advice on my Summer Cycle

[FitModel]

okay i'm trying to put together a good summer cycle...

I've done 2 cycles in the past...12 week test e+dbol and 12 week test e+deca+dbol...


I want to do a 6 - 8 week cutter, with adding about 10-15lbs of muslce...

I'm thinking...
1-8 test prop 100mgs EOD
1-7 tren ace 75mgs EOD (or what about tren e?)
1-4 anavar 40mgs ED (pricy, what about pp)
2-8 Nolva 20mgs ED
2-10 HCG 500iu 2x per week

okay, i'm a little concerned about pinning prop and tren EOD, I'm assuming tren e u only might pin 2x a week...correct?
should I do that instead, cause I don't want to have soreness every day for this 8 weeks...

Also, this is a rather expensive cycle, if I was to take out either the ana or tren, which one would u guys advise me to take out and what might I lose from removing that compound (gains wise)...
and finally what if I remove the ana and replace it with pp, any comparison between products? or i'm a way off...?


Thanks for any advice/suggestions...

 

[idunk42]

If I would take out either the tren or anavar, I would take out the anavar.

 

[mercedesdd]

okay i'm trying to put together a good summer cycle...

I've done 2 cycles in the past...12 week test e+dbol and 12 week test e+deca+dbol...


I want to do a 6 - 8 week cutter, with adding about 10-15lbs of muslce...

I'm thinking...
1-8 test prop 100mgs EOD
1-7 tren ace 75mgs EOD (or what about tren e?)
1-4 anavar 40mgs ED (pricy, what about pp)
2-8 Nolva 20mgs ED
2-10 HCG 500iu 2x per week

okay, i'm a little concerned about pinning prop and tren EOD, I'm assuming tren e u only might pin 2x a week...correct?
should I do that instead, cause I don't want to have soreness every day for this 8 weeks...

Also, this is a rather expensive cycle, if I was to take out either the ana or tren, which one would u guys advise me to take out and what might I lose from removing that compound (gains wise)...
and finally what if I remove the ana and replace it with pp, any comparison between products? or i'm a way off...?


Thanks for any advice/suggestions...

You can get away with the prop EOD but ED works the best ( keeps blood levels stable.) You can go with the prop 75mg ED if you like and cut it with cottonseed oil to reduce the pain of prop. As far as tren ace it really needs to be injected ED 75 mg . Yes if you go with tren e you can go with it twice a week. Yea anavar is pricey and that dose it kinda low I would start around 50mg ED if you do go with it , and 4 weeks is not long enough with the var ( I would say 6 wks min but thats just me). Why are you adding the HCG in this short cycle? You probly do need it on such a short cycle unless you have had bad atrophy in past cycles ... And also why start the nolva at week 2 and not at start of cycle( just wondering)??? For the 10-15 lbs of mass your shooting for it should be no prob just have your training and diet in check as this is the most important aspect of your cycle!!!

 

[FitModel]

You can get away with the prop EOD but ED works the best ( keeps blood levels stable.) You can go with the prop 75mg ED if you like and cut it with cottonseed oil to reduce the pain of prop. As far as tren ace it really needs to be injected ED 75 mg . Yes if you go with tren e you can go with it twice a week. Yea anavar is pricey and that dose it kinda low I would start around 50mg ED if you do go with it , and 4 weeks is not long enough with the var ( I would say 6 wks min but thats just me). Why are you adding the HCG in this short cycle? You probly do need it on such a short cycle unless you have had bad atrophy in past cycles ... And also why start the nolva at week 2 and not at start of cycle( just wondering)??? For the 10-15 lbs of mass your shooting for it should be no prob just have your training and diet in check as this is the most important aspect of your cycle!!!

I've heard of a lot of people (on this board as well) that pin tren ace EOD (I would go ED but I really don't think I could take pinning ED for 7 weeks)

so maybe no ana (what about substituting with PP?) and I was under the impression 40mgs was a average dose...

yeah, I have had bad atrophy in past cycles

then perhaps I will just start NOLVA at the beginning...20mgs, ED?

 

[mercedesdd]

I've heard of a lot of people (on this board as well) that pin tren ace EOD (I would go ED but I really don't think I could take pinning ED for 7 weeks)

so maybe no ana (what about substituting with PP?) and I was under the impression 40mgs was a average dose...

yeah, I have had bad atrophy in past cycles

then perhaps I will just start NOLVA at the beginning...20mgs, ED?

I have tried pharmacy compounded var at 40 mg did very little, 50 mgs it was a good starting point and 60mg worked great for me. It is mostly a strength compound it will make you harder also . It seems you are just wanting a lean bulk and would be fine with just prop and possibly tren to meet your 10-15 lbs gain( again diet and training are the most important part). Not sure about PP I have not used many supps like pp. Someone else can advise you on that!! If you do go with tren you need to run an AI . letro at .25 mg ED or even EOD will suffice!!. Tren is a progestin and it is possible you can get gyno using it .

 

[glenihan]

cycle looks absolutely fine, and i always use HCG regardless

tren e should really be pinned 3x a week .. just stick with tren ace

btw you are NOT going to add 10-15lbs of actual muscle in 8 weeks esp if this is your 3rd cycle ESPECIALLY if its a cutter .. unless you are far below your genetic limit .. in which case all you need to do is fix your diet and training then there's no need for drugs

 

[FitModel]

okay...

how exactly should I administer Letro or adex, which one is better to use?

thanks for the help guys, I want this to go as good as possible...

 

[mercedesdd]

okay...

how exactly should I administer Letro or adex, which one is better to use?

thanks for the help guys, I want this to go as good as possible...

Use letro if using tren!! Go with .25 ED or EOD. By the way whats your pCT look like?? .. Pct is very important you dont want to bust your butt than lose all your gains.. You can check out this link . It is the pct I advise!!

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/anabolics/45056-test-e-sustanon.html

 

[FitModel]

for PCT I plan on using Nolva and someother supp's (ie Controlled labs products)

in the past I also used Rebound xt and Lean xtreme (tho, one of them shut down my sex drive hard core, I don't know which one, someone told me before but I forgot...)

 

[mercedesdd]

Oh and if you go with tren ace try to go ED if possible it will keep the level more stable 75mg ED might be to high to start with maybe try 50mg ED than you can bump it up!!.. It is so androgenic that EOD will make you moody !!! Just my 2 cc's

 

[same_old]

cycle looks absolutely fine, and i always use HCG regardless

tren e should really be pinned 3x a week .. just stick with tren ace

btw you are NOT going to add 10-15lbs of actual muscle in 8 weeks esp if this is your 3rd cycle ESPECIALLY if its a cutter .. unless you are far below your genetic limit .. in which case all you need to do is fix your diet and training then there's no need for drugs

listen to this man. 10-15lbs on a caloric deficit is virtually impossible using those drugs.

also, i'd like to see the PCT plan. it's a little tricky so if you dont mind laying it out...

 

[mercedesdd]

listen to this man. 10-15lbs on a caloric deficit is virtually impossible using those drugs.

also, i'd like to see the post cycle therapy plan. it's a little tricky so if you dont mind laying it out...

Hey man!! Was wondering if you like the aromasin , nolva , hCG pct ? Just want somefeed back from some other bros on the board!! Heres the link to the thread again!! http://anabolicminds.com/forum/anabolics/45056-test-e-sustanon.html

 

[glenihan]

Oh and if you go with tren ace try to go ED if possible it will keep the level more stable 75mg ED might be to high to start with maybe try 50mg ED than you can bump it up!!.. It is so androgenic that EOD will make you moody !!! Just my 2 cc's

this is something that is truly dependent on the individual i use my tren EOD and never experience a single side aside from strength increase and fat decrease (i have to actually severly up my cals to actually gain weight while on tren because of how much fat it melts off me .. that's not to say i'm not gaining muscle .. just not adding on the scale but i could care less about my weight .. anyway i digress)

many can use tren EOD without getting the sides of acne and insomnia, others even with ED shots don't react well .. its definitely the trickiest compound out there and can have devastatingly harsh sides

 

[mercedesdd]

this is something that is truly dependent on the individual i use my tren EOD and never experience a single side aside from strength increase and fat decrease (i have to actually severly up my cals to actually gain weight while on tren because of how much fat it melts off me .. that's not to say i'm not gaining muscle .. just not adding on the scale but i could care less about my weight .. anyway i digress)

many can use tren EOD without getting the sides of acne and insomnia, others even with ED shots don't react well .. its definitely the trickiest compound out there and can have devastatingly harsh sides

Haha I agree it is a tricky compound man! I like the ED over EOD due to it begin so androgenic it increases chemicals called serotoergic amines in the brain and decrease brain serotonin, making you more aggressive. Anyways with a decrease in serotonin you become cranky and sleepless. The only thing worse than this shunting of serotonin is having a rollercoster of blood levels making it worse. When dealing with strong compounds or big doses my primary focus is on keeping blood levels stable!! Thats why I say ED over EOD!!

 

[mercedesdd]

quotemercedesdd Haha I agree it is a tricky compound man! I like the ED over EOD due to it begin so androgenic it increases chemicals called serotoergic amines in the brain and decrease brain serotonin, making you more aggressive. Anyways with a decrease in serotonin you become cranky and sleepless. The only thing worse than this shunting of serotonin is having a rollercoster of blood levels making it worse. When dealing with strong compounds or big doses my primary focus is on keeping blood levels stable!! Thats why I say ED over EOD!![/QUOTE]

Oh Glenihan, I forgot to ask you. Can you explain why you advise tren EOD instead? Is it just cause you dont seem to have many sides? Just wondering your reason for your protocol!!

 

[glenihan]

i don't necessarily advocate EOD over ED with tren .. i usually advise to start with EOD because ED is SUCH a PITA .. if sides get bad then one should switch to ED at half the dose used EOD to see if that helps

all i said was many can get away with using it EOD and not notice any sides

 

[mercedesdd]

i don't necessarily advocate EOD over ED with tren .. i usually advise to start with EOD because ED is SUCH a PITA .. if sides get bad then one should switch to ED at half the dose used EOD to see if that helps

all i said was many can get away with using it EOD and not notice any sides

Gotcha bro!! From what I have read on here many people are doing tren ace EOD and just wanted some feedback as to why they are choosing this protocol!! Thanks man!!!

 

[1ad man]

you could go eod on the tren but ed is better that glenihan guy is smart he knows what he is talking about listen to him.

 

[sage]

got some sick AAS lined up for you summer cycle bro. if pinning frequency is your worry, do what u asked and pin tren enan over tren ace. with the test prop, you're still going to shoot eod (whats this ed only talk.... eod works just fine with the half-life of prop) though. I suppose u could use a test blend but that would leave you with some long esters to deal with and by the looks of your cycle, you're strictly shooting for a cutter.

You could always have a less frequent injecting test ester/blend in the middle of your cycle if its not a problem. just start and end with propinate.

 

[mercedesdd]

you could go eod on the tren but ed is better that glenihan guy is smart he knows what he is talking about listen to him.

HUH, Glenihan says with tren to start with EOD( not ED) and if sides are bad than lower dose and go with ED!! I say go ED with tren for the reason I mentioined in my above post due to increased serotonergic amines in the brain..

 

[mercedesdd]

got some sick anabolic steroids lined up for you summer cycle bro. if pinning frequency is your worry, do what u asked and pin tren enan over tren ace. with the test prop, you're still going to shoot eod (whats this ed only talk.... eod works just fine with the half-life of prop) though. I suppose u could use a test blend but that would leave you with some long esters to deal with and by the looks of your cycle, you're strictly shooting for a cutter.

You could always have a less frequent injecting test ester/blend in the middle of your cycle if its not a problem. just start and end with propinate.

Hey man, I agree you can go EOD with prop I prefer ED more stable blood levels but thats just me. I was just saying ED due to this is his third cycle begin 400 mg per( if he used prop 100 mg EOD) WK of prop MIGHT be a kinda low dose depending on his prior cycle doses . He could maybe go with 75 mg ED( would be 525 mg EW or even 125mg EOD ( would be 500 mg EW) . But it is hard to say because he did not post his previous doses from his other two cycles..

 

[FitModel]

cycle 1
1-12 test e 500mgs per week, dbol 30mgs for 30 days

cycle 2
1-12 test e 500mgs per week, deca 350mgs (I think) per week, dbol 30mgs for 30 days...last 2 weeks test prop eod 100mgs...

so right now i'm thinking same as I was at first...lol
if need be I can always bump up the test p to 125 and tren a to 100 after a few weeks...

Also I can get winny tabs for way better price then ana...would that be an unnecessary addition?

next up PCT...

 

[mercedesdd]

cycle 1
1-12 test e 500mgs per week, dbol 30mgs for 30 days

cycle 2
1-12 test e 500mgs per week, deca 350mgs (I think) per week, dbol 30mgs for 30 days...last 2 weeks test prop eod 100mgs...

so right now i'm thinking same as I was at first...lol
if need be I can always bump up the test p to 125 and tren a to 100 after a few weeks...

Also I can get winny tabs for way better price then ana...would that be an unnecessary addition?

next up post cycle therapy...

Thats cool whatever you choose its up to you in the end man!! I just wanted to know why you are bumping your test dose down in your third cycle? If you used 500 mg EW in the past two cycles and 700 mg with the addition of prop in your last cycle for the last 2 wks ( not sure if you mean you dropped the test e at wk 12 and used the prop for 2 wks and did a 14 weeker but anyways) why go down to 400 mg per week on your third cycle? Is it because you are adding the tren( when you added the deca I see you still went with 500 mg EW)? I was just wondering your reason for this LOL.. And you could add winny if you like ( people get alot of sides from it but I really dont) What are the mg of the winny pills and how many mg per day where you thinking of using and for how long??

 

[FitModel]

both those cycles were proposed by reputable people off this board...I did drop the test e when I did the test prop 100/eod...and it seemed to work great, I really felt it more then the test e (but i'm sure I still had test e in my system)...

anyways...so your recommending I do 125/eod and 75 or 100 eod of tren?

winny tabs are 25mgs, I do belive...was thinking of taking 2 per day, but only if I would really benefit, no reason to take more if I really don't need to (as in adding it to my cycle)

 

[mercedesdd]

both those cycles were proposed by reputable people off this board...I did drop the test e when I did the test prop 100/eod...and it seemed to work great, I really felt it more then the test e (but i'm sure I still had test e in my system)...

anyways...so your recommending I do 125/eod and 75 or 100 eod of tren?

winny tabs are 25mgs, I do believe...was thinking of taking 2 per day, but only if I would really benefit, no reason to take more if I really don't need to (as in adding it to my cycle)

I would go with the 125 mg of prop ED to get 525 mg per week since you used 500 of test in in the past two cycles.. I would not want to use less test in my third cycle than I did in my first and second cycle. As for the tren I would go with the 75mg... What would be your purpose in adding the winny? It will not burn fat!! It will harden you up . It will also help lower SHBG( this is a good thing) and raise free test level. I think you will be fine with just the tren and test... In my opinion winny is more of a pre contest compound . Sure it will harden you up ( give you a dry look ) but most of the effects go away when stopping use.. Just my 2 cc's

 

[mercedesdd]

OOPS !! I mean prop 125 EOD not ED !! Sorry man just saw that!!!

 

[FitModel]

cool thanks...I may add the winny just for experimental purposes...what would be a good dose and time frame to take it...

also letro .25 eod, throught the cycle, correct...?

 

[mercedesdd]

cool thanks...I may add the winny just for experimental purposes...what would be a good dose and time frame to take it...

also letro .25 eod, through the cycle, correct...?

Yea with the tren go with letro ED or EOD. It is very strong and can kill your sex drive if you use to much. You will have to play with the dose and see what works for you. As for the winny , injection works best for absorption you get 100% of the compound absorbed, and much less with the oral. That said for you can go with 50 mg ED ( split in to 2 doses of 25 mg. Remember winny has a short active life of around 8 hours so two times through out the day will suffice). I would say use the winny for the last 5-6 weeks of your cycle and make sure to use liver protection( milk thistle) cause the winny is a 17aa. Hope this helps !!!

 

[bpmartyr]

As for the winny , injection works best for absorption you get 100% of the compound absorbed, and much less with the oral.

No you don't. Virtually no differance injecting vs swallowing it.

 

[FitModel]

1-8 test prop 125mgs EOD (if sides) 65 mgs ed
1-7 tren ace 75mgs EOD 40 mgs ed
4-8 winny 50mgs ED (maybe! experimental purposes)
1-8 Nolva 20mgs ED
1-8 Letro .25 EOD - ED

1-10 HCG 500iu 2x per week
9-12 Nolva 40, 40, 20, 20
Lean Xtreme
PCT...??? what else?

other...
b5 3mgs ED?
b6 ?
Dostinex @ .5mg/EOD (necessary, or will the letro take care of this?)


Really Appreciate the help guys...I've been searching around, but I just wanted to get advice on the complete and final package...

 

[FitModel]

No you don't. Virtually no differance injecting vs swallowing it.

i'm not sure if that is true or not...

however I do know that u can orally take winny in it's liquid/oil form...

 

[mercedesdd]

No you don't. Virtually no differance injecting vs swallowing it.

Heres the some input from the winstrol profile ( from hooker)..

as it is available in both an oral form as well as an injectable form. Both forms contain the exact same compound, but injecting this compound (and yes, you can drink the injectable version, and no you shouldn’t) is superior to ingesting it orally in terms of nitrogen retention (6), and thus one would also imagine, for overall anabolism. Injecting it also has the advantage of avoiding the “first pass” through your liver, and thus places your liver under less stress

 

[mercedesdd]

Ingesting it orally may provide more benefit with regards to SHBG, but injecting it provides better protein synthesis.

 

[mercedesdd]

1-8 test prop 125mgs EOD (if sides) 65 mgs ed
1-7 tren ace 75mgs EOD 40 mgs ed
4-8 winny 50mgs ED (maybe! experimental purposes)
1-8 Nolva 20mgs ED
1-8 Letro .25 EOD - ED

1-10 HCG 500iu 2x per week
9-12 Nolva 40, 40, 20, 20
Lean Xtreme
post cycle therapy...??? what else?

other...
b5 3mgs ED?
b6 ?
Dostinex @ .5mg/EOD (necessary, or will the letro take care of this?)


Really Appreciate the help guys...I've been searching around, but I just wanted to get advice on the complete and final package...

Drop the nolva!! It will lessen the effect of the letro!! nolva makes type -2 AI's less effective. Also never use nolva with tren see this thread.. http://anabolicminds.com/forum/anabolics/45232-dostinex-adex-tren-test-cycle.html

You can use the b-6 @ 100-200 mg ED

 

[mercedesdd]

For some reason I missed the nolva in your other post.. I know I asked you why start the nolva on wk 2 before but I forgot you where using tren!!! My bad man!! Wanted to clear that up!!

 

[FitModel]

Drop the nolva!! It will lessen the effect of the letro!! nolva makes type -2 AI's less effective. Also never use nolva with tren see this thread.. http://anabolicminds.com/forum/anabolics/45232-dostinex-adex-tren-test-cycle.html

You can use the b-6 @ 100-200 mg ED

okay, I'll check out that thread...I am prone to gyno tho...will the Letro be enough to keep it away...is there anythign else I can take (besdies nolva) to help keep gyno away...

 

[size]

Cutting while adding 10-15lbs of muscle???
The world obviously has changed as I have aged. 10-15lbs of muscle would be good on any cycle combine that with a cutting cycle then it is amazing.

 

[same_old]

Cutting while adding 10-15lbs of muscle???
The world obviously has changed as I have aged. 10-15lbs of muscle would be good on any cycle combine that with a cutting cycle then it is amazing.

well, i did it once, but i was using IMPOSSI-BOL stacked with bee testicle extract and we ALL know about the synergy of those two.

 

[size]

well, i did it once, but i was using IMPOSSI-BOL stacked with bee testicle extract and we ALL know about the synergy of those two.

I am going to have to try that combo. Thank you for the advice.

 

[bpmartyr]

Lat time I added Impossi-Bol to my stack, I had bee testicles of my own!:blink:

 

[FitModel]

what about adding some clomid in the mix...

or just for PCT...is it neccessary...in the past I had some not so good shut down...I'd like to avoid this time around...and was told clomid/nolva stack might help (pct)