated sides). Either way, Finasteride is not the most effective way to inhibit DHT in the scalp. There are more effective ways, which also have less sides, (topical Spiro for one) to inhibit DHT only in the scalp. I would check the Hair Loss Prevention Thread. Lots of good info in there.
topical spiro can be LADEN with sides. look for the thread posted by the guy who had bloodwork done while on Dr.X's topical spiro - it absolutely killed his natty T production.

5mg is by no means an outrageous amount to use while on cycle. your own testimony that you had itchiness on just test prop should be clear enough.

as for libido - finasteride wrecks mine too - OFF cycle. when i've got upwards of 850mg/week in me though, i still bother the **** out of my girlfriend the whole cycle. i wouldnt recommend using finasteride off cycle in any quantity more than 1mg, and that's only if you dont get the sides. i am personally in PCT of my cycle and am REgrowing lost hair - no sh1t - with 1mg finasteride (i am more using it for the HCG-generated test surges i would get the first week but this is a big plus)
 
xxtruxx1

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topical spiro can be LADEN with sides. look for the thread posted by the guy who had bloodwork done while on Dr.X's topical spiro - it absolutely killed his natty T production.

5mg is by no means an outrageous amount to use while on cycle. your own testimony that you had itchiness on just test prop should be clear enough.

as for libido - finasteride wrecks mine too - OFF cycle. when i've got upwards of 850mg/week in me though, i still bother the **** out of my girlfriend the whole cycle. i wouldnt recommend using finasteride off cycle in any quantity more than 1mg, and that's only if you dont get the sides. i am personally in post cycle therapy of my cycle and am REgrowing lost hair - no sh1t - with 1mg finasteride (i am more using it for the HCG-generated test surges i would get the first week but this is a big plus)
Test Prop/Tren Ace. Currently I'm only on Test Prop & the very SLIGHT itchiness is still present.
 

Tom 185

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no i didnt edit my post at all...ive been using nizoral and saw palmetto for the past 2 years and now i want to add 1mg finasteride on and off cycle...i am just concerned with taking dbol and the finasteride only helping with the dht from the test, therefore making no progress with reduced hair loss
 

same_old

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no i didnt edit my post at all...ive been using nizoral and saw palmetto for the past 2 years and now i want to add 1mg finasteride on and off cycle...i am just concerned with taking dbol and the finasteride only helping with the dht from the test, therefore making no progress with reduced hair loss
this is a little tricky and not altogether agreed-upon situation with dbol and 5AR inhibitors. my personal understanding is that dbol, like boldenone its base hormone, has very little, if any affinity for 5AR. it will however reduce via 5BR to what are basically analogs of M1T, which is quite androgenic (and bold will reduce to a 1T variant, of course - also androgenic)

i have personally used dutasteride with EQ and dbol, and i found that it didnt work for either if the doses were even reasonably high (>350mg/week EQ, >30mg/d dbol)...for me, the best solution is test and superdrol or tbol. i think i have one of the most sensitive scalps ever and can tell when i am going to have problems (took me a week on max LMG, about 5 days on MDHT, about 2 weeks on 1ad, 4-5 days on anadrol, 3 days on bold base transdermal, etc etc to get the itchies)

anywho - superdrol and tbol are better options than dbol, IMO. SD is harsher by most estimates, and you wont get the mild euphoria some get from dbol, but for fast lean mass and little hairline impact, it's a winner. if you're insitent on several weeks of oral use, go with tbol. it takes a bit longer but it's the closest thing to a perfect steroid i've encountered.
 

Tom 185

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interesting, i never considered tbol but i'm liking what i've been reading about it...ill see if my source can get some...what are the optimum doses and lengths of use?
 
swoody

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topical spiro can be LADEN with sides. look for the thread posted by the guy who had bloodwork done while on Dr.X's topical spiro - it absolutely killed his natty T production.

5mg is by no means an outrageous amount to use while on cycle. your own testimony that you had itchiness on just test prop should be clear enough.

as for libido - finasteride wrecks mine too - OFF cycle. when i've got upwards of 850mg/week in me though, i still bother the **** out of my girlfriend the whole cycle. i wouldnt recommend using finasteride off cycle in any quantity more than 1mg, and that's only if you dont get the sides. i am personally in post cycle therapy of my cycle and am REgrowing lost hair - no sh1t - with 1mg finasteride (i am more using it for the HCG-generated test surges i would get the first week but this is a big plus)
I have heard that topical spiro can have that effect, but I SWEAR there are some other threads around here that state the opposite... I'm just too lazy to post my sources right now:D But if topical spiro does in fact drop t levels, I usually only run it while on cycle when my natural t is gonna be supressed anyway...
 

same_old

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I have heard that topical spiro can have that effect, but I SWEAR there are some other threads around here that state the opposite... I'm just too lazy to post my sources right now:D But if topical spiro does in fact drop t levels, I usually only run it while on cycle when my natural t is gonna be supressed anyway...
no no no - you mistake spiro's action. spiro is an anti-androgen. it will reduce SERUM T, not intratesticular T...so using it on cycle, if one is to believe the rather compelling evidence of the bloodwork results that were posted, would be ill-advised.

the clinical trials for topical spiro were successful - no systemic effects, but that's with a novel carrier that nobody can even identify. apparently Dr.X's stuff permeates the skin and gets systemic. i personally use the thick cream from WSHCP and mix it with oil and/or glycerin - i can be relatively sure it doesnt absorb much, if at all, using that carrier.
 
swoody

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no no no - you mistake spiro's action. spiro is an anti-androgen. it will reduce SERUM T, not intratesticular T...so using it on cycle, if one is to believe the rather compelling evidence of the bloodwork results that were posted, would be ill-advised.

the clinical trials for topical spiro were successful - no systemic effects, but that's with a novel carrier that nobody can even identify. apparently Dr.X's stuff permeates the skin and gets systemic. i personally use the thick cream from WSHCP and mix it with oil and/or glycerin - i can be relatively sure it doesnt absorb much, if at all, using that carrier.
I know that spiro is an anti-androgen... which is exactly why I used it during my cycle of superdrol, since superdrol is not very androgenic and doesn't negate its effects. I put on 11 lbs of lbm while using it on cycle, am in my 4th week of pct and recovering very nicely:) And I didn't get my spiro from Dr. X, I got it from the same place you did... so my opinion is that for some people, it can pose a problem... with others, it doesn't, just like with any compound... I just happen to be one of those people who it didn't effect in a negative way. Systemic spiro would indeed raise concern, but if that was the case with my I'm sure I'd be feeling it and not recovering as well as I am...
 

same_old

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I know that spiro is an anti-androgen... which is exactly why I used it during my cycle of superdrol, since superdrol is not very androgenic and doesn't negate its effects. I put on 11 lbs of lbm while using it on cycle, am in my 4th week of post cycle therapy and recovering very nicely:) And I didn't get my spiro from Dr. X, I got it from the same place you did... so my opinion is that for some people, it can pose a problem... with others, it doesn't, just like with any compound... I just happen to be one of those people who it didn't effect in a negative way. Systemic spiro would indeed raise concern, but if that was the case with my I'm sure I'd be feeling it and not recovering as well as I am...
LOL - "anti-androgen" doesnt mean "negates only androgenic effects" - it means that it negates ANDROGEN effects, as in STEROID effects. test is an androgen. superdrol is an androgen. they're all androgens. which is why spiro made the guy's SERUM T drop so much and didnt just decrease acne and aggression, etc....

anyway, like you i found the WSHCP stuff didnt do much systemically. did you use the paste or the solution?
 
TripDog

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Superdrol is great for those concerned about hairloss... I am one of them. Ran the usual 10-20-20 cycle with topical spiro 5% and 5 mg of finasteride... actually had LESS hairloss than off cycle:jaw: 5 mg is a bit much for off cycle, but while on, alot of compounds supress libido anyway, so might as well be safe then sorry...
thats kinda funny,I did a halodrol/mega zol cycle,and the hair loss issue was better then when i ran activate/rebound xt.figure that sheit out.
 
swoody

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thats kinda funny,I did a halodrol/mega zol cycle,and the hair loss issue was better then when i ran activate/rebound xt.figure that sheit out.

Same with me when I tried activate bro...:blink: Even though it is a mild increase, for people who are suseptible to androgenic sides, an increase in free T would result in more hairloss, which sucks for poor bastards like you and I:frustrate But megaZOL?!? weird... I would think that would make your shed a HELL of alot more than activate... :wtf:
 
swoody

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LOL - "anti-androgen" doesnt mean "negates only androgenic effects" - it means that it negates ANDROGEN effects, as in STEROID effects. test is an androgen. superdrol is an androgen. they're all androgens. which is why spiro made the guy's SERUM T drop so much and didnt just decrease acne and aggression, etc....

anyway, like you i found the WSHCP stuff didnt do much systemically. did you use the paste or the solution?

NOW I see what your sayin... I was going strictly from anabolic/androgenic ratios when describing SD... so just a little bit of miscommunication.

I just used the paste... wasn't pretty, but it worked fine for me...
 
TeamSavage

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thats kinda funny,I did a halodrol/mega zol cycle,and the hair loss issue was better then when i ran activate/rebound xt.figure that sheit out.
Interesting... The increase in free test from ActivaTe+RXT probably leads to a proportional increase in DHT... perhaps even a greater than proportional increase since testosterone can no longer aromatize into estrogen. (Something similar happens when taking finasteride to prevent conversion to DHT. Test only increases slightly but estrogen can increase significantly.) Since DHT is so androgenic, it's not completely surprising that this might present more androgenic sides more than taking Halodrol, which I believe is not very androgenic.

If you're looking for anabolism rather than strength, perhaps adding finasteride to the ActivaTe+RXT stack could increase results even more...
 
wastedwhiteboy2

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activate+rxt+fina is pretty much my pct. + a few other supps.
 
TripDog

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Same with me when I tried activate bro...:blink: Even though it is a mild increase, for people who are suseptible to androgenic sides, an increase in free T would result in more hairloss, which sucks for poor bastards like you and I:frustrate But megaZOL?!? weird... I would think that would make your shed a HELL of alot more than activate... :wtf:
I stopped the zol after a week just to be safe...so it was pretty much just a halo cycle.
 

dobebrief

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I was planning on running a cycle like this:

750 Enanthate 1-13
500 EQ 1-12
40 Dianabol 1-5
((1mg Finasteride ED))

I am very concerned with hair loss so I was thinking of replacing the dianabol with some test prop 1-4 at 100mg eod, since finasteride doesn't block androgenic steroids..

any suggestions for a difference jumpstarter or alternative method?
If you are concerned with hairloss then you should not even consider test, it is far worse than dianabol unless test prop itself is mild.
 

Tom 185

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If you are concerned with hairloss then you should not even consider test, it is far worse than dianabol unless test prop itself is mild.
ive already ran 4 test cycles...this is an old thread now anyway
 

dobebrief

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no i didnt edit my post at all...ive been using nizoral and saw palmetto for the past 2 years and now i want to add 1mg finasteride on and off cycle...i am just concerned with taking dbol and the finasteride only helping with the dht from the test, therefore making no progress with reduced hair loss
Im getting ready to do a dbol only cycle whilst on dutasteride, i only hope that i may not need to up the duta dose, kind of expensive you see, i hope it will be enough to take out enough dht from the dbol.
 

Tom 185

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Im getting ready to do a dbol only cycle whilst on dutasteride, i only hope that i may not need to up the duta dose, kind of expensive you see, i hope it will be enough to take out enough dht from the dbol.
it wont...i would look into spironolactone if i were you...and u probably already know but it's not good to run dbol only cycles...if you must run a non-injectible cycle then try superdrol
 

dobebrief

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it wont...i would look into spironolactone if i were you...and u probably already know but it's not good to run dbol only cycles...if you must run a non-injectible cycle then try superdrol
Superdrol's only a supplement but acts like a steroid, oh and it's more than a prohormone as well. I don't get it.
 

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no no no - you mistake spiro's action. spiro is an anti-androgen. it will reduce SERUM T, not intratesticular T...so using it on cycle, if one is to believe the rather compelling evidence of the bloodwork results that were posted, would be ill-advised.

the clinical trials for topical spiro were successful - no systemic effects, but that's with a novel carrier that nobody can even identify. apparently Dr.X's stuff permeates the skin and gets systemic. i personally use the thick cream from WSHCP and mix it with oil and/or glycerin - i can be relatively sure it doesnt absorb much, if at all, using that carrier.
What kind of oil do you use to mix the spiro? I have the distinct feeling that I will be back on it very soon.
 

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