Old School Orals vs. Designer Steroids (New School)

[CEDeoudes59]

Thought we could have some fun with this one:

Old School Orals (Dbol, Winny, Drol, Anavar, etc.)

versus

New School Designers (Superdrol, M1T, ErgoMax, Pheraplex, etc.)


Do you believe that any of the new school orals have any huge advantages over the old school orals? (vice-versa)

Who would opt for M1T or Ergomax over Dianabol?

The New Designers are mysterious and fun talking about - but are they really any better than what we already have? (Legality aside)

I've never tried Anavar or Winny so I can't really compare that to Superdrol. I'm bias but I'll tend to say that M1T is slighty better than Dianabol - although I've only played with Dbol once. M1T kicks in quicker and I don't get any of the nasty sides that have been reported. Dbol, however, boasts libido 500%. Never tried Pheraplex, Halodrol, Ergomax.

 

[Rocky82]

Who would opt for M1T or Ergomax over Dianabol?

I'd say anyone who hasnt ever used legit dbol...Dont get me wrong, m1t and SD are great drugs, but I just respond better and have longer lasting results (and less sides) from legit orals such as dbol, drol, var, winny, etc.

 

[NevrEnuf]

I'd say anyone who hasnt ever used legit dbol...Dont get me wrong, m1t and SD are great drugs, but I just respond better and have longer lasting results (and less sides) from legit orals such as dbol, drol, var, winny, etc.

:cheers: i totally agree

 

[Skark]

On a mg to mg basis, the old school drugs are better.

Now looking at Anavar vs. M4OHN, I think that 80 mg OHN should be equivalent to 40 mg Var, but to my knowledge no one has tried this.

Since I have 20+ grams of OHN on hand I'm seriously thinking of trying this out for a month.

 

[Gary46080]

I'm bias but I'll tend to say that M1T is slighty better than Dianabol - although I've only played with Dbol once. M1T kicks in quicker and I don't get any of the nasty sides that have been reported.

I think M1T is complete garbage. Most of the initial weight gained from it is water weight and the gains are very short term as they disappear soon after discontinuing use. High blood pressure, nose bleeds, seriously aggressive behaviour, gyno and sodium retention? I can't find a single good use for this drug in bodybuilding. Old school AAS all the way, Dbol > M1T.

 

[jmh80]

skark - try it and log it for us!

Have you tried anavar before?

 

[CEDeoudes59]

On a mg to mg basis, the old school drugs are better.

Now looking at Anavar vs. M4OHN, I think that 80 mg OHN should be equivalent to 40 mg Var, but to my knowledge no one has tried this.

Since I have 20+ grams of OHN on hand I'm seriously thinking of trying this out for a month.

I've ran ~60mg of M4OHN - I've never tried anavar... M4OHN is pretty weak (as in not potent - the results were decent in a recomp sense).

 

[jonny21]

Old School Orals (Dbol, Winny, Drol, Anavar, etc.)

versus

New School Designers (Superdrol, M1T, ErgoMax, Pheraplex, etc.)

Who would opt for M1T or Ergomax over Dianabol?

I've never tried Anavar or Winny so I can't really compare that to Superdrol. I'm bias but I'll tend to say that M1T is slighty better than Dianabol - although I've only played with Dbol once. M1T kicks in quicker and I don't get any of the nasty sides that have been reported. Dbol, however, boasts libido 500%. Never tried Pheraplex, Halodrol, Ergomax.

Of those you mentioned I have done:
E-max @ 20mg/day; thought it was a waste, got real greasy and pimples on my head :blink:

Anavar, 8 week cycle most of the time @ 45mg/day. Noticeable increase in strength and decrease in appetite, not much in way of LBM. I boosted the dose to 60 in the beginning and it jacked up my BP. Got it back up to 60 with some hawthorne. If I do it again it will be 50-60mg/day at least. No back pumps, excellent recovery time. good choice if you are not looking to put on much weight just strength.

D'bol, only did 2 weeks during the above anavar cycle just to try it out. Napoism 5mg tabs, up to 20mg. SD like pumps after week one. No bloat at that dose. Boosted my total weight gain to 8lbs, 5lbs of which remained. But i was @ maintenance kcals the whole time.

 

[size]

In my mind nothing will ever touch oxandrolone.
Winstrol is nice.
Dbol, not a fan.
In regards to some of the new stuff, ergo/phera/dmt is definitely a good choice.

 

[aspire210]

Well from a health stand point I think anyone would choose the oldies. Why? Look at the blood tests from SD and M1T. Makes my arteries clog just looking at them. +1 for the oldies.

Also, the old ones have years of research and usage behind them. What they do is well known making them easier to stack with other items. An example is say I want to run Test and EQ. Well I would know to avoid drol once the EQ kicks in because of the massive increase in RBC, which can lead to serious problems. All steroids increase RBC to some extent, but these do it like no other. Now can anyone tell me to what degree DMT or SD affects RBC? Not knowing could lead to some health problems. +1 for the oldies.

Legality stand point I can see the usage of these new ones. No watching the block when the postman rolls up to see if there is a CD going on. Also, your significant other is less likely to ask questions if you can buy them at GNC or other supplement stores. +1 for the designers.

The side effects for all these new items seem to be fairly harsh. Hypoglycemia, Wicked back pumps even at the lowest possible dosage, lethargy that made it hard to even get out of bed, dibilitating pumps that kept me from doing my semi-manuel labor job, these are the things that I encountered on my SD cycle. Not to say that the oldies are side effect free, but we all know what to expect from them and the problems most people run into. I think most people who have tried dianabol and SD would prefer the former if they had to run a stand alone. +1 for oldies.

3 to 1 by my count. I think if you are willing to deal with the fact that you might spend some time in jail, or atleast probation and a record, then you will have a more pleasent experience. Also, most advise test for a base, well thats illegal, so mine as well get some drol or dbol to go along with it. Fact of the matter is, no one "invented" these "prosteroids", each and everyone was already known about. Pharmacutical companies didn't use them for one reason or another. Just keep that in mind.

 

[Ubiquitous]

M1T is not a new thing.. It was discovered 40-50 years ago but laid low for some reason until a resurgence a few years back.

I actually liked M1t all 4 times I ran it. I didn't really get water weight from it either. I was pretty dry actually.. diet dictated that.

Anyways, I'd lump them all together these days, but I have my favorites.. mostly the old school compounds.

 

[Beelzebub]

i hate them all.

that's hog wash bobby, i invented all the injectables, orals are the devil.

 

[jonny21]

Just speculating but probably due to supply and demand. It is very mild as far as sides. At adequate doses increases strength noticeably. Solid maintainable gains. ****, if the stuff could cook & clean and would marry it.

Besides it has real world applications. It is the only steroid I have ever heard a doctor consider prescribing a patient that was cachetic.

 

[stinkfinger]

Thanks guys, for someone new in this world like myself this is a great discussion!

 

[french_muscle]

I'm definitely with aspire210's point of view, and to the list of the "old school" orals I'd add tbol

 

[Iron Warrior]

I'm about to try some TBOL in 1-2 weeks so I'll let you guys know how it compares to SD for a recomp. Only difference is that I ran SD for 4 weeks and I'm going to do TBOL for 8 weeks. I've been hearing great things about TBOL

 

[Rocky82]

In reference to aspire's post (and a good one at that), the only drugs i've seen used medically are oxandralone (for cachexia/cancer chemotherapy patients/AIDS wasting syndrome), oxymetholone, i.e. Anadrol (for anemia - very old school and not used medically anymore due to its being banned in the US years ago for its sides), and of course, test for "anti-aging", hypogonadism, panhypopituitarism, and a slew of other conditions. All the other aformentioned substances were developed with performance enhancement as the main goal.


As far as oxandralone (anavar) being the drug of choice medically, it is virtually side effect free, non androgenic (can be given to women with the above ailments), does not cause water retention, and preserves/increases lean body mass without exercise (end stage AIDS/cancer patients arent lifting 4 days a week, so yes it does work without lifting). Even still, it is very expensive in its pharmaceutical grade (Oxandrin) and is unfortunately under-prescribed to those that actually NEED it.

 

[MGH1982]

Truthfully i like both .... My favorite is an old school though (TBOL), But i got better gains on SD than i did DBOL IMO... DBOL gains were a little too watery for me... and i am looking forward to my test e, tren ace, and var cycle soon considering i never tried anavar

 

[jverch]

I'm about to try some TBOL in 1-2 weeks so I'll let you guys know how it compares to SD for a recomp. Only difference is that I ran SD for 4 weeks and I'm going to do TBOL for 8 weeks. I've been hearing great things about TBOL

What dosage you going for those 8 weeks? I'm thinking of tryin the stuff soon as well.

 

[the42nd]

New School hasn't done as much for me as old school. M1T was alright, but DBOL rocked, for my experience. Running var right now, so I'll see how I like that.
Old School New School
1 0

 

[jonny21]

Sounds like a few of us will be giving T'bol a go around. I will be starting a TD Test/t'bol cycle Feb 1. I am going to start @ 50mg and adjust if necessary.

 

[x_muscle]

Winny: THis stuff was very mild and killed my joints

M1T: very nice gains, i mean awsome. I dont get bad side from it. But i stopped using it, after reports of liver toxicity.

Dbol: Awsome gains similar to M1T, but it made me very lethargetic, and slugish, didnt agree with my body.

Tbol: very mild, i ran 30-60mg ed, and i didnt notice anything, thought its waste of money.

 

[400runner]

DMT, the stuff rocks....i think it ranks up with the old school dbol stuff.... i think once its gone its gonna be ranked up there with some of the best. just my opinion though

 

[Iron Warrior]

What dosage you going for those 8 weeks? I'm thinking of tryin the stuff soon as well.

50 mgs, it's the IP brand.

 

[Rocky82]

Tbol: very mild, i ran 30-60mg ed, and i didnt notice anything, thought its waste of money.

that dose of tbol is like taking 100 mg test per week

 

[DR.D]

In terms of safety and lack of sides, it sounds like a near-perfect oral steroid. (nothwithstanding that it can't cook & clean ...)

Are you still taking abot Var? Dude, you fellas are so damn spoiled! SD is twice as potent as Var with only half the androgeny. Winny is the only thing that even comes close to SD. Still, M1T is the strongest oral ever invented IMO, so I am way off in my opinions with you guys. I'm old school too, big time, but these new orals are way better. PheraPlex for example, except for the gyno threat, what even comes close to it? A50 or Dbol, OK, at 3x the dose maybe! Gimme a break. Also, at 60mg/d, 4OH-MN is probably the best over all. Go try some 'old skool' juice. You'll be back looking for legals again real soon.

 

[LCSULLA]

M1T is the strongest oral ever invented IMO

Doc, how do you compare M1T with Methoxy-trn? I have heard it's just as harsh.

 

[Sir Foxx]

50 mgs, it's the IP brand.

Remember to crush these tabs up before taking as they are pressed too hard. It makes a big difference, trust me.

 

[jonny21]

Remember to crush these tabs up before taking as they are pressed too hard. It makes a big difference, trust me.

I made my hampster chew the IP anavar.

 

[jonny21]

Research hampster .

 

[Iron Warrior]

Remember to crush these tabs up before taking as they are pressed too hard. It makes a big difference, trust me.

Thank you for the tip SF. You get rep points and maybe I'll pray a little for the Broncos too because they'll need it :icon_lol:

 

[mindgames]

I did winny at 25mg twice daily3 weeks - the gains were consistent, dry and retained (8lbs) . It made me harder and, particularly in the shoulders, quite striated. Bloodwork done after 2 weeks and all was OK. Overall a good experience

I wasn't that impressed with M1T - I didn't really get the same gains and certainly not the strength gains of winny either. I gotta admit all the bad news on M1T made me wary so I dosed pretty low though.

The SD is in the fridge ready to roll....I'm just pre loading with posicosanol, RYR and hawthorn. I'll be interested to see how it compares...

 

[DR.D]

Doc, how do you compare M1T with Methoxy-trn? I have heard it's just as harsh.

I'm not sure. I have a bottle of MeO-TRN but still haven't tried it yet. To clarify my comment, actually Mibolerone is the strongest oral IMO I've ever used as far as potency goes, but M1T is qualitatively very potent.

Everyone responds differently, so I guess there will always be differences of opinion in this area. Some people have told me they don't even respond to high dose SD, but I respond to low doses. I also respond to relatively low doses of Anadrol (like 37.5-50mg) but others use 100mg or more. It's hard to say who will benefit from what until they have tried it.

 

[sage]

not a close comparison. var-w's-dbol-drol anyday of the year. any advantage of m1t, SD, etc?...... no
Sage

 

[x_muscle]

that dose of tbol is like taking 100 mg test per week

I dont think taking more 100mg of methylated stuff is a good idea.

 

[CEDeoudes59]

I did winny at 25mg twice daily3 weeks - the gains were consistent, dry and retained (8lbs) . It made me harder and, particularly in the shoulders, quite striated. Bloodwork done after 2 weeks and all was OK. Overall a good experience

I wasn't that impressed with M1T - I didn't really get the same gains and certainly not the strength gains of winny either. I gotta admit all the bad news on M1T made me wary so I dosed pretty low though.

The SD is in the fridge ready to roll....I'm just pre loading with posicosanol, RYR and hawthorn. I'll be interested to see how it compares...

that's interesting... nobody ever says anything good about winny - yet it remains popular. I may have to locate some.

 

[phaeton66]

Well from a health stand point I think anyone would choose the oldies. Why? Look at the blood tests from SD and M1T. Makes my arteries clog just looking at them. +1 for the oldies.

I am sure someone has blood test results from dbol; can you cite a reference by any chance? I agree that SD is skeery in what it does to your inner pipes, but I kind of suspect that dbol and everything else that works is just as scary. If not, perhaps a nice vacation overseas might be the right way to do my next cycle.

 

[tegman]

Anavar is great for strength...

I did 8 weeks of var at 80mgs and my strength went through the roof! Gained a little weight and was alot fuller but no real mass. A few months later I did a 3.5 week sdrol cycle and gained 17 pounds, ok strength and almost an inch on my arms at 3500kal a day!!!!

Bottom line sdrol is best for mass var is better for strength...

 

[Tom 185]

var is better for strength?? anyone else think this? that is the first time i ever heard that..if so, then im definitely going to get some

 

[aspire210]

var is better for strength?? anyone else think this? that is the first time i ever heard that..if so, then im definitely going to get some

Better than what? You tend to keep everything you gain off anavar, unlike dbol, drol, SD, etc. In the end, I gained more off anavar, strength wise, than I did dbol. I also lost weight while on var.

 

[jarhead]

I have tried just about every "old school" oral, and love them but....I have to say -without taking sides into account- superdrol mg/mg blows them away for me in terms of dry mass. 3 weeks of any listed oral compared to 3 weeks of sd, and sd comes out on top for me.

Having said that, if I could only use 1 oral, it would be good old dbol. Can use it for longer cycles and it feels great as opposed to the lethargy I get from sd.

 

[Popa Murph]

I'm not sure. I have a bottle of MeO-TRN but still haven't tried it yet. To clarify my comment, actually Mibolerone is the strongest oral IMO I've ever used as far as potency goes, but M1T is qualitatively very potent.

Everyone responds differently, so I guess there will always be differences of opinion in this area. Some people have told me they don't even respond to high dose superdrol, but I respond to low doses. I also respond to relatively low doses of Anadrol (like 37.5-50mg) but others use 100mg or more. It's hard to say who will benefit from what until they have tried it.

Good old cheque drops, never used then but from what I've read about their toxicity they make Superdrol look like Tylenol.

 

[Ubiquitous]

Mibolerone :twisted: I've used it.. (in Ubi-fantasyland)
And it's nuts... I was expecting intensity to go up, but not to that extent.

Especially considering it's dosed in mcg (micrograms).. that's how potent it is on a mg:mg basis.

200mcg/day for 2 weeks at a time is what is accepted as 'safe dose/duration'.

:twisted:

 

[Jstrong20]

It depends some new and some old are good. Winstrols sucked ass. Aandrol is definatley number one as long as you get powder and know your getting the full dose because to many pills are underdosed. Dbol is ok but superdrol and m1t are much stronger with less bloat. Too bad everybody missed out on the injectable 1-test/4-ad stack. This **** was just as good if not better than alot of the illegal stacks I see on here. I don't use illegal stuff anymore. If I did I would just avoid orals all together because they are not worth it. Test suspension or TNE is all that is really needed to jumpstart a cycle. 150mgs ed will get the gains coming fast!

 

[lifthardheavy]

Test suspension or TNE is all that is really needed to jumpstart a cycle. 150mgs ed will get the gains coming fast!

150mg of test susp per day?? FFS!!

 

[Jstrong20]

150mg of test susp per day?? FFS!!

LOL! Yeah most will probably want to go lower than that.

 

[CEDeoudes59]

wow this is way old.. I have so much more hands-on experience since.

Dbol, Anavar is the way to go
Superdrol, not bad.. deadly on the lipids for me
Tbol, no thanks.. unimpressed I'm using it now.
M1T, I haven't used this one in a while, I did like it though.
I think that's it.

 

[Moyer]

Is Dbol generally easier on lipids/liver than SD?

 

[lifthardheavy]

wow this is way old.. I have so much more hands-on experience since.

Dbol, Anavar is the way to go
Superdrol, not bad.. deadly on the lipids for me
Tbol, no thanks.. unimpressed I'm using it now.
M1T, I haven't used this one in a while, I did like it though.
I think that's it.

I agree about tbol. I stacked it @ 20-30mg per day with test and I didn't notice much... maybe a little in the way of strength gains, not much. It totally jacked up my cholesterol. I think you probably need 5 weeks of it @ 50mg to notice anything.

 

[Modoc]

I'll put in another vote for Superdrol. I ran d-bol solo a few times in the 90's and the results from Superdrol alone are just as good if not better. I do, however, experience some side effects from Superdrol, whereas d-bol made me feel really good all the time. I did one cycle of M1T for 3 weeks and hated it - felt like **** and my prostate swelled up and I had to piss like a racehorse every 45 minutes. Never again.