TST/TRN/ZOL...just throwing it out there.

[PumpingIron]

I'm just trying to start compiling a calendar for my next cycle. I was thinking these three compounds have a very good track record of working together, and all see to have been used very effectively during cutters. This is going to be a contest prep cycle.

I was planning on running it for 6 weeks and have the contest fall in the middle of the 6th week. Here are the doses I have come up with. Now this is just an idea, so lets not go jumping down my throat if I'm off base...

TRN: 2/4/4/6/0/0
TST: 2/4/4/6/0/0
ZOL: 0/0/100/100/150/150

What are your oppinions on the stack? Since there is limited info on MTST, I was hoping to get some extra oppinions.

 

[BigMattTx]

looks pretty good. you may want to consider the dosages. I have heard that the sides really start to kick in at 6mg of TRN. The Zol may not even be necessary since it is primarily for cutting and TRN is a stronger cutter. I am on week 6 of a TRN/ZOL Cycle and I just stopped taking the Zol so I am starting to realize what the TRN's effects were and what Zol's effects were (especially since Ive done a zol solo cycle).

 

[PumpingIron]

Bump for some more oppinions.

 

[BigMattTx]

i took Zol for about 6 weeks on this cycle. I almost feel better on just the TRN at 4mg then I did on the Zol/Trn stack. One thing about the Zol was that it keeps you pumped up all day but I actually think I lost some water weight when I got off it because I noticed more definition almost instantly...who knows though.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Iron, I'd start your ZOL earlier, possibly starting the ZOL/TST at the same time run that for the first four weeks, have a piggy back week and continue with the TRN/ZOL..I guess you could start all of them earlier, but I'd take haste in stack three orals and running them all for six weeks.

 

[PumpingIron]

Iron, I'd start your ZOL earlier, possibly starting the ZOL/TST at the same time run that for the first four weeks, have a piggy back week and continue with the TRN/ZOL..I guess you could start all of them earlier, but I'd take haste in stack three orals and running them all for six weeks.

What your proposing is something like this?

TST 2/2/4/4/0/0
TRN 0/0/2/2/4/4
ZOL 100/100/100/100/150/150

????

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Yeah sorta..I was thinking this

TST 2/2/4/4
TRN 0/0/0/2/2/4
ZOL 100/125/150/150/150/150

Now, I do know that TST/TRN are meant to work synergistically, but if you want that ZOL to take effect, at least from what I heard, it needs to be run at a higher dose for a longer time. So, if you are fine with stacking three orals for six weeks, then that is fine, but it might be better to have only that piggy back week stacking all three.

 

[PumpingIron]

I haven't read any bad blood analysis after any of these orals, so its the only reason I'm thinking of taking three together. But The piggybacking idea does sound better than running them together.

I think its going to run like this:

MTST:2/2/4/4/0/0
MTRN:0/0/0/2/4/4
MZOL:100/100/150/150/150/150

Now I guess I need to look into the effects of MTRN three weekers...and the ZOL lengths a little more indepth...

 

[PumpingIron]

I am planning on starting this the last week in June...so i have plenty of time to fine tune it? Anybody know anyone on the board who has run something like this? I guess I'll start another log then, maybe?

 

[BigMattTx]

There are some good TST logs and also some good TRN logs. There are TST/TRN logs as well -- look in the BioScience and Generic Labz forums. Most people that stack the two usually run them both for the duration of the cycle and most cycles I have seen are in the 4-6 week range. Zol is pretty damn weak and I think it can pretty much be added to any stack. If you have not taken Zol tho, I would consider doing this:

MTST:2/2/4/4/0/0
MTRN:0/0/0/2/4/4
MZOL:0/100/150/150/150/0

That way you would start week 1 with just TST and you could get a pretty good idea of how it effects you. You will also be able to tell the difference the TRN makes as the last week will be TRN solo and you should be able to tell the change that adding and subtracting the Zol makes in the cycle. If you did this, you would be able to seperate the effects from each of the 3 substances.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

There are some good TST logs and also some good TRN logs. There are TST/TRN logs as well -- look in the BioScience and Generic Labz forums. Most people that stack the two usually run them both for the duration of the cycle and most cycles I have seen are in the 4-6 week range. Zol is pretty damn weak and I think it can pretty much be added to any stack. If you have not taken Zol tho, I would consider doing this:

MTST:2/2/4/4/0/0
MTRN:0/0/0/2/4/4
MZOL:0/100/150/150/150/0

That way you would start week 1 with just TST and you could get a pretty good idea of how it effects you. You will also be able to tell the difference the TRN makes as the last week will be TRN solo and you should be able to tell the change that adding and subtracting the Zol makes in the cycle. If you did this, you would be able to seperate the effects from each of the 3 substances.

I see what you are saying, but running ZOL for four weeks is basically pointless, in some cases I have heard it taking upto two-three weeks just to kick in, and that is at higher doses. It's a weak compound and running it for four weeks only may give you one week of it's effects.

 

[BigMattTx]

I see what you are saying, but running ZOL for four weeks is basically pointless, in some cases I have heard it taking upto two-three weeks just to kick in, and that is at higher doses. It's a weak compound and running it for four weeks only may give you one week of it's effects.

I have ran both a Zol solo cycle at about 4 weeks and a Trn/Zol cycle which I am still on (but I recently dropped the Zol). Both times, it's effects started to kick in around day 3. Everyones different but you cant expect much from the Zol anyways. If I was him, I would just run a 6-weeker of Trn/Tst and run both for most of the 6 weeks. I havent tried TST but the logs are looking good.

 

[PumpingIron]

So do you guys think I'm getting ahead of myself with running these 3 non-methylated orals at the same time?

I kinda of took the inspiration of the cycle from the tst/trn and trn/zol logs out there and the complicated oral cycles ran by diplomats...

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Well, that's why I said running all three at once is just not a good idea, with my set-up you would only be running all three for one week. People have the misconception that just because it isn't methylated, it's not going to do damage. Stacking orals is still gonna mess you up, so you have to run a setup that will yield the best results, but not destroy your body.

 

[BigMattTx]

^^Very True. Prostanozol likely does the least damage while SD does the most (out of the designers). I think the sides/gains on TRN are somewhere right between them. If I were you I would run a TRN/TST cycle. Trust me from experience that Zol isnt needed. I am finishing up a TRN/Zol cycle and although I still have a few bottles of prostanozol...I will wait quite a while to use them and I think I would rather run TRN by itself.

 

[PumpingIron]

I know the risks and health concerns with all different orals but they are still on a smaller scale when they are unmethylated. Thats not to say that they aren't there. I dont know, gonna do some more reading on these three and come up with something...

I wasnt planning on starting until the last week in june anyways.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Yeah, sorry if that seemed like a lecture Iron, I know you have your buisiness together.

 

[PumpingIron]

Don't worry about it...I'm stubborn as hell, I got it stuck in my head that the three of these will work perfectly for my contest prep cycle and its going to take a lot to get the idea out, you know?

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Oh yeah, I have issues with stubborness as well..I do think that would be a great stack for pre-contest, have you considered brewing your own transdermal Test Base?..Or is that not an option?

 

[PumpingIron]

At the moment no...dude, i need to get your e-mail address, I have a few questions for you...

 

[Smoky]

Lots of good answers with decent logic. Here's my take.

I am currently in the 6th week of an 8 week XMASS/PP/TRN/ZOL stack. I ran the XMASS/PP for 4 weeks together. In the fifth week I started TRN/ZOL and halted the others. In the seventh week I am adding TST, heck that's tomorrow. So I will start @ 3 caps. Considering dropping the ZOL which I am currently running at 200. Just isnt doing for me what I had from prostan at 100. But I may just finish it out as well. Could be the TRN masking it, as I have heard no reports of ZOL being underdosed or anything. I am also leaning towards always using TRN in a stack. I started TRN @ 6mg, as most I do must be dosed up a bit. I ran superdrol @ 30 with no problems as well. The biggest issue I see here is you and how you react. Does your blood pressure jump when on or is it stable? How does your heart rate react? TRN for me has quite the cardiac effect. Any stims at this point is pushing my limits. If you know your body and have some experience with PHs then I may suggest the following. Know your limits and how you respond to determine dosing. If you are new to the PH just start low and step it up slowly if needed. Start TRN @ 2 caps, TST @ 2 caps, ZOL @ 2 caps. The stager should provide the ability to experience each one as it comes on line. I strongly suggest this is for the experienced. I prefer at least a 6 week cycle as I feel it makes keeping the gains a little easier.

TST wk 1-6
TRN wk 2-7
ZOL wk 3-8

Otherwise

TST wk 1-3
TRN wk 2-4
ZOL wk 3-6

Either way do the support supps and watch the BP and heart rate. And of course a solid post cycle therapy.

 

[dirtysouthmuscl]

Im doing M-TST, TRN 3mg. Why not take them together. Why do 2ad 2ad 4ad 4ad,instead of doing them together. Im doing 3ad M-TST and 2ad of 3mg TRN.

 

[PumpingIron]

Lots of good answers with decent logic. Here's my take.

I am currently in the 6th week of an 8 week XMASS/PP/TRN/ZOL stack. I ran the XMASS/PP for 4 weeks together. In the fifth week I started TRN/ZOL and halted the others. In the seventh week I am adding TST, heck that's tomorrow. So I will start @ 3 caps. Considering dropping the ZOL which I am currently running at 200. Just isnt doing for me what I had from prostan at 100. But I may just finish it out as well. Could be the TRN masking it, as I have heard no reports of ZOL being underdosed or anything. I am also leaning towards always using TRN in a stack. I started TRN @ 6mg, as most I do must be dosed up a bit. I ran superdrol @ 30 with no problems as well. The biggest issue I see here is you and how you react. Does your blood pressure jump when on or is it stable? How does your heart rate react? TRN for me has quite the cardiac effect. Any stims at this point is pushing my limits. If you know your body and have some experience with PHs then I may suggest the following. Know your limits and how you respond to determine dosing. If you are new to the PH just start low and step it up slowly if needed. Start TRN @ 2 caps, TST @ 2 caps, ZOL @ 2 caps. The stager should provide the ability to experience each one as it comes on line. I strongly suggest this is for the experienced. I prefer at least a 6 week cycle as I feel it makes keeping the gains a little easier.

TST wk 1-6
TRN wk 2-7
ZOL wk 3-8

Otherwise

TST wk 1-3
TRN wk 2-4
ZOL wk 3-6

Either way do the support supps and watch the BP and heart rate. And of course a solid post cycle therapy.

Those doses seema bit high to me, how big are you smoky?

 

[mixedup]

just my imo but alot of people have been saying the zol is a weaker compound and with the doses you have to run you'll need more bottles. You could get a six week cycle of tst/trn with only one bottle a piece at 4mg a day of each. I find the trn is a great hardener in itself and the zol might not really be needed for the extra money.

 

[Smoky]

Those doses seema bit high to me, how big are you smoky?

5'11" 196#

They may be considered high by some. From the logs I have seen and such here and other boards they are not considered high. I percieve chemicals are not absorbed/reacted to/ metabolized/ processed/ ...etc , the same in all people. How many people have you seen that were small and could drink like a fish and walk away , where most would be crawling. I don't claim to understand why my body requires such dosing but it has been apparent most of my adult life. Every thing from novacaine to aspirin I have to dose up. And yes I used to hold my liquor as well. Not sure today as I haven't drank in years other than a glass of wine with a dinner. Even though I find this true in most all I take, I still approach with caution when the elements are unknown to me. I started ZOL @ 100 which was my magic number with prostan. I started TRN @ 4mg and now @ 6. One needs to find their thresholds if you will. what does it take to make you anabolic and grow. Or the opposite if cutting. Read your body not another's to gauge your own.

 

[PumpingIron]

5'11" 196#

They may be considered high by some. From the logs I have seen and such here and other boards they are not considered high. I percieve chemicals are not absorbed/reacted to/ metabolized/ processed/ ...etc , the same in all people. How many people have you seen that were small and could drink like a fish and walk away , where most would be crawling. I don't claim to understand why my body requires such dosing but it has been apparent most of my adult life. Every thing from novacaine to aspirin I have to dose up. And yes I used to hold my liquor as well. Not sure today as I haven't drank in years other than a glass of wine with a dinner. Even though I find this true in most all I take, I still approach with caution when the elements are unknown to me. I started ZOL @ 100 which was my magic number with prostan. I started TRN @ 4mg and now @ 6. One needs to find their thresholds if you will. what does it take to make you anabolic and grow. Or the opposite if cutting. Read your body not another's to gauge your own.

Wow, you are the same exact size I was a few months ago. And it is true to say that people require different dosages of compounds to obtain the same desired effect. I just automatically assume the higher doses were because you were a ridiculously huge got, I didn't even consider the latter.

But I def. agree with you, I usually dose thing slightly higher then recommended. I'll figure this one out soon enough...

Thanks for the input.

 

[Smoky]

I started at about 192 prior to the bulking phase of my cycle. I quickly grew to 206 in 3-4 weeks. And I am a lean bulker to boot. I have been cutting since.