Old Newbie advice required

[Diminisher]

Hey all, this is my first post after lurking in the shadows for a number of months reading and deciding on my best path

Let me introduce myself I'm 42yrs young 5'10" currently 204lbs, I have been training for around 10 years but 3 years ago I had a life altering situation which resulted in a laparotomy operation and 102 staples as a result

I am currently cutting down and was at 237lbs 8 months ago, I am employing a Upper / Lower / Cardio split over 6 days with cardio coming from biking / punchbag

I am wanting to continue cutting down to around 190lbs then recomping to around 195lbs

Diet at the moment is 2200cals
Pro 200g
Carb 200g (50g AM,50g Pre, 50g Post, 50g 2nd Meal PWO)
Fat 66g

Unlike many of you I work out at home with a power-rack and dont currently have a training partner so I use more focus on movements rather than weights using 3 second contractions during each rep

after a lot of reading and deciding that the time is nigh to get myself looking good again I am thinking of going for the following which I am going to log with pics

1st wave
Dermacrine - 4wks
Sustain alpha - 4wks

2nd wave (was looking at sarms but not sure and Epidrone is milder run)
Decmarine - 6wks
Epidone - 6wks
Ar1macare - Cyc Ass

Rebirth - 8wks
Sustain alpha
SuperPCT

havent thought much further beyond this but might try Sup3r-1&4 by OL

Does this look ok to start with

 

[jakz]

I don't know much about PH's, BUT I do know they need a serm as PCT just lime AAS.

 

[hairygrandpa]

Hey all, this is my first post after lurking in the shadows for a number of months reading and deciding on my best path

Let me introduce myself I'm 42yrs young 5'10" currently 204lbs, I have been training for around 10 years but 3 years ago I had a life altering situation which resulted in a laparotomy operation and 102 staples as a result

I am currently cutting down and was at 237lbs 8 months ago, I am employing a Upper / Lower / Cardio split over 6 days with cardio coming from biking / punchbag

I am wanting to continue cutting down to around 190lbs then recomping to around 195lbs

Diet at the moment is 2200cals
Pro 200g
Carb 200g (50g AM,50g Pre, 50g Post, 50g 2nd Meal PWO)
Fat 66g

Unlike many of you I work out at home with a power-rack and dont currently have a training partner so I use more focus on movements rather than weights using 3 second contractions during each rep

after a lot of reading and deciding that the time is nigh to get myself looking good again I am thinking of going for the following which I am going to log with pics

1st wave
Dermacrine - 4wks
Sustain alpha - 4wks

2nd wave (was looking at sarms but not sure and Epidrone is milder run)
Decmarine - 6wks
Epidone - 6wks
Ar1macare - Cyc Ass

Rebirth - 8wks
Sustain alpha
SuperPCT

havent thought much further beyond this but might try Sup3r-1&4 by OL

Does this look ok to start with

You have some nice compounds listed -but IMHO you have to change things around, cut some of the stuff- and add others.
As I'm not much into DHEA stuff and other OTC anymore (besides Dermacrine -and they stop producing it, damn) I'll tag the diet guru HIT4ME to help out.

 

[Diminisher]

thanks for feedback, I had already got hold of Dermacrine & sustain previously as I wanted to run these months ago but held out so I am going to run these first to see what my feedback is as all reading shows minimal suppression over 3-4 wks, I also plan to run a log over the course of 6-8wks of both compounds to see for myself
for the 2nd wave I will wait for feedback

 

[hairygrandpa]

Your "first wave" I would cut out.
Start with the "second wave".

Dermacrine is usually used as a "test base" on a PH, Sarms -or short oral AAS cycle. For guys on TRT, Dermacrine has some benefits.
Sustain Alpha is mainly used in PCT after a cycle.

Here what I did for my first recomp:
Ostarine 20mg/day
MK-677 10-30mg/day (working dose up)
ECA - or DMAA to curb appetite from MK
Dermacrine
Huperzine
PCT
Rebirth
Sustain Alpha
other

 

[LAH813]

You need a SERM with any PH, AAS, SARM cycle usually.
Also I agree with the above comment, just do your second one that you have listed.

 

[AntM1564]

You need a SERM. No matter the compound, it is better to be safe than sorry. You can run an OCT product, for example, AlphaMax XT, Rebirth, Redcuce XT, Sustain Alpha, etc. but any of those should be ran in conjunction with a SERM, not as a replacement.

 

[Diminisher]

Your "first wave" I would cut out.
Start with the "second wave".

Dermacrine is usually used as a "test base" on a PH, Sarms -or short oral AAS cycle. For guys on TRT, Dermacrine has some benefits.
Sustain Alpha is mainly used in PCT after a cycle.

Here what I did for my first recomp:
Ostarine 20mg/day
MK-677 10-30mg/day (working dose up)
ECA - or DMAA to curb appetite from MK
Dermacrine
Huperzine
PCT
Rebirth
Sustain Alpha
other

Thanks for this however is it possible to substitute Carderine for MK-677 as this is associated with cutting cycles

also found myself laughing when I searched Nutrobal which is the common name for MK-677 as its reptile food so was thinking some strange thoughts there

lastly what results did you achieve with this stack

 

[Diminisher]

You need a SERM. No matter the compound, it is better to be safe than sorry. You can run an OCT product, for example, AlphaMax XT, Rebirth, Redcuce XT, Sustain Alpha, etc. but any of those should be ran in conjunction with a SERM, not as a replacement.

was already looking into Nolva and clomid but was trying to avoid stronger compounds for now and stay with OTC Serms however it doesn't seem likely so will opt for correct PCT protocol

 

[LeanEngineer]

You need a SERM. No matter the compound, it is better to be safe than sorry. You can run an OCT product, for example, AlphaMax XT, Rebirth, Redcuce XT, Sustain Alpha, etc. but any of those should be ran in conjunction with a SERM, not as a replacement.

This. Your serm should be your base and then you can through in extra supplements as add ons including an otc pct product.

 

[Diminisher]

I have researched a couple of sites to purchase Serms from but I am not sure if its ok, if possible can someone PM me a trusted source as I have never purchased before and want to make sure I get the correct items

Apologies if I have over stepped the mark on this question just want to start up and as you have said quite rightly I need the right tools to do the job

I live in the UK by the way

 

[hairygrandpa]

Thanks for this however is it possible to substitute Carderine for MK-677 as this is associated with cutting cycles

also found myself laughing when I searched Nutrobal which is the common name for MK-677 as its reptile food so was thinking some strange thoughts there

lastly what results did you achieve with this stack

Follow the link:

You can see by the pictures how it went:

I started Mar. 2015 until Jun.2015/ The oct.2015 pic is after PCT and after the bulk.

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/277737-hairygrandpas-log-fat.html

here the cycle, it was a 8 weeks cut, followed by a bulk:
1-8 cardarine GW-501516 20mg 10mg mornings/10mg pre workout
1-8 ostarine MK-2866 25mg split dosage morning/pre workout
1-19 Ibutamoren MK-677 25-50mg night (begin at 15mg going up)
1-20 huperzine-a 200mcg 3x day (HGH antagonist killer)
9-14 LGD-4033 10mg mornings (begin at 3mg going up)

PCT:
15-20 Tamoxifen 40/30/30/20/20/20 mornings
15-20 mucuna dopa 2caps mornings
Aromasin at hand
Prami at hand ( don't think I'll need it)


1-8 diet: low carb/med fat/ high prot /total about 1600kcal
9-14 diet: high carb/low fat/high prot / total about 4000kcal
15-20 PCT diet: med carb/low fat/high prot/ total 3400 kcal maintenance

Edit: I used Dermacrine for the second part of the cycle too, to combat lethargy.

If I could turn back time, I would have done the cut for 12 weeks -and with Dermacrine as a test base. No bulk afterwards, because I still was fat after the cut. I also would go down on the MK dose, as it bloated me up too much -and run it longer.
Here the modified cycle:

1-8 cardarine GW-501516 20mg 10mg mornings/10mg pre workout
1-12 ostarine MK-2866 25mg pre workout
1-12 dermacrine 2xday
1-30 Ibutamoren MK-677 25mg night (begin at 10mg going up)
1-30 huperzine-a 200mcg 2x day

PCT:
13-18 Tamoxifen 40/30/30/20/20/20 mornings
- Sustain alpha
Aromasin at hand

Hope this helps.

 

[kelso312]

Looks ok to start with. Basically you want to use the fewest things you possibly can for the simple reason that you have never used them before and do not know how each one will effect you.

Running Dermacrine solo might be good for you to see how you feel on it. Some guys don't respond well to it. But if you are taking it with 2-3 other things and something happens, you can't really identify which thing you were taking that caused things to go badly. You understand what I am saying?

I would pick one compound to run with it. Something dry, since you are cutting and use Sustain/Dermacrine as a 'base' to combat lethargy. Osta would work as well. I am just not a fan of cocktailing stuff for first timers. Sorry hairygrandpa no disrepect.

It being a first time I would keep it between 4 and 6 weeks and definitely do not even start anything until you physically have the proper PCT -Clomid/Nolva because Sustain/ Dermacrine have the potential to disrupt your bodies natural production/balance of hormones.

I would even consider grabbing an OTC AI to run just in case you aromatise the DHEA and Preg into E2.

Oh ****. You are in the UK? Just saw that. The world is your oyster over there. I know a few guys that rep over there, PM me and I will send you in their direction.

 

[Diminisher]

Damn Hairygrandpa just reviewed your log and wow what a change, if I had a hat on I would take it off that is one awesome transformation
I should have taken pics when I was at heaviest but didnt have the confidence at that time due to illness but I am certainly going to start a log with my first run

 

[Diminisher]

Looks ok to start with. Basically you want to use the fewest things you possibly can for the simple reason that you have never used them before and do not know how each one will effect you.

Running Dermacrine solo might be good for you to see how you feel on it. Some guys don't respond well to it. But if you are taking it with 2-3 other things and something happens, you can't really identify which thing you were taking that caused things to go badly. You understand what I am saying?

I would pick one compound to run with it. Something dry, since you are cutting and use Sustain/Dermacrine as a 'base' to combat lethargy. Osta would work as well. I am just not a fan of cocktailing stuff for first timers. Sorry hairygrandpa no disrepect.

It being a first time I would keep it between 4 and 6 weeks and definitely do not even start anything until you physically have the proper PCT -Clomid/Nolva because Sustain/ Dermacrine have the potential to disrupt your bodies natural production/balance of hormones.

I would even consider grabbing an OTC AI to run just in case you aromatise the DHEA and Preg into E2.

Oh ****. You are in the UK? Just saw that. The world is your oyster over there. I know a few guys that rep over there, PM me and I will send you in their direction.

interesting read there Kelso, was thinking of Osterine but what about RAD as its also good for building lean muscle

also I cant PM anyone due to insufficient posts sorry

 

[hairygrandpa]

Looks ok to start with. Basically you want to use the fewest things you possibly can for the simple reason that you have never used them before and do not know how each one will effect you.

Running Dermacrine solo might be good for you to see how you feel on it. Some guys don't respond well to it. But if you are taking it with 2-3 other things and something happens, you can't really identify which thing you were taking that caused things to go badly. You understand what I am saying?

I would pick one compound to run with it. Something dry, since you are cutting and use Sustain/Dermacrine as a 'base' to combat lethargy. Osta would work as well. I am just not a fan of cocktailing stuff for first timers. Sorry hairygrandpa no disrepect.

It being a first time I would keep it between 4 and 6 weeks and definitely do not even start anything until you physically have the proper PCT -Clomid/Nolva because Sustain/ Dermacrine have the potential to disrupt your bodies natural production/balance of hormones.

I would even consider grabbing an OTC AI to run just in case you aromatise the DHEA and Preg into E2.

Oh ****. You are in the UK? Just saw that. The world is your oyster over there. I know a few guys that rep over there, PM me and I will send you in their direction.

You are right with your critique, less is safer.
Have to admit that I'm a notorious risk taker -it's the way how I approach things and I got desensitized to rough landings.
I totally agree with your post.

 

[hairygrandpa]

Damn Hairygrandpa just reviewed your log and wow what a change, if I had a hat on I would take it off that is one awesome transformation
I should have taken pics when I was at heaviest but didnt have the confidence at that time due to illness but I am certainly going to start a log with my first run

Please do a log!
It helps to keep track of your own progress -and is sort of an commitment to the AM community.
The fear to fail in public could give you the needed push for discipline.
Before pics are only shameful if you don't see progress in the after pics!

 

[Diminisher]

all,
I have done some more research and agree Serm is definitely required so hunting for a good source before cracking on
I am going to add some pics on here as I am in for the long haul

Also looking at what to run with Dermacrine and found the following:

Sarms - Osterine or Radar1ne or Mass GH contains 4g LGD-4033 & 10g MK-677
OR
1-Andro (Olympus Labs Sup3r-1) @ 220/330/330/330/330/330

 

[bigsmall]

was already looking into Nolva and clomid but was trying to avoid stronger compounds for now and stay with OTC Serms however it doesn't seem likely so will opt for correct PCT protocol

Rebrith by black lion reseach is all the SERM you need (its two SERMs infact) and can be used to combat the strongest or lightest PH runs.

 

[Diminisher]

I have decided to go with the following for first cycle:

Decmarine - 8wks
Osterine - 8wks @ 15/15/15/15/20/20/20/20
Ar1macare - Cyc Ass - 8wks (Not sure if needed or not)

PCT
Sustain alpha - 4wks
SuperPCT - 4wks
Nolva - 4wks @ 20/20/10/10

I will be placing order this week for all items and extra Dermacrine & Sustain before they runout of stocks and will start March as I am starting to slow down on weight loss so need a push now, I will also log this and take photos to show hopeful progress

Thinking of running MK-677 after PCT for 4-6 weeks between cycles to hopefully maintain any progress made

 

[hairygrandpa]

I have decided to go with the following for first cycle:

Decmarine - 8wks
Osterine - 8wks @ 15/15/15/15/20/20/20/20
Ar1macare - Cyc Ass - 8wks (Not sure if needed or not)

PCT
Sustain alpha - 4wks
SuperPCT - 4wks
Nolva - 4wks @ 20/20/10/10

I will be placing order this week for all items and extra Dermacrine & Sustain before they runout of stocks and will start March as I am starting to slow down on weight loss so need a push now, I will also log this and take photos to show hopeful progress

Thinking of running MK-677 after PCT for 4-6 weeks between cycles to hopefully maintain any progress made

Cycle looks good, don't expect huge gains. It will be awesome for keeping muscles in a cal deficit and should give you a little strength boost.
IMHO, any GH secretagogue like MK and CJC should be run long term to see effects -and shines if used with PH's, Sarms -or AAS.
4-6 weeks is a waste.

 

[Diminisher]

Cycle looks good, don't expect huge gains. It will be awesome for keeping muscles in a cal deficit and should give you a little strength boost.
IMHO, any GH secretagogue like MK and CJC should be run long term to see effects -and shines if used with PH's, Sarms -or AAS.
4-6 weeks is a waste.

thanks for that, it was really an afterthought with MK-677 but may add to next cycle which I am leaning towards Sup3r-1&4 which looks quite promising but want to get down weight wise first to make the most out of it

 

[Diminisher]

right all gone ahead with all orders now.....
going with

Dermacrine - 8wks
Osterine - 8wks @ 15/15/15/15/20/20/20/20
Ar1macare - Cyc Ass - 8wks (Half Dose to start with to see impacts)

PCT
Sustain alpha - 4wks
SuperPCT - 4wks
Nolva - 4wks @ 20/20/10/10

took some pics today and will start my log once everything arrives, thanks to everyone who has helped - Here goes nothing .....

 

[Diminisher]

right all items have now finally arrived my Nolva must have gone round the world a few times before it reached me
going to start my cycle this coming Sunday night with the dermacrine and the Osterine on monday morning for the next 8 weeks cant wait
going to add some Ep1c unleashed for 8 weeks Post PCT to get me through to my next cycle as well
will log this first run on here so here goes......

 

[bigsmall]

right all items have now finally arrived my Nolva must have gone round the world a few times before it reached me
going to start my cycle this coming Sunday night with the dermacrine and the Osterine on monday morning for the next 8 weeks cant wait
going to add some Ep1c unleashed for 8 weeks Post PCT to get me through to my next cycle as well
will log this first run on here so here goes......

If getting EP1c again, opt for Folidrone 2.0....it blows Ep1c away.